So, cost issues in regards to basebuilding:
It hasn't come up yet (my players are still en route to Sumitha), but they're already laying plans for basebuilding after they've secured the island. They're not planning to use the fort (current plans involve tearing it down for building materials); I'm tempted to try to convince them to renovate Sumitha, but they may end up making their own castle/base/whatever on the Eastern bay instead.
The reason they figure they can get away with this is that the party Sorcerer has Craft Wondrous Item, and as they were sailing from Drenchport to the IoEE, she made a Lyre of Building. The party bard (who is also the captain) has a +17 to Perform: Strings, and since nat 1s aren't auto-failure for skill checks... As near as I can tell, he can pretty much play the thing ALL DAY to get the effect of, oh, 4,800 man-days of construction labor in a single day. Once per week.
Granted that they'll still need to acquire some materials and furnishings and stuff, but that still leaves them with a lot of leeway in terms of what stuff they can build. I'm wondering if anyone would have any suggestions regarding how to handle the listed repair costs in the "prepping for the party" section in regards to this.
Jondera, The conclusion I came to was that while the ruins are cool and would make a nice base, they would not make a good initial fort, and a simple knowledge check should tell your plays why.
There is no good way to defend your island from it. It is far from a coast, and there is only 1 entrance and exit. In addition the closest bay is the more difficult one, making it difficult so sail through. Probably not a great way to impress pirate lords(is also pretty much fails you for the first section).
Now if your players still want to do it they can.(my party is using the fort for the pirate lords, but have set aside a large sum of money to fix the ruin as well to use as their actual main base) Note that while the lyre requires the fabricate spell to be created, it does not cause a fabricate effect, so they will still need some supplies. I deemed that it would take another 10 plunder points to fix the ruins, and 5 more to fix the docks in the northern bay. If they want to build extra buildings and such, I would look at the building costs in the Kingdom rules of Ultimate campaign. If you don't have it I can give you some cost examples later.
Again, if your party wants to I would let them, you will just need to change the Eel's tactics a bit. He will need to setup shop in a different location, and since everyone will be further away from the boats and Sefina's Grotto, it will take them more time to reach the ships and stop him/put out the fires. Once again lowering their chances with the pirates council.
Interestingly enough my group did the island in reverse order so to speak. They headed straight to Sumitha (yet have to claim the stone) before searching Bikendi and now look for his apprentice.
I tried to use both the Nereide and Maride to give hints about the fort and how some wizard there had stolen something that was brought back later, but they still decided to clear the city first. Only after running blindly (literally) into the stone and barely managing to escape using dimension door they realized they might need more information about what they are up against.
Overall there is an apprechiated increase in difficulty compared to the previous books. Stuff finally catches up with their above average AC and there are a lot of special abilities that make them think twice. They hated the item destroying treants with a passion (they lost 3 magic items to them, but could repair them later).
The attribute damage can be a real pain if you don't have the right tools at hand. Two of them caught the disease from the undead guarding the stone and nobody managed to save against the addiction. Their divine caster is a shaman and for whatever reason they get no access to remove disease it seems. At least this allows the magical hammock to really shine.
They are convinced Bikendi tried to use the dreamstone as a phylactery to become a lich and whoever performs the ritual will become his new body. It actually fits suprisingly well with the information they get.
my game is almost up to the party encountering the dreamstone. Just wanted to double check with others that the dreamstone's soul bind only affects those who perish to the negative levels.
Given the average character level thats almost a natural 20 to make the saving throw when you tack on 10 negative levels, this should be rough for the party
I'm storytelling that part now. My players are still on the Chelish fort but I guess they will get there soon. They have had a hard fight with the animate dreams and the phase spiders, which allowed me to test how good they are doing with their saving throws. The swashbuckler is the one who is failing a lot of them, low fort and will are a handicap despite his charmed life ability.
Fortunately, they have a bard with Saving Finale that will surely allow them to pass some extra saves there. Alongside with Sandara, who is part of the group, I hope they do well. But yes, it looks like a rough part indeed.
Trap the soul only affects to characters killed by the negative levels, as you said.
My group is still a long way of from this book, but reading ahead and learning how the Eel plans to sabotage, I have some concerns, specifically about his plan to sneak around the fort invisibly while introducing the second half of his poison into the food. See Invisibility is a pretty easily available resource at this point. I know, there's not much reason for a PC to randomly cast See Invisibility the day before the dinner, and even if they do, I as the GM can just decide the Eel had already done the deed, or else hasn't started yet, and the spell is wasted.
However, I had Permanent See Invisibility on my Kingmaker character by 9th level (I bought a scroll of Permanency to do it), and one of the PC's in this group is an Occultist with the Divination Implement, which could reasonably give him all-day See Invisibility by level 10. See Invisibility is a powerful ability to have on at all times - something a PC could very understandably want for himself - and if a PC wanted to spend resources to get that, I wouldn't want to have to tell them that they didn't notice the freaking INVISIBLE MAN sneaking around because it was crucial to the plot that they didn't.
Has anyone run into this problem in the past? Any ideas how to remedy it?
Not sure if this will help you but in my campaigns, See Invisibility-Permanent must be triggered. Is not on continuously, so a PC must declare that they are scanning the area in question. They just can't leave it on full time. Vexes my PCs but they have come used to the restrictions and now use them accordingly.
Also, they have to be in the same place as The Eel when he is doing his sneaking. If they are out and about or not in the kitchens, dining rooms, prep rooms, storage rooms at the same time they can't see him. Seriously, what PCs spend their time in the Mess Decks and scullery when on the ship? The Eel, being a pro, should recognize the 'threats' to his mission and move accordingly.
Hope this helps.
The Eel simply uses the time when the PCs are greeting the pirate captains at the docks to start luring in the rats. As written the food tinkering took place before it even reached the island, so your PCs never get the chance to see him doing that either way. He is careful to a degree that borders paranoia, so its also very plausible that he would wait for the PCs to leave before doing anything in the weeks prior to the feast. He should still have plenty of time to explore everything.
From a DMing perspective, do you think it's fair to have every Cyclops in Sumitha use their Flash of Insight ability to score/confirm critical hits against the PCs?
I don't suppose the Cyclopes would have much use for it on the the island unless they got mixed up in a scuffle with some of the island's other inhabitants, but the fact that they're in Sumitha suggests they haven't.
I have a 5 PC party and they had no trouble with Bikendi (although one of them died against an Animate Dream...). They'll probably hit the level 10 sometime in Sumitha. If I want it to be a challenge, I'm definitely going to have to buff it up. Either buff up the cyclopes themselves (which is what I'm leaning toward) or add more.
Don't forget that Cyclopes have Ferocity, so they go on fighting well after the party brings them to 0 hp.
True, but it doesn't matter so much when they're up against a group of level 10 PCs with haste and mage armor, bumping their AC up to around 25-30. With a +11 to hit, that means a Cyclops needs to roll 14-20 to hit (with the exception of their flash of insight).
Sometimes I don't understand the encounters in these APs. They often seem so ridiculously easy. Are they intended to be challenging? If so, CR 5 monsters up against level 10 PCs seems like a crazy oversight. Ishtoreth is a CR 12, but I foresee them knocking him out in two or three rounds due to action economy.
Another way to get the most out of your Cyclopes is instead of saving their Flash of Insight ability to confirm a crit, preemptively use it to set up a Critical Called Shot. Worst case scenario, you fail to confirm, but still deal normal damage and get a secondary Called Shot effect; best case scenario, you confirm the crit, deal extra damage, and get a very satisfying Called Shot effect, usually dealing ability damage, or at least applying a hefty penalty. Even if confirming the critical Called Shot is next to impossible with rhe PCs’ AC, once they realize what you’re going for, it’ll really ratchet up the tension as they wait in fear for you to roll that natural 20.
Taking a second look at Cyclopes, a Critical hit from their Greataxe deals on average 52 damage (without Power Attack), which would bump up a confirmed Critical Called Shot (for all but the tankiest level 10 PC's) to a Debilitating Called Shot.
Again, it's not gonna connect every time, since Called Shots take a penalty on attack rolls, but if each Cyclops attempted this, odds are, one or two of them will confirm.
Take a Debilitating Called Shot to the Chest (-2 penalty to attack roll): A debilitating blow to the chest deals 2d4 points of Constitution damage and exhausts the target. A successful Fortitude saving throw (made after the Constitution damage is applied; DC 29, since the save DC is equal to the AC hit by the attack roll) reduces the exhaustion to fatigue. If the saving throw fails by 5 or more, the creature's internal injuries deal 1 point of Constitution damage in any round the creature takes a standard action. The internal injuries can be healed by either a DC 25 Heal check or by healing as many hit points as the debilitating blow dealt, whether by magical or natural means. The creature also suffers the effects of a called shot to the chest (any skill checks caused by the hit (such as an Acrobatics check while balancing or a Climb check while climbing) take a –2 penalty.)
That's a pretty unexpected turn of events from a creature whose CR is half your level, and many other [-2 penalty] Called Shots are available to pick from.
So... The great mother.
Party's been doing great so far. Some tough fights, but they've managed. Then they got to this one. With stealth like that, nobody saw it coming.
Surprise round: Gunslinger is dead before she knows what's happening.
Round 1: The mother wins initiative. The alchemist is dead.
Our rogue-ish type makes her knowledge check, says to the witch "I hope you have something, because this thing is immune to the storm of crits and sneak attacks I usually make, and the remaining 7.5 damage per round isn't gonna cut it."
The last two try to make a run for it. AoO. Witch is dead.
We're going to do a do-over. Any ideas on fixing this encounter up into something that's not quite so insurmountable?
Between the Slam and Constrict damage, it's doing 69 damage on average, which is definitely a hefty amount, but I feel like the Gunslinger should have at least survived the surprise round (assuming they had at least a +1 Con), unless the Great Mother rolled really well.
As for how to deal with it: With a 10' movement, I'd say they're golden as long as they attack with range (stay 20' away to prevent a charge, and then an additional 20' to keep out of its reach; though looking at the Sumitha map, the area may be a bit too close-quarters to do that very successfully...). It also has Light Sensitivity, so adding bright light will tack on a -1 to its attack rolls.
Assuming the group is level 10, the Alchemist can go to town and buy a scroll of Freedom of Movement and add it to his Formula Book. If he has the Infusion Discovery, he could then pass out a couple of Elixers of these to whichever PC's plan to fight it up front. With Freedom of Movement, the Great Mother's DPR is immediately halved, making her much more manageable.
Elven Gunslinger. The racial Con penalty hurts. She's not outright in the negatives, but her hp isn't exactly stellar. Good Dex though.
Normally they negate some of that by careful battlefield positioning, but that's tough against a super-stealther with great reach. By the time you know you're in a battle, getting out is hard.
...The whole party's just countered hard by that monster, at any rate. Witch doesn't like to be grappled, and doesn't play with spells that'll one-shot an encounter on her own (she usually supports), sneak attacks and crits are negated and both our best melee types rely on those pretty well, and the Gunslinger could probably finish the fight single-handedly if she could stay out of range, but getting back away from this thing's a tricky prospect.
Freedom of Movement is not a bad idea. I'll suggest it as an anti-grapple option, since they've basically struggled with grapplers all campaign.
Ultimately though, I think I'm just going to replace the Great Mother with one of those weird Cyclopes with the eye and mouth on their torso, from (I think) Bestiary 5. Say he had a wish already used, giving him summon monster (or something) as a one-use SLA, or as a Contingency sort of thing, or something. He can summon some dinosaurs, run to get backup while the party fights those, etc. Should be fun.
|Darius Darkblade aka Legionare
|Neil Spicer Contributor, RPG Superstar 2009, RPG Superstar Judgernaut
Looking at a map of the Shackles, it occurs to me that the Isle of Empty Eyes is about as far north as Tempest Cay, which would give it the same weather modifiers (+36 when rolling random weather). This means there's just under a 20% chance for no precipitation, and the rest of the time it's at least raining. I've never really pictured the Island of Empty Eyes as a storm-worn island similar to Tempest Cay, but it would appear that it is. Has anyone else noticed this? Have you run the Island of Empty Eyes under constant rainfall and storms?
I have an unusual question to pose for folks familiar with this module. It revolves around Severe Diplomacy, or attempts at it.
My gaming group is one that, if at all possible, will always try diplomacy if it seems feasible. They're also not the bloodthirsty types and avoid combat if it doesn't make sense to them. Looking at the dire circumstances the cyclopes of the island face (extinction via starvation), it makes sense that, if the heroes are able to figure this out somehow, they would try to ally with the cyclopes, offering food and general weal in exchange for their help defending the island against intruders.
The problem is, I'm not sure if it can happen, or how easily.
I've only started really reading this module (I'm 1/3 of the way through the second one in the series, I have a ways to go before they get to the Island) but I'm not seeing any indications of plot points that cater to a diplomatic approach. Our bard may just have the mad skills to make peace with at least some of the cyclopes, in which case they might be able to get an audience with the Great Cyclops. If they do, however, I don't have any guidelines for handling it. I can probably come up with a few things on my own, but I'd welcome any suggestions from readers on the board that are familiar with The Island of Empty Eyes. Thanks!
Check out the Plunder and Peril Module - there's an encounter where the PC's are expected to meet and humor an Adult Brine Dragon in order to gain permission to search his territory for a certain object. The Module gives you interests and tactics that the PC's can utilize, as well as subjects and actions that anger the dragon. This is the closest thing I've personally seen to what you're looking for. Also, Plunder and Peril takes place in the Shackles and is for Players of levels 4, 5, and 6, so you could use stuff from it right now if you wanted!
I was thinking more specifically for advice relating to the cyclopes in mod 4. I have some ideas on how the PCs could try making peace, though I'm certain it wouldn't be easy...the cyclopes would certainly attack on sight, for food if nothing else, making that method an uphill struggle. They'd also have to pass up on a lot of loot, which for them is a secondary consideration, but they'd be willing to do that.
Thanks Cuup...I got Peril and Plunder and it gives some good rulesy guidelines for handling a Diplomacy effort with difficult opponents. I am thinking of adding a cyclops mystic/oracle type to possibly help make this possible, though the party bard will have to push his Diplo-nut powers to make it happen.
Looking at the dire circumstances the cyclopes of the island face (extinction via starvation), it makes sense that, if the heroes are able to figure this out somehow, they would try to ally with the cyclopes, offering food and general weal in exchange for their help defending the island against intruders.
My group is playing this now and I've always had this potential outcome in mind for them. It can work if you say it can. My party will have to deal with hostile cyclopes. There will be clues about the cyclopes' plight:
- the party cleric knows Gholgan. He'll hear the cyclopes refer to then as "food!"
- the party will come across the remains of corpses of the large creatures they've slain, all the meat removed: the Shark-eating crabs and the giant anaconda.
- The party already knows the cyclopes can raid the fort. The party also understands why. They don't particularly have anything against the cyclopes at this point so parleying with them is certainly an option.
I figure so long as they can successfully communicate to the cyclopes that the party is willing to assist in feeding them and succeed at their diplomacy attempt, they could work out a pact that might allow them to borrow the cyclopes' holy artifact (that gem)
The script does mention a cyclops druid gone fishing off-scene. This can be potentially recruited for their fleet in the next volume. Even if it's just a huge raft with jury-rigged sail. Or, if the party does eradicate the cyclopes in Sumitha, the druid and her party can return to exact revenge...
Can go either way for my group. Hope you have fun with yours!
My players just finished the feast for the Pirate Council, and they deduced Sefina charmed the courtesan to spike Avimar's drink. They then promptly decided to go to bed.
So, I'm trying to decide if it's a tremendous d*ck move to have the Eel start his sabotage while the party sleeps without Sefina firing the skyrocket. It seems to be the most likely/logical course, but, based on the layout the party designed for their fort, by the time they're awoken and make it to the ships, at best they'll be able stop the third bomb (I estimate). I know that isn't a huge hit to their respect total; I just don't want to make them think I'm screwing them over.
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Quick question, no where near this book but wondering what people did.
What was done about Tidewater Rock? Did your players just fully drop it? Move the people to the Island of Empty Eyes?
They kept it as a second base of operations. After winning several ships, they gave them to their allies as a reward to go and engage in piracy in the Shackles, so every now and then they'd come back and their captains would have deposited a couple points of plunder. Plus, my party's captain married the Lady of the Rock, and she didn't care to leave, so they always had a connection back to it.
My two cents to a couple things above...
1. If the party has see invisibility up I would give them 1 opposed perception/stealth check to spot the eel. As a player I'd feel cheated if I didn't have a shot after preparing the right counter. The party may (probably will) or may not catch him after he is spotted.
2. If the eel starts blowing up ships it is reasonable to expect the party to have dimension door, phantom steed or similar at this level to quickly reach the bay. If they don't they probably won't get a shot at saving a ship.
It will be a while before I can run this one but I hope to run this with as little railroad as possible within the context of an adventure path.