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Keep in mind though that Summoners don't get that spell until what.. 10th level. Also keep in mind that it's the base level that determines whether the spell can be put into a wand, so it can't happen at all.Something to consider for your Early Access spell list for the Samsaran.
Teleport.
Summoners have Teleport as a 4th level spell. May not seem all that powerful, but consider this.
A Wand of Teleport.
That's right, a Samsaran Wizard could craft a Wand of Teleport for 5,250 gp and Teleport 50 times. It turns the Samsaran into the Ultimate Taxi Cab and is a Must as far as Wands go.
That's not true. When you make a magic item, you use whatever level the spell is that you are able to cast. If you are able, for some reason, to get Fireball as a second level spell, you can craft items requiring fireball, by using the second level version of the spell.
Since different classes get access to certain spells at different levels, the prices for two characters to make the same item might actually be different. An item is only worth two times what the caster of the lowest possible level can make it for. Calculate the market price based on the lowest possible level caster, no matter who makes the item.
This means, each time a spell casting class is introduced, if they give early access to a spell, then items that require that spell need to have their price readjusted. However, it also opens up new items that couldn't be made before. Wands of Teleport are one such item. There is a reason why, in PFS, if a spell is on a Cleric or Wizard spell list, then the Cleric/Wizard version is the basis of the price for the item.
I disagree that purchase prices have to be adjusted. If a wizard has created the item, the price is still the same as it always was. The new class may offer some unfair competition in the production of that item, but if that class is very rare, wizards may still end up setting the most common price.
A question to the author of the guide: did you use the preferred spell for your "universal" diviner build, as greater specialization applies only to one specialized spell? In case greater specialization would apply to all spells having the feat "spell specialization", would you still prefer the preferred spell feat?
A question to the author of the guide: did you use the preferred spell for your "universal" diviner build, as greater specialization applies only to one specialized spell? In case greater specialization would apply to all spells having the feat "spell specialization", would you still prefer the preferred spell feat?
Hmm... This is actually something I hadn't considered.
You're right, as written you might take Greater Spell specialization as applying to all of the spells that you specialize in without having to take a Greater Specialization feat for each of them.
The great advantage of Spell Specialization is that you can change which spells you can cast each time you get new spells - which I think makes it superior for doing something like applying it to Summon Monster spells.
The great disadvantage of Spell Specialization (With Greater Spell Specialization) is that it increases the casting time of your favored spell to a full round cast when you use Metamagic on them. This makes Preferred spell a much better option for taking spells you'll be casting all the time for your entire career and may want to spontaneously add metamagic to - like adding Dazing Spell to your favorite Evocation Spell.
Taking that into account, I think it's a little expensive to get both Spell Specialization AND Preferred Spell since they both take two feats to allow spontaneous casting. As far as my Diviner build goes, the fact that I put "Your choice" on those feats kind of leaves open the question of which is best.
If you want to spontaneously cast spells that really don't benefit from any metamagic besides Quicken Spell (which doesn't get a increased casting time) then I think taking multiple Spell Specialization Feats and only applying only one global Greater Spell Specialization feat is the best way to go. Haste and Dimensional Anchor are good examples of good spells. Greater Dispel Magic actually greatly benefits from this approach because it's one of the few spells that improves remarkably from the +2 caster level.
If you want to use ANY kind of metamagic like Persistent Spell, Dazing Spell, Reach Spell, or even the obligatory Heighten Spell, then I think you're better off sticking to Preferred Spell. My spell example of Cold Ice Strike would love to have Rime Spell attached to it, but it's not required. Telekinetic Charge, my other recommendation, greatly benefits from Reach Spell - but again, it's up to you if you think you'd rather have Preferred spell.
TLDR version (AKA, my simple opinion): I think I would prefer Spell Specialization for my Diviner Build if my DM agrees with the interpretation that Greater Spell Specialization has a global effect on all spell specializations.
If you want to spontaneously cast spells that really don't benefit from any metamagic besides Quicken Spell (which doesn't get a increased casting time) then I think taking multiple Spell Specialization Feats and only applying only one global Greater Spell Specialization feat is the best way to go. Haste and Dimensional Anchor are good examples of good spells. Greater Dispel Magic actually greatly benefits from this approach because it's one of the few spells that improves remarkably from the +2 caster level.
One Note: the advantage of preferred spell is that you can use spells from different schools, whereas the spell specialization chain must be of a school for which you have the spell focus feat.
Anyhow, the good thing is, that we have both options given.
First off, thanks for the great guide!
For various RP reasons I've decided to build a wizard necromaner for a campaign I'm playing in. I realize a wizard isn't the most efficient necromancer but it's what I've got to work with so I'm trying to make the best of it. I'm starting at level 3 with 20 point buy for abilities. Here is what I have so far:
Human Wizard, Necromancer specialist with the Undead variant, opposed schools are Abjuration and Enchantment.
STR: 7
DEX: 13
CON: 12
INT: 18 (20 w/ the +2 racial bonus)
WIS: 10
CHA: 12I didn't dump charisma since it helps with Command Undead but perhaps 12 is too much?
For feats I was thinking of taking Combat Casting (given that so many Necro spells are touch it seems like this might be worth taking?), Improved Initiative, and Opposition Research (Abjuration). I would probably take Spell Focus (Necromancy) with my next available feat. I looked at the Skeleton Summoner feat but it kinds of feels like a waste of a feat for just the ability to apply a skeleton template to Summon Monster I and III.
For a familiar I'm on the fence between a scorpion for the +4 init or a raven for RP purposes.
My goal is for the character to have the feel of a necromancer without completely killing my ability to provide utility to the group.
Do you have any recommendations on how I can improve this build or perhaps I'm going in the wrong direction entirely?
I like the concept. I often go for a more themed build than the "optimized" build. The thing that jumps out at me though is the feat Opposition Research... unfortunately, you must be 9th level to get this one. I'd think about Craft Wondrous Items... several relatively in expense items you can make, and if you have flexible GM, you could come up with some fun necro-type variants.
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First off, thanks for the great guide!
For various RP reasons I've decided to build a wizard necromaner for a campaign I'm playing in. I realize a wizard isn't the most efficient necromancer but it's what I've got to work with so I'm trying to make the best of it. I'm starting at level 3 with 20 point buy for abilities. Here is what I have so far:
Human Wizard, Necromancer specialist with the Undead variant, opposed schools are Abjuration and Enchantment.
STR: 7
DEX: 13
CON: 12
INT: 18 (20 w/ the +2 racial bonus)
WIS: 10
CHA: 12I didn't dump charisma since it helps with Command Undead but perhaps 12 is too much?
For feats I was thinking of taking Combat Casting (given that so many Necro spells are touch it seems like this might be worth taking?), Improved Initiative, and Opposition Research (Abjuration). I would probably take Spell Focus (Necromancy) with my next available feat. I looked at the Skeleton Summoner feat but it kinds of feels like a waste of a feat for just the ability to apply a skeleton template to Summon Monster I and III.
For a familiar I'm on the fence between a scorpion for the +4 init or a raven for RP purposes.
My goal is for the character to have the feel of a necromancer without completely killing my ability to provide utility to the group.
Do you have any recommendations on how I can improve this build or perhaps I'm going in the wrong direction entirely?
Best recommendation I can give: My guide is a guide.
If it makes more sense for you to have a Raven, take a Raven. Role-playing trumps Optimization any day. If you were going for the optimized choice obviously the Scorpion is the better option. But think of how much fun a Raven could be as far as actually playing goes because it has the ability to speak?
This is just a personal choice, but if I were to make a Necromancer, I'd probably keep Enchantment and dump something else - maybe Divination or Evocation? The reason I say that is I think Enchantment nicely compliments Necromancy - you have one to affect a good number of Mind-Affecting immune through Undead and the other to cover just about everything else (With conjuration to back you up against Constructs and Oozes.) Plus it also kind of fits the bill of a wizard dabbling in black magic, don't you think?
The hardest part about that choice would of course be the opposition school though. I wouldn't dump Illusion if you're dumping Abjuration because you're basically selling out all of your protection spells if you did that (Mirror Image and Invisibility are life-savers.)
Also, I'm really not a fan of Skeletal Summoner. I just don't think it has the value of most other feats.
Combat casting isn't a bad idea, but I'd stretch for Reach Spell metamagic as soon as you can afford to use it.
7 str and 7 cha made me chuckle.
haha.
You know, I'm currently playing a Samsaran Diviner, and I still think of myself as a "Bearded Wizard" even though in my DM's eyes Samsarans are like Elves when it comes to facial hair.
First off, thanks for the great guide!
For various RP reasons I've decided to build a wizard necromaner.
...
For feats I was thinking of taking Combat Casting (given that so many Necro spells are touch it seems like this might be worth taking?)
...
Do you have any recommendations on how I can improve this build or perhaps I'm going in the wrong direction entirely?
Feat to consider given the number of touch spells is Reach spell. +1 level takes touch to close. I doubt you would have much need to extend much beyond close range.
Thank you very much for something so awesome.
When Mythic Adventures come out would you expand this to include the Archmage tier?
Very cool guide!
Only found one thing to comment on so far: Destructive Dispel requires a targeted dispel to work, meaning it cannot work with the area application of Greater Dispel Magic.
On the carbuncle: It can be argued that dimension door brings others along, which makes this quite a nice positioning option. I can see many DMs not liking this idea tough.
I know this isn't definitive, but the Rise of the Runelords Anniversary edition (updated from 3.5 to PF) gives Karzoug the school powers for Transmutation.
This would be evidence that Thassilonian Specialists still receive school powers for their school.
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Im not sure if anyone has mentioned this yet, however if you plan on talking about Wizard Prestige Classes, then you really need to look at the book Paths of prestige.
Arclord of Nex: Become Uber Universalist and make golems like crazy.
Hellknight Signifier: Basically Space Marine Librarians, actually pretty good since you can get special powers and wear armor.
Magaambyan Arcanist: Spell Mastery as prerequisite, but actually makes it semi-useful. Gives you Druid Spells as well as spells from the Good Domain. Constant Protection from Evil and boosted Good-aligned spells. And semi-spontanious casting.
Blackfire Adept/Rift Warden: Uber-Conjuration and Anti-Conjuration. Kinda cool.
Razmiran Priest: Be an evil Wizard who casts healing spells and can channel.
Storm Kindler: Turn into tornadoes and manipulate weather like Storm from X-Men
Tattooed Mystic: MOAR TATTOO MAJIKS!
Im not sure if you read this book and havent got around to updating or not, but I highly reccomend looking these up and discussing them in the PrC section of the guide.
First I wanted to thank you for putting this together and for giving props to my favorite school, Void. I thought I was the only one who really digs that school, so I'm glad I'm not alone.
I also wanted to point out that Bluff actually can come in handy for any Wizard build, not just the Enchanter. The feat "Spell Bluff" is incredible in my opinion and requires 5 ranks in Bluff to take. As a DM, I let my players with Bluff and Spell Bluff roll a Bluff check when they're casting a spell, and if they succeed against the enemy's Sanse Motive, that enemy takes a penalty to their Spellcraft check it identify what is being cast. By failing to identify the spell, they might try to Counterspell the wrong spell which results in wasting one of their spells per day.
I'm also a big fan of Disruptive Spell. I do understand it's quite situational, but even a Dsruptive Magic Missile can cause an enemy caster to fail casting a powerful spell like the Summons. It can also really hurt a Cleric who might fail at casting a Cure spell, which basically ends an encounter sooner by not allowing the enemy party to regain health.
Those are just my 2 cents on some features of the Wizard I prefer that you didn't seem to like as much as I do. I know it's to each her/his own, so I thought I'd share why I like those in case others hadn't thought of their uses.
Edit: I just read the section of Familiars too, and wanted to share the Parrot from the Shcakles. It grants a +3 to Linguistics. If your DM is like me, that means you automatically get 3 additional languages for simply having a pet. It can also fly which makes it a grat familiar overall.
I realized that you also didn't include one of my favorite 1st Level Enchantment spells: Keep Watch (http://pengeo.net/2485). It's from Knights of the Inner Sea and let's you gain the benefits of resting for 8 hours or fewer if your race needs less sleep in order to regain HP, spells, etc.
This makes it the party's crafter favorite spell. While everyone else is resting, you're creating magic items without need ping to sleep. That's 8 hours of crafting that you otherwise would be wasting sleeping.
If your DM allows custom magic items, making an item of Keep Watch that's usable once per day without need to set a spell slot aside makes it a great option. Giving them out to the party also helps, then the party's scout and defender can keep the party safe while exploring the wilderness while the other party members regain their spells or craft at the same time. That means no nobody's going to be surprised by a wandering monster.
I tried that, but gave up after ~1/3 of an hour of Firefox "Unresponsive script" errors. Something happened in the course of corruption of this document that causes that problem, because I don't usually get this problem viewing other documents in Google Docs (occasionally get a couple of "Unresponsive script" errors with another document, and then it gets through).
I tried that, but gave up after ~1/3 of an hour of Firefox "Unresponsive script" errors. Something happened in the course of corruption of this document that causes that problem, because I don't usually get this problem viewing other documents in Google Docs (occasionally get a couple of "Unresponsive script" errors with another document, and then it gets through).
Chrome seemed to give me the best results. Firefox is having problems with google docs on some platforms right now.
Please, the "suggesting" feature of Google Docs is making almost impossible to open the guide! Could you (the author) please do something to prevent idiotic vandalization?
^Okay, so its not just me and my obsolete computer (had to pull my 2003 vintage computer back into service when my 2005 vintage computer fried).
I have to query your red rating of Ablative Barrier as turning 5 points of damage into non-lethal means that any healing you receive is basically empowered.
You heal an equal amount of non-lethal damage as you do lethal. I've used this long duration spell many times, with a number of classes to great effect, especially those classes with lower than average hit points.
Red seems very harsh for a long duration spell that keeps you alive.
<BUMP> Any chance of restoring this great guide to its original glory? I can't seem to get Google Docs to show me the uncorrupted version.
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I have to query your red rating of Ablative Barrier as turning 5 points of damage into non-lethal means that any healing you receive is basically empowered.
You heal an equal amount of non-lethal damage as you do lethal. I've used this long duration spell many times, with a number of classes to great effect, especially those classes with lower than average hit points.Red seems very harsh for a long duration spell that keeps you alive.
That's not a bad argument for it, but it still feels to me like it'd only bump it to a yellow. Maybe a green at higher levels when you have a spell slot and/or money to burn, but that feels a little generous.
For half-elves, Elf Blood was rated as red. But with the FAQ updates, Elf Blood now lets half-elves access many human and elven options that you rated much higher.
Half-Elf or Half-Orc: Can a character of either of these races select human racial archetypes (such as from Advanced Race Guide?
Yes. Half-elves and half-orcs may select racial favored class options, archetypes, traits, and so on, as if they were a full member of both races (a half-elf can select elf and human rules elements, a half-orc can select human and orc rules elements).Edit 9/26/13: This is a reversal of an earlier ruling. This resolves a discrepancy between this FAQ and two Advanced Player's Guide FAQs.
It seems to me that Elf Blood should be rated as high as the options that it grants.
For the Silvanshee, you suggested that its lay on hands power might scale with the wizard's level. By RAW it originally worked that way, but the Silvanshee entry was changed so that the lay on hands power is set permanently at 2nd level.
Just realized that KaptainKrunch probably isn't on these boards any more -- link gives last post as being back in 2013. Does anyone know where a non-corrupted version of the document exists?
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I downloaded *a* version of it, not sure if it's the 'most current' version. I could throw it up on OneDrive for you guys if you want?
[Edit] Here's the version of the Complete Wizard's Guide that I downloaded. I hope this helps!
^Awesome! I can't tell off-hand if it is the most current version, but I suspect that if you downloaded it any time after November (or especially December) 2013, it probably is. Even better, Office Online doesn't hose my computer the way Google Docs does! (Strange -- you'd think Microsoft would be reluctant to make Office Online work with anything other than Internet Exploder, and that Google would have the more incentive to make Google Docs work with Firefox, but the actual result seems to be the opposite. Go figure . . . .) Wonder if the Zenith Games Guide to the Guides will post this alternate link.
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I downloaded *a* version of it, not sure if it's the 'most current' version. I could throw it up on OneDrive for you guys if you want?
[Edit] Here's the version of the Complete Wizard's Guide that I downloaded. I hope this helps!
Thank you!
Hmm
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For anyone who cares, I made a copy of the file without all the crazy editing: Copy of the Complete Professor Q's Guide to the Patfinder Wizard.
^Good to have another backup copy. Also good that the 2 backup copies are under different online document presentation software -- my computer has more trouble with Google Docs, but somebody else's computer might have more trouble with Office Online.
Shades are not inteded to cover even whole wizard/sorcerer conjuration school:
I am going to look into adding this to the FAQ, but here are a few notes (subject to change)...
...As for this particular issue, I think the intent here of this spell was to keep the subschool limitations. Without them, this spell is probably too good, seeing as its 80% limitation would not really apply (or would have to be creatively applied) to a number of spells outside the subschool limitation. For now, that is the way I would play it, and that is certainly the way I am leaning toward with any clarification.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
Shades are not inteded to cover even whole wizard/sorcerer conjuration school:
I am going to look into adding this to the FAQ, but here are a few notes (subject to change)...
...As for this particular issue, I think the intent here of this spell was to keep the subschool limitations. Without them, this spell is probably too good, seeing as its 80% limitation would not really apply (or would have to be creatively applied) to a number of spells outside the subschool limitation. For now, that is the way I would play it, and that is certainly the way I am leaning toward with any clarification.
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
Not sure how accurate his belief of that intention is.
This spell functions like shadow conjuration, except that it mimics sorcerer and wizard conjuration spells of 8th level or lower. The illusory conjurations created deal four-fifths (80%) damage to nonbelievers, and nondamaging effects are 80% likely to work against nonbelievers.
This spell functions like shadow conjuration, except that it mimics conjuration spells of 8th level or lower. The illusory conjurations created deal four-fifths (80%) damage to nonbelievers, and non-damaging effects are 80% likely to work against nonbelievers.
Much of Pathfinder spells and stuff was basically copy pasted with a few alterations. Shades is one of those spells that seems to have been specifically altered from it's 3.5 counterpart. In 3.5 it was limited to only sorcerer/wizard spells. Pathfinder removed that clause and limited it to only conjuration spells.
It's been nearly 4 years since that post and Shades has never been FAQ'd or errat'd in that time. At this point Shades functions by drawing off the entire conjuration subschool, or it needs a brand new FAQ so Mark can bring it up before the design team.
I'm confused by a statement made in the section on familiars, "Generally speaking it’s better to just grab Improved Familiar once you get to level 7 because you get your familiar for free that way. However if you want the benefits of an Improved Familiar early you might consider taking the expense of dismissing your familiar later and just grab the feat at level 3."
How does anyone get their familiar free at level 7?
I'm confused by a statement made in the section on familiars, "Generally speaking it’s better to just grab Improved Familiar once you get to level 7 because you get your familiar for free that way. However if you want the benefits of an Improved Familiar early you might consider taking the expense of dismissing your familiar later and just grab the feat at level 3."
How does anyone get their familiar free at level 7?
When you take the feat at lvl 7 you can pick a familiar without doing the ritual. If you take the feat earlier, you're supposed to switch it as you gain levels.
Because you get access to new familiars at level 5 and 7. The whole idea of level 7 familiar is intelligent creatures, SLAs, and for many the use of Wands, which is granting you a new action through them.Many buffs/Crow Control aren't worth an action during combat, but having a familiar do it gives new strategic options.
Seems that the links are all down...
Hmmm...waiting
Looks like I failed to repost this in the thread I have linked in my guide.
My bad.
Sorry about that. The original guide was destroyed by commenters, so I have reposted it with the comments turned off.
Great job with the guide, very extense and very detailed.
I would like to point one minor disagreement with the rating of a few spells. The "hand" group of spells, and the permanent comparison with Summon Monster VII and the augmented summoning T-Rex.
Some few details that I think the guide does not takes in account:
Summon monster is a 1 round cast. By the time the T-Rex is active, the hands have done TWO checks to grasp/bull rush/whatever. That increases the odds of the hands for a succesful maneuver at the end of round 2, which is when the T-Rex can do it.
Not to mention that, being 1 round cast, any single damaging spell will "counter" it, because concentration checks vs damage are hard as hell. In my opinion, that alone should make all the Summon Monster spells green, unless you can cast them as standard action (summoners, some druids with certain summonings, clerics with sacred summons, etc)
The Grasping Hand and his friends are also Force Spells, which means you can grapple incorporeal creatures, including casters that have made themselves incorporeal (like casters with Dust Form, for example).
Also, in general, I think spells that target CMD are undervalued, based on the median CMD of the bestiary. While it's true that your grasping hand has low chances to grapple a Red Wyrm, Balor, or Cthulhu, it's very probably that has a better chance to do so against the NPC caster. It's not a universal spell, that you can memorize 4x because you'll use it every combat, as you do with, say Haste, but it's situationally useful. But in certain situations, it's an encounter-killer. That makes them a great option for the bonded item if you don't have a familiar, or to memorize them if you can gather some info and know what you are going to fight (sometimes it's pretty obvious, like "everything in the adventure implies that there are going to be mad cultists and an evil wizard at the end of this lair", some times you need some divination).
It's the same that FOR vs REF vs WILL, for example. Yeah, Desintegrate is pretty lame vs a dragon. But it's kind of a killer vs an undead caster. You should target REF or WILL vs huge dudes, and Fort or CMD vs guys with a pointy hat and a wand.