Wondrous Item CL


RPG Superstar™ 2012 General Discussion


Well I am working on my wondrous item and getting in to the last couple stages before I start looking over it one last time and I realized I really don't know how to determine the cl of the item. I have combed the rules numerous times (had to do it anyway to make sure I wasn't missing some sort of ruling) and can't find it anywhere. Even after looking at already published items, I am lost.

Scarab Sages

Generally, you want it to be at least the minimum level to cast the requisite spells. I go by the general rule on wands and scrolls where the item is the minimum level to cast the spell.

A generic shirt of revivify (CMW 1/d) would be caster level 3, but if you want to make it a 2d8+10 maximum healage shirt, you would need to bump the CL up to 10, increasing the base price of the item by 3.33 times.

There are always outliers in the rules, though. Specifically pearls of power (17th) and sovereign glues (20th).

Star Voter Season 9

archmagi1 wrote:
Generally, you want it to be at least the minimum level to cast the requisite spells.

Just today I was wondering, is this necessary? Does the CL of an item have to be at least the CL to cast the spells in the requiered spells?

Liberty's Edge Dedicated Voter Season 6

Ceylon Tom wrote:
archmagi1 wrote:
Generally, you want it to be at least the minimum level to cast the requisite spells.

Just today I was wondering, is this necessary? Does the CL of an item have to be at least the CL to cast the spells in the requiered spells?

No, you could create an item that was less than the caster level to cast the item. For whatever reason the creator wanted to mitigate his costs to create and didn't care if after sold the item was sub par (not sub par superstar wise, but sub par duration/effect wise).

But essentially, the rule of thumb is to pick what effect you want the item to have, find a spell that you are basing the effect from, and then taking all that into account determine the caster level the spell is being cast at to come up with that effect.

Star Voter Season 9

I get what you mean. I was thinking of a creator of a wondrous item that gets help from someone with a higher caster level to cast to required spells.

Dark Archive

i was having trouble with CL too. it states that the item uses it's CL too for saves and such. does this mean if i have an item cast a spell, and the CL is 10, the cl of the spell is 10 and the save for the spell is +5? I was considering including "cl of effect =..."i some variable,, like 1/2 char level or save bonus =... char's int etc. would that be fine formatting or should it always be whatever the cl is?

Silver Crusade Star Voter Season 6

Buckinin, you might want to review the Wondrous Item rules. Caster Level is not part of the calculation of a save DC.

Dark Archive

Caster Level (CL): The next item in a notational entry gives the caster level of the item, indicating its relative power. The caster level determines the item's saving throw bonus, as well as range or other level-dependent aspects of the powers of the item (if variable). It also determines the level that must be contended with should the item come under the effect of a dispel magic spell or similar situation.

For potions, scrolls, and wands, the creator can set the caster level of an item at any number high enough to cast the stored spell but not higher than her own caster level. For other magic items, the caster level is determined by the item itself.

@Celestial Healer, at first i interpretted it as it uses cl for its effects, but now that you point it out, it says "item's" not effect's. thanks for pointing that out!

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Dedicated Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7 aka Standback

Buckinin, here's the relevent passage from the PRD:

PRD wrote:
Magic items produce spells or spell-like effects. For a saving throw against a spell or spell-like effect from a magic item, the DC is 10 + the level of the spell or effect + the ability modifier of the minimum ability score needed to cast that level of spell.

Dedicated Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9 aka OwlbearRepublic

As somebody who is playing a crafting character right now, I found choosing a CL for my entry very jarring. I figured that I couldn't go wrong using well-established items as benchmarks for CL and prerequisites... that said, I found myself creating an item that, like many in the PRD, a smart PC would not craft at the CL listed in the item's description.

Likewise, I rolled my eyes a bit at the care I put into spell prereqs. A competent crafter can skip any reasonable number of spell prereqs without the slightest danger of failure, so they're really only good for flavor.

I'll be interested to see whether published wondrous items eventually fall more in line with the actual Pathfinder crafting rules, or whether benchmarks from the old SRD items will continue to rule the day.

Dedicated Voter Season 8

Caster Level is probably as inconsequential for item crafting for PCs as anything gets (if they want it, and focus on crafting, the penalty for lowering CL is hardly ever a problem).

Looking at the Core Rulebook, and thinking through every source I can bring to mind, the CL tends to coincide with the required CL for the highest spell level involved, unless something else is going on with significant heightens or lowers the power of the effect.

Of course, if the spell is only "the closest available" to an effect, which doesn't have an instantly obvious spell choice, I would say looking at the price of the item and comparing it to as many as possible items, which seem around the same power level, and trying to deduce an appropriate CL for when this item should first (without penalty) be craftable by PCs. Then again it's all guesswork here.

It might also be valuable to, as stated several times by the judges, look at the current DCs as compared to what your average opponents chance of saving at the appropriate level and perhaps consider this in the process. I did a quick check of item in the Core Rulebook, and found only one example of my theory, but with the eyes of charming, it is clearly the case that the CL is increased by the Heighten Spell feat.

Hope it is of any help.

Sincerely,
Siv

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