I know right!
these guys are much scarier than pit fiends.
You ain't just a whistlin' Dixie.
That particular creature is so powerful that it easily represents more of a campaign-ending threat than a mere (1\year) wish spells (+everything else the pit fiend gets).
The thing is horrifying for lower level parties - sure a lot fiend is, too, but properly planned lower levels could hypothetically take it out. This one casually and even incidentally wrecks half your party (Paladins and clerics and inquisitors and Druids and such made nearly worthless nearly instantly) and had solid attacks (or AC) against others. Most notably, it has touch of idiocy. What's that? Your wizard was your last hope? Oh well! Too bad he's in Avernus while he attacks. Or maybe 100 feet away in a brick bubble. Also your GM hates you! Yay!
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.
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That is what it is. Paizo put it together.Rustlord: eats items, drains con, scares players and especially power-gamers.Sounds like a Rust Monster on pcp AND steroids!
that's nothing
2e had rust freaking dragons (a really old rust monster makes a caccoon that then hatches into a hatchling rust dragon at about CR 9 but then as it gets older it has all the normal life stages of rust monsters)But my favorites are probably Linnorms
Some of the only high level monsters that mage-bane won't work on, but still hella powerful. For one, what high level characters bother to use actual cold iron once they can afford a +3
For two, they're the only monsters I know of immune to curses and three, they are just hella vengeful and powerful
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Since the spellcasting rules state that you can target anything you can touch, even if you can't see the target, a deimavigga can technically use most of it's offensive spells against a target even from another plane. It just reaches out and touches you while casting dominate person or similar. Hehe.
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I think one issue with CR is that the designers got better at determining CR as they became better designers through practice. That, and some legacy issues with trying to be backwards compatible with 3.5 materials.
It's the same reason a lot of the newer classes are better than some of the older classes. Also why the Unchained Classes are better. Practice makes one closer to perfect. :-)
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The Froghemoth!
This, because froghemoth!
I skip dragons because calling them "monsters" is a grave insult.
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With Apostate Devils, Paizo at least exercised mercy and/or poor planning with the thing by not giving it access to any divination SLAs or extra vision abilities beyond see in darkness. Sure the thing could hypothetically slap people through a brick wall or from a lounge in Hell, but he has no way to actually tell where anyone is.
It would be laughably easy for a creature of that level to obtain access to scrying through magic items, or something like prying eyes. Hell, if it threw on a headband of vast intelligence keyed to UMD, it would suddenly have a +27 to UMD checks. A few scrolls later it could wreck your day from essentially anywhere.
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I know right!
these guys are much scarier than pit fiends.You ain't just a whistlin' Dixie.
I don't know what this means but I feel like I like it.
That particular creature is so powerful that it easily represents more of a campaign-ending threat than a mere (1\year) wish spells (+everything else the pit fiend gets).The thing is horrifying for lower level parties - sure a lot fiend is, too, but properly planned lower levels could hypothetically take it out. This one casually and even incidentally wrecks half your party (Paladins and clerics and inquisitors and Druids and such made nearly worthless nearly instantly) and had solid attacks (or AC) against others. Most notably, it has touch of idiocy. What's that? Your wizard was your last hope? Oh well! Too bad he's in Avernus while he attacks. Or maybe 100 feet away in a brick bubble. Also your GM hates you! Yay!
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.
They feel a bit like the Empyrean angel compared to the solar to me.
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I know right!
these guys are much scarier than pit fiends.You ain't just a whistlin' Dixie.
I don't know what this means but I feel like I like it.
They feel a bit like the Empyrean angel compared to the solar to me.
That particular creature is so powerful that it easily represents more of a campaign-ending threat than a mere (1\year) wish spells (+everything else the pit fiend gets).The thing is horrifying for lower level parties - sure a lot fiend is, too, but properly planned lower levels could hypothetically take it out. This one casually and even incidentally wrecks half your party (Paladins and clerics and inquisitors and Druids and such made nearly worthless nearly instantly) and had solid attacks (or AC) against others. Most notably, it has touch of idiocy. What's that? Your wizard was your last hope? Oh well! Too bad he's in Avernus while he attacks. Or maybe 100 feet away in a brick bubble. Also your GM hates you! Yay!
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.
I think Pit Fiends are ranked higher because the majority of the deimavigga's abilities are wasted on lawful evil creatures, and the Pit Fiend could floor a deimavigga, because they actually can scry and fry right out of the can. Still, I would think an apostate devil would be more reasonably seated around CR 20 as they would be incredibly effective against, like, 90% of parties.
Empyreans are kind of an oddball. They have lower raw combat power, but higher hit dice. They specifically say they exist outside the standard hierarchy and generally don't respond to callings, so maybe their less regarded (or possibly rarely even known) by mortals.
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Don't know why, but I always liked the Hezrou... in a homebrew campaign setting, I made demon lords out of advanced versions of each demon from the Bestiary. Something about the Hezrou compelled me to make it the highest demon lord, and the household name for "team evil"
(Hezrou Sorc20[aquatic bloodline], Barbarian20[wild rager archetype], Advanced, Colossal size)
... I should really update it with Mythic rules.
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This guy
gives me them chils, yo
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This guygives me them chils, yo
Oh, he's not so bad, once you get to know him.
And sooner or later, everyone gets to know him.
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I'm a fan of Magicbane Bandersnatches.
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The Kimenhul sakhils are pretty amazing.
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Yeah, pretty much all of the sakhils are thematically amazing.
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I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.
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Shapeshifters were covered before, but outsiders capable of possessing people don't get enough attention. Things like Invidiak, aka Shadow Demon, or Bdellavritra - the Belier Devil. Especially if you treat them as changing the personality of the possessed if they stay in a person for a long time.
One of these could really wreak havoc in something like Kingmaker.
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If we're talking DnD not just Pathfinder, then I have to say my favourites have always been Beholders. Just something about them with their multiple eye beams of death, flyingness, big eye of you can't cast that now, and generally large gnash teeth.
Such cool critters.
If it's only Pathfinder....anything demon
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If we're talking DnD not just Pathfinder, then I have to say my favourites have always been Beholders. Just something about them with their multiple eye beams of death, flyingness, big eye of you can't cast that now, and generally large gnash teeth.
Such cool critters.
If it's only Pathfinder....anything demon
Well, opening that up, I really like mind flayers.
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Nothing inspires true terror quite like the moment after a failed will save when you realize that the pretty lady is a succubus and she has your mind in her control
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I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.
I think that you still have to have the strength score to lift said skyscrapers...
I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.I think that you still have to have the strength score to lift said skyscrapers...
Nope; doesn't say that :D
It only mentions size category. Not all impressive displays of strength need to be tied to a strength score.
I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.I think that you still have to have the strength score to lift said skyscrapers...Nope; doesn't say that :D
It only mentions size category. Not all impressive displays of strength need to be tied to a strength score.
That's not how the rules work.
Normally you can't throw items more than two size categories smaller than you (I think), however this has no relation to being able to pick them up.
Just because hurling allows you to throw objects the same size category as you doesn't mean you get to ignore how much it weighs.
I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.I think that you still have to have the strength score to lift said skyscrapers...Nope; doesn't say that :D
It only mentions size category. Not all impressive displays of strength need to be tied to a strength score.That's not how the rules work.
Normally you can't throw items more than two size categories smaller than you (I think), however this has no relation to being able to pick them up.
Just because hurling allows you to throw objects the same size category as you doesn't mean you get to ignore how much it weighs.
Uh, yes I do ignore how much it weighs, because that's what the ability allows me to do. You don't just add on rules on to an ability because you think it makes more sense that way. Even the method of how it damages a Target is a little different because that's how the ability works. You do what it says it does, anything more or less than that is a house rule.
Uh, yes I do ignore how much it weighs, because that's what the ability allows me to do. You don't just add on rules on to an ability because you think it makes more sense that way. Even the method of how it damages a Target is a little different because that's how the ability works. You do what it says it does, anything more or less than that is a house rule.I like to make lots of my own monsters using templates and existing creatures. One of them is a Megaprimatus w/giant template and 8 levels of Barbarian to gain hurling. Hurling allows you to throw objects equal to your size category (colossal for the Giant Megaprimatus) so it can be allowed to throw gigantic objects like skyscrapers and plateaus or even larger since there is no limit, technically, lol.I think that you still have to have the strength score to lift said skyscrapers...Nope; doesn't say that :D
It only mentions size category. Not all impressive displays of strength need to be tied to a strength score.That's not how the rules work.
Normally you can't throw items more than two size categories smaller than you (I think), however this has no relation to being able to pick them up.
Just because hurling allows you to throw objects the same size category as you doesn't mean you get to ignore how much it weighs.
And so this thread, like all others, gets completely derailed by an off-topic rules debate.
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Get back on topic or Baba Yaga will come turn you into something ugly
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Get back on topic or Baba Yaga will come turn you into something ugly
well, she is'nt going to have a hard time, is she?
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Given that she made Kostchtchie what he is I'm gonna go with nope
Lol
She's one of my fave high CR things in the game.
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How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.
Baba Yaga too. The 'monster' that can literally be justified in doing anything as she can craft artifacts and spells and even Demon lords on a whim.
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Given that she made Kostchtchie what he is I'm gonna go with nope
LolShe's one of my fave high CR things in the game.
Do you mean Kostchtchie the D&D/PF demon lord of giants, or do you mean the legendary Koshchei the Immortal?
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I don't see how there can be any confusion over what I meant given we are spelling it the same way
I meant the demon lord.
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How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.
Erm,
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.
:I
EDIT: I mean, it was, like, the second post. XD
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How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.Erm,
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.:I
EDIT: I mean, it was, like, the second post. XD
My bad. I Searched "Zygomind" but it came up with no result's. I assumed they were accurate >.>
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My bad. I Searched "Zygomind" but it came up with no result's. I assumed they were accurate >.>How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.Erm,
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.:I
EDIT: I mean, it was, like, the second post. XD
Yeah, weird. It doesn't for me, either.
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Sauce987654321 is doing it wrong.
How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.
Haha. Yeah, that's a pretty nasty beasty for sure!
Baba Yaga too. The 'monster' that can literally be justified in doing anything as she can craft artifacts and spells and even Demon lords on a whim.
She can really do all that? Where is that stated?
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Under her extraordinary ability Queen of Witches
As Queen of Witches, Baba Yaga knows all witch spells, as well as all sorcerer/wizard spells. Baba Yaga also has knowledge of many other spells that she has researched. Many of these are arcane versions of divine spells. In addition, Baba Yaga can create artifacts, and has done so to great extent, the greatest of which is the Dancing Hut of Baba Yaga
In the hands of a creative Gm I'd say she's easily the most powerful statted creature in pathfinder.
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In addition as "Chromantic Durgon <3" pointed out she also created the Demon Lord Kostchtchie.
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Yep I often wonder what I think second most powerful Cr30 creature is, it's a much more interesting contest.
-Cthulu's aura is incredibly powerful but aside from that he isn't very exciting in my opinion.
-Baalzebul being a swarm gives him some interesting powers
-Charon is interesting because although he is probably one of the weakest against other demigods he's one of the strongest vs PCs because they can die of old age, and he can do that much easier than he can do Hit point damage.
-Nocticula is the other stand out with seductive presence being insanely hard to beat DC43 fort save, removing immunity to Mind effecting as a free action, followed by Domination DC43 will save. Although I'd suggest more classes could make that than the fort save, which I suspect only a mythic kineticts or mythic superstitious barbarian could make reliably.
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Or a caster with a moment of prescience up.
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Or any mythic paladin worthy of the title.
Yeah, weird. It doesn't for me, either.My bad. I Searched "Zygomind" but it came up with no result's. I assumed they were accurate >.>How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.Erm,
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.:I
EDIT: I mean, it was, like, the second post. XD
That's... weird. It... didn't for me, either.
Oh well~! XD
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The Zygomind's fake reality does not simulate internet searches with perfect fidelity. Sweet dreams!
The newish Izfiitar protean deserves some love in this thread. A CR20 outsider that is medium, has great mobility and senses and crazy good SLAs. The physical damage is relatively poor, but it gets 7 greater warp wave attacks per round in a full attack for bonus wackiness and debuffs or oops-you-lose effects.
On the SLA front note that it can cast three standard action SLAs every two rounds via Kiss of the Speakers, plus it has three quickened Disintegrates, Confusions, and Telekinesis per day. So it could dump five Confusions over two rounds, or three Words of Chaos and a pair of Confusions, or three Prismatic Sprays and a pair of Disintegrates, or...
Defenses and resilience are relatively weak, but it has Heal and Prismatic Sphere 1/day if it for reason can't teleport away. Oh, and the standard protein change shape 1/day functions as Shapechange, so it can pick up regeneration or fast healing that way, or Heal when it changes back.
And it also has a Mage's Disjunction. Run!!!
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Yeah, weird. It doesn't for me, either.My bad. I Searched "Zygomind" but it came up with no result's. I assumed they were accurate >.>How in 4 pages of posts has the Zygomind not been mentioned yet? It's an entire campaign hook in itself even if you discount the fact that it's a walking existential crisis.Erm,
I find the zygomind similarly horrifying.:I
EDIT: I mean, it was, like, the second post. XD
That's... weird. It... didn't for me, either.
Oh well~! XD
have you guys looked at the 1st page? it's not there