Hi all!
Right now my group is playing the Carrion Crown AP. So far the things have been going good and we are almost through with Vol. 2.
The only problem is, we have lost our third cleric since the start of the campaign. Two players quit the group and one player changed his character, being not happy with the cleric.
I am playing a gunslinger (musketeer) atm, and having hit lvl 6, he really dishes out loads of dmg. Now my GM urges me to pick up a cleric, since I am one of the most regular players (and probably the only one, that would go for cleric). Considering that Carrion Crown is all about undead and horror, cleric might be a good addition to the group. (By now a witch and an inquisitor are the only chars capable of healing.)
Long story short: Thinking about my options as a cleric (I didn't want to be the party band-aid) I came up with the Gun Cleric.
Gunslinger (Gun Tank) at level 1 and then Cleric. This would give me access to all armor types (wrapping up in mithral heavy armor at later levels), martial weapons and firearms. The clerics high WIS would also give me decent grit points. Since Pathfinder lacks the "Zen Archery" feat (to swap WIS for DEX on ranged attacks) the firearm's special ability to attack vs. touch AC in the first range increment will let me hit quite nicely even at later levels.
My idea is an Aasimar Cleric of Desna with Luck and Travel Domains.
Str 10, Dex 14, Con 12, Int 10, Wis 16(+2), Cha 12(+2) [20 Points]
Profession Feat: Point Blank Shot
1st level feat: Rapid reload
3rd level feat: Precise Shot
5th level feat: Selective Channeling
7th level: Craft Wand (for out of combat healing)
Equip for start: Breastplate, Heavy Shield, Pistol (Paper Cartridges)
Does this sound like a viable build?
Do you have any suggestions on feats, weaponry or maybe other building options?
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In many ways you are making a range Cleric, which is not uncommon.
On the "No Zen Archery" Topic, there is a weapon property that allows you to use Wis in place of Str or Dex to attack AND damage.
Its called Guided and you can find it here:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/magic-weapons/magic-weapons-non-core/we apon-property---guided
Do note that its from another Adventure Path. Pathfinder 10: A History of Ashes aka Curse of the Crimson Throne 4th book.
There is also a 2 feat tree that allows you to use Wis for attacks... if its the favored weapon of your Deity.. which is bad, since I don't think any Deity favors firearms. (Throws out ideal.)
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On your Domains, Travel is good! Even better at lv 8! You get teleport!
As for Luck, its more buffer friendly, but it fits the theme you are going for.
Do think about the Liberation domain, as it gives you Freedom of Movement on demand and lets you get OTHERS out of grabs and other trouble with the aura at lv 8.
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On Ability spread:
No help here, Clerics need the numbers in ALL their ability scores. And Range Clerics needs even more. Do try to see if you can maybe drop 1 point from Wis and pump it into Con and Dex. Only if you can afford it.
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On feats:
Try to pick up Quick Channel, if you can afford it. It allows you to expend 2 uses of channel to use Channel as a Swift action. This can be a life saver, as you can channel AND heal in 1 round.
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Final thoughts:
Since you already have 2 other party members that can heal, you don't need to worry too much on some things, like your relatively low Con. Since they can heal you up if you drop. Usually if you are the only healer, you need a ton of Con and MUST stay alive to keep the party alive. But not so in your case.
Nice build. Its not "min-maxed" aka 7 Int.. lol :P. But it does not need to be.
I LOVE the Gunslinger of God ideal you have here. Go with it!
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Inquisitor may be a better suited approach. A wand of cure light is cheap, and handles post combat healing fine. Alchemist can actually be a decent healer as well.
I think the OP stated there is already an Inquisitor in the party.
(By now a witch and an inquisitor are the only chars capable of healing.)
As for why the OP is going for Cleric, it could have to do with the ability to Channel Positive Energy, which is limited to Clerics and Life Mastery Oracles.
Carrion Crown do have situations where Channel Positive Energy is useful. Also Clerics get spells like Magic Circle against Evil at a much earlier level then Inquisitors.
A full 9 levels caster is nothing to sneeze at.
You know when I first saw the Gunslinger and saw WIS being one of their primary stats my first thought was.....I can make a cleric....I can make a cleric with a Shotgun!
I had an build idea thought out at one point, but I abandoned it.
This needs to be made.
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Grammaton cleric?
As for why the OP is going for Cleric, it could have to do with the ability to Channel Positive Energy, which is limited to Clerics and Life Mastery Oracles.
And Paladins, technically.
If you're going for it mostly for the channel, then the Holy Gun Paladin archetype might work well for you. It'll also get spells eventually too of course, and Lay on Hands and being able to smite evil at a distance would both be excellent in an AP like Carrion Crown I imagine. Plus I'm pretty sure Holy Gun doesn't need to multiclass as much as a gun-wielding cleric would.
Quick channel allows you to channel energy as a move action, not a swift action.
Gun toting cleric in an undead heavy campaign, reminds me of Jonah Hex.
Thank you guys!
Since the question came up, I decided on the cleric for several reasons.
1) The GM is kinda obsessed with his "oldschool" idea, how a party has to be set up. He was really upset after the other cleric player left. (Besides that he is a fun guy.) He has been nagging how dear we need a cleric, because of healing, resurrection, channeling and all that. (And maybe he was a bit pissed about my Musketman, dealing 50something dmg per round, so he is urging me now.) I bet he expects some "Healing Domain" band-aid as a party cleric. So I decided to give him some "cleric" in his face. *evilgrin*
2) I like the character concept. It really fits the campaign with its steam-punk-esque background.
3) Full caster ftw. Cleric has a huge versatility, but I did not want to stand aside in combat or throw some stupid damage spells - wasted spell slots imho at the opponents.
4) I want it all. Channel, healing, tons of spells and all nicely wrapped in a fat mithral tank. And a decent weapon by my side.
Thanks for the hint to the "Guided" enchantment. I will be pestering my GM about that.
As stated above, the real deal about firearms, compared to other ranged clerics, is the TouchAC thingie.
The BAB progression is lame, so once you get to higher levels the cleric will hardly hit anything vs. AC (adding +5 WIS or +2 DEX to the attack won't matter then). But hitting a Balor on TouchAC 10... *sneer*
Of course the damage output will stay behind the party's fighter or the magus, but is still some nice topping.
Crafting wands will keep me from wasting my preciuos spell slots for lousy cures.
Cheers!
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I have to throw an idea out here, as I have been thinking through this exact same scenario as you are for a Kingmaker Campaign. 9th level - 1st lvl Spellslinger/8th level Oracle of life. Yes I loose a little spell versatility, but the primary advantage of excessive number of spells that Oracle gives can take care of the the best part about this build. A 1st level Spellslinger gets all of the fun of owning a gun, plus he can make it an Arcane Gun. Or 2!!. The primary ability of casting spells through your gun will likley be wasted (the first ray spell you get is searing light at level 3), but the secondary ability that allows you to sacrifice a spell for a enchantment bonus to your gun is awesome. Plus you can use the enchantment bonus to give your weapon the qualities of fire, frost and shock. I am awaiting confirmation of this but assuming it works another ability that it gives you is the ability to apply spellstoring to your gun. Since spell storing is usually a melee weapon only feat, I'm uncertain how this would interact, but I'd assume you'd be able to cast some of the awesome cleric spells into your weapon, shoot you target and have them take damage and be affected by the spell.
Finally, there is also the cool tricks you can do with reach spells fired through your arcane gun. Ranged touch healing spell, able to crit for X3 value is just one of the applications.
I'll state this early, I borrowed the ranged touch bit, but it still another great reason to use the gun.
Is there a reason you couldn't just build a good cleric with a couple of the gunslinger feats?
Black Powder Inquisition to get the proficiency and Free Gunsmithing, Amateur Gunslinger to get the grit & deeds.
Black Powder Inquisition is an Inquisitor archetype, not cleric. It does not give heavy armor proficiency , only 1 grit point, only lvl 1 deed, only 1d8 hp and +0 BAB on lvl 1.
I think that build would be much more feat hungry and not more efficient than sacrificing 1 level of cleric.
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I have to throw an idea out here, as I have been thinking through this exact same scenario as you are for a Kingmaker Campaign. 9th level - 1st lvl Spellslinger/8th level Oracle of life. Yes I loose a little spell versatility, but the primary advantage of excessive number of spells that Oracle gives can take care of the the best part about this build. A 1st level Spellslinger gets all of the fun of owning a gun, plus he can make it an Arcane Gun. Or 2!!. The primary ability of casting spells through your gun will likley be wasted (the first ray spell you get is searing light at level 3), but the secondary ability that allows you to sacrifice a spell for a enchantment bonus to your gun is awesome. Plus you can use the enchantment bonus to give your weapon the qualities of fire, frost and shock. I am awaiting confirmation of this but assuming it works another ability that it gives you is the ability to apply spellstoring to your gun. Since spell storing is usually a melee weapon only feat, I'm uncertain how this would interact, but I'd assume you'd be able to cast some of the awesome cleric spells into your weapon, shoot you target and have them take damage and be affected by the spell.
Finally, there is also the cool tricks you can do with reach spells fired through your arcane gun. Ranged touch healing spell, able to crit for X3 value is just one of the applications.
I'll state this early, I borrowed the ranged touch bit, but it still another great reason to use the gun.
Going to have to defend why a Travel domain cleric is better then a Oracle of Life.
Travel Clerics have great mobility, once you hit lv 7 you get D Door as a Domain spell, at level 8 you can teleport up to 80 feet without provoking AOs.
Being able to deal lots of damage with your gun is mooted, if you are going to provoke AOs while doing it.
Pathfinder is not a MMORPG, Enemies are not going to just go after your party's tank. They are going to aim for YOU the party healer! Being able to get yourself out of trouble is important if you want to stay alive!
In short, a Cleric (with the right domains) is a lot more survivable then a Life Oracle. Therefore being better at keeping the party alive.
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcastingClassOptions/i nquisitor.html#inquisitions says that clerics can take any inquisition.
http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateCombat/classArchetypes/inquisito r.html#inquisitions says that inquisitions are limited to inquisitors exclusively.
Cheapy pointed me to The FAQ
Apparently they can take the inquisition as a domain, which might be a better way to get gunslinging than taking the level dip.
They lose a domain slot and a feat, but keep their caster level. If I were building it, I think that's what I'd do.
Currently I'm considering a 15 point "hobo with a shotgun" cleric of pharasma as a healbot for the 20 point carrion crown party I'm gming. DC 15 perform mime check to get him to do anything other than kill undead and heal the injured.
Grammaton cleric?Mmh... ;)
Very nice, sir. I simply did this:
Zen Gunslinger
Some monks seek to become one with another weapon entirely—the gun. The zen gunslinger takes a weapon most other monks eschew and seeks perfection in the pull of a trigger, the haze of a gun's smoke, and the flight of a bullet fired true.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Zen gunslingers are proficient with firearms in addition to their normal weapon proficiencies.
Flurry of Blows (Ex): Starting at 1st level, a zen gunslinger can make a flurry of blows as a full-attack action, but only when using a gun (even though it is a ranged weapon). He may not make a flurry of blows with his unarmed attacks or any other weapons. A zen gunslinger's flurry of blows otherwise functions as normal for a monk of his level.
A zen gunslinger cannot use Rapid Shot or Manyshot when making a flurry of blows with his gun.
Bonus Feats: A zen gunslinger's bonus feats must be taken from the following list: Combat Reflexes, Deflect Arrows, Dodge, Far Shot, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and Rapid Shot. At 6th level, the following feats are added to the list: Focused Shot*, Improved Precise Shot, Manyshot, Mobility, and Parting Shot*. At 10th level, the following feats are added to the list: Improved Critical, Pinpoint Targeting, Shot on the Run, and Snatch Arrows. A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them. These feats replace the monk's normal bonus feats.
Perfect Strike (Ex): At 1st level, a zen gunslinger gains Perfect Strike as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. A zen gunslinger can use Perfect Strike with any gun. At 10th level, the monk can roll his attack roll three times and take the highest result. If one of these rolls is a critical threat, the monk must choose one of his other two rolls to use as his confirmation roll. This ability replaces Stunning Fist.
Way of the gun (Ex): At 2nd level, a zen gunslinger gains Weapon Focus as a bonus feat with one type of gun. At 6th level, the monk gains Weapon Specialization with the same weapon as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. This ability replaces evasion.
Zen gunslinger (Ex): At 3rd level, a zen gunslinger may use his Wisdom modifier instead of his Dexterity modifier on ranged attack rolls when using a gun. This ability replaces maneuver training.
Point Blank Master (Ex): At 3rd level, a zen gunslinger gains Point Blank Master* as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites. This ability replaces still mind.
Ki Pool (Su): At 4th level, in addition to the normal abilities of his ki pool, a zen gunslinger may spend 1 point from his ki pool to increase the range increment for his gun by 50 feet for 1 round.
Ki Shots (Su): At 5th level, a zen gunslinger may spend 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action to change the damage dice of bullets he shoots to that of his unarmed strikes. This lasts until the start of his next turn. For example, a Medium zen gunslinger's gun normally deals 1d6 damage; using this ability, his bullets deal 1d8 damage until the start of his next turn. This ability replaces purity of body.
Reflexive pistolwhip (Ex): At 9th level, a zen gunslinger can make attacks of opportunity with blow from the butt of his gun. The monk still threatens squares he could reach with unarmed strikes, and can still only make one attack of opportunity per round (unless he has Combat Reflexes). This ability replaces improved evasion.
Trick Shot (Su): At 11th level, a zen gunslinger may hit targets that he might otherwise miss. By spending 1 point from his ki pool as a swift action, the zen gunslinger can ignore concealment. By spending 2 points, he can ignore total concealment or cover. By spending 3 points, he can ignore total cover, even firing bullets around corners. The bullet must still be able to reach the target; a target inside a closed building with no open doors or windows cannot be attacked. These effects last for 1 round. This ability replaces diamond body.
Ki Focus gun (Su): At 17th level, as long as he has at least 1 point of ki in his ki pool, a zen gunslinger may treat arrows fired from his gun as if they were ki focus weapons, allowing him to use his special ki attacks as if his arrows were unarmed attacks. This ability replaces tongue of the sun and moon.
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Going to have to defend why a Travel domain cleric is better then a Oracle of Life.
Travel Clerics have great mobility, once you hit lv 7 you get D Door as a Domain spell, at level 8 you can teleport up to 80 feet without provoking AOs.
Being able to deal lots of damage with your gun is mooted, if you are going to provoke AOs while doing it.
Pathfinder is not a MMORPG, Enemies are not going to just go after your party's tank. They are going to aim for YOU the party healer! Being able to get...
As far as the mobility issue of the travel domain, yes teleportation is handy, no one will ever say it isn't, but that's really the job of the arcane casters. There are plenty of ways to increase your movement speed. If you're just trying to avoid Attacks of opportunity though you really only need to include Grace on your spell list as a 2nd lvl spell.
Enemies nearly surrounding you "Grace" swiftaction, move 30 feet away, taking no attacks of oportunity, then proceed to continue firing. Better yet, take sacred summon, use Summon Monster as a standard action to create buffer creature between you and your opponent. Now your out of range of attacks of opportunity and you have friend to ensure you won't find yourself in that position again immeadiately.Finally, none of these should be a concern, because at 5th level you should be picking up the Gunslinger feat, which allows you to not provoke attacks of opportunities while using firearms.
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The teleportation is not just to get out of a "being surrounded" situation.
Firstly, Grace only works if you are not completely surrounded. You can't move through an enemy’s space at all without something like overrun, so Grace can't save you all the time.
2ndly, If you are grabbed, teleportation is one of the best ways to get out of a grab. (The other being having freedom of movement on.)
Summon Monster on the other hand is always good. Better if you can get Sacred Summons and convince your DM to let it work on summoned animals.
Survivability, Role-play and the theme of a "Gun-Slinger Cleric" makes a Travel Cleric better then an Oracle of Life.
OTHER types of Oracles would be a better pick, then Life for the OP's character.