Additional Resources Updates


Pathfinder Society

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Sovereign Court

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Chris Lambertz wrote:
A reminder: let's keep this thread strictly about updates to the Additional Resources to keep it easier to sort through, please.

Silver Crusade

Chris Lambertz wrote:

Additional Resources has been updated! :)

This has probably been asked before, but I'm not sure what the ruling is, because they were talking about aasimar/tiefling boons in the past tense...I have a few aasimar characters from before they cut off Aasimar/tiefling characters from "always available" resources. Does that let me create characters that are aasimar? or just keep playing the ones I have?

Shadow Lodge

You can still play the ones you have, but to create a new one you need the boon.

5/5

You have to have played the PC prior to the cutoff date - just GM credit is not enough.

Silver Crusade

GM Lamplighter wrote:
You have to have played the PC prior to the cutoff date - just GM credit is not enough.

I have played aasimar before the cutoff date. I wasn't saying GM credit.

Silver Crusade

Chris Lambertz wrote:
Additional Resources has been updated! :)

One more question: Where it says that the Varisian Idol is not allowed in the list of either Rise of the Runelords player's guide or Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide, the other doesn't say it, but has the Varisian Idol as well on the listed pages. Is this an error?

Shadow Lodge 5/5

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GM Lamplighter wrote:
You have to have played the PC prior to the cutoff date - just GM credit is not enough.

That's not true, unless this was further clarified. GM credit is okay as long as the intent was noted.

The Occult Mysteries playtest was run that way, though.

1/5

Paranoidmark wrote:
One more question: Where it says that the Varisian Idol is not allowed in the list of either Rise of the Runelords player's guide or Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide, the other doesn't say it, but has the Varisian Idol as well on the listed pages. Is this an error?

The two sources have different Varisian Idols.

Sovereign Court

Paranoidmark wrote:
Chris Lambertz wrote:
Additional Resources has been updated! :)
One more question: Where it says that the Varisian Idol is not allowed in the list of either Rise of the Runelords player's guide or Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide, the other doesn't say it, but has the Varisian Idol as well on the listed pages. Is this an error?

I suspect that it is a mistake, because it is also explicitly banned in Varisia, Birthplace of Legends. I would advise against depending on or purchasing this item.

Silver Crusade

shaventalz wrote:
Paranoidmark wrote:
One more question: Where it says that the Varisian Idol is not allowed in the list of either Rise of the Runelords player's guide or Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide, the other doesn't say it, but has the Varisian Idol as well on the listed pages. Is this an error?
The two sources have different Varisian Idols.

There don't appear to be any rules differences as far as I can tell, though. The Varisian idols have different descriptions, but only in the descriptive text as far as I can tell.

Sovereign Court

Paranoidmark wrote:
shaventalz wrote:
Paranoidmark wrote:
One more question: Where it says that the Varisian Idol is not allowed in the list of either Rise of the Runelords player's guide or Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide, the other doesn't say it, but has the Varisian Idol as well on the listed pages. Is this an error?
The two sources have different Varisian Idols.
There don't appear to be any rules differences as far as I can tell, though. The Varisian idols have different descriptions, but only in the descriptive text as far as I can tell.

Crimson Throne has these rules for the item:

Crimson Throne Player's guide, pg 13 wrote:

Varisian Idol: These depictions of forgotten spirits can

be used to augment summoning magic. If used as an additional
material component for any summon monster or
summon nature’s ally spell, the summoned creature has an
additional +2 hit points per Hit Die.
Rise of the Rune Lords Player's Guide, pg 11 wrote:

Varisian Idol: Scavenged from rare uneroded Varisian monuments,

these depictions of forgotten spirits can be used to augment
summoning magic. If used as an additional material component
for any summon monster or summon nature’s ally spell, the summoned
creature has an additional +2 hit points per Hit Die.

It is mechanically identical to the varisian idol in Rise of the Runelords players guide, but much different than the varisian idol in Varisia, Birthplace of Legends.

Would be easier to not take it.

Grand Lodge 2/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Something for whomever is approving Melee Tactics Toolbox to consider; the book contains a number of items that are explicitly described as alchemic, but none of them have crafting DCs. Can Alchemists and Investigators craft these items?

Liberty's Edge 5/5 5/5 Venture-Agent, United Kingdom—England—Chester aka Paz

Darrell Impey UK wrote:
Something for whomever is approving Melee Tactics Toolbox to consider; the book contains a number of items that are explicitly described as alchemic, but none of them have crafting DCs.

Response on that HERE; they're DC 25.

Grand Lodge 2/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Thanks Paz. Now to wait and see what's approved. :)

Community & Digital Content Manager

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Additional Resources has been updated with the Melee Tactics Toolbox.

Scarab Sages 5/5 5/5

Just wondering, does anyone know if there are plans to add PFS chronicles to the Kingmaker Adventure Path (and make parts of the PFS legal to play?), like they have for most of the other adventure paths?

The Exchange 5/5

Darrell Impey UK wrote:
Thanks Paz. Now to wait and see what's approved. :)

Gee, I wish they would do this for Clearear from Adventurers Armory (set a crafting DC for it I mean)...

Grand Lodge 4/5 Venture-Agent, Nevada—Las Vegas aka kinevon

Revvy Bitterleaf wrote:
Just wondering, does anyone know if there are plans to add PFS chronicles to the Kingmaker Adventure Path (and make parts of the PFS legal to play?), like they have for most of the other adventure paths?

There are, indeed, plans, IIRC. Note that the older APs are being done in reverse order, from most recent backwards; and that they are being done in an "as time allows" fashion, when they get time between other projects, like sanctioning the newer APs, modules and scenarios.

Shadow Lodge 5/5 5/55/5 Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East aka thistledown

kinevon wrote:
Revvy Bitterleaf wrote:
Just wondering, does anyone know if there are plans to add PFS chronicles to the Kingmaker Adventure Path (and make parts of the PFS legal to play?), like they have for most of the other adventure paths?
There are, indeed, plans, IIRC. Note that the older APs are being done in reverse order, from most recent backwards; and that they are being done in an "as time allows" fashion, when they get time between other projects, like sanctioning the newer APs, modules and scenarios.

Not that they're exactly speedy on the newer AP's either.

Shadow Lodge

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Yeah, John suffers from a terrible ailment known as "too-much-crap-to-do-itis".

Sovereign Court 4/5 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Netherlands—Leiden aka Ascalaphus

Are the monsters from the Monster Codex legal polymorph targets, like Bestiary monsters? They lack that text in the Additional Resources.

Could they be? Pretty please? :P


I would like a clarification on the use of authorized material, one from a fully legal book (field guide) compared to the segment in one that isn't fully listed (Monster Codex).

The question I have is Grenadier. It is legal in the Field guide, but not listed as authorized in the monster codex although everything about it is the same minus the initial title that states "The following archetype is common among hobgoblin alchemists, who wish to maximize their destruction."

So it is stated in a fully authorized source, but not part of the list in the other segmented source. Can I use the segmented source as proof of resource? And will this work for other items that are worded the same?

(if I misread the class then please correct me and I'll take the lashes).

Silver Crusade 2/5 RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16 aka cartmanbeck

Hzardus wrote:

I would like a clarification on the use of authorized material, one from a fully legal book (field guide) compared to the segment in one that isn't fully listed (Monster Codex).

The question I have is Grenadier. It is legal in the Field guide, but not listed as authorized in the monster codex although everything about it is the same minus the initial title that states "The following archetype is common among hobgoblin alchemists, who wish to maximize their destruction."

So it is stated in a fully authorized source, but not part of the list in the other segmented source. Can I use the segmented source as proof of resource? And will this work for other items that are worded the same?

(if I misread the class then please correct me and I'll take the lashes).

Are you just asking because you currently own the Monster Codex but not the Field Guide? I think the answer is no, you need to own the Field Guide.

3/5

Hzardus wrote:
The question I have is Grenadier. It is legal in the Field guide, but not listed as authorized in the monster codex although everything about it is the same minus the initial title that states "The following archetype is common among hobgoblin alchemists, who wish to maximize their destruction."

... or, as an alternate phrasing to the Powers-That-Be: as the text of the alchemist grenadier archtype in the Monster Codex appears to be exactly the same text as that appearing in the Pathfinder Society Field Guide, save the specification that hobgoblins often take the archtype, would you please look at the Monster Codex Grenadier again for inclusion in additional resources, or advise why it is illegal when it is mechanically the same archtype?

-TimD


TimD wrote:
Hzardus wrote:
The question I have is Grenadier. It is legal in the Field guide, but not listed as authorized in the monster codex although everything about it is the same minus the initial title that states "The following archetype is common among hobgoblin alchemists, who wish to maximize their destruction."

... or, as an alternate phrasing to the Powers-That-Be: as the text of the alchemist grenadier archtype in the Monster Codex appears to be exactly the same text as that appearing in the Pathfinder Society Field Guide, save the specification that hobgoblins often take the archtype, would you please look at the Monster Codex Grenadier again for inclusion in additional resources, or advise why it is illegal when it is mechanically the same archtype?

-TimD

This ^ and if there is other portions that pop up that are similar (like other items or archtypes etc.) circumstances. Mainly to avoid purchasing a whole different book for that one thing if the player already has a resource available but was overlooked for whatever reason. Its understandable those that put the additional resources together might miss some specifics like this from multiple sources.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Did the list of approved Animal Companions from the bestiaries change? I could have sworn the Spinosaurus from Bestiary 3 was legal (and Archives of Nethys still lists it as legal) but I no longer see it listed in Additional Resources as a legal animal companion.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I see from earlier thread that I'm not the only person who didn't realize that the list of Animal Companions which are legal had changed recently - can we please get a post or update that clearly spells out when formally legal options are no longer legal for PFS?

And please include what to do for players and characters that have been using and investing in those now illegal options. Rebuilding an Animal Companion is non-trivial (especially if items as well as feats etc have been invested in building that character)

Scarab Sages 4/5

The Spinosaurus hasn't been legal for at least 2 years. Here's the post from earlier in this thread where this is discussed.

LINK

Granted, at the time no one knew it happened, but there was a discussion of it here a while back.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Yes. I found that. But still it begs the question of exactly when it happened and why there wasn't an official post about it and what to do with existing companions that are now illegal (which is more than just the Spinosaurus)

5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Finland—Tampere aka Rei

Rycaut wrote:
Yes. I found that. But still it begs the question of exactly when it happened and why there wasn't an official post about it and what to do with existing companions that are now illegal (which is more than just the Spinosaurus)

The existing companions are illegal, so you must replace them with a legal option immediately.

As to why there was no post about it, my guess is, someone dropped the ball somewhere in the chain of communication.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Why is the COMPSOGNATHUS listed as an animal companion in the Bestiary 2 entry when there are no stats for them as an animal companion?

Sovereign Court 5/5 RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

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Eagerly awaits the update to additional resources. Heroes off the wild gave me some excellent ideas.

The Concordance 5/5 5/55/5

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Rei wrote:
Rycaut wrote:
Yes. I found that. But still it begs the question of exactly when it happened and why there wasn't an official post about it and what to do with existing companions that are now illegal (which is more than just the Spinosaurus)
The existing companions are illegal, so you must replace them with a legal option immediately.

I just RPed it as the Society complaining that my Spinosaurus was eating more Aspis than they could interrogate, so they asked that I leave it at home.

Besides, a more accurate, recent construction of Spinosaurus replaces the "Jurassic Park" image we all have in mind, and I just couldn't continue to bring along what is now essentially a crocodile with a fin on its back.


I wondered if there will be any items legal from Champions of corruption?
I know most from the stuff there propably won't be allowed from PFS, but there were some items which might be ok.

Silver Crusade 5/5

Ibram Gaunt wrote:

I wondered if there will be any items legal from Champions of corruption?

I know most from the stuff there propably won't be allowed from PFS, but there were some items which might be ok.

They've already made it clear that nothing from Champions of Corruption is going to make it onto the AR. I would've liked to see it made a legal source for deities, since there aren't very many sources that have Tien deities in them.

Scarab Sages 5/5 5/5 Venture-Captain, Washington—Spokane

UndeadMitch wrote:
Ibram Gaunt wrote:

I wondered if there will be any items legal from Champions of corruption?

I know most from the stuff there propably won't be allowed from PFS, but there were some items which might be ok.
They've already made it clear that nothing from Champions of Corruption is going to make it onto the AR. I would've liked to see it made a legal source for deities, since there aren't very many sources that have Tien deities in them.

Unfortunately, it only lists the Tien deities with Evil alignments. Both the Dragon Empires Gazeteer and Primer have the complete lists.


Hmm ok. I though at least this ring which protects from negative Energy might become legal. Maybe it actually can, but on a chronicle sheet.

Anyways thanks for that clarification.

Scarab Sages

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Ferious Thune wrote:

The Spinosaurus hasn't been legal for at least 2 years. Here's the post from earlier in this thread where this is discussed.

Not quite true i have a May 2014 Additional resources where Spinosaurus was on the legal animal companions for beastiary 3.

I think from time to time it popped on the list qnd then next time disappeared again. And if you happened to look on that May 2014 list and saw it was legal you probably didn't think to keep checking every month.

Silver Crusade 5/5

Preston Hudson wrote:
UndeadMitch wrote:
Ibram Gaunt wrote:

I wondered if there will be any items legal from Champions of corruption?

I know most from the stuff there propably won't be allowed from PFS, but there were some items which might be ok.
They've already made it clear that nothing from Champions of Corruption is going to make it onto the AR. I would've liked to see it made a legal source for deities, since there aren't very many sources that have Tien deities in them.
Unfortunately, it only lists the Tien deities with Evil alignments. Both the Dragon Empires Gazeteer and Primer have the complete lists.

I have the Dragon Empires Primer, but it only has basic descriptions on each of the deities in Tian Xia, it lacks the domains/subdomains/favored weapons of them. Only the Gazetteer has the full portfolio for each Tien deity. Each of the "Champions" series of books has the portfolio for them as well, so one can also piece them together from those. The Tien deities with evil alignments are legal for neutral worshippers, so that shouldn't be a stopping block, and coud be flavorful.

My sneaky ratfolk rogue would have liked to be a worshipper of Lao Shu Po, but went a different direction because I didn't feel like shelling out for a PDF so I could worship one deity.

Scarab Sages 5/5 5/5 Venture-Captain, Washington—Spokane

Undead Mitch,

I made the reference to the Dragon Empires books to mention they had a complete reference for the Tien deities. I don't blame you for not wanting to shell out for a PDF for only one item. According to the Additional Resources, Lao Shu Po is a legal option and, after looking at the other Champion books, I do agree that Champions of Corruption should allow the deity information in PFS. Thank you for pointing out that the other Champions books had the rest of the Tien deities.

Silver Crusade 5/5

Sorry about that, I should have been more clear with that coming out the gate.

Silver Crusade 5/5 5/55/5 Venture-Captain, Germany—Bavaria

This is going into the old "material appears in a number of books, but only one is a legal source§ territory again.

But unless I am mistaken, you don't need the book to worship a deity unless you get some kind of mechanical benefit out of it.

Scarab Sages 4/5

Dhjika wrote:
Ferious Thune wrote:

The Spinosaurus hasn't been legal for at least 2 years. Here's the post from earlier in this thread where this is discussed.

Not quite true i have a May 2014 Additional resources where Spinosaurus was on the legal animal companions for beastiary 3.

I think from time to time it popped on the list qnd then next time disappeared again. And if you happened to look on that May 2014 list and saw it was legal you probably didn't think to keep checking every month.

I apologize. It seems the confusion went on longer than I thought.

Didn't that earlier discussion result in them using a strikethrough now when text is removed? Or at least adding language when something is removed, like "Pummeling Charge has been removed from the banned list and is now available for play." It's little consolation to the dinosaur owners, but it's progress towards avoiding this kind of issue in the future.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

It might help if they figured out a way to list both the affirmatively allowed options from each book as well as the specifically denied. It would take a new format and would be a lot longer but it would be easier to then show changes.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Dhjika wrote:
Ferious Thune wrote:

The Spinosaurus hasn't been legal for at least 2 years. Here's the post from earlier in this thread where this is discussed.

Not quite true i have a May 2014 Additional resources where Spinosaurus was on the legal animal companions for beastiary 3.

I think from time to time it popped on the list qnd then next time disappeared again. And if you happened to look on that May 2014 list and saw it was legal you probably didn't think to keep checking every month.

Glad to hear this - I thought I had looked at the Additional resources more recently than 2 years ago and saw the Spinosaurus on the list - glad I was not misremembering.

5/5

Rycaut wrote:
It might help if they figured out a way to list both the affirmatively allowed options from each book as well as the specifically denied. It would take a new format and would be a lot longer but it would be easier to then show changes.

I once thought of this, and started to make it. Then I realized what a ridiculously-huge task it was, and stopped. I think the existing system generally works. Things like the spinosaurus don't happen often - Mike has said they will add future deletions in the red "changed" text in future updates.

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I agree that it is a huge task - though possibly it is one that could be crowdsourced to a degree and if started with new additions wouldn't be too hard (the current system where some books list the affirmatively ALLOWED content, some books list only the NOT-ALLOWED content and some mix that with things like "everything on pages ..." I think is actually somewhat hard for people to check to see what is/isn't allowed.

Yes there are dense pages which would make this tricky (pages listing say every familiar allowed or every god allowed. And lists of things like spells or magic items makes the "affirmative" list potentially unworkable (a list of everything from Ultimate Equipment which is allowed would be longer than the whole additional resources document)

but perhaps there is a better approach - just thinking about this:

Books with great than some N number of allowed options are ALWAYS described in terms of the specific items that are not allowed (i.e. Ultimate Equipment or other hardcovers would default to a specific list of what is NOT allowed and a general blanket statement of what is allowed. IF pages or chapters are not-allowed adding the title of that page for clarity (i.e. instead of "chapter 6 isn't allowed" say something like "Chapter 6 - customer magic systems isn't allowed"

Books which are mostly NOT allowed (following a similar criteria) would have ALL affirmatively allowed items spelled out with a blanket statement saying that everything else in the book isn't allowed (and again if entire sections/chapters were allowed these would be at least documented a bit more than just Pages 28-29)

Books which are about evenly split between what is/isn't allowed would list Both lists - the allowed items and the disallowed items. This would allow for highlighting any future changes far more clearly in these cases (mostly splat books not hardcovers)

This third approach might also be taken with specific sections of hardcovers where the list of what is most relevant to a lot of people is actually short while the whole book is only relevant to a handful of people (i.e. bestiaries where the whole book is relevant to druids and a few spell casters using polymorph effects but the sections on animal companions or familiars may be relevant to a lot of players (and the general "no monster feats are allowed unless specifically allowed by another source" needs to be reiterated clearly.

Another approach might be to create a few special tables as part of the Additional Resources document - i.e. lists of Familiars, Animal Companions and possibly Gods along which whether they are/are not allowed and the source(s) required if you use them might be really really helpful in avoiding this confusion in the future


So, is the additional resource page going to be updated soon the reflect the unchained stuff? And hopefully include Heroes of the Wild.

Silver Crusade 5/5

The AR page has traditionally been updated on Wednesday, so I would expect an update either this week or the next.

5/5

Rycault - because this is a critical rules document, I doubt Paizo will ever crowdsource it. Paizo staff would have to go through the entire thing to check it anyway, and it really is a HUGE amount of work.

I agree, there could be some more consistency in the way things are worded from update to update, and it seems that they are working towards that.

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