Death of a Pre-Gen.


Pathfinder Society

4/5

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Pathfinder Adventure, Lost Omens, Maps, Rulebook, Starfinder Maps Subscriber

So what happens if a new player plays a pre-gen and the character dies during the scenario?

Do I give him a chronicle and mark the character slot 1 as dead and his first character would be number 2?

Does he get a chronicle as if his character lived with the gold, xp, and prestige earned at the table?

Or is it something else I'm too thick to realize?

The Exchange

I'm interested to know the answer since the same thing happened today.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

Take a look at the following post by Michael Brock:

Playing Pregens

4/5

Pathfinder Adventure, Lost Omens, Maps, Rulebook, Starfinder Maps Subscriber

Well he really doesn't mention what to do reporting wise? It seems to imply that I should mark his first character as dead, and he would need to start with character number 2.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Alaska—Anchorage aka Dragnmoon

Those were Pregen Rules that he was working on to put into the Guide in Version 4.1 (The current version of the Guide), the Pregen death was never implemented.

As advice to the OP this is what I suggest.

You give him a Chronicle with the Gold earned up to his death, and any Prestige Points (If any earned) up to the death. If he completed 3 scenes or more he gets 1xp.

Follow normal Pregen Rules for applying the chronicle to a character.

Liberty's Edge

Yeah, I GMerd Dragonvan's game on Saturday. We were a three player table, two of which were playing pregens they planned to credit to their brand new characters. One of the pregens died in the first encounter of the scenario. Fortunately the other two managed to survive the rest of the scenario on their own, but filling out the paperwork was different.

Grand Lodge 4/5 Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes aka TwilightKnight

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Stop to consider your players. If we are talking about brand new players, I would not punish them for their very first session. If their pregen dies, let them bring in a replacement and continue to play. Award them full chronicle gold, XP, and fame, but let them know this is only done for a n00b. After-all, we are supposed to be bringing new players in, not killing them off ;-). The character should be ######-1 so reporting is easy. BTW, stop killing n00bs :-)

If we are talking about an experienced player, then #1, why are they using a pregen anyway? In any case, there is really no reason not to just keep it simple and apply the same resolution as for a noob. Do we really care that much about a gold reduction at first level?

Grand Lodge

To my knowledge, the current Guide does not specify how to handle permanent pregen death (at least not completely and clearly).

I have not encountered this yet, but I would allow them to apply the Chronicle to a new PC only. I would not make them deal with resolving the death for a PC they were planning to use the Chronicle for at level 4 or 7. This is simple and doesn't leave them with a death looming over their PC's head.

Yes, this can take away some of the risk to a PC, but considering that the pregens are not build optimally and that a player may not be as familiar with a pregen as their own PC and that the player has a limited choice of pregens, it seems unfair to burden a PC with the death.

There is incentive for a player to keep the pregen alive since they will only be able to apply the Chronicle to their current PC if the pregen lives.

Of course, this is only my opinion. Mike may already have clarified this issue or may plan to do so before the next Guide update.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Alaska—Anchorage aka Dragnmoon

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Don Walker wrote:
This is simple and doesn't leave them with a death looming over their PC's head..

The Current Pregen rules do not have a Looming death over a PCs head. Mike mentioned in a post that it was considered for update 4.1, but when 4.1 came that rule was never added.

Currently there are no specific rules of penalty for a Pregen death be it level 1, 4 or 7.


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Dragnmoon wrote:
Currently there are no specific rules of penalty for a Pregen death be it level 1, 4 or 7.

Right. So don't be a jerk. Let them reappear as Valeros #2 and finish the adventure. When it's over, give them a chronicle and help them build their first real character... Then kill it.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 Venture-Captain, Missouri—Cape Girardeau aka Arnim Thayer

Kyle Baird wrote:
Dragnmoon wrote:
Currently there are no specific rules of penalty for a Pregen death be it level 1, 4 or 7.
Right. So don't be a jerk. Let them reappear as Valeros #2 and finish the adventure. When it's over, give them a chronicle and help them build their first real character... Then kill it.

Bwahahahahahaha!!!!

Silver Crusade

What about if it's a whole table of pre-gens? Like with We Be Goblins or a convention?


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Wow, Tracy. Killing an entire convention? That's too evil. Too evil even for me!

Silver Crusade

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Kyle Baird wrote:
Wow, Tracy. Killing an entire convention? That's too evil. Too evil even for me!

What can I say? I'm a hard Venture-Captain.

Or maybe I forgot to type the word "at" before "a convention"...

Liberty's Edge

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Kyle Baird wrote:
Dragnmoon wrote:
Currently there are no specific rules of penalty for a Pregen death be it level 1, 4 or 7.
Right. So don't be a jerk. Let them reappear as Valeros #2 and finish the adventure. When it's over, give them a chronicle and help them build their first real character... Then kill it.

Well I really didn't think I was being a jerk. In anything but a PFS game, I would have had him back in the game the next round. I made the ruling I did because it was organized play and I thought doing otherwise was against the rules. I'm still new to PFS myself and organized play in general, and there's no Venture Captain in my area. My options were rule as I understood or pause the game to check the rules. Because time has been traditionally tight at our FLGS PFS, looking it up wasn't really an option.

It's a situation I doubt I'll be in again, but it sucks that it happened. And for realsy, zero intent to be a jerk.

The Exchange 5/5

and thus we learn something new (at least to a few of us).

so thanks for the post!


Ryan. Costello wrote:
Kyle Baird wrote:
don't be a jerk
Well I really didn't think I was being a jerk.

That was more in the tone of the first rule of PFS, not a specific indictment of you personally. All too often we forget that this is a game and it's supposed to be fun for everyone.

Grand Lodge 4/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Canada—Manitoba—Brandon aka kevin_video

I love how you can't reply and ask questions on the Playing Pregens link. Makes things so much more helpful.

Pregen death
While playing a pregenerated character higher than 1st level, the risk of death is still a serious concern. If you do not chose to convert the Chronicle to Chronicle #1 for a new character, you will have to resolve the death of the pregen before you can play beyond the Chronicle awarded. This means if you have a legal 5th level character, choose to play a 7th level pregen in a tier 7-11 scenario and are killed you would have to resolve that death before your 5th level character could claim the previously earned Chronicle upon reaching level 7.

Define "resolve that death".

@Bob Jonquet -- To answer your question about the "why" you'd play a pregen instead of your own character, it's probably the obvious -because you're too low a level- or -because you're too high a level- for that particular scenario, but you still want the points.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Alaska—Anchorage aka Dragnmoon

kevin_video wrote:

Pregen death

While playing a pregenerated character higher than 1st level, the risk of death is still a serious concern. If you do not chose to convert the Chronicle to Chronicle #1 for a new character, you will have to resolve the death of the pregen before you can play beyond the Chronicle awarded. This means if you have a legal 5th level character, choose to play a 7th level pregen in a tier 7-11 scenario and are killed you would have to resolve that death before your 5th level character could claim the previously earned Chronicle upon reaching level 7.

Define "resolve that death".

Wait... Were are you seeing this rule? Did I miss it in the Guide or are you getting this from Mike's post? If you are getting it from Mike's post, it never made it in the Guide, so you don't have to worry about it.

Grand Lodge 4/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Canada—Manitoba—Brandon aka kevin_video

Dragnmoon wrote:
Wait... Were are you seeing this rule? Did I miss it in the Guide or are you getting this from Mike's post? If you are getting it from Mike's post, it never made it in the Guide, so you don't have to worry about it.

Yeah, I got it from the link in the second post. If I don't have to worry about it, that's great. It's too bad that there's no actual solid ruling though regarding pregen death and how it should treated with a player who's got a regular character other than do what you feel's best.

Dark Archive 5/5 Regional Venture-Coordinator, Midwest

Dragnmoon wrote:


Wait... Were are you seeing this rule? Did I miss it in the Guide or are you getting this from Mike's post? If you are getting it from Mike's post, it never made it in the Guide, so you don't have to worry about it.

This isn't entirely correct. Sometimes issues are minor enough to not make it into the Guide or even the FAQ. You should never disregard a ruling made by Mike Brock or Mark Moreland on the forums just like you should never ignore a ruling made by your GM in a home game.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 Venture-Lieutenant, Alaska—Anchorage aka Dragnmoon

Todd Morgan wrote:
This isn't entirely correct. Sometimes issues are minor enough to not make it into the Guide or even the FAQ. You should never disregard a ruling made by Mike Brock or Mark Moreland on the forums just like you should never ignore a ruling made by your GM in a home game.

This was not a ruling, this was a preview on what they were thinking on putting into vs 4.1 of the Guide, when vs. 4.1 of the guide came out, they made changes to that preview, Death penality of a pregen being one of them they left out.

So this is not going against a rule posting in the forums.

Dark Archive 5/5 Regional Venture-Coordinator, Midwest

In that case, I suppose it's all right, I'm just wary of publicly telling players to disregard what the campaign staff posts. It could be taken out of context...

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