I know lately i have been spamming with help requestes, i apologize if i'm getting boring.
The fact is my experience in GMing the d20 after OGL came out is all from 3.5, and i thought PF would have been more or less the same.
I tried GMing some sessions of Carrion Crown or Second Darkness, but being official material the AP have pregenerated CR for encounters.
So i began running a game in a world of my design, and so is the story, but i'm seeing i cannot come up with challenging encounters.
I follow what the tables says and i add minions if the main bad guy is alone ( group of six ),but till now they just killed every encounter the tables said should have been a difficult one like a walk in the park.
So far i mainly used melee encounters, and maybe i understimated the party's strenght so i'm doing a last attempt at throwing at the group a combat and stealth focused quest, before trying with a full casters/undeads dungeon.
Actually my PCs are all well into 5 and not far from 6; they are in a Katapesh/Osirion like setting and trying to free a village overcome by gnolls raiders/slavers :
The leader is a barbarian 6 with augmented statblock (20 pnts) and pc-like equip,fighting with one handed/board and TWF
There are also about 10 elite gnolls bodyguard CR4 (also with augmented stats) and 50+ regular CR1 gnolls.
I know i cannot expect them to take all the village at once;it is mainly an infiltration and intelligence mission.There will be allies to be found among the enslaved people,but i'm trying to make things difficult for a change.
The other dungeon i still have to finish the design, but the final boss should be this:
Drow conjurer 6 turned lich CR 8
XP 4800
NE (medium undead, elf)
Initiative +3 ; Senses Darkvision 120ft ,Perception+11
Aura fear (60feet / will DC16)
Defense
AC 19,Touch 14 ,Flat footed 15 ( Dex+3, Natural+5, Deflection +1, Size)
HP 39 (6d6+18 )
Fortitude +1 , Reflexes +5 , Will +8
DR 15/bludgeoning and magic ; Immune magical sleep ,electricity,cold,undead traits ; channel resist+4 SR 12
Vulnerability light blindness
Offence
Speed 30 feet
Meele touch +2 (1d8+3 plus Paralyzing touch)
+1 shortsword +3 (1d6 /19-20 x2)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Aura of fear (60feet / will DC16) / Paralyzing touch (fortitude DC16)
Acid dart ranged touch attack,8x day (1d6+3 acid)
Spells (CL 6 ; concentration+15 )
3°: Summon monster III x2, Protection from energy, Fireball (reflexes DC17)
2°: Acid arrow x2 (2d4 acid x 2rounds), Summon monster II, Mirror image, See invisibility
1°:Protection from law, Mage armor, Summon monster I x2, Magic missile x2 (3 missiles)
0°:Acid splash (1d3 acid) , Resistance, Detect magic, Flare
Spell-like abilities (CL 6 ; concentration+15 )
1xday: Dancing lights , Darkness , Faerie fire
Statistics
Str 8, Dex 16, Con /, Int 18, Wis 15 Cha 16
BaB +3 ; CMB +2 ; CMD 15
Feats Combat casting,Iron will,Augment summoning,Improved familiar
Skills Knowledge arcana+14, Knowledge history+12, Knowledge planes+13, Knowledge locals+12, Linguistics+12, Spellcraft+14, Appraise+13, Fly+9, Perception+11, Stealth+14,Sense motive+9
SQ Arcane bond (fiendish cat),Scribe scrolls, Arcane school (conjuration),Opposite schools (Transmutation, Necromancy),Cantrips,+2 will vs enchantment,Poison expert,Rejuvenation, Summoner's charm (+3 round),
Possessions +1 shortsword , Ring of protection +1 , mw handcrossbow (400oro), Rod of Undetectable Alignment , Wizard scroll 2° Levitate x2 , Wizard scroll 2° Summon monster II, Wizard scroll 2° Flaming sphere
The PCs are:
CG (medium humanoid, elf)
Initiative +3 ; Senses Low light vision ; Perception +3
Traits Corageous – Focused mind
Defense
AC 18 ,Touch 13 ,Flat footed 15 ( Armor +5, Dex+3, Size )
HP 42 (5d8+5+4+5 )
Fortitude +6 , Reflexes +7 , Will +4 (+6 vs. fear)
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 30 ft
Melee +1 scimitar +8 (1d6+4/18-20 x2)
Ranged mw composite longbow (str+1) +7 (1d8+1/x2)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Spell combat; Spell strike
Spells (CL5 ; Concentration +13 )
2nd level :Frigid touch (x2); Bull's strength
1st level : Shocking grasp (x2); Magic missile ; Shield
Cantrips : Acid splash ; Detect magic ; Dancing lights ; Read magic
Statistics
Str 16 , Dex 16 , Con 12 , Int 16 , Wis 8 , Cha 10
BaB +3 ; CMB +6 ; CMD 19
Feats Combat casting, Weapon focus scimitar, Thoughness, Craft magic arms/armors
Skills Acrobatics +4, Craft-alchemy- +9, Escape artist +4, Ride +8, Knowledge arcana +11, Knowledge dungeoneering +7, Knowledge planes +8, Stealth +4, Swim +8, Perception +3, Spellcraft +11/+13, Climb +7, Fly +3
SQ magus arcana pool (5) ; 3rd level arcana-familiar (weasel) ; Spell recall
Possessions +1 scimitar ; +1 chain shirt ; Cloak of resistance +1 ; potion of Shield ; 2x potion of Cure light wounds ;
potion of Owl's wisdom
NG (medium humanoid,dwarf)
Initiative +1 ; Senses darkvision 60 ft ; Perception +5
Traits Anatomist– Undead slayer
Defense
AC 21 ,Touch 11 ,Flat footed 20 ( Armor +7, Dex+1, Shield +2, Natural +1 Size )
HP 40 (5d8+10 )
Fortitude +6 , Reflexes +2 , Will +8
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 20 ft
Melee dwarven waraxe +5 (1d10+1/x3)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Domains (Death-Healing) / Channel positive en. 3xday (3d6/save will DC12)
Spells (CL5 ; Concentration +13 )
3rd level : Magic circle against evil ; Dispel magic ; Cure serious wounds (D)
2nd level : Bull's strength ; Sound burst ; Hold person ; Cure moderate wounds (D)
1st level : Endure elements; Protection from evil ; Bless ; Shield of faith ; Cure light wounds (D)
Orisons : Create water ; Detect magic ; Resistance ; Stabilize
Statistics
Str 12 ,Dex 12 , Con 14 , Int 12 , Wis 19 , Cha 10
BaB +3 ; CMB +4 ; CMD 15 (19 vs bull rush/trip attempts)
Feats Combat casting, Weapon focus Dwarven waraxe, Ironhide
Skills Knowledge arcana +5, Knowledge nobility +5, Knowledge religions +8, Diplomacy +6, Heal +11,
Sense motive +10, Perception+5, Spellcraft +5, Climb +2, Appraise +5
SQ Death domain (Bleeding touch 7xday)-Healing domain (Rebuke death 7xday)
Possessions Dwarven waraxe ; +1 breastplate ; +1 Light steel shield ; potion of Shield ; 2x potion of Cure light wounds
scroll of Cure moderate wounds ; potion of Cure serious wounds
N (medium humanoid,human)
Initiative +5 ; Senses Perception +3
Traits Anatomist– Adopted (Elven reflexes)
Defense
AC 22 ,Touch 14 ,Flat footed 18 ( Armor +7, Dex+3, Shield +1, Dodge+1, Size )
HP 48 (5d10+10 )
Fortitude +6 , Reflexes +4 , Will +2 (+3 vs fear)
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 30ft
Melee mw sword,two-bladed (two handed) +12 (1d8+9/19-20 x2) or
mw sword,two-bladed (two weapons fighting)+10/+10 (1d8+7-1d8+7/19-20 x2)
Ranged mw composite longbow (str +2) +9 (1d8+2/x3)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks no
Spells no
Statistics
Str 18 ,Dex 17 , Con 14 , Int 10 , Wis 12 , Cha 8
BaB +5 ; CMB +9 ; CMD 22
Feats Exotic wepons proficiency (two bladed sword), Weapon focus two bladed sword, Dodge, Two weapons fighting,
Two weapons defense, Weapon specialization two bladed sword, Double slice
Skills Handle animals+3, Ride+7, Knowledge dungeoneering+4, Intimidate+7, Linguistics+1, Swim+9,
Perception+3, Climb +8, Survival+8
SQ Bravery+1; Armor training 1; Weapon training (blades,heavy) 1
Possessions Mw two bladed sword ; +1 breastplate ; Gauntlets of ogre power +2 str ; potion of Protection from evil ;
potion of Enlarge person ; 5xpotion of Cure light wounds ; potion of Cure moderate wounds
CG (medium outsider, native)
Initiative +12 ; Senses darkvision 60 ft ; Perception +8 (+10 traps)
Traits Reactionary – Exile
Defense
AC 19 ,Touch 15 ,Flat footed 14 ( Armor +4, Dex+4, Dodge+1 Size, +1 vs traps)
HP 35 (5d8+5)
Fortitude +3 , Reflexes +9 (+10 traps) , Will +2
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no ; Resistances Fire 5, Cold 5, Electricity 5
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 30 ft
Melee mw rapier +9 (1d6+1/18-20 x2)
Ranged mw composite shortbow (str+1) +8 (1d6+1/x3)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Sneak attack 3d6
Spell-like ability ( CL5 ; Concentration +6 ) Darkness 1xday
Statistics
Str 12 , Dex 18 , Con 12 , Int 14 , Wis 10 , Cha 12
BaB +3 ; CMB +4 ; CMD 18
Feats Improved initiative, Dodge, Combat reflexes
Skills Acrobatics +17, Escape artist +12, Disguise+6, Disable device +12(+14 traps), Ride +5, Knowledge local +7, Diplomacy +7, Perform dance+6, Stealth +13, Intimidate+7, Sense motive+8, Perception +8 (+10 traps), Bluff +10
Sleight of hands+8, Climb +6, Survival+1, UMD+7, Appraise+6
SQ Rogue talents (Bleeding attack // Finesse rogue) ; Trapfinding; Evasion; Trap sense +1;Uncanny dodge
Possessions Mithral chain shirt ; mw rapier ; Ring of resistance +1 ;mw composite shortbow (str+1);
Boots of tumbling +5 ; potion of Cat's grace ; 2x potion of Cure light wounds ; potion of Endure elements
LG (medium outsider, native)
Initiative +2 ; Senses darkvision 60 ft ; Perception +6
Traits Anatomist – Flame of the Dawnflower
Defense
AC 24 ,Touch 12 ,Flat footed 22 ( Armor +9,Shield+3, Dex+1, Dodge+1 Size)
HP 46 (5d8+10)
Fortitude +9 , Reflexes +5, Will +8
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no ; Resistances Acid 5, Cold 5, Electricity 5
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 20 ft
Melee +1 scimitar +9 (1d6+3/18-20 x2)
Ranged mw composite longbow (str+1) +6 (1d8+1/x3)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Smite evil (+3 attack/+5 dam, against evil creatures); Channel positive energy (3d6 // save will DC15)
Spell-like ability ( CL5 ; Concentration +8 ) Daylight 1xday
Spells ( CL2 ; Concentration +5 )
1st level Lesser restoration; Grace
Statistics
Str 15 , Dex 13 , Con 14 , Int 12 , Wis 12 , Cha 16
BaB +5 ; CMB +7 ; CMD 18
Feats Weapon focus scimitar, Dodge, Outflank
Skills Ride +6, Knowledge religion +6, Diplomacy +13, Intimidate+4, Sense motive+9, Perception +6,
Survival+2
SQ Mercy (Sickened) ;Aura of good; Detect evil ; Divine grace; Lay on hands 5x day; Aura of courage; Divine health;
Channel positive energy; Divine bond (bonded weapon)
Possessions Full plate; +1 scimitar ; +1 steel shield,heavy ;mw composite longtbow (str+1);
potion of Cure moderate wounds ; 2x potion of Cure light wounds
NG (medium humanoid, human)
Initiative +2 ; Senses Perception +2
Traits Indomitable faith – World traveler
Defense
AC 17 ,Touch 12, Flat footed 15 ( Armor +4, Dex+2, Natural+1 Size )
HP 31 (5d6+5 )
Fortitude +3 , Reflexes +4 , Will +5
DR no ; Immune no ; SR no ; Resistances Fire 5
Weakness no
Offense
Speed 30 ft
Melee claws +3 (1d4+1/ x2)
Ranged mw crossbow +5 (1d8/19-20x2)
Space med.creature ; Reach 5ft
Special attacks Spells
Spells (CL5 ; Concentration +14 )
2nd level (6xday) :Acid arrow; Mirror images ; Resist energy*
1st level (8xday) : Magic missile; Endure elements ; Shield ; Mage armor* ; Enlarge person
Cantrips (at will) : Acid splash ; Detect magic ; Resistance ; Read magic ; Light ; Disrupt undead
Statistics
Str 12 , Dex 14 , Con 12 , Int 10 , Wis 8 , Cha 20
BaB +2 ; CMB +3 ; CMD 15
Feats Combat casting, Prof. Light armors, Arcane armor training, Craft wondrous item
Skills Bluff +12, Escape artist +4, Ride +3, Knowledge arcana +4, Diplomacy +12, Perform dance+6, Intimidate +6
Linguistics +1, Perception +2 , Spellcraft +7
SQ Natural attacks-claws; Dragon resistances ; Spells dealing energy dam of the bloodline's dragon type add +1 dam x die rolled of that energy type
Possessions Mithral chain shirt; Amulet of resistance +1 ; mw crossbow,light ; Rod of Magic missile (CL 3 // 18 charges left) ; 5x potion of Cure light wounds ; scroll of Shocking grasp ; potion of Shield ; scroll od Summon monster I
Edit:my final question should be....am i exagerating with these encounters or the PCs will just make another short work of everything?
Party of 6 level 5 PCs = APL 6.
APL 6 = CR 5 encounters are walk in park, CR 6 are stuff handled easily. CR 7 are moderate challenges, CR 8 are hard challenges, CR 9 are zomgbbqwtfhitus.
This is why i'm getting frustrated,i read the tables and used always APL +1 to +3 encounters.
Think i misread the final CR until now.| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
A quick peek at your characters looks like they rolled and came out pretty close to a 25 pt buy. They all have about +9 total ability score bonuses (except the paladin, who has +10) which are naturally optimized for their characters. They hit more often, they hit harder, their special abilities are more effective, saves are better, spell DCs are harder, etc.
The average 15 pt buy (what the APs were built to be challenging for, I think?) gives you about +4 or +5. So essentially, you've given your party roughly a +1 to their individual CRs. If they were (at first level) an encounter, the adventure is treating them as CR 3 (4x1st level characters) but you have 6 stronger than average characters, CR 4 or 5. Granted, this is not how you evaluate your characters, but it can be a helpful way to look at it.
Toughen things up for them by adding mooks to the BBEG encounters. The players biggest advantage in those fights is number of actions, and your guys have 6 to every one of hers. That CR8 lich has 39hps, a total that the fighter can reach in a round if he crits. She has a fairly hittable AC and should last maybe 4 rounds, once the party starts hammering her (assuming she has darkness, mirror image and mage armor up). That gives her 3 or 4 chances to hit back, and she hasn't got the hitting power to have a chance. Her summon spells are going to delay the inevitable, but they'll get chewed up pretty quick. Put a couple of drow ninjas with her in the darkness (even 3rd level) and your party will have a fight on their hands. Give her a Schir demon sidekick, and the players will be crying for mama.
The other thing to avoid is a static dungeon environment, where the party can use their best stuff every encounter and walk away to recover whenever they're low on resources. Meet the lich when the paladin's used his smite and the casters have thrown some of their best spells. They'll still beat her, but they'll have to sweat for it.
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Yes, use multiple encounters of moderate difficulty to wear them down before the big boss fights.
If they're stomping everything you throw at them, either:
A. Just add more guys to each encounter -- WAY more guys, like 4 or 6 each time.
B. Slap the Simple Advanced Template on everything. The upshot is about an extra +2 on every roll for the monsters.
C. Give everything maximum hit points so that the monsters have more chances to hit the PCs.
D. Cheat. You know the party's weaknesses. Unhittable fighter? Dominate Monster turns him on the party. Super wizard? Antimagic Field. Crazy gear builds? Sunder that stuff, and send in the rust monsters.
IMPORTANT TO KNOW:
you have a balanced party, enough healing, melee combat, mass damage and trap disabling. Looking at their builds, they know the game an know how to play: This means that they always have an answer to problems. This kind of party is supposed to do it good. I does'nt mean you can make it exiting now and then.
They are Level 5 and it is important to use magic. I dont see any magic. This can be in the form of Caster or Monster with spell like abilities.
A character fascinated by the spell or a level 2 rogu with normal invisibilty delivering a sneak attack can give your party a surprise. Create difficult terrain, Underwater combat, even low CR creatures can make it exiting. , Combat in total darkness with low CR createres can be tough because not everybody is able to see.
Make sure you give them in one encounter different types of enemeys. Lets roll the knowledges to recognise the real threats in a combat.
For example.
1 Sorcere level 5Casterlevels , Casting Ray of enfeeblement, Burninghands etc give a extra dimension.
2 Fighter types level 3HD, Give them trip or disarm,
2 Rogue HD 3 Each.
This cant kill a party but makes it a very interesting combat.
That CR8 lich has 39hps, a total that the fighter can reach in a round if he crits. She has a fairly hittable AC and should last maybe 4 rounds, once the party starts hammering her (assuming she has darkness, mirror image and mage armor up). That gives her 3 or 4 chances to hit back, and she hasn't got the hitting power to have a chance. Her summon spells are going to delay the inevitable, but they'll get chewed up pretty quick. Put a couple of drow ninjas with her in the darkness (even 3rd level) and your party will have a fight on their hands. Give her a Schir demon sidekick, and the players will be crying for mama.
Thanks for the advice, i'm still building the dungeon.Of course the drow lich isn't going to be alone.
Also,
Augment Summoning requires Spell Focus (conjuration).
Lich's Fort save go off Cha bonus, so you should be at Fort +5 not +1.
Why the shortsword? It eats up 2k of gold for items of more use both for the lich and for PCs (like, Wands or a Cloak of Protection).
Just randomly generated.My bad for the feat prerequisite,wil correct.