Grenadier... how to build it?

[Blackfoot]

I'm looking to put together a Grenadier type character, basically a black powder alchemist.. without the potions and mutagens. Is there a way to do it? (short of custom class or whatever GM intervention)

[Ryu Kaijitsu]

hm, consider maybe to multiclass into gunslinger

[Iggy Toymaker]

I've looked at multiclass with gunslinger, ranger, rogue, fighter... straight alchemist gets the bomb piece.. but I could really care less about the other 'magic' poop. I want to work with the Black Powder.. not a bunch of magical hoopla.

[Ryu Kaijitsu]

well, definitely gunslinger then, gives you better BAB, access to gunpowder/bullet using weapons, better HP, and some nice abilities, although you can keep the levels in it to a minimum and improve through feats as a gunslinger, and even take 4 levels in rogue (maybe trapmaker archetype) in addition, or swashbuckler (main class) if you want to be a bit into melee and get a result similar to a musketeer

erm... and don't call magic poop or hoopla or whatnot, even if you dislike magic others may like it equally much as the more tech-related classes, or better

[Iggy Toymaker]

Yeah.. but your bombs are nowhere near as good as a straight alchemist. Bah. Magic is for sissies. Black Powder and Traps.. all the way!

[Iggy Toymaker]

I actually looked at doing it with a fighter 'bought' stuff and a focus on throwing.. but it gets really expensive in terms of uses per day...
and still the bombs aren't as good as alchemist bombs.

[Fredrik]

If you're making a PFS character, then there's no way that I know of. Otherwise, check out the 3pp Advanced Options: Alchemists' Discoveries from Super Genius Games. It provides a couple of "mad science" kind of alternate class features that you can take in place of the extracts and mutagens.

[Iggy Toymaker]

Hrm. Thanks for the suggestion. Really trying to go PFS here though. :(

[DreamAtelier]

Have you considered the Grenadier Archetype?

Admittedly, it doesn't get rid of the magic or mutagen that you dislike, it does get you the grenade/bomb setup.

You could always have a mutagen and/or extracts and simply not use them.

[Iggy Toymaker]

It's not so much about 'dislike' as they don't actually fit with the character type... I'm really looking at more of a fighter with bombs... essentially a gunslinger with bombs instead of guns... a master of throwing stuff that goes boom... probably good at building and disabling things as well.
Most of the non-alchemist builds I've tried just don't have the firepower. Grenadier is a step in the right direction.. (ditches poison for a couple of bomb effects) but, in PFS, loses his extra bombs and keeps his chemicals. It seems like, in a world where black powder characters exist... a black powder bomber is a natural.

[Iggy Toymaker]

Is there a way to build a gunslinger without a gun? or does that totally hose the class... hmmm...

[blackbloodtroll]

Saboteur/Grenadier alchemist.

@OP: Is this for PFS?

[Iggy Toymaker]

Eh? Yeah.. I'm looking for a PFS build.

[blackbloodtroll]

Wait, you are not the OP, are you? Different account?

[Iggy Toymaker]

OP? Sorry.. what does that mean?

[blackbloodtroll]

Original Poster(or Post).

[Iggy Toymaker]

It would be nice if there was a Gunslinger archetype that got Alchemist 'Bombs' in place of his 'Deeds' or something...

[Psion-Psycho]

I know its not throwing the bomb but what do u think about launching the bomb? Go full alchemist and pick up the Discoveries Explosive Missile and Explosive Bomb with the Exotic Weapon Prof for a pistol. U will get 1 attack a round but u will be able to launch the bomb with ur gun shot still hitting touch ac when ur in the 1st rage increment of the gun which also increases the range by default on the bomb.

[Iggy Toymaker]

The idea is generally to ditch all the alchemist stuff except the bombs ... a rogue archetype that did traps and bombs would be cool too... perhaps in place of sneak attack.

[Psion-Psycho]

Well sadly there is only 2 ways to do that and they both suck. The 1st is to just ignore all the alchemist abilities except bombs and just dont use them. The 2nd is to make powder kegs on a rogue but the cost will leave u beyond broke. Both ways suck so ur gonna have to bite the bullet on this 1 since there is nothing optimal for u to do.

[Iggy Toymaker]

You can build a bomb focused Alchemist with all their feats, discoveries, and abilities focused on making their bombs better... it's not that bad but it'd be cooler if there were an archetype that fit with a nonmagical bomber... it seems very possible within the structure of the world. I'm hopeful that they may at some point create one.