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Can you use a 1 level druid dip to get access to any of the druid animal companions and then use cavalier levels to have it scale.
e.g. Level 1 Druid for Roc and then Cav levels to improve it ?
NB: I use Roc as the example because it has fly which cavalier specifically says they can't choose as a mount.
The Cavalier has a mount feature that works mechanically like a animal companion class feature, but is an altogether different class feature.
A druid/cavalier would have a mount AND an animal companion.
You cannot have both. The levels stack.
Not saying you're necessarily wrong, but if this is true, what happens when a medium druid with a cheetah companion multiclasses into cavalier? Does his cheetah then become an illegal choice since it is too small for the druid to ride?
NB: I use Roc as the example because it has fly which cavalier specifically says they can't choose as a mount.
I'm sorry, I can't tell if you're saying that rocs aren't on the short list of what cavaliers can ordinarily choose (which I knew), or that somewhere it specifically says that cavaliers can't choose flying creatures (which would be news to me)?
My nuanced answer is that a druid/cavalier gets to choose one creature, and his effective druid levels from cavalier stack with his actual druid levels for its advancement. He can choose from the options available for an animal companion from the druid's Nature Bond class feature, and he gets the benefits of both; but he also has to abide by the restrictions of both.
For example, a cavalier's animal companion "must be one that he is capable of riding and is suitable as a mount." (If you started druid and then went into cavalier, and your original animal companion didn't meet that requirement, then I'd require you to release it and get a legal one before advancement.) It's also combat trained and gets Light Armor Proficiency as a bonus feat, but the replacement process is more restrictive.
NB 1: Druids are prohibited from wearing certain kinds of armor and shields. However, for a one-level dip, the only drawback for violating the restriction is that you wouldn't be able to cast your 3/day orisons and 1/day 1st-level spell.
NB 2: I'd say that a druid/cavalier's mount gets the share spells special ability, since that isn't a restriction; it's just something that they don't get from Mount (just like Nature Bond doesn't grant Light Armor Proficiency). However, it doesn't really matter for a one-level dip (see NB 1).
Disclaimer: This is, as always, just how I'd rule it. And I'm always open to changing my mind if you can show me the page number. ;)
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It is not illegal, because it is not gained from the Cavalier's mount ability. It is gained from the animal companion class feature of the druid.
Hmm...I'm gonna FAQ this, since I'm not entirely convinced. The fact that the mount comes with extra abilities and restrictions and has a different ability name inclines me to think that it is a similar but separate ability, though I am happy to be proven wrong. If the class levels stack, however, I'd be inclined to think however that the new animal would enjoy the benefits and be constrained by the same limitations of both features.
It is not illegal, because it is not gained from the Cavalier's mount ability. It is gained from the animal companion class feature of the druid.Hmm...I'm gonna FAQ this, since I'm not entirely convinced. The fact that the mount comes with extra abilities and restrictions and has a different ability name inclines me to think that it is a similar but separate ability, though I am happy to be proven wrong. If the class levels stack, however, I'd be inclined to think however that the new animal would enjoy the benefits and be constrained by the same limitations of both features.
Actually, there is no Animal Companion class feature. A druid's animal companion comes from its Nature Bond class feature. So, "animal companion" doesn't follow the usual formalities of class feature names; you have to look at the text.
This mount functions as a druid's animal companion, using the cavalier's level as his effective druid level.
If a character receives an animal companion from more than one source, her effective druid levels stack for the purposes of determining the statistics and abilities of the companion.
For the record, James Jacobs has expressed the opinion that the cavalier/druid would get both a mount and an animal companion, so no dice, Phasics.
But it does mean I (probably*) didn't accidentally permit one of my players to make an illegal character, so I'm actually relieved.
*proviso made for those who hold that JJ is not a rules authority
FiddlersGreen: While I often ask JJ for his opinion I do agree that he is not a rules authority. However, he is vastly closer to the source of information than I am so I usually accept his word except when it directly contradicts what is written.
- Gauss
FiddlersGreen: While I often ask JJ for his opinion I do agree that he is not a rules authority. However, he is vastly closer to the source of information than I am so I usually accept his word except when it directly contradicts what is written.
- Gauss
I generally go with that approach too. I was only making the proviso because every now and then when I offer JJ's opinion, I get replies about him not being a rules authority. As far as my own games go, however, I usually follow James' rulings unless there is a 'more official' contrary ruling. =)
Unfortunately, this may be a situation where he is contradicting what is written (I agree with Fredrik). I would post the two rules quotes so he can make an informed opinion. Remember, he doesn't know each and every rule like many of us. Or he forgets them. Etc etc.
- Gauss
Unfortunately, this may be a situation where he is contradicting what is written (I agree with Fredrik). I would post the two rules quotes so he can make an informed opinion. Remember, he doesn't know each and every rule like many of us. Or he forgets them. Etc etc.
- Gauss
Could I trouble you to do that for me? I feel bad asking a question, getting an answer and then re-questioning his answer. XD
ROFLMAO so do I. He is probably tired of me from my earlier posts today. :D
Perhaps I will ask tommmorow or Fredrik can ask.
- Gauss
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No me. I respect JJ in many ways, but not as a source of rules adjudications. Especially not his off-the-cuff answers in an off-topic thread.
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I would suggest staying away from druid altogether, even though I love druid, and take the following link to get a ranger (hippogriff rider) with a first level of fighter (dragoon):
Has anyone ever attempted to make a flying calvary character?
You wouldn't have the armor problem, and still get spells at a later time from ranger.
Official Rules Response
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FAQ: http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fn#v5748eaic9qqn
Cavalier: Do animal companion levels from the druid class stack with cavalier mount levels?
If the animal is on the cavalier mount list and on the list of animal companions for your other class, your cavalier and druid levels stack to determine the animal's abilities. If the animal is not on the cavalier mount list, the druid levels do not stack and you must have different animals (one an animal companion, one a cavalier mount).
For example, if you are Medium druid and you choose a horse companion, levels in cavalier stack to determine the horse's abilities. If you are a Medium druid and you choose a bird companion, levels in cavalier do not stack to determine the bird's abilities, and you must choose a second creature to be your mount (or abandon the bird and select an animal companion you can use as a mount).
This same answer applies to multiclassed cavalier/rangers.
(Note that the design team discourages players from having more than one companion creature at a time, as those creatures tend to be much weaker than a single creature affected by these stacking rules, and add to the bookkeeping for playing that character.)
I'd say this sets the precedent which would apply the same to a druid/ranger. I guess PFS leads the way to screwing over cavaliers from flying again.
Back to designing my beastmaster ranger who rides a roc instead of a cavalier.