Highest Diplomacy! Can You Get Your Bonus Over 100 by lvl 20?


Advice

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blackbloodtroll wrote:
What about the Negotiator Bard?

I would say the Dragon Herald trumps it; at level 5 you get auto take 10 on diplomacy and intimidate, but more importantly you get the 1/day (maxing at 3/day) ability to make such a check as a full round action instead of taking a minute. Yay, up to three combats you can essentially auto-win with a high enough skill roll!

Liberty's Edge

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I would suggest Fate's Favored trait as your second trait: increases luck bonuses by 1.


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Pathfinder Maps, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Deadbeat Doom wrote:
Forget Silver Tongued, Diabolical Negotiator is where it's at. You can use Int or Wis instead of Cha and you only drop their attitude if you fail by 5 or more on a natural 1, AND most importantly, there is no limit to how many steps up you go!

Called it. I knew there was something out there.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

The usual shenanigans plus Leadership. Or heck just leadership and a ton of followers all assisting...


Pardon my rant, I'm a little sore from a long debate with other players at a diplomacy issue we had today

//Begin Rant

Here's what I'm confused about. Yes it's fun to see how high you can get your numbers, but let's be honest...why? A character who's level 20 shouldn't be fighting something more than 6 levels above itself without seriously looking into your Game mastering, so at level 20, a monster who's hostile to yourself is going to have a DC of 25 + Cha (which at level 26 shouldn't be higher than what, a +26 bonus?) giving a final DC of 51? So why do you need a +101 diplomacy? Are you asking the CR 26 monster to kill itself (DC 66) and then destroy it's own soul (DC 71)? And hunt down the last of it's kind? (which might increase the DC by another 5 or it might not so we'll say it does). And destroy any chance of giving it a chance to come back (DC 81). And whatever other 4 requests you wish to ask of it without having to roll?

At some point numbers don't even matter anymore (A first level commoner doesn't care how much strength you have, a critical from a scythe is still fatal.

But that's just my .02

Of course If you give me some viable reason why you need to have diplomacy at =>100, I'll be happy to delete these programmers comments ^_^

//End Rant


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Your Soul is Mine! wrote:

Pardon my rant, I'm a little sore from a long debate with other players at a diplomacy issue we had today

//Begin Rant

Here's what I'm confused about. Yes it's fun to see how high you can get your numbers, but let's be honest...why?

Your Soul is Mine! wrote:
Yes it's fun


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How much does a +1d6 help? Inspiration ability of the Investigator.

also 2 lvls of Psychic Searcher ( http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/base-classes/oracle/archetypes/paizo---orac le-archetypes/psychic-searcher) can do that all day long.


I don't know if this was mentioned already, but I recommend the Street Performer Bard for Diplomancer builds.

Gladhanding lets you Diplomance as a Standard action instead of 1 minute. Is there another way to reduce the time besides Street Performer?


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Pathfinder Maps, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Has anyone mentioned the stone of good luck or the pale green prism ioun stone?


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For maximum cheese, you should go through the bard's versatile performance ability and "summon Bollywood."

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder_RPG/comments/3c33k 2/summon_bollywood/


Nanite Surge should be a desired feat for getting the biggest bonus.
It's one per day, but at 3+level untyped bonus that 23 is quite useful.

You can get it either if you're an android or with the sorcerer bloodline, obtainable with the eldritch heritage feats.


Pathfinder Maps, Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

People need to get in the habit of not only listing the bonuses and their sources, but their bonus types as well. Wouldn't surprise me if a lot of the combos in this thread didn't quite "stack up."


Compiling everything is hard... I may try when I have 6 hours


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voideternal wrote:

I don't know if this was mentioned already, but I recommend the Street Performer Bard for Diplomancer builds.

Gladhanding lets you Diplomance as a Standard action instead of 1 minute. Is there another way to reduce the time besides Street Performer?

Street performer wrote:


As a standard action, he may use a Bluff check in place of a Diplomacy check to improve a creature’s attitude for 1 minute, after which its attitude becomes one step worse than originally.

We kind of want the change to last more than a minute.


Dot!


has anyone added a dip into synthesist for a +8 racial bonus to diplomacy?


Ravingdork wrote:
Has anyone mentioned the stone of good luck or the pale green prism ioun stone?

Luckstone has been added. Pale green prism pales in comparison to the Mulberry pentacle


Lady-J wrote:
has anyone added a dip into synthesist for a +8 racial bonus to diplomacy?

Yes, it may be worth it, it may not.


Fates favoured.


At the heart of it all.


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Level 20 Nature Oracle abusing Awaken Animal loops to gain infinite (read: arbitrary) CHA, and infinite (read: arbitrary) HD, which also yields infinite (read: arbitrary) skill ranks into Diplomacy.

Do I win?


No, you don't win.


With Aspect(LLV 10 summoner) you could grab Skilled for a +8.


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Azten wrote:
With Aspect(LLV 10 summoner) you could grab Skilled for a +8.

1 level dip into synth will get that as well with less level investment


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CHARISMA BONUSES
Point buy: 18 (?)
Aasimaar: +2 (Racial)
Headband of Mental Prowess (Wisdom, Charisma): +6 (Enhancement) (36,000)
Tome of leadership and Influence: +5 (Inherent) (137,500)
Middle Age: +1 to all mental
Level up: +5 (?)
+2 profane from succubi
DIPLOMACY BONUSES
Feats
Persuasive: +4 (?)
Skill focus: +6 (?)
Voice of the Sybil: +3 (?)
Racial heritage (Kobold): Allows for others
Diabolical Negotiator: Can increase more than 2 steps. Only decreases on a Nat 1
Leadership: ?
Equipment
Masterwork Tool: +2 (Circumstance) (50)
Mulberry Pentacle: +5 (Competence) (10,000)
Circlet of Persuasion: +3 (Competence) (4,500)
Stone of good luck: +1 (Luck) (20,000)
Traits
Ambassador of Sarenrae: +2 (Trait)
Golden Scaled: +2 vs. non reptilian humanoids (?)
Class (Bard (Dragon herald) 17, Inquisitor (Infiltrator) 1, Summoner (Synthesist) 1)
Class skill: +3 (?)
20 ranks Diplomacy: +20 (?)
Bard (Dragon herald) (Dragon voice): +8 (?)
Inquisitor (Infiltrator) (Guileful Lore): +wis (?)
Wizard (Enchantment school) (Enchanting smile): +2 (Enhancement)
Wizard (Enchantment school) (Familiar): +3 (?)
Summoner (Synthesist) (Skilled Evolution): +8 (Racial)
Bard (Dragon herald) (Master of persuasion): can use diplomacy 3/day As a full round action
Race
Scion of humanity: Allows for Racial heritage
Immortal Spark: Lesser age resistance 1/day
Spellls
Heroism, Greater: +4 (Morale)
Moment of greatness: *2 one morale bonus
+20 insight moment of prescience
Notes
Infiltrator Archetype and the conversion inquisition don’t stack


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Natural Divination, a revelation that nature oracles can get, has the option of giving a +10 competence bonus to one skill check.

Encouraging Spell is a metamagic feat which increases any morale bonus of a spell by 1.

Tactical Leader inquisitors get half their level as a morale bonus to diplomacy.

Savage Technologist barbarians get half their level as an untyped bonus to diplomacy by spending 2 rounds of rage (without actually raging) from level 3. They also get to add their Str bonus, but only with 'tribal cultures'. These last two would require more of a redesign than would be easy tho'.

For whatever reason you've taken only 19 levels. If you get one level as a nature oracle you can take that revelation for the +10 competence bonus. Competence bonuses don't stack BTW. A metamagic rod of encouraging spell (or encouraging spell, 2 other metamagic feats & spell perfection) puts greater heroism's bonus up to +5, which moment of greatness doubles to +10.


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Ok everyone I did the best I could, and would like to thank people for pointing out certain bonuses like encouraging spell...

Here's what I got. I did NOT use "home made items" for +30. Or profane bonuses or anything that makes me trade my life away.

I did take a buddy with leadership. He gets half my profits because we are a team. I call him FlavaFlav the halfling. It's his job when I start to sing to use his oratory and stand behind me and say "yeeeeahhh boooooyyy" with basic harmony and helpful to basically beat DC 110 by about 100 points. I didnt bother calculating his exact anounts because at this point it didn't matter.

I took argent voice. Which.. ok guys so this is how it works. You get sing. Then you get a bonus to sing based on how many other perform skills you maxed out. The bonus grows.

I'd like to point out this guy can also do this t to anything versatile performance (and it's alternatives) can do. So.. he can escape the grapple check anything or activate anything magical or convince you of any lie.

Here's what I got.

Bard. Argent voice.

20 ranks perform sing.

20 ranks all other kinds of perform (9 others)
9 x4 36

20 start + 6 headband + wish 6 +5 stat 3 venerable = 15

Skill focus sing + 6

Greater heroism +4 x2 moment of greatness 8

Songbird throat lozenges 2 alchemical

Masterwork tool 2 circ

Shadow bard spell inspire competence 6

Class skill 3

Trait Savant (sing) 2 trait

Trait Fates Favoured + harrowing = +3 luck

Race aasimar muse touched 2 racial

Scroll of moment of prescience CL20 +20 insight

Blade of 3 fancies +4 sacred

Cyclops head gear nat 20

Encouraging spell rod +2 more morale

Leadership evangelist cleric halflings similar build and glory domain. +18

Basic harmony with evangelist +20 (rough estimate based on the bonus character would get.) (Included halfling aid another)

189. I should add unlike others here I used 20 from the Cyclops helm. I find this beats a circlet of persuasion.

Total 189. I think.

Go bards!


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"Hey abadar, can I get the key to the first vault?"
diplomacy: 1d20 + 189 ⇒ (2) + 189 = 191
"Sure!"


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To be fair, the 20 is from the Cyclops helm. So... it'll be 189 straight.

But I mean.. I just want that last point...


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+163. Your inspire competence does not affect yourself + Cyclops helm


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Hey, Pharasma, will you tell me what happened to Aroden?


Actually it would affect him because it's not coming from him it's coming from shadow bard who possesses all the songs the character does

"When a shadowbardcomes into being, it immediately begins a bardic performance of your choice—it has access to all of the bardic performances that you do. "

Even if it didn't work, you can't just hand wave circumstance bonuses away like there's no replacement. Bards possess +4 in grand destiny by that level.

I included the numbers of the Cyclops helm due to the fact you can pick the number therefore it's not random. It's just 20.

If it makes you feel better to type it as x+20 That's fine.

Even if you state shadow bard wouldn't work (I see no evidence it wouldn't but fine) that's still 167+20 for a total of 187


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Sorry, missed shadow hard.


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whats the most you can get via permanent modifiers (no buffs)?


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CHARISMA BONUSES (Total: +13)
Point buy: 17 (?)
Aasimaar: +2 (Racial)
Headband of Mental Prowess (Wisdom, Charisma): +6 (Enhancement) (36,000)
Tome of leadership and Influence: +5 (Inherent) (137,500)
Middle Age: +1 to all mental
Level up: +5 (?)
+2 profane from succubi
DIPLOMACY BONUSES
Feats
Persuasive: +4 (?)
Skill focus: +6 (?)
Voice of the Sybil: +3 (?)
Racial heritage (Kobold): Allows for others
Diabolical Negotiator: Can increase more than 2 steps. Only decreases on a Nat 1
Leadership: See below
Additional traits: +2 traits
Equipment
Masterwork Tool: +2 (Circumstance) (50)
Stone of good luck: +1 (Luck) (20,000)
Rod of encouraging spell: +1 morale bonus to a spell (
Moon dew: +1 CL to divination spells
Ring of Terrible cost: +5 (Profane)
Traits
Ambassador of Sarenrae: +2 (Trait)
Golden Scaled: +2 vs. non reptilian humanoids (?)
Fates Favoured: +1 to current luck bonuses
Class (Bard (Dragon herald) 15, Inquisitor (Infiltrator) 1, Summoner (Synthesist) 1, Wizard (Enchantment Specialist) 1, Oracle (Nature) 1, Vigilante (?) 1)
Class skill: +3 (?)
20 ranks Diplomacy: +20 (?)
Bard (Dragon herald) (Dragon voice): +8 (?)
Inquisitor (Infiltrator) (Guileful Lore): +wis (?)
Wizard (Enchantment school) (Enchanting smile): +2 (Enhancement)
Wizard (Enchantment school) (Familiar): +3 (?)
Summoner (Synthesist) (Skilled Evolution): +8 (Racial)
Bard (Dragon herald) (Master of persuasion): can use diplomacy 2/day As a full round action
Oracle (Nature Mystery) (Natural Divination): +10 (Competence)
Vigilante (?) (Social graces): +4 (Circumstance)
Race
Scion of humanity: Allows for Racial heritage
Immortal Spark: Lesser age resistance 1/day
Spellls
Heroism, Greater: +4 (Morale)
Moment of greatness: *2 one morale bonus
Moment of prescience: +20 (Insight)
--Harrowing: +1 or +2 (Luck) N/A
Leadership
Evangelist cleric halflings similar build and glory domain. +18 (?)
Aid Another: +4 (Halfling) (?)
Wisom (Total: +9)
Point buy: 16
Aasimaar: +2 (Racial)
Headband of Mental Prowess (Wisdom, Charisma): +6 (Enhancement) (Already paid)
Tome of ? and ?: +5 (Inherent) (137,500)
Middle Age: +1 to all mental
Notes
Infiltrator Archetype and the conversion inquisition don’t stack
Inspire competence gives a Competence bonus
Maths!!: 13 + 4 + 6 + 3 + 2 + 1 + 2 + 1 + 5 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 3 + 20 + 8 + 9 + 2 + 3 + 8 + 10 + 4 + 4 + 4 + 20 + 18 + 4 = 159


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Can you explain what basic harmony with the Evangelist means?
Also wishes can only go up to +5. Calculator says (including the helm) +188

You, but revised (Slightly):

Here's what I got.

Bard. Argent voice.

20 ranks perform sing.

20 ranks all other kinds of perform (9 others)
9 x4 36
Maths!!: 20 + 36 + 14 + 6 + 8 + 2 + 2 + 6 + 3 + 2 + 3 + 2 + 20 + 4 + 2 + 18 + 20 + 20 = 188

20 start + 6 headband + wish 5 +5 stat 3 venerable = 39 (+14)

Skill focus sing + 6

Greater heroism +4 x2 moment of greatness 8

Songbird throat lozenges 2 alchemical

Masterwork tool 2 circ

Shadow bard spell inspire competence 6

Class skill 3

Trait Savant (sing) 2 trait

Trait Fates Favoured + harrowing = +3 luck

Race aasimar muse touched 2 racial

Scroll of moment of prescience CL20 +20 insight

Blade of 3 fancies +4 sacred

Cyclops head gear nat 20

Encouraging spell rod +2 more morale

Leadership evangelist cleric halflings similar build and glory domain. +18

Basic harmony with evangelist +20 (rough estimate based on the bonus character would get.) (Included halfling aid another)


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Glimpse of the Akashic


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Basic harmony is like aid another only they make a perform check DC 10. Then every 5 they beat that by add another to aid another.

Since he won't have a few bonuses like the character I made would, such as the argent voice ridiculous bonus to sing, or his aid another, I figured him about +100 and a bit. Enough to add 20 plus a little more for being a halfling and having that bit too. Also being level 18 but that's fine, not a huge effect.

Hence him basically screaming "ya boy!" Like he's my back up rapper in my video. It really pushes my message.

I'd sit down and go through it but because it's just a perform check and he gets oratory it's pretty simple. The actual amount of comes to? No clue. But knocking off basic harmony and argent voice was about 70 points so I think saying 100 is keeping it honest.


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Oh if you mean can an evangelist take it? Their ability acts as bardic performance for feats so.. I can't see a single reason why not.

With a basic 100 in diplomacy himself that makes a check for 20 plus another 2 for the halfling thingy.


So your followers get a basic harmony with the evangelist who then gets harmony with you? Wouldn't it be simpler for them to get harmony with you?

A level 1 follower can't fail (Take 10) supplying at least a +3 (+5 perform should be easy to manage)
I will do the maths later, but I'm sure you can easily get more than +20.
Your build was better (it was easier to add to perform than Diplomacy) but if you multiclass like I did you can get far higher bonuses.


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CHARISMA BONUSES (Total: +13)
Point buy: 17 (?)
Aasimaar: +2 (Racial)
Headband of Mental Prowess (Wisdom, Charisma): +6 (Enhancement) (36,000)
Tome of leadership and Influence: +5 (Inherent) (137,500)
Middle Age: +1 to all mental
Level up: +5 (?)
+2 profane from succubi
PERFORM (SING) BONUSES
Feats
Prodigy: +4
Skill focus: +6 (?)
Diabolical Negotiator: Can increase more than 2 steps. Only decreases on a Nat 1
Leadership: Score: 20+13
Additional traits: +2 traits
Basic Harmony: You'll see
Eldritch heritage (Arcane): Familiar!!!
Equipment
Masterwork Tool: +2 (Circumstance) (50)
Stone of good luck: +1 (Luck) (20,000)
Rod of encouraging spell: +1 morale bonus to a spell (
Moon dew (2): +1 CL to divination spells (?)
Ring of Terrible cost: +5 (Profane)
Blade of three fancies: +4 (Sacred)
Songbird throat lozenges: +2 (Alchemical)
Ring of the ?: Double followers
Suzerain Scepter: Double + Double= Triple followers
Traits
Savant: +2 (Trait)
Fates Favoured: +1 to current luck bonuses
Class (Bard (Argent voice) 18, Summoner (Synthesist) 1, Oracle (Nature) 1)
Class skill: +3 (?)
20 ranks Diplomacy: +20 (?)
Wizard (Enchantment school) (Familiar): +3 (?)
Summoner (Synthesist) (Skilled Evolution): +8 (Racial)
Bard (Argent Voice) (?): 9*4=36
Oracle (Nature Mystery) (Natural Divination): +10 (Competence)
Versatile performance: Can use perform for diplomacy
Race
Immortal Spark: Lesser age resistance 1/day
Spellls
Heroism, Greater: +4 (Morale)
Moment of greatness: *2 one morale bonus
Moment of prescience: +20 (Insight)
Glimpse of the Akashic: +20 (Circumstance)
--Harrowing: +1 or +2 (Luck) N/A
Leadership
Evangelist cleric halflings similar build and glory domain. +18 (?)
L.1-405, L.2-39, L.3-21, L.4-12, L.5-6, L.6-6
^In the process of converting to a perform (Sing) user


Total: 18 + 20 + 20 + 13 + 4 + 6 + 2 + 1 + 2 + 2 + 5 + 4 + 2 + 2 + 1 + 3 + 20 + 3 + 8 + 36 + 10 + 4 + 4 = 190
Multiclassed amalgamtions are better than a single classed bard (for the simple reason that with only 18 levels I can gain your buffs, meaning I have 2 levels to play around with)

Shadow Lodge

Free snickerdoodles! +10
(Pumpkin-spice flavor) -5

Liberty's Edge

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If you're already grabbing a Succubus bonus, I recommend a Lilitu instead, since that's a +4 instead of a +2.


Well I am not factoring in followers.

The followers aren't doing basic harmony on the cohort because it's already an aid another action. He's adding in basically a d20 plus his perform (which if built similar but lacking argent voice and basic harmony on himself because once again aiding another to aid another sounds dumb) then divide by 5. The result is the aid another bonus.

HOWEVER. There is a way to get multiple aid another to work well enough with followers.

Let's go with followers. Now because the bard is allowed to use his bardic performance and versatile.performance at the same time, let's give him the team work feat Ensemble and then the ability to share it. (That's right we are using masterpieces up in this)

Up to 4 people with perform 5 can now do aid another. If they are all halfling bards they can do an ordinary check and still jump it up by 4. That's +16 more because a bard can only have 4 people do it this way.

So factoring in the aid another from the cohort using his team work feat, and the 4 followers using Ensemble that's a massive boost.

An evangelist doesn't use sing. Uses oratory. That doesn't matter for the purposes of Basic Harmony. But with a halfling it would still be at least 22. So 22 basic harmony plus 16 from followers plus 18 from glory domain. 56 total from helpers.


That should push it well past 200


Actually come to think of it there's no reason those followers have to be a certain class. If they can use perform and be order of the dragon cavalier... That would make another 4 total. For 20 more.

It's funny that this isn't even diplomacy and if this bard wanted to he could just have a bunch of guys sing and he could make an escape artist check at 200.


This is slightly different than the original post

BUT.... HOW would you play a character with over 100 on Diplomacy

What could he/she do?


I'm pretty sure at that level you're basically pathfinder Ace Rimmer

What a guy.


No harmony assumed
Hey goblin. *talks for 1 minute*. Would you please throw yourself off a cliff?
Suicidal goblin: 1d20 + 190 ⇒ (1) + 190 = 191
"Sure"

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