Critique / Advice for blaster cleric


Advice


Hello all

I've got a new character concept in mind for PFS. I want to be a cleric that can heal, buff and do some utility stuff - and I want to be well rounded and suitable for several situations. But I also want to shine in one area now and then - and for this area, I've chosen blasting.

What I'm focusing on right now is the mechanics and making a character that can contribute. Character development and background will come later. And will most likely be severely silly. Cause that's just how it is.

I've made and overview of my character progression below. Advice and critique is very welcome!

I've chosen the sorcerer mix for a plus to caster lvl (evocation) and plus to damage. I've chosen theologian cleric because they can memorize Domain slot spells in normal spell slots, even if the spells are not on the cleric spell list.

Human Sorcerer / Cleric
Str 12, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 13, Wis 16, Cha 13

1st lvl Character: Tattooed Crossblooded Red Dragon / Orc Sorcerer (1st lvl)
Traits: Reactionary, Magical Lineage (Fireball)
Feats: Spell Focus (Evocation), Spell Specialisation (Burning Hands), Bonus: Varisian Tattoo (Evocation)
Powers: Tattoo familiar (Compsognathus; +4 Initiative)
Sorcerer spells (1st: 3/day): Shield, Burning Hands (causing 4d4+8 dmg)

2nd lvl Character: Theologian Cleric of Sarenrae (1st lvl)
Powers: Fire Bolt (6/day; ranged touch attack causing 1d6+3 dmg)
Domain spell: Burning Hands (causing 4d4+8 dmg)
Channeling: 1d6 healing
Cleric spells (1st: 2+1 domain)

3rd lvl Character: Cleric (2nd lvl)
Feats: Spell Specialisation (Admonishing Ray)
Burning Hands now causes 5d4+10 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 3+1 domain)

4th lvl Character: Cleric (3rd lvl) (Stat increase: +1 Cha)
Domain Spell: Produce Flame (causing 1d6+5 dmg, usable 4 times, but the slot will be filled with Burning Hands)
Spells: Admonishing Ray (1 ray causing 4d6+4 dmg)
Channeling: 2d6 healing
Cleric spells (1st: 3+1 domain; 2nd: 2+1 domain)

5th lvl Character: Cleric (4th lvl)
Feats: Selective Channeling + change Spell Specialisation from Burning Hands to Fireball
Spells: Admonishing Ray (2 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 3+1 domain)

6th lvl Character: Cleric (5th lvl)
Domain Spell: Fireball (causing 8d6+16 dmg)
Channeling: 3d6 healing
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 3+1 domain; 3rd: 2+1 domain)

7th lvl Character: Cleric (6th lvl)
Feats: Empower Spell + change Spell Specialisation from Admonishing Ray to Spiritual Weapon (+7 to hit, causing 1d8+4 force dmg for 9 rounds)
Powers: Fire Resistance (10)
Fireball now causes 9d6+18 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 3+1 domain)

8th lvl Character: Cleric (7th lvl) (Stat increase: +1 Int)
Domain Spell: Wall of Fire (but the slot will be filled with an Empowered Fireball)
Channeling: 4d6 healing
Fireball now causes 10d6+20 dmg
Empowered Fireball causes 15d6+30 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 3+1 domain; 4th: 1+1 domain)

9th lvl Character: Cleric (8th lvl)
Feats: Unknown? Any advice? + change Spell Specialisation from Spiritual Weapon to Admonishing Ray (3 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 4+1 domain; 4th: 2+1 domain)

And that's my thoughts for now...

The Exchange

I'm sorry, you can't be a Crossblooded Sorcerer for PFS.


I don't believe that is correct. Why do you think so?

The Exchange

In additional resources, it doesn't mention that they are allowed in PFS.

PFS Ultimate Magic:
Alternate Class Abilities: alchemical simulacrum discovery, alchemical zombie discovery, bottled ooze discovery may only be used to bottle oozes which appear in the Pathfinder RPG Bestiary, doppelganger simulacrum discovery, greater alchemical simulacrum discovery, Clone Master alchemist archetype, Vivisectionist alchemist archetype does not gain awaken at 9th level nor does it grant the ability to make anthropomorphic animal permanent and the vivisectionist alchemist gains Skill Focus (Craft [alchemy] or Knowledge [nature]) in place of Brew Potion at 1st level, Geisha bard archetype grants Spell Focus instead of Scribe Scroll, clerics using alternate channeling rules who worship a deity not listed in the Core Rulebook must provide a copy of the source in which their god’s portfolio is listed, Clostered Cleric archetype grants Spell Focus at 4th level in place of Scribe Scroll, Pack Lord druid archetype, Reincarnated Druid archetype, an ex-Inquisitor may not replace existing class abilities with those granted by the Heretic archetype, a broken monk vow only requires a casting of atonement to be renewed, the Time oracle mystery grants hold monster at 10th level in place of permanency, Broodmaster summoner archetype, Evolutionist summoners may only mutate an eidolon between sessions, child scent hex, poison steep hex, cook people major hex, witch’s brew major hex, arcane builder arcane discovery, golem constructor arcane discovery, true name arcane discovery, staff-like wand arcane discovery;


Read the section again. The list you mention is what is NOT allowed (or is changed).

Anyone has any advice? Things to change? Better traits / feats?


Well its a decent build but fire isn't a great energy choice, your basicly using the blaster wizard build that i posted in the evocation optimisation thread but using a cleric base insted.

Looks functional but you don't need any advice, just keep copying the wizard build using cleric levels insted. You have made a mistake as you only have 1 sorcerer spell knkwn due to the crossblooded archtype, i'd go for silent image or vanish


Thank you for replying Egoish - now I get to thank you for the build :) For you are of course correct - I got the idea after seeing your build. I only copied the beginning though, the rest I planned out my self, but maybe it still reads like a copy all the way through? I'll go and re-read your build and see if I get any new insights...

I was thinking of having the human favored class sorcerer bonus - and therefore an extra spell - but that is a mistake, as that would be stupid. Thanks for pointing it out!


Oh - and I think fire is the only possibility for a cleric... But I plan to get a Rod of Elemental Meta Magic. If I keep meeting fire immune critters, I'll have to fall back on buffing, healing and supporting.

The Exchange

Sorry, again, but it says that that is the list for waht is allowed.

PFS Additional Rules:
Below is a specific list of Paizo Publishing products and the equipment, traits, deities, spells, feats, and classes contained within that are legal for play in Pathfinder Society Organized Play. While most of the Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook is legal for play (with some feat and spell exceptions), these additional resources give you new character options. If a product does not appear on this list, then it is not considered legal for play. This list will be updated frequently as new products are released

And if you still don't believe me, look here

EDIT: I feel like a Jerk, not seeing the part that says "Not leag for Play", sorry. I could have also sworn that I heard it from a Venture captain, but I might be wrong. Once again, sorry.


That's ok - the page on additional ressources is a mess and quite hard to get a good overview of :)


Derwalt wrote:

Hello all

I've made and overview of my character progression below. Advice and critique is very welcome!

How are you getting +3CL on burning hands? I count +2 (tattoo and spell spec) what am I missing?

Also there is another trait (regional I believe) that duplicates magical lineage.. I suggest that over reactionary.

That way you can talk about empowered fireballs (3rd level spells) and intensified empowered fireballs (4th level spells).

Of course 11th level feat will be greater spell specialization, so 9th should be quicken (quickened fireball will be a 5th level slot and a quickened intensified one a 6th level slot if you're taking the feat rather than the archetype ability).

I would take empower at 5th, freeing up the 7th level slot for selective channel (should you wish it).

What are you thinking for your 5th cleric level ability? Intensified fireball? If not then your 7th level feat should be intensify spell.

I would consider Brigh or Asmodeus as the deity instead, and be LN.. look at the diabolist PrC as it will add a few nice things via levels. You may consider Arson subdomain if possible as flaming sphere for 3d6+6 is kinda nice over produce flame.

Also you only get 1 1st level sorcerer spell known..

-James


Well a cleric would use a few different feats but your plan seems sound and if you base it on the wizard your going to be about as effective. I think RD probably laid the majority of the ground work so i can't really claim credit.

I'd look towards alternate energy types like the metamagic rod but the cleric is rather limited for options, also the divine strategist archtype could be an excellent idea so you can blast first at the expense of channel.


@James: Arson subdomain is pure gold! I didn't know about that one! :)

Spell Specialisation gives +2 CL, so +3 in all, with the tattoo.

...and I'll have to go and look through All the traits now, hehe.

@Egoish: I'll go and look up divine strategist :)


Found the trait! Wayang Spellhunter. ...wouw. It makes this kind of crazy...


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

I did a bit more looking into it and the only major problem i can see is no decent 5th level blasting spell you can play with that even compares to firesnake. Your damage should be close to the wizard blaster, you won't have the free crafting feats but i think the ability i mention below makes up for it, you have good options other than blasting but rather than control and debuff you will have to focus on healing and buffing.

However the 5th level ability that give you free intensify is awesome and almost worthwhile by itself. The fact that you can do that and have more hp, a better ac and better saves is awesome, i think i would prefer the wizard but its a good build.


What do you mean by free intensify? I haven't caught that...

@James: the Arson subdomain is from Goblins of Golarion and doesn't seem to be legal for PFS play...


Derwalt wrote:
Found the trait! Wayang Spellhunter. ...wouw. It makes this kind of crazy...

Tends to make up for being down a casting level across the board.

I would also look into a few levels of diabolist, after all who *needs* a soul?

Btw why do you want to be a cleric? A pure sorcerer can do this even better even possibly pick up bloat mage for another CL.

When you hit 11th level what are you going to switch the admonishing ray over to?

-James


Domain secret means you can intensify one of your domain spells for free at fifth level, so burning hands at 6(clr5) and fireball at 11(clr10) i guess.

A pure sorcerer is not as good at blasting as a sorcerer dip since it loses lots of utility, if you check the evocation optimisation thread theres a lot of discussion in there regarding sorcerer wizard hybrids and what holds true for a blaster wizard dipping crossblooded sorcerer holds true for clerics as well.

Since its for pfs you probably won't even miss fire snake, going strategist so you can go first with a fireball before everyone hits melee is probably the best way to go though. A good offense won't need channel.

Edit: does wayang spellhunter burning hands mean that at level 6 this character can cast intensified 8d4+16 burning hands as an orison? Burning hands is 1st level, it gets intensified by the theologian domain secret which does not increase its level and wayang spellhunter reduces it by 1 level to 0th.


But you need theologian to memorie domain spells in non-domain slots. And it is not combinable with divine strategist sadly. But I had completely forgotten about that power! Makes it even sweeter! :)


The two archtypes do not have any conflicting restrictions, they share the single domain restriction. I think you could take both since they do not interfere with each other in the way they are written.

Its open to debate though.


They alter the same class feature, they're clearly incompatible.

In your interpretation there would be absolutely no reason to ever be a Divine Strategist but not a Theologian, violating the transactional design of archetypes.


Take Boat wrote:

They alter the same class feature, they're clearly incompatible.

In your interpretation there would be absolutely no reason to ever be a Divine Strategist but not a Theologian, violating the transactional design of archetypes.

In that interpretation neither of the archtypes can take sub domains because the alter or replace as class feature which has already been altered.

I understand what your saying, but i would let one of my players take both if he wanted to since i do not think it would make an op character. For pfs play its best to steer away from controversy.


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I've reviewed my options and rebuild the character. The new stats are below - the build shines immensely because of the two traits. They basically mean that the moment the character gets fireball he can also empower it - for free! And that's a huge spike in damage. All of his feats are now used on blasting - but he's still a cleric, even though he's a mediocre one.

I'm not using Diabolist - as the thing about the soul and ressurection seems very dangerous in PFS play - and because I think the cleric gives more to the build. As Egoish pointed out, getting intensify twice for free (in both feat cost and appliance) is really great.

Oh - and at lvl 11 he changes spell specialisation back to Burning Hands - not to get more damage out of it (since it's maxed out) - but to be able to use Greater Spell Specialisation with Burning Hands and Fireball - which are the builds' bread and butter.

Human Sorcerer / Cleric
Str 12, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 13, Wis 16, Cha 13

1st lvl Character Tattooed Crossblooded Red Dragon / Orc Sorcerer (1st lvl)
Traits: Wayang Spellhunter (Fireball), Magical Lineage (Fireball)
Feats: Spell Focus (Evocation), Spell Specialisation (Burning Hands), Bonus: Varisian Tattoo (Evocation)
Powers: Tattoo familiar (Compsognathus; +4 Initiative)
Sorcerer spells (1st: 4/day): Burning Hands (causing 4d4+8 dmg) OR Vanish?

2nd lvl Character Theologian Cleric of Sarenrae (1st lvl)
Powers: Fire Bolt (6/day; ranged touch attack causing 1d6+1 dmg)
Domain spell: Burning Hands (causing 4d4+8 dmg)
Channeling: 1d6 healing
Cleric spells (1st: 2+1 domain)

3rd lvl Character Cleric (2nd lvl)
Feats: Spell Specialisation (Admonishing Ray)
Burning Hands now causes 5d4+10 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 3+1 domain)

4th lvl Character Cleric (3rd lvl) (Stat increase: +1 Cha)
Domain Spell: Produce Flame (causing 1d6+5 dmg, usable 4 times, but the slot will be filled with Burning Hands)
Spells: Admonishing Ray (1 ray causing 4d6+4 dmg)
Channeling: 2d6 healing
Cleric spells (1st: 3+1 domain; 2nd: 2+1 domain)

5th lvl Character Cleric (4th lvl)
Feats: Empower Spell + change Spell Specialisation from Burning Hands to Fireball
Spells: Admonishing Ray (2 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg), Burning Hands (still causing 5d4+10 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 3+1 domain)

6th lvl Character Cleric (5th lvl)
Power: Domain Secret (Free Intensify Spell for Burning Hands)
Domain Spell: Fireball (which is empowered for no extra cost, causing 12d6+24 dmg)
Channeling: 3d6 healing
Spells: Burning Hands is now intensified and causes 6d4+12 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 3+1 domain; 3rd: 2+1 domain)

7th lvl Character Cleric (6th lvl)
Feats: Dazing Spell + change Spell Specialisation from Admonishing Ray to Burning Hands
Powers: Fire Resistance (10)
Spells: Admonishing Ray is still two rays, and he can cast a 1st level Intensified Burning Hands (causing 9d4+18 dmg), Empowered Fireball (remember it’s still a 3rd lvl spell) now causes 13d6+26 dmg
Cleric spells (1st: 4+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 3+1 domain)

8th lvl Character Cleric (7th lvl) (Stat increase: +1 Int)
Domain Spell: Wall of Fire (but the slot will be filled with a Dazing Fireball)
Channeling: 4d6 healing
Spells: Intensified Burning Hands (causing 10d4+20 dmg), Empowered Fireball (now causing 15d6+30 dmg), Dazing Fireball (causing 10d6+20 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 3+1 domain; 4th: 1+1 domain)

9th lvl Character Cleric (8th lvl)
Feats: Quicken Spell + change Spell Specialisation from Burning Hands to Admonishing Ray
Spells: Intensified Burning Hands (1st level spell; causing 9d4+18 dmg), Admonishing Ray (2nd level spell; 3 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg), Empowered Fireball (3rd level spell; causing 15d6+30 dmg), Dazing Fireball (4th level spell; causing 10d6+20 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 4+1 domain; 4th: 2+1 domain)

10th lvl Character Cleric (9th lvl)
Spells: Intensified Burning Hands (1st level spell; causing 10d4+20 dmg), Admonishing Ray (2nd level spell; 3 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg), Empowered Fireball (3rd level spell; causing 15d6+30 dmg), Dazing Fireball (4th level spell; causing 10d6+20 dmg), Quickened Fireball (5th level spell; causing 10d6+20 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 4+1 domain; 4th: 2+1 domain; 5th: 1+1 domain)

11th lvl Character Cleric (10th lvl)
Feats: Greater Spell Specialisation + change Spell Specialisation from Admonishing Ray back to Burning Hands
Power: Domain Secret (Free Intensify Spell for Fireball)
Spells: Intensified Burning Hands (1st level spell; causing 10d4+20 dmg), Admonishing Ray (2nd level spell; 3 rays causing 4d6+4 dmg), Intensified Empowered Fireball (3rd level spell; causing 19d6+38 dmg), Intensified Dazing Fireball (4th level spell; causing 13d6+26 dmg) ), Intensified Quickened Fireball (5th level spell; causing 13d6+26 dmg)
Cleric spells (1st: 5+1 domain; 2nd: 4+1 domain; 3rd: 4+1 domain; 4th: 2+1 domain; 5th: 2+1 domain))

At character level 11, in one round he can cast both an Intensified Quickened Fireball and en Intensified Empowered Fireball for 32d6+64 dmg – that’s an average of 176 damage. And if things are immune to fire – he’s still a cleric.


I've finally gotten to play this guy - and he's a blast - pun intended ;) I just reached Level 7 tonight (playing Day of the Demon).

He's quite fun to play - pretty versatile. With a buff and a consumeable he can reach AC 26 (29 if fighting defensively), and actually tank a little. He can heal, buff and support. And when it's needed he can throw down a 12d6+12 damage fireball (with selective metamagic rod, so that his friends go free), and he can do this 3 times a day :)

Now on lvl 7 he's got even more options (I'm gonna take selective channeling over dazing spell, so that he's a bit more flexible). I really like the versatility of the cleric, combined with the occasional possibility of a high damage output.


What about taking the glorious heat feat for some added fluff :)


That would actually be pretty nice, but the build is severely feat starved as is, so I think it's a no go. Also most of the time he would just cast fireball or burning hands (when we're talking fire spells), so he would only heal 3 or 1 hp a spell.


Sorry to necro but wouldn't the primal bloodline be better than orc? Same boost to damage but you don't get the light sensitivity.


Kill it with frost!


Pathfinder Pawns Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Re-necro!

Derwalt wrote:
Domain Spell: Produce Flame (causing 1d6+5 dmg, usable 4 times, but the slot will be filled with Burning Hands)

AND

Derwalt wrote:
Domain Spell: Wall of Fire (but the slot will be filled with a Dazing Fireball)

I'm confused. What allows you to substitute a different spell in a domain slot?


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Tarondor wrote:

Re-necro!

Derwalt wrote:
Domain Spell: Produce Flame (causing 1d6+5 dmg, usable 4 times, but the slot will be filled with Burning Hands)

AND

Derwalt wrote:
Domain Spell: Wall of Fire (but the slot will be filled with a Dazing Fireball)
I'm confused. What allows you to substitute a different spell in a domain slot?

Metamagic lets you change the level of a spell. If you take one domain spell and add a metamagic feat to it you can prepare it in a spell slot of different level.

Also, you can use a higher level slot to prepare a lower level spell, as with using a 2nd level domain slot (produce flame by default) to prepare burning hands (a 1st level fire domain spell).

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