Hey guys quick question:
If a Witch dies, does her familiar lose all of its familiar powers straight away? In my group that's how we've normally played it with the Wizard, but the Witch's familiar gets its abilities from her Patron rather than herself, so it wouldn't necessarily lose them, am I correct in this assumption?
I had a quick look through the Witch's familiar section and on the boards but couldn't find anything.
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Under Familiar Teaching Familiar
"If a familiar belongs to a witch that has died, it only retains its knowledge of spells for 24 hours, during which time it is possible to coerce or bribe the familiar into teaching its spells to another, subject to GM discretion."
So I would think that the familiar will retain his powers for 24 hours after the witch death.
And a witch death can be very bad for him/her, as staying dead for more than 24 hours can cost her a lot of spell and force him/her to call a new familiar.
Maybe it should be FAQed to see if it is ROI.
Remember that text only says, that after 24 hours the familiar can't access the stored spells anymore.
So, really all this sentence is saying that for 24 hours after a witches death the spells are DEFINITELY still there!
It does not say anything about the time after, except that the spells can't be accessed anymore. It's quite possible all those powers reactivate and whatnot, if the witch gets revived after that time period.
It's also possible that the familiar turns back into a normal animal and all is really lost, but it doesn't say that. So that part is up to the GM.
If it was my game I'd probably give it a bit longer time. Maybe roll a d20 with a DC of the days dead, to see if the spells are still there afterwards. (so a witch that's been dead for more than 10 days has a 50/50 chance to lose the spells)
Why? Well usually when a familiar dies it's the witches fault for putting it in harms way somehow. Using it to do touch attacks or something.
If the witch herself dies, it can be anyones fault. Maybe it was the witches fault or maybe it was a lucky crit from a CR 1/3 goblin ;)
However if the witch stays dead for more than 24 hours or not, is not exactly anything in the witch's power, she's dead after all. That's her companions either reacting fast enough or taking their sweet time. And I find it extremely unsporty to punish someone this severly for mistakes someone else did.
Also from a balance issue. Noone else takes really permanent penalties from dying. A wizards spellbook doesn't erase it's letters after 24 hours or so, a cleric's god doesn't forget his spells, a fighter doesn't unlearn his weapon training. Sure a wizards spellbook may be destroyed by the same thing that killed the wizard, but that usually takes care of the familiar as well. And for a wizard its alot easier to make backup spellbooks than for a witch.
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For a similar loss upon death:
Wizard bonded item:
"If a bonded object's owner dies, or the item is replaced, the object reverts to being an ordinary masterwork item of the appropriate type."
RAW if a wizard die his bonded item revert to a masterwork item, even if it was a a magic item before being bonded! :o
Even allowing it to retain its pre-bond enchantment he still lose all the enchantments that the wizard did put in it.
True that is also a nasty penalty, didn't know about that.
But I think it's not quite the magnitude of a witch's familiar. The item still works as bonded object too, just not magical anymore.
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Not sure about that. It will revert to a masterwork item, not to a bonded masterwork item. I think this will come into effect:
"If the object of an arcane bond is lost or destroyed, it can be replaced after 1 week in a special ritual that costs 200 gp per wizard level plus the cost of the masterwork item. "
I think that it would count as "lost" (actually what was lost is the link between the wizard and item) so the wizard has to re-bond it.
Plenty of space for a GM interpretation of how fast it will happen.
There are several similar instances of creatures boosted by they owner life force and no clear rule about what happen when the owner dies.
Things that can have that problem:
- sorcerer/wizard familiars (they revert to normal animals? How fast? If they are damaged and lose the extra HP for the familiar status, they die?)
- druid/ranger bonded animals (they lose the stat increases so they risk to die when the druid/ranger die)
- the witch familiar (obviously)
- the cavalier mount (not sure when it will happen with this one, or if it should happen at all).
The witch is the character hit the worst way by this kind of problem,
And Quatar, the rule for the witch say: "If a familiar belongs to a witch that has died, it only retains its knowledge of spells for 24 hours, during which time it is possible to coerce or bribe the familiar into teaching its spells to another, subject to GM discretion.", so no, after 24 hours the knowledge is totally lost, not only inaccessible.
Just in case anybody is interested, I had a quick discussion with my DM about it tonight. Going by the "retains its knowledge of spells for 24 hours" rule, and would be able to teach that knowledge for at least that amount of time, we decided that the familiar would keep its powers for at least that long (the fact that my character's familiar is a scorpion and therefore mindless without his familiar powers makes this a necessity).
After that point the familiar would lose the spells but keep his powers, however he would not automatically be bonded to the witch if she was brought back to life (and would seek out the patron as soon as possible for reassignment). However in most cases it's probably safe to assume that the familiar would prefer to go back to its original Witch.