My alchemists get a lot of use out of spell craft. Slap on identify and you know can identify magic items, or you can tell what enemy spell casters are doing.
I always put a few point in UMD but, an alchemist can use most of the wands that you want already.
Spellcraft can be very useful for just about anyone, since you can tell spell enemy casters are doing. If you have a party with a spellcraft-focused wizard, then it might not feel that effective, but a few ranks would be helpful nontheless.
UMD is always good to have at least one rank in, generally because of wands.
well alchemists are int based, so spell craft is solidly good for them. Cha is a dump stat for them, so UMD is harder to make great use out of.
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Cha is a dump stat for them, so UMD is harder to make great use out of.
Ugh, I hate this attitude.
Cha is a dump stat for them, so UMD is harder to make great use out of.Ugh, I hate this attitude.
Could you explain "this attitude" Cheapy?
If you can make an alchemist that has points to be able to put a good score into CHA then more power to you. Alchemists are somewhat MAD, since they need good dex for throwing bombs/shooting backup, decent STR to carry things/be capable in melee, good INT for class abilities, good con to not die and have a good Fort save, and decent wis to avoid tanking will saves.
Also is a character that is essentially Dr. Jeckle Mr. Hyde, mad scientist, Jack the Ripper, crazy bomber going to be putting points into a stat that has no mechanical benefit other than UMD, a skill he could care less about since he can use the main items he would use the skill on anyways? I mean a creepy guy who messes around with designer drugs and bombs might be your idea of a great party face, but I'm not seeing it.
Could you explain "this attitude" Cheapy?Cha is a dump stat for them, so UMD is harder to make great use out of.Ugh, I hate this attitude.
"This attitude" toward "dump stats." While an alchemist doesn't need a good Cha to be effective with their primary class abilities, it's the CharOp attitude of "doesn't need it = not worthwhile" that grates on the nerves.
Pidgeonholing a class based on a single "best" build/configuration is a tremendously limiting way to play a roleplaying game, IMO.
If you can make an alchemist that has points to be able to put a good score into CHA then more power to you. Alchemists are somewhat MAD, since they need good dex for throwing bombs/shooting backup, decent STR to carry things/be capable in melee, good INT for class abilities, good con to not die and have a good Fort save, and decent wis to avoid tanking will saves.
Gnome Alchemist (20-point buy)
12 Str (-2 race), 14 Dex, 14 Con (+2 race), 14 Int, 12 Wis, 13 Cha (+2 race)Alternate racial trait: Pyromaniac
Alternate favored class reward: +1/2 to the number of bombs per day each alchemist level
Improve Cha to 14 at 4th level; place at least two advancements in Int (an alchemist only needs a 16 Int to gain all levels of extracts). As small-sized creatures, gnomes gain a +1 size bonus to attack rolls; using a Dex mutagen, the alchemist makes ranged attacks at +5 at 1st level. If you're concerned about the -2 Wis penalty from the Dex mutagen, the Iron Will feat is a quick and easy solution. Granted, this is more of a "mad bomber" alchemist than a "mad meleer," but with a longspear (or injection spear) for a reach weapon and reasonable expectations, they can definitely contribute (+2 melee attack bonus at 1st level); AC will be pretty good, even in light armor (AC 16 in studded leather, 18 when using a Dex mutagen).
That build of alchemist is exactly what I'm talking about being a bit MAD. Not a single good stat even though its 20 point buy. Sure 14s are nice, but you aren't going to be doing much damage with that low of a score. 5.5 damage 3 splash damage bombs are rather underpowered compared to a more focused character. High INT on alchemists isn't about extracts, its about splash damage. If you put an 18 on that INT (by playing an elf/human/halforc/halfelf) your damage is more like 7.5 and 5 splash. that bit of difference often relates to how many bombs you need to throw in an encounter, and how good your non bomb splash weapons are (you will probably lean heavy on acid flasks if you do a lot of throwing).
When I was playing my PFS alchemist I would often not even attempt to throw at the enemy (too many derpbarians charging in first round to eat the enemies retribution), and relied on the splash damage to do the dirty work.
Later on my guy was able to become a switch hitter by taking feral mutagen/strength mutagen, bull strength, and a level of barbarian. That's a +12 STR swing, with 3 natural attacks, enlarging it made it even fiercer (though hard finding enough actions to do it all, I haven't gotten consistent rulings on action economy of drunken brute + extracts). Wasn't able to keep it up for long, but its not very often you need more than that.
Also, what was the point of putting the attribute point into CHA at level 4? To prove a point? Cause alchemists don't have face class skills, and don't really have much use for UMD.