|
What is inhumane about being turned to stone? They don't die, they don't age, they don't harm anyone else. No prison overpopulation, just big rooms of passive, stone people. Zero maintenance. The happy happy view of everyone being able to be rehabed to be productive members of society is overly optimistic.
I love this thread.
Taking away someones memory is a very effective way to Rehabilitate them.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Sure is. Just look at Reven from Knights of the Old Republic.
I would go with the Flesh to Stone route. Can keep them stored in any prison basement. You can fit many of them in the same room once turned to stone. Can keep with many other statues of the same person, so any rescue attempts require them to take all the likenesses.
Would just need a stonemason and a wizard/sorcerer on hand to create the initial statue, then the copies.
All those other ideas are more complicated than they need. This, you just turn the guy to stone, make 14 copies, then put all 15 statues in a single room. Don't need to go through the whole process of time and money to make a whole demi-plane just for them
Personally I think mine's less complicated. You only have an initial investment and then you're set. No need to keep a wizard on hand to restore the prisoners for whatever reason you may need and no need to find a place to put all these statues.
Does anybody else notice that all the suggestions here are very 'non humane'?
After all, imprisonment has TWO goals. Two duties!
1. Keep 'em locked up.
2. Rehabilitate them so when they re-enter society, they will not go back to their old ways.
Hey now, I think my idea is reasonably humane. It's a functional prison, just like any other. No need for constant sleep deprivation, 24/7 restraints, Feebleminds, or the like. Just put them in a cell and you're good to go.
(reduce person + Bag of Holding) x the Astral Plane = Superman II style prison
Allright, sounds fair. So how are you going to handle the rehabilitating of the prisoner while petrified? :)I've never seen D&D/PF imply that petrified people are still conscious or aware in any manner. (If they were, a petrified Psion on a handtruck would be a scary enemy. :D )
Why is rehab a goal? It's just storage. You can't kill them or they'll just be resurrected.
Rehabilitation isn't a high priority in medieval prisons.
|
Rehabilitation wasn't completely off the table in medieval law. Just look at the stocks-- you spent several days in the center of town exposed to the elements getting rotten food thrown at you. A few days of that and you'd make damn sure you never did it again.
Of course, the real effectiveness of the stocks wasn't for the prisoner, it was for all the townsfolk who got to see what would happen to them if they committed the same crime. People are forgetting what the REAL goal of prison is-- to scare people into obeying the law in the first place.
Per the Sanity and Madness rules, bestow curse can afflict someone with a single type of insanity, such as amnesia. Do you know what amnesia does to a person? Not only does it inflict a –4 penalty on Will saving throws and all skill checks, it also causes the amnesiac to lose all class abilities, feats, and skill ranks for as long as his amnesia lasts (along with the traditional loss of memory of identity, skills, and past history).
Once you've got all you need out of a prisoner through interrogation, I can't think of a more effective way of stripping someone of their power.
EDIT: You could cast it twice to give someone permanent achluophobia (fear of the dark) and ahotophobia (fear of light) in order to make them perpetually frightened. For good measure, strike them down with agoraphobia too. Then they will CHOOSE not to leave their safe little prison.
Couldn't this be a great beginning to a campaign? The party starts with amnesia and 'escapes' (actually either their unconscious enabling or allies manipulating events) and starts to adventure at 1st level ... to a point where they get hit by a "break enchantment, limited wish, miracle, remove curse, or wish spell" and remember their other 12+ levels.
Weird power curve... low level to high level missing the mid levels
Build the portal so you have to climb up to get out. Make it far enough and you control from the exterior who comes in and out. Exit could be as simple as a rope or as complicated as a golem driven elevator mechanism.
Jailbreadk? Just cut the exit rope/elevator cable.
And that worked soooo well for the Harrowstone guards.
And that worked soooo well for the Harrowstone guards.Build the portal so you have to climb up to get out. Make it far enough and you control from the exterior who comes in and out. Exit could be as simple as a rope or as complicated as a golem driven elevator mechanism.
Jailbreadk? Just cut the exit rope/elevator cable.
The human element is hard to control for. I'd prefer the stone shape prison. It's less messy.
|
Remember a caster needs a minimum ability score of 10 + the level of the spell to actually be able to cast it. Simply use Bestow curse to lower the sorcerer's charisma below 10. Then he can't cast spells at all. Sorcerer's have notoriously low skill points, just chain him up and toss in the brig. Done.
I keep seeing that mentioned. While feeblemind would probably work since they basically become a drooling idiot having them go to 9 cha isn't good enough.
Hi I'm a high level elemental blooded sorcerer. I will blast your walls with my bloodline ability several times a day eventually making a nice hole for myself to walk through. Same with draconic, infernal, and many other bloodlines. If you can't blast there are other things you could possibly do like with Protean who can do dimension door with his bloodline.
Not foolproof at all.
Except that they can't use their 1st-level bloodline abilities with a Charisma of 1 (3 base - 5 Charisma modifier = 0). Higher level bloodline abilities are a bit more difficult to deprive them...
Phew, it's a good thing you aren't restricted to level 1 bloodlines when you are a high level sorcerer :). Besides people were talking about reducing the stat to 9 and like I said a feeblemind level reduction of int and cha to 1 would do the trick in terms of keeping them caged. However in my mind it would be like caging a dangerous animal that could lash out by instinct when frightened or in pain. YMMV on that though.
Could always cut out their tongue and sever their limbs. Chances are they haven't got both the Silent and Still metamagic feats. In that case... see any of the other insidious ideas provided above.
Could always cut out their tongue and sever their limbs. Chances are they haven't got both the Silent and Still metamagic feats. In that case... see any of the other insidious ideas provided above.
Nope, bloodlines don't require any verbal or somatic component. They aren't spells and they can be used while paralyzed. Go sorcerers! :)
Cast dimensional anchor. Kill sorcerer. Cast animate dead. Cast reduce person and permanency. Buy a Bag of Holding. Enjoy your pet sorcerer.
Willing slave labor prison force?
Robe of powerlessness + bestow curse (casting stat) for -16 to it (min 1)
Then bestow curse (amnesia)
Then bluff ('Your name is [falsenamehere]. I'm your [friend/relation]. You caught the memory-plague. You're healed and they say as soon as you work off your debt to the town/temple/nation for the magic healing you can come home.')
Take to mine/fields/other workplace.
Kill sorcerer.
And have a wee bit of a problem, when the magistrate wants you to produce the prisoner but Pharasma has already judged the soul...
Flesh to Stone + Shrink Item + Handy Haversack.
Sorcerer now statue. Now 1/16 scale statue. Now safe, and you can always fetch the prisoner you want easily, they will be the statue on top.
Flesh to Stone + Shrink Item + Handy Haversack.
Sorcerer now statue. Now 1/16 scale statue. Now safe, and you can always fetch the prisoner you want easily, they will be the statue on top.
You're gonna need Permanency, because Shrink Item last of 1/day per caster level... and if you have like 100 prisoners, you're gonna need a lot of casters to cast the spell and keep the statues small.
Letting them lose consciousness seems too nice, hacking off things seems too cruel, and antimagic seems too obvious. How about a permanent stinking cloud? Perhaps a bit on the cruel side but still interesting, only 7.5K and you could put several prisoners in one room.
Could you create an endless loop with two teleportation circles in which they are conscious of the teleportation but don't have time to react at either end point?
Letting them lose consciousness seems too nice,
This is quite a... unique argument against capital punishment.
Remember a caster needs a minimum ability score of 10 + the level of the spell to actually be able to cast it. Simply use Bestow curse to lower the sorcerer's charisma below 10. Then he can't cast spells at all. Sorcerer's have notoriously low skill points, just chain him up and toss in the brig. Done.
I understand what you're suggesting, but it's effectively metagaming, isn't it? How does anyone know what a "Charisma score" is? How would they know a sorcerer has a high charisma?
Bear in mind too, that a magical prison ought to be interesting and compelling as a setting for a fantasy adventure.
You're gonna need Permanency, because Shrink Item last of 1/day per caster level... and if you have like 100 prisoners, you're gonna need a lot of casters to cast the spell and keep the statues small.Flesh to Stone + Shrink Item + Handy Haversack.
Sorcerer now statue. Now 1/16 scale statue. Now safe, and you can always fetch the prisoner you want easily, they will be the statue on top.
Not as much as you might think. A single level 10 sorcerer could have the magic to handle way more than 100 shrunk objects. Assuming 18 charisma - shrink item could be cast 112 times a week, but would only need to cast it once every 10 days per object. Of course if you only have one person doing it you might have a problem if he quits...
Anyway, carry on :)
As blahpers pointed out on page 1, the ritualistic obsession spellblight (which can be imparted with bestow curse) makes all spells and spell-like abilities absolutely require somatic components, even if the Still Spell feat is applied. Your bound-in-manacles sorcerer is accordingly now unable to use either spells or his spell-like bloodline powers, period. He can be left conscious, sane, able to speak, and still unable to cast anything.
A robe of powerlessness is a useful general prisoner item, since there's no save and the effect remains after the robe is removed, allowing re-use of the robe on all prisoners. -10 to a casting ability score and -10 Strength is not perfect, but slows pretty much anyone down.
Hmm...
TEMPORAL STASIS
School transmutation; Level sorcerer/wizard 8
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S, M (powdered diamond, emerald, ruby, and sapphire dust worth 5,000 gp)
Range touch
Target creature touched
Duration permanent
Saving Throw Fortitude negates; Spell Resistance yes
You must succeed on a melee touch attack. You place the subject into a state of suspended animation. For the creature, time ceases to flow, and its condition becomes fixed. The creature does not grow older. Its body functions virtually cease, and no force or effect can harm it. This state persists until the magic is removed (such as by a successful dispel magic spell or a freedom spell).
+
Portable holes full o bodies.
Letting them lose consciousness seems too nice,This is quite a... unique argument against capital punishment.
I had been dead for billions and billions of years before I was born and had not suffered the slightest inconvenience from it.
Mark Twain
I don't see a reason for any city needing more than a cell, bindings and real gags. That should be enough to deal with 95% of all magic users, sorcerers included. Sorcerers who have feats such as silent or still spell have an advantage to escaping, yes, but I think it would be extreme to assume every sorcerer has such an ability. If the sorcerer is known for having such feats or has somehow magically escaped imprisonment before then it might be time to look into more costly means to restrain them. But even then, It would probably be simpler to just kill the sorcerer at that point rather than to deal with trying to hold him.