Tips and Traits: A guide to Pathfinder Traits (Work in Progress)


Advice

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For everyone that wants this organized by skill. It effectively does this already. By being on one list it allows ctrl+f (search) to work. I do a search for perception and all skills with perception come up. A bit less effective than the organization you are asking for but not by much.

- Gauss

Silver Crusade

I'm really surprised to see that you called Gifted Adept yellow. That one should be blue. +1 CL on a Fireball is an extra 1d6 damage every time you cast it. Or put it on Scorching Ray, combine it with Specialized Spell feat, and you're casting 8d6 damage in rays in a single round at level 4.

Granted, it's pretty much only good for blasting, but it's good enough for at least a green rating.


I do plan on adding a list of traits that add skills to your list.
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Example:

Perform

Savant (Social)
Dilettante Artist (Racial)(Elf)
ect...


Thank you for this.


I have literally just started looking over the guide, but I wanted to point one thing out:

Accelerated Drinker
Benefit: You may drink a potion as a move action instead of a standard action as long as you start your turn with the potion in your hand.

So even if your GM does allow you to use Quick Draw to draw a potion, you still wouldn't be able to drink it in the same turn as a move action using Accelerated Drinker since you need to start the turn with the potion in hand.

The advantage I see to this trait is that you could walk around with a potion in hand at all times so that if you don't have time to buff before combat, you could drink it as a move action during the first turn of combat (and then do something like drink an extract, if you're an alchemist.)


Fromper wrote:

I'm really surprised to see that you called Gifted Adept yellow. That one should be blue. +1 CL on a Fireball is an extra 1d6 damage every time you cast it. Or put it on Scorching Ray, combine it with Specialized Spell feat, and you're casting 8d6 damage in rays in a single round at level 4.

Granted, it's pretty much only good for blasting, but it's good enough for at least a green rating.

I might consider turning it green. But 1d6 damage until you reach the spell cap on one spell doesn't strike me as that great. You effectively used a trait to average 3 more damage a few times a day. For 4 or 5 levels at that.


Also, under the Sacred Touch trait, you state that "it's a standard action to pour a 50gp Cure Light Wounds potion down their throat." I assume you are talking about pouring a potion down an unconscious creature's throat. This is nitpicky, but it is actually a full-round action to administer a potion to an unconscious creature:

From the PRD:
"A character can carefully administer a potion to an unconscious creature as a full-round action, trickling the liquid down the creature's throat."

This doesn't really make the trait any better, I just thought I'd point it out since it seems to be a rule that most people are not aware of.

Scarab Sages

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Dragonamedrake wrote:

I do plan on adding a list of traits that add skills to your list.

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Example:

Perform

Savant (Social)
Dilettante Artist (Racial)(Elf)
ect...

I think that would be helpful to a lot of people.

If you want to compare it to my list, it is in the spoiler....

Spoiler:

The following is my list of the traits that make a skill a class skill. Many also give a +1 bonus or a situational bonus. Many give a choice of two skills, one of which can be made a class skill. In that case, I list the trait under each skill. Please reference the source material and/or d20pfsrd for full details.

Personally, I feel that working with your DM will always be a better option than using the officially published traits. Regardless, I offer the following list of skills granted as class skills via published traits that I am aware of.

Note: I am listing the PFS traits as Faction traits with a source Guide to PFS Organized Play even though they should probably be thought of as Campaign traits.

Acrobatics
-Rice Runner (Regional, Wanshou) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Rescued (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Captain's Blade (Faction - Andoran) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Appraise
-Antiquities Smuggler (Regional, Osirion) - Inner Sea Primer
-Merchant of Katheer (Regional, Qadira) - Qadira, Gateway to the East
-Merchant’s Child (Regional, Katapesh) - Inner Sea Primer
-Szaezan Crags Miner (Regional, Bachuan) - Dragon Empires Primer

Bluff
-Witty Repartee (Combat, Kitharodian Academy) - Faction Guide
-Convincing Liar (Social, Bellflower Network) - Faction Guide
-Fast-Talker (Social) - APG
-Antiquities Smuggler (Regional, Osirion) - Inner Sea Primer
-Keeper of the Veil (Regional, Qadira) - Qadira, Gateway to the East
-Minkai Advocate (Regional, Minkai) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Pesh Addict (Regional, Katapesh) - Inner Sea Primer
-Privileged Slave (Regional, Kaoling) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Extremely Fashionable (Equipment) - Adventurer's Armory
-Conspiracy Hunter (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide
-Best Friend (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s Guide
-Black Sheep (Campaign) - APG
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-Fashionalbe (Faction - Taldor) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Under Siege (Religion, Sun Goddess) - Taldor, Echos of Glory

Climb
-Seasoned Climber (Regional, the Wall of Heaven) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Shoanti Tribesman (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer
-Jenivere Crew (Campaign) - Serpent's Skull Player's Guide
-Captain's Blade (Faction - Andoran) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Craft (any one)
-Clan Artisan (Regional, Xa Hoi) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide

Craft (armor or weapons)
-Indentured Blacksmith (Regional, Kaoling) - Dragon Empires Primer

Craft(alchemy)
-Snake Bleeder (Regional, Nagajor) - Dragon Empires Primer

Diplomacy
-Ease of Faith (Faith) - APG
-Princess (Social, Female) - Quadira, Gateway to the East
-Freed Slave (Race, Bellflower Network, halfling) - Faction Guide
-Dilettante Artist (Race, Elf) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Well-Informed (Race, Halfling) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-World Traveler (Race, Human) - APG
-Fangwood Diplomat (Regional, Nirmathas) - Inner Sea Primer
-Honeyed Tongue (Regional, Amanandar) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Extremely Fashionable (Equipment) - Adventurer's Armory
-Conspiracy Hunter (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide
-Missing Child (Campaign) - Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide
-Barroom Talespinner (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Best Friend (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s Guide
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-Fiendish Presence (Faction - Cheliax) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Insider Knowledge (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Shadow Diplomat (Faction - Shadow Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Fashionalbe (Faction - Taldor) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Calistrian Prostitute (Religion, Calistria) - APG
-Devotee of a Dead God (Religion, A Fallen God) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Erastil’s Speaker (Religion, Erastil) - Faiths of Purity
-Illuminator (Religion, Sarenrae) - Faiths of Purity

Disable Device
-Vagabond Child (Regional, urban) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Gold Finger (Faction - Qadira) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Nimble Fingers, Keen Mind (Religion - Brigh) - Faiths of Balance

Disguise
-Ugly Swine (Race, Goblin) - Goblins of Golarion
-Keeper of the Veil (Regional, Qadira) - Qadira, Gateway to the East

Escape Artist
-Freedom Fighter (Race, Halfling) - APG
-Bandit (Regional, the River Kingdoms) - Inner Sea Primer
-Vagabond Child (Regional, urban) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory

Handle Animal
-Animal Friend (Social, Gnome) - APG
-Jungle Guide (Regional, Sargava) - Inner Sea Primer
-Savannah Child (Regional, Katapesh) - Legacy of Fire Player's Guide

Heal
-Caretaker (Faith) - APG
-Imperial Soldier (Regional, Molthune) - Inner Sea Primer
-Ship's Surgeon (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Battlefield Surgeon (Religion, Zon-Kuthon) - Faiths of Corruption

Intimidate
-Bully (Social) - APG
-Convincing Liar (Social, Bellflower Network) - Faction Guide
-Princess (Social, Female) - Quadira, Gateway to the East
-Brute (Race, Half-Orc) - APG
-Aspiring Hellknight (Regional, Cheliax) - Inner Sea Primer
-Bandit (Regional, the River Kingdoms) - Inner Sea Primer
-Imperial Soldier (Regional, Molthune) - Inner Sea Primer
-Soldier of the Faith (Regional, Razmiran) - Inner Sea Primer
-Tiger Brigadier (Regional, Bachuan) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Viking Blood (Regional, Lands of the Linnorm Kings) - Inner Sea Primer
-Extremely Fashionable (Equipment) - Adventurer's Armory
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s GuideF
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-Bad Reputation (Faction - Sczarni) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Deformed (Religion, Lamashtu) - Faiths of Corruption
-Fiendish Confidence (Religion, Asmodeus) - Faiths of Corruption

Knowledge (any one)
-Teacher's Pet (Campaign) - Carrion Crown Player's Guide
-Foster Child (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Secrets of the Sphinx (Faction - Osirion) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Secret Knowledge (Religion - Norgorbor) - Faiths of Corruption

Knowledge (arcana)
-Mathematical Prodigy (Magic) - APG
-Fanatic (Race, Human) - Taldor, Echos of Glory
-Outlander (Campaign) -APG

Knowledge (dungeoneering)
-Scholar of Ruins (Race, Human) - APG
-Darklands Delver (Regional, the Darklands) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Tomb Raider (Faction - Osirion) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Knowledge (engineering)
-Mathematical Prodigy (Magic) - APG
-Warsmith (Race, Dwarf) - Dwarves of Golarion
-Crusader Tactician (Regional, Lastwall) - Inner Sea Primer
-Osirionologist (Regional, Osirion) - Inner Sea Primer
-Guardian of the Forge (Religion, Torag) - APG

Knowledge (geography)
-Devotee of the Green (Faith) - APG
-Nomadic (Race, Bas'o) - Sargava, the Lost Colony
-Scholar of Ruins (Race, Human) - APG
-Artifact Hunter (Regional, Mwangi Expanse) - Inner Sea Primer
-Belem Pirate (Regional, Minata) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Mountain Guide (Regional, Five Kings Mountains) - Inner Sea Primer
-Trench Navigator (Regional, Xidao) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Jenivere Crew (Campaign) - Serpent's Skull Player's Guide
-Proper Training (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Knowledge (history)
-Scholar of the Great Beyond (Faith) - APG
-Fanatic (Race, Human) - Taldor, Echos of Glory
-Historian (Race, Human) - Legacy of Fire Player's Guide
-Keeper of the Ancestral Scrolls (Race, Tian) - Humans of Golarion
-Artifact Hunter (Regional, Mwangi Expanse) - Inner Sea Primer
-Osirionologist (Regional, Osirion) - Inner Sea Primer
-Ancient Explorer (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Proper Training (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Guardian of the Forge (Religion, Torag) - APG

Knowledge (local)
-Well-Informed (Race, Halfling) - Taldor, Echoes of Glor
-World Traveler (Race, Human) - APG
-Acolyte of Razmir (Regional, Razmiran) - Inner Sea Primer
-Pesh Addict (Regional, Katapesh) - Inner Sea Primer
-Ancient Explorer (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Insider Knowledge (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Knowledge (nature)
-Devotee of the Green (Faith) - APG
-Guerilla (Regional, Dtang Ma) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Savannah Child (Regional, Katapesh) - Legacy of Fire Player's Guide
-Spiritual Forester (Regional, the Forest of Spirits) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Jenivere Crew (Campaign) - Serpent's Skull Player's Guide
-Child of Nature (Religion, Gozreh) - APG
-Know the Land (The Green Faith) - Faiths of Balance

Knowledge (nobility)
-Child of the Temple (Faith) - APG
-Freed Slave (Race, Bellflower Network, halfling) - Faction Guide
-Keeper of the Ancestral Scrolls (Race, Tian) - Humans of Golarion
-Crusader Tactician (Regional, Lastwall) - Inner Sea Primer

Knowledge (planes)
-Scholar of the Great Beyond (Faith) - APG
-Spiritual Forester (Regional, the Forest of Spirits) - Dragon Empire Primer

Knowledge (religion)
-Child of the Temple (Faith) - APG
-Zealot (Gnome, Faith) - Gnomes of Golarion
-Acolyte of Razmir (Regional, Razmiran) - Inner Sea Primer
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s Guide
-Outlander (Campaign) -APG
-Comparative Religion (Faction - Silver Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Devotee of a Dead God (Religion, A Fallen God) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Elven Pantheist (Religion, any elven deity) - Faiths of Purity

Linguistics
-Etymologist (Gnome, Social) - Gnomes of Golarion
-Lettered (Race, Halfling) - Halflings of Golarion
-Cosmopolitan (Regional, Absalom/Goka) - Inner Sea Primer/Dragon Empire Primer
-Contract Master (Religion, Asmodeus) - Faiths of Corruption

Perception
-Balloon Headed (Race, Goblin) - Goblins of Golarion
-Militant Merchant (Race, Dwarf) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Valashmai Veteran (Regional, the Valashmai Jungle) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Conspiracy Hunter (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide
-Friend of the Family (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-Observant (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Tomb Raider (Faction - Osirion) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Eyes and Ears of the City (Religion, Abadar) - APG

Perform (all?)
-Faithful Artist (Religion, Desna) - Faiths of Purity
-Intense Artist (Religion, Shelyn) - Faiths of Purity

Perform (any one)
-Savant (Social, Kitharodian Academy) - Faction Guide
-Dilettante Artist (Race, Elf) - Taldor, Echos of Glory
-Rude Songs (Race, Goblin) - Goblins of Golarion
-Hwan Artist (Regional, Hwanggot) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Varisian Wanderer (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer
-Barroom Talespinner (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s Guide
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-Performance Artist (Faction - Taldor) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Eye of the Father (Religion, Torag) - Faiths of Purity

Perform (act)
-Child of Infamy (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide

Profession (fortuneteller)
-Varisian Wanderer (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer

Profession (gambler)
-Looking for Work (Campaign) - Second Darkness Player's Guide

Profession (miner)
-Conscientious Miner (Regional, Jinin) - Dragon Empire Primer

Profession (sailor)
-Belem Pirate (Regional, Minata) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Trench Navigator (Regional, Xidao) - Dragon Empires Primer

Profession (soldier)
-Militia Veteran (Regional, any town or village) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Nirmathi Militia (Regional, Nirmathas) - Inner Sea Primer

Ride
-Imperial Soldier (Regional, Molthune) - Inner Sea Primer
-Lastwall Cavalry Rider (Regional, Lastwall) - Inner Sea Primer
-Militia Veteran (Regional, any town or village) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Nirmathi Militia (Regional, Nirmathas) - Inner Sea Primer
-Savannah Child (Regional, Katapesh) - Legacy of Fire Player's Guide
-Horse Lord (Faction - Qadira) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Sense Motive
-Suspicious (Social) - Second Darkness Player's Guide
-World Traveler (Race, Human) - APG
-Cynic (Regional, Mendev) - Inner Sea Primer
-Pesh Addict (Regional, Katapesh) - Inner Sea Primer
-Conspiracy Hunter (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide
-Missing Child (Campaign) - Curse of the Crimson Throne Player's Guide
-Ilizmagorti Native (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Missionary (Campaign) - Legacy of Fire Player’s Guide
-Fiendish Presence (Faction - Cheliax) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Observant (Faction - Grand Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Watchdog (Faction - Shadow Lodge) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Fashionalbe (Faction - Taldor) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Calistrian Prostitute (Religion, Calistria) - APG
-Holy Schemer (Religion, Calistria) - Faiths of Balance
-Sensing Imperfection (Religion, Irori) - Halflings of Golarion
-Strip the Veils (Religion, Sivanah) - Faiths of Balance
-Talented Organizer (Religion, Milani) - Faiths of Purity
-Under Siege (Religion, Sun Goddess) - Taldor, Echos of Glory

Sleight of Hand
-Child of the Streets (Social) - APG
-Antiquities Smuggler (Regional, Osirion) - Inner Sea Primer
-Pesh Dealer (Regional, Katapesh) - Legacy of Fire Player's Guide
-Vagabond Child (Regional, urban) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Varisian Wanderer (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer
-Black Sheep (Campaign) - APG
-Gold Finger (Faction - Qadira) - Guide to PFS Organized Play

Spellcraft
-Classically Schooled (Magic) - APG

Stealth
-Slippery (Combat, Bellflower Network) - Faction Guide
-Bandit (Regional, the River Kingdoms) - Inner Sea Primer
-Highlander (Regional, hills or mountains) - APG
-Swamp Rebel (Regional, Wanshou) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Uskwood Hunter (Regional, Nidal) - Inner Sea Primer
-Conspiracy Hunter (Campaign) - Council of Thieves Player's Guide
-Black Sheep (Campaign) - APG

Survival
-Poverty-Stricken (Social) - APG
-Nomadic (Race, Bas'o) - Sargava, the Lost Colony
-Outcast (Race, Half Orc) - APG
-Darklands Delver (Regional, the Darklands) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Guerilla (Regional, Dtang Ma) - Dragon Empire Primer
-Jungle Guide (Regional, Sargava) - Inner Sea Primer
-Militia Veteran (Regional, any town or village) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Nirmathi Militia (Regional, Nirmathas) - Inner Sea Primer
-Shoanti Tribesman (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer
-Surivivor (Regional) - Taldo, Echoes of Glory
-Valashmai Veteran (Regional, the Valashmai Jungle) - Dragon Empires Primer
-Jenivere Crew (Campaign) - Serpent's Skull Player's Guide
-Caravan Guard (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Student Survivalist (Campaign) - Jade Regent Player’s Guide
-Explorer (Faction - Andoran) - Guide to PFS Organized Play
-Child of Nature (Religion, Gozreh) - Faiths of Balance
-Child of Nature (Religion, Gozreh) - APG
-Know the Land (The Green Faith) - Faiths of Balance

Swim
-Goblin Pirate (Regional, Shackles) - Goblins of Golarion
-Oagan Diver (Regional, the Sodden Lands) - Inner Sea Primer
-River Rat (Regional, marsh or river) - Taldor, Echoes of Glory
-Shackles Seafarer (Regional, the Shackles) - Inner Sea Primer
-Shoanti Tribesman (Regional, Varisia) - Inner Sea Primer
-Jenivere Crew (Campaign) - Serpent's Skull Player's Guide
-Touched by the Sea (Campaign) - Skull & Shackles Player's Guide
-Noble-Born (Campaign) - Kingmaker Player’s Guide

Use Magic Device
-Dangerously Curious (Magic) - APG
-Underlying Principals (Religion, Nethys) - Faiths of Balance


Thanks Kexle. That will be helpful when I get to that section.

@Maggiethecat - Thanks for the heads up. I will update my description.

Alright I am headed to bed.

29 Combat, 19 Faith, 28 Magic, 24 Social, and 41 Racial done so far.

141 traits reviewed in 2 days. Not to bad. I will jump back on it tomorrow when I get up.


Better than me doing it over at least a week and no one caring.

Do seem to have missed the PFS faction traits, which are fairly good.

Liberty's Edge

I just wanted to throw this thread at you. It might help to see what traits other people have suggested.

Course, it probably would have helped more early on, but I just stumbled across it.

Non-linked version (in case link doesn't work): http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5le6?Best-Traits


Alright. Got the US Open on TV and another Rip It to drink. Back at it.

@deuxhero - I assume those are under Regional which I will do after Racial.

@ShadowcatX - thanks I will take a look at that in a bit.

Silver Crusade

The PFS faction traits are the Campaign Traits for the Pathfinder Society Organized Play campaign.


Fromper wrote:
The PFS faction traits are the Campaign Traits for the Pathfinder Society Organized Play campaign.

Ahh yes. I will be tackling those too.


I dropped the ranking on a few of the skill traits and upped the ranking on the flat +1 save bonuses.


Dragonamedrake wrote:
deuxhero wrote:

I noticed that in my rating for Summoners too. Would not be the first time someone didn't know the rules for the game they were writing a supplement for (both WotC and Paizo are VERY guilty of this)

Anyways, the guide underrates St. Clydwell’s Ward a bit. Depending on the potion you are referring to...

1: Sanctuary can't be a potion and even if it could, is single target and doesn't have a scaling save
2: Protection from eEvil only works on summoned demons, demons that planeshift through natural ability or enter through planar gate (which a quick look at PF wiki says that was the kind of demon St. Clydwell dealt with) are immune.

Not fantastic if you aren't in a campaign centered around the worldwound, but better than you give it credit for.

If you cant make a potion of Sanctuary then why is it listed as a potion on the SRD for 50 gp.

It is not "personal" so I don't see why it can't be a potion. Unless deuxhero can point out a rule that I missed it should work.


^ It was 2 in the morning at the time and I alreddy stated that it was in error.

Dragonamedrake wrote:


@deuxhero - I assume those are under Regional which I will do after Racial.

I meant that I missed them when rating Summoner traits.

The Exchange

One of my favorite traits is Lessons of Chaldira from Faiths of Purity, especially since it is legal in PFS.

Rerolls are pretty amazing.

"Lessons of Chaldira (Chaldira Zuzaristan)

Your studies of Chaldira Zuzaristan’s exploits have given you a knack for avoiding trouble.

Benefit: Once per day, when you fail a saving throw, you can reroll the saving throw. You must take the second result even if it is worse."


Magical Knack: You really should take this trait if you want to play any character that multiclasses with a spellcasting class. You ABSOLUTELY MUST take this choice if you are playing from low levels and you want to build towards Mystic Theurge. It means that one of your two spellcaster classes will always gain +2 ECL. This is worth like two feats, so you'd be pretty foolish to not pick it up.

The traits that give +2 to Init (Excitable, Reactionary) should be purple. These are the traits you take if you can't think of a choice, or are in a hurry. Going first is just always good.

Strong Arm, Supple Wrist should probably be orange. Sure, it's situational and odd, but any character who wants to throw stuff should at least consider it. Note that one of the few odd holes in PF combat is their treatment of throwing. There are very few feats, archetypes or racial attributes that help with this. Compare throwing weapons to missile weapons and you'll see what I'm talking about: if you want to build an elven archer, you're spoiled for choice, but if you want to build a halfling knife-thrower, well, good luck. So anything that helps a thrower counts for more than it might otherwise. And note that for many thrown weapons, increasing the range increment by +10' effectively doubles the range. If I were building a bomber alchemist, I'd definitely consider this trait. It would be seriously handy at lower levels. Less so at high levels where the move requirement would cost me my iterative attacks, but still worth taking. So I'd color this orange, myself.

Faithful Feedback I would color orange or red-orange depending. At first level it's a whopping 18% increase on your CLWs. That's nothing to sneeze at. Once you hit midlevels that drops off fast, but even at 10th level you're getting average 5% more on your CMWs. And hey -- it does give a fun in-game justification for persuading your fellow PCs to convert to worshipping Desna or the Great Old Ones or whoever.

Sacred Conduit is blue or green if you're playing a channel monkey, which is a thing that some people do. Red otherwise, no question.

Charlatan is certainly green, probably blue, and purple if you're building a bluff monkey. Rakshasa bloodline + this trait = crazy stuff. A rak bloodline sorceror who has dipped a level or two of rogue can easily hit Bluff +40 with this trait by 10th level. And, seriously, look at it. Go back and look at it. (1) It's a swift action. (2) It's not a spell, so can't be detected. (3) It's giving you a bonus on one of the most useful skills. You purpled Witty Repartee for giving you +1 to Bluff, so why are you oranging this trait that can give up to +9? (4) It's a bonus that you can fine-tune -- if you're an 8th level sorceror, you can decide on the spot on a bonus between +1 and +4. (5) Unlike a lot of traits that are good at low levels but then fade away, this one gets steadily better as you advance. (6) The bonus is an unlabelled bonus, meaning it stacks with everything (including Witty Repartee). How many traits stack with other traits? And (7) did I mention that it's a free action that can't be detected as a spell? Yes, you have to burn a spell slot. You've pretty much always got a spell slot or two hanging around. By higher levels, you're running out of things to do with those first and second level spells. This trait makes them useful again! It's awesome. I only wish they'd done more like this.

What prevents this trait from being purple IMO is its obnoxious specificity. You have to be a nonlawful gnome (or take the Adopted trait), you really should be a full caster, and you ought to be a Bluff monkey. That really narrows it down. But even so, this is a mighty tasty trait.

More in a moment...

Doug M.


Quote:
Foul Belch (Race?) - Once per day as a standard action, you can belch at a single opponent within 5 feet. DC 12 Fortitude save or be sickened for 1d6 rounds. The save DC is Constitution-based. While this is another humorous trait, its usefulness is debatable. Its a standard action, and its save is static.

The save actually isn't static, since it scales with CON. It's like having a second level spell as an At-Will SLA, but as an Ex ability. Imposing a –2 penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks is not a bad go for a standard action. Especially if your schtick is melee but not damage (trip build or something).


Charming: I agree that this can make for some uncomfortable (or funny) moments around the gaming table. Still, from a mechanical POV it's one of the most powerful traits. +1 to two skills /and/ a spell DC bonus? And while there are only a few language-dependent spells, they include a number of favorites such as Suggestion. Whether you can get away with this trait without constantly bringing the game to a snickering halt... well, that really depends on your gaming group and DM.

Maestro of the Society is blue for low-level characters, fading to orange as they advance. At first level +3 rounds/day is about a 50% increase for your average bard. That's pretty sweet. By 10th level it's more like a 10% increase. The reason it doesn't fade to red is that bard performances, unlike spells, are on a fixed 24 hour recharge. And most bards use their Bardic Performance rounds a lot. So this is always at least OK for bards, and at low levels it's great.

Speaking of Bards, Historian is effectively granting you +1 on all Knowledge skills. That's 10 skill ranks worth of bonuses. Compare this to the feat Breadth of Experience -- that one gives +2 to all Knowledge skills, but you have to be an elf, dwarf or gnome and at least 100 years old. And it's definitely one of the more popular feats. (If you really wanted to be obnoxious, you could take both, and turn your character into the party know-it-all.) So I'd probably color this blue for bards, orange for anyone else. BTW, I believe there are a couple of archetypes that give Bardic Knowledge to non-bards, so it could theoretically be meaningful to gain Knowledge (History) as a class skill.

cheers,

Doug M.


Mauril wrote:
Quote:
Foul Belch (Race?) - Once per day as a standard action, you can belch at a single opponent within 5 feet. DC 12 Fortitude save or be sickened for 1d6 rounds. The save DC is Constitution-based. While this is another humorous trait, its usefulness is debatable. Its a standard action, and its save is static.
The save actually isn't static, since it scales with CON. It's like having a second level spell as an At-Will SLA, but as an Ex ability. Imposing a –2 penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks is not a bad go for a standard action. Especially if your schtick is melee but not damage (trip build or something).

On a second read I see your right about that save. It should be rewriten. The wording makes it seem to be a static save. Either way its still once a day and only imposes a -2 penalty. I would rather have other traits. I will raise it to orange however, because of the save.

My question is what race does this deal with? I assume its Goblin. Anyone know?


Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Magical Knack: You really should take this trait if you want to play any character that multiclasses with a spellcasting class. You ABSOLUTELY MUST take this choice if you are playing from low levels and you want to build towards Mystic Theurge. It means that one of your two spellcaster classes will always gain +2 ECL. This is worth like two feats, so you'd be pretty foolish to not pick it up.

I agree with all this. I ranked it at purple after all. lol.

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
The traits that give +2 to Init (Excitable, Reactionary) should be purple. These are the traits you take if you can't think of a choice, or are in a hurry. Going first is just always good.

I did rank them purple. And I agree that they are very good.

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Strong Arm, Supple Wrist should probably be orange. Sure, it's situational and odd, but any character who wants to throw stuff should at least consider it. Note that one of the few odd holes in PF combat is their treatment of throwing. There are very few feats, archetypes or racial attributes that help with this. Compare throwing weapons to missile weapons and you'll see what I'm talking about: if you want to build an elven archer, you're spoiled for choice, but if you want to build a halfling knife-thrower, well, good luck. So anything that helps a thrower counts for more than it might otherwise. And note that for many thrown weapons, increasing the range increment by +10' effectively doubles the range. If I were building a bomber alchemist, I'd definitely consider this trait. It would be seriously handy at lower levels. Less so at high levels where the move requirement would cost me my iterative attacks, but still worth taking. So I'd color this orange, myself.

2 Things and I will add this to the description.

1. Throwers, as all other ranged builds, are good because it is easier for them to Full Attack during combat. Being able to hit from range allows them to get all their attacks every round. This trait keeps you from full attacking and is in direct conflict with the main advantage of being a ranged attacker.

2. Most throwers depend on things like Point Blank Shot. Thrown weapons have a much smaller range increment but this isn't an issue because you want to be within 30 feet. A trait that adds to a thrown weapons range increment really isn't very helpful for most thrower builds.

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Faithful Feedback I would color orange or red-orange depending. At first level it's a whopping 18% increase on your CLWs. That's nothing to sneeze at. Once you hit midlevels that drops off fast, but even at 10th level you're getting average 5% more on your CMWs. And hey -- it does give a fun in-game justification for persuading your fellow PCs to convert to worshipping Desna or the Great Old Ones or whoever.

It doesn't affect channel. It only heals one extra point. Your target has to worship the same deity as you. The deck is stacked against this trait. There are honestly just better options for healers.

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Sacred Conduit is blue or green if you're playing a channel monkey, which is a thing that some people do. Red otherwise, no question.

For most chandlers however that channel positive energy this is a waste. It will only help you on the rare occasion you decide to channel against undead. Rare and limited to specific builds = Lower ranking.

Douglas Muir 406 wrote:
Charlatan is certainly green, probably blue, and purple if you're building a bluff monkey. Rakshasa bloodline + this trait = crazy stuff. A rak bloodline sorceror who has dipped a level or two of rogue can easily hit Bluff +40 with this trait by 10th level. And, seriously, look at it. Go back and look at it. (1) It's a swift action. (2) It's not a spell, so can't be detected. (3) It's giving you a bonus on one of the most useful skills. You purpled Witty Repartee for giving you +1 to Bluff, so why are you oranging this trait that can give up to +9? (4) It's a bonus that you can fine-tune -- if you're an 8th level sorceror, you can decide on the spot on a bonus between +1 and +4. (5) Unlike a lot of traits that are good at low levels but then fade away, this one gets steadily better as you advance. (6) The bonus is an unlabelled bonus, meaning it stacks with everything (including Witty Repartee). How many traits stack with other traits? And (7) did I mention that it's a free action that can't be detected as a spell? Yes, you have to burn a spell slot. You've pretty much always got a spell slot or two hanging around. By higher levels, you're running out of things to do with those first and second level spells. This trait makes them useful again! It's awesome. I only wish they'd done more like this.

Ok ok lol. I see your point. I still think there are better things to do with your spells then sack them for a bonus on bluff... but I will up it to Green. Your points on it being undetectable and being a swift action.


Douglas Muir 406 wrote:

Charming:

Maestro of the Society

Speaking of Bards, Historian is effectively granting you +1 on all Knowledge skills. That's 10 skill ranks worth of bonuses. Compare this to the feat Breadth of Experience -- that one gives +2 to all Knowledge skills, but you have to be an elf, dwarf or gnome and at least 100 years old. And it's definitely one of the more popular feats. (If you really wanted to be obnoxious, you could take both, and turn your character into the party know-it-all.) So I'd probably color this blue for bards, orange for anyone else. BTW, I believe there are a couple of archetypes that give Bardic Knowledge to non-bards, so it could theoretically be meaningful to gain Knowledge (History) as a class skill.

cheers,

Doug M.

I like the ranking on the first two. I might give Historian a duel ranking as it is a very nice bonus for bards.


Dragonamedrake wrote:
Fromper wrote:

I'm really surprised to see that you called Gifted Adept yellow. That one should be blue. +1 CL on a Fireball is an extra 1d6 damage every time you cast it. Or put it on Scorching Ray, combine it with Specialized Spell feat, and you're casting 8d6 damage in rays in a single round at level 4.

Granted, it's pretty much only good for blasting, but it's good enough for at least a green rating.

I might consider turning it green. But 1d6 damage until you reach the spell cap on one spell doesn't strike me as that great. You effectively used a trait to average 3 more damage a few times a day. For 4 or 5 levels at that.

Yes, you pretty much have to combine this with Intensify Spell. But OTOH, you can get such fun results with it! It can be stacked with other stuff in all kinds of fun ways. Put it on Shocking Grasp and play a Stormborn Sorceror with Skill Focus (Evocation) and Varisian Tattoo. Boom: touch attack for 3d6 at first level. Put it on Burning Hands, and play a gnome pyromaniac. Whoosh: 3d4 damage in a 30' cone at first level. Pretty tasty stuff. I really think this one's gotta be green.

Doug M.


Dragonamedrake wrote:
My question is what race does this deal with? I assume its Goblin. Anyone know?

Yes, goblin.

Silver Crusade

The only down side of Magical Knack is that it's not legal for PFS.

As for Sacred Conduit, you consider channeling against undead rare??? What campaigns are you playing in??? Plus there are traits to let you channel against outsiders or elementals, if someone is going channel specialist. And then there are people channeling negative energy to hurt living things. Just given the frequency of channels against undead, I'd call this a decent trait for any cleric, but if you're doing any of those channel specialist options, it's that much better.


Dragonamedrake wrote:


I agree with all this. I ranked it at purple after all. lol.

Sure. Just, if you want to add more reasons why.

On the Strong Arm trait: throwers like to get FRAs, but most throwers are 3/4 BAB classes like rogues and alchemists. So this isn't an issue until 8th level.

As to throwers relying on Point-Blank Shot, that's certainly true, but that doesn't help if the enemy is beyond the miserable 10' range increment for most thrown weapons. Check it out: a thrown dagger is a normal attack out to 10', then -2 at 15 or 20 feet, -4 at 25 or 30 feet, and so on. Well, once you get past 10' range, this trait is better than the feat! (As long as you can satisfy the silly move requirement.) From 15 to 30 feet this trait gives you +1 to hit over the feat. And once you're past 30 feet, phew.

Here's another way to think about it: ff not for the move requirement, this trait would be pretty much equivalent to Far Shot -- and Far Shot is not only a feat, it's a feat that has another feat as a prerequisite.

I will note that this trait doesn't actually help alchemists at all. I thought alchemist bombs had a range increment of 20', but checking I see that they have a *range* of 20'. So no joy there. It does help with other splashy stuff, though, acid flasks and holy water and such.

As to Sacred Conduit, don't forget that there are a bunch of channel powers that use that save DC. There's the Turn Undead feat, which is actually a really good feat -- excellent if you're facing a lot of undead. (I had a dwarf cleric in my last campaign who used that damn feat all the time, to impressive effect.) And there are specialized turning powers like the Ale/Wine domain, which lets you nauseate everyone who fails their save. If you noodle around, you'll see there are quite a few of these. Again, you pretty much have to build the character around them to make them shine. But this is a thing that people sometimes do.

Doug M.


Anyone know the Race tied to the following:

Perfect Servant
Lettered
Helpful

Silver Crusade

Dragonamedrake wrote:

Anyone know the Race tied to the following:

Perfect Servant
Lettered
Helpful

Those are all halfling traits from page 30 of Halflings of Golarion.


Fromper wrote:


As for Sacred Conduit, you consider channeling against undead rare??? What campaigns are you playing in??? Plus there are traits to let you channel against outsiders or elementals, if someone is going channel specialist. And then there are people channeling negative energy to hurt living things. Just given the frequency of channels against undead, I'd call this a decent trait for any cleric, but if you're doing any of those channel specialist options, it's that much better.

Anyone else think this deserves a bump?


Fromper wrote:
Dragonamedrake wrote:

Anyone know the Race tied to the following:

Perfect Servant
Lettered
Helpful

Those are all halfling traits from page 30 of Halflings of Golarion.

Thanks


Question for everyone. Should I organize each category by its name or by the ranking it receives. Placing the purples first and on down?


I would organize by name. Color coding is still subjective.

- Gauss


Gauss wrote:

I would organize by name. Color coding is still subjective.

- Gauss

Yeah its probably the best bet. I just underestimated the shear size of this guide. I will need to come up with some smaller list. Possibly a best of the best for each category.


Dangerously Curious you mispelled UMD as UDM (twice).

I would increase the value of Freedom Fighter (or any Escape Artist granting trait). The reason is as follows: Grab (Grapple) is the most common devastating ability that creatures in the Bestiary have. I believe Escape Artist (or other means to escape a grapple) is a must have for any poor BAB spellcaster and probably even for the medium BAB classes as well. Escape Artist can break a grapple alot easier than a CMB check to break a grapple.

- Gauss


Latent Psion: mispelled second occurance of mind-affecting.

Market Rat: no bolding

Militant Merchant: just: woohoo!

Nomadic: no bolding

Proud Tribesman: no bolding

Good work so far :)

- Gauss


You gave Ruthless (Dwarf) a green rating.
You gave Anatomist a yellow rating.

Both traits do the same thing (albeit with different wording).

- Gauss


1 person marked this as a favorite.

For reducing size... consider railing less against the super bad traits. People read the guide looking for good traits and useful combos to use traits with, and most bad traits are self-evidently so anyway. Unless the bad trait in question seems like it would look good to a beginner but is in actuality horrible (ie, a trap option), there's no need to be devoting small paragraphs towards the cruddy traits. In a lot of cases, just the name in red and the short description of what it does would be enough to tell people how bad the trait is. You see red and the effect is "+2 on heal checks during a full moon," and...most will be able to instantly write that trait off in their minds all on their own.


@Gauss - Thanks. I fixed all the mistakes. You have been a big help.

What did you mean about Militant Merchant?

StreamofTheSky - I could but Im a big old wind bag! lol. You have a point. I will be less lengthy in my dislike of some traits. Sometimes I subconsciously have to defend my Red rating. You have also been very helpful.

Two the two of you both. What do you feel should be the rating of:

Strong Arm trait
Sacred Conduit


Trait question.
Adopted is a social trait, which in turn gives you a racial trait. You can only have one trait of a given type. Assuming you take adopted as a trait, can you a) take another racial trait (as adopted itself is social, over-riding the trait type of the racial trait you gained), b) take another social trait (as your net gain is a racial trait) c) any further traits you gain must not be in either of the social or racial categories.


I meant that Militant Merchant is a nice trait. That is all.

- Gauss


pad300 wrote:

Trait question.

Adopted is a social trait, which in turn gives you a racial trait. You can only have one trait of a given type. Assuming you take adopted as a trait, can you a) take another racial trait (as adopted itself is social, over-riding the trait type of the racial trait you gained), b) take another social trait (as your net gain is a racial trait) c) any further traits you gain must not be in either of the social or racial categories.

I'm not sure if there is an official answer. My gut tells me it is still a social trait that gives you the benefit of a Racial trait. So you have used your Social and everything else is open.


Dragonamedrake wrote:

Two the two of you both. What do you feel should be the rating of:

Strong Arm trait
Sacred Conduit

Sacred Conduit is terrible, I think. Mostly because channeling is weak. Especially as offense. I'd do red, but don't mind it being orange for those that love channeling for some reason...

Assuming you meant strong arm, supple wrist...
It sucks. The whole point of ranged combat is full attacking. Even if you can move 10 ft and full attack, it caps you to once/round. Red, definitely.
Paizo has a serious hate-on for letting throwers attack farther. As it is, they nerfed Far Shot to not double your range, just reduce the penalties. If you're making a thrower, you should just accept that you'll need to stand within charge range to attack.


StreamOfTheSky wrote:
Dragonamedrake wrote:

Two the two of you both. What do you feel should be the rating of:

Strong Arm trait
Sacred Conduit

Sacred Conduit is terrible, I think. Mostly because channeling is weak. Especially as offense. I'd do red, but don't mind it being orange for those that love channeling for some reason...

Assuming you meant strong arm, supple wrist...
It sucks. The whole point of ranged combat is full attacking. Even if you can move 10 ft and full attack, it caps you to once/round. Red, definitely.
Paizo has a serious hate-on for letting throwers attack farther. As it is, they nerfed Far Shot to not double your range, just reduce the penalties. If you're making a thrower, you should just accept that you'll need to stand within charge range to attack.

Those where my thoughts. Just making sure I wasn't off base. Fromper and Douglas where championing pretty hard for them.


Suicidal and Superior Clutch are two pretty awesome traits I didnt know about. Very impressed by them.

Also Tunnel Fighter is crazy good for underground campaigns.


Personally, I think there is a place for Sacred Conduit in an undead heavy campaign (or any campaign where the person is channeling damage regularly). But, channeling for damage is often an inferior tactic otherwise.

- Gauss


We keep bumping up against what works for specific characters in specific campaigns. A +1 to a weak save is always good, and helps you forever.

Magical Knack is always good, if you're multiclassing with a spellcasting class. Otherwise, it's useless. A +2 to initiative is always good for practically any character. Going before the enemy is always a good thing.

Other traits are situational, and if you're free to pick, you go with what works for your build. Sacred Conduit is perfect for some clerics, but probably not for most.

A focus on for who and where a certain trait can be good is probably better than just saying it's crappy across the board (though some are).

They're flavor choices, for the most part. Some do stand out, though, since they work at all levels, forever, and will see frequent use. Those are purple.


Maestro of Society would be purple for an Archaeologist. Because his rounds of luck doesn't scale with levels so adding rounds to it would be pretty ridiculously good.

Silver Crusade

I never said Sacred Conduit is awesome, but I do think it should be green for clerics that like to channel, and there are quite a few possible builds of that type. Otherwise, color it red.

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