Least favorite classes!


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion

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Dark Archive RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32

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As a counterpoint to this thread, let's talk about which classes you just don't care for. I'll start!

#1 - Summoner: I hate casters that summon stuff. It's an absolute nightmare to have all the various summonable monsters' statblocks available and, moreover, even more annoying to have the summoner's player spend half an hour declaring the movements and attacks of his upteen-thousand summoned minions. This is doubly problematic with the eidolon, as it has a mutable statblock and can be altered on the fly with evolution surge and similar spells. Ugh.

#2 - Alchemist: I just don't get this class. You hurl bombs at stuff. Okay, that's cool. And you maybe cast some primarily self-only buffs on the side. Yeah, you might make some helpful infusions for the party, but this class mostly buffs itself and blows things up. Mostly I see people taking a dip in this class for the extra tentacle attack it allows and then being a fighter and/or barbarian the rest of the way... which is a ridiculous visual, IMO.

#3 - Cavalier: For the same reason I don't like summoners, I don't like classes that rely heavily on an animal companion/mount to "do their thing." Sure, you don't NEED a mount to be a cavalier, but that seems to be a big part of their schtick. Without the mount around, cavaliers are just really weird fighters.

Grand Lodge

Oh goodness, Zack, you forgot the only one that really counts:

Bard

Though I also hate Cavalier and Samurai and 3E Marshal.


1st - Summoner. I don't want to carry a lot of statblocks, cast spells, upgrade an eidolon, etc.. all at the same time.

2nd - Alchemist. Weird and complex.

3rd - Bard. Too many abilities, too many abilities with too long descriptions, spells, skills, again more special abilities, why hasn't this been simplified? I don't really want to know.


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Clerics -- alright so you got a god's attention and the darn thing smiled on you... (if that's all he did) now you have shields, medium armor, good weapons medium BAB, two good saves, two free specializations, free healing/damage/whatever on the side, with full ninth level casting without any spell failure despite the fact you have just as much handwaving as anyone else -- and you can steal spells off of other classes list as a default feature with your domains.

Summoners -- yeah yeah, keep it in your pocket alright?

Dark Archive

Don't care for the monk.

Not a fan of the bard as written, with some archetypes though I think it is better.

Finally Summoner, only cause I think to much of the focus is on their pet.

Silver Crusade

Wizards. D6s, and can't even handle a sword to cut ennemies in two.


Cleric: still can't figure out how they work.

Druids: see above. I can't grasp divine casters.

Rangers: seriously. I don't get divine casters.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Trinam wrote:
Rangers: seriously. I don't get divine casters.

Tip: Forget about their casting ability, and just play them like martial characters who can activate happy-sticks.

I don't like summoners or alchemists, but don't have time to go into it right now.


Trinam wrote:

Cleric: still can't figure out how they work.

Druids: see above. I can't grasp divine casters.

Rangers: seriously. I don't get divine casters.

umm if you hate divine casters where is the paladin and oracle?

I dislike the rogue.

i dislike the monk because its still MAD but that's the only reason.


Rogues - Other classes can do everything better
Alchemists - I've seen them in play and they seem fun but I have no desire to play one.
Cavalier - Too many class abilities are linked to the mount which often can't be used.

Monk used to be on the list but UC has lifted it from the bottom to near the top of the pack of favorite classes.


Dragonsong wrote:
Trinam wrote:

Cleric: still can't figure out how they work.

Druids: see above. I can't grasp divine casters.

Rangers: seriously. I don't get divine casters.

umm if you hate divine casters where is the paladin and oracle?

I dislike the rogue.

i dislike the monk because its still MAD but that's the only reason.

Paladins are just cavaliers with bows.

Oracles are there for barbarians to splash for fatigue immunity.


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I actually like summoners, but I also don't mind the mutable quality of the eidilons or running multiple "characters." I digress.

I am not a big fan of purely martial characters (FIghter, cavalier, etc). They bore me.

Me: "I hit it with my sword."

next round;

I hit it with my sword.

Bla ... *unconscious*

In real life I could learn to wield a sword. I haven't, but the option is out there. I cannot learn to fly (without technology) or throw fireballs (without technology). Hence I have a preference of casters over non-casters. I prefer my fantasy to be stuff that doesn't really exist. But thats just me.


The gunslinger is my least favorite.

Bows make sense for characters of level 5 or less, even if using rapid shot, its reasonable.

Crossbows are worse, because characters are loading these things in 3 seconds or less, and for the most part it is silly.

The Gunslinger blows the roof off of Pathfinder's problems. This guy is packing 6 shots into a revolver, sealing them with wax, and firing in just a few seconds. It stinks.

HP needs to be conceptualized better, along with a rework of ranged combat so that cover means something. Guns need to be more deadly, take longer to reload, cover needs to mean more...

The gunslinger should never have been tacked onto the system.


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Clerics. Specifically the old-school, 1st edition-like, chain-mail wearing semi-fighter with divine spells. There should be no clerics but robe wearing priests. Or better merge wizards and priests into single class with selectable features and more customizable spell list.

Grand Lodge

Dragonsong,

The Pally is also MAD, do you hate it?

The Pally is my fav but I hate the fact that I have to deal with MAD while half of the PCs don't. My STR is always so much lower and I have fewer HP. Damn it!

Grand Lodge

Crane Wings,

I don't know who told you the Gunslinger is an actual Class; it's not.

It does not exist.

You can prove this by grabbing your Ultimate Combat and looking inside. You read the Ninja. You read the Samurai. Then your eyes glaze over at the stupid nothingness for a few pages.

There is no Gunslinger.

The Bard sucks but at least it exists.


W E Ray wrote:

Dragonsong,

The Pally is also MAD, do you hate it?

The Pally is my fav but I hate the fact that I have to deal with MAD while half of the PCs don't MySTR is always so much lower and I have fewer HP. Damn it!

They only need 3 stats? And cha just needs to be 12.

My least favorite?

Nobles.

And monks.


Any class from APG (haven't had any desire to look more closely into any of them). Mostly I don't want to read up on them for hours and never play them.


Adept this sucks at casting period and its spell list will never get better. I mean even for npcs they still suck with delayed spells and no real powers gained and a bad list mostly.

Commoner of course sucks.


Any casters that use the Vancian mechanic. Ever since I started with 2e I've hated the whole thing.

The 3.5e Warlock was the first D&D casting class I actually liked. Plus, it was actually a pretty balanced class. It wasn't uber-godly like the wizard/cleric/druid, but still fun to play.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Gunslinger, Gunslinger and the Gunslinger.

Maybe its the Ranged touch attacks of their fire arms, maybe its the noise the make, or maybe its that silly tri-cornered hat and goggles the iconic character has.....I guess I just don't like them. I wouldn't like them in the caves of chaos, the mud sorcerer's tomb , the forge of fury, nor Thistle top near sand point.

They can stay in Alkenstar..... for all I care.

Well I guess i wouldn't mind them in a "pirates of the Caribbean" type game just not one with fighters rogues clerics and wizards and cavaliers....I guess in such a game one would have to make up an increasing armor class mechanic to replace heavier armors.

But i digress.....I don't like the gunslinger.

I seem to remember the paizo developers, in their search for a name for the Fighter-mage, they decided they didn't want new classes to have compound names.....so they picked magus.

Now they have picked a compound name for a new character class.....gunslinger....

You know I just don't like the class, and I don't like their fire arms.


I hate the gunslinger... fantasy and firearms don't mix. I guess it's kinda neato to have the option for those that want to mix Three Musketeers n' Magic, but it's definitely not for me.

Same goes for the Samurai and the Ninja... I keep them confined in the Mysterious East, and my campaign doesn't swing in that direction. They have no place in traditional Sword n' Sorcery fantasy genre.

As far as the traditional Core Classes go, my least favorite is the Barbarian... they have extra hit points (barely) but are restricted to lower protection armors... Hide is the heaviest that they can use, right? So despite the fact that they get an average of +1 hit point more per level than a Fighter, they have an average of 3 or more points of lower Armor Class... so for a vaguely +5% hit points (if you're lucky) you are hit 15% to 20% more often. Oh but you can rage a couple times a day... meh. Just doesn't do it for me.

The Exchange

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Summoner _ Just ugh
Gunslinger _ though we do use them, only as Archers
And in standard western fantasy games _ the Monk.
the Samurai and the Ninja goes in this vein


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What I've learned from this thread is that people have extremely strict ideas of what fantasy is.

You'd think that with the rarity of firearms in golarion, firearms would be the fantastical! Nevermind that golarion has a tech level of about Europe in the 1400s.

Grand Lodge

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Alkenstar and Numeria are the same as the Gunslinger.

You saw my earlier post, right.

I look in my Inner Sea Guide and read all about Cheliax and Varisia, etc., etc. but starting on page 110 for a couple pages and again on 142, there's just this haze of stupid nothingness and you wonder why Paizo didn't actually write anything in those pages.

There's nothing there.


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Clerics, wizards, druids, and any other class that is basically just a walking spell list.

BOREDOM.

Dark Archive

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I can handle Adept, Aristocrat and Expert. Situationally, they've got their uses.

But Commoner? Oh hell no.

And Warrior? Why would anyone pay the same XP for a Fighter with no Fighter class features? Anytime I see some NPC listed in an adventure as a 'Warrior 3' I want to energy drain him and use those XP for a *real* class. I once saw one who was a 'Warrior 8' and I wanted to cry. 51,000 XP and you still haven't figured out Bravery +1 or Armor Training 1? Just die!

[Now, if an NPC class automatically used a faster XP track than a PC class, and could be 'upgraded,' from Warrior to Fighter, Expert to Rogue, Adept to Cleric, etc. by getting special training and paying off the difference, that could be cool!]

Also, any 'Monster Class' whose HD don't keep up with its 'level.' A '12th level character' who has 6d8 for HD is just sad.

Grand Lodge

Set wrote:
And Warrior? Why would anyone...

LOL

Set wins.

Seriously, I'd mark it as a favorite except I decided only to Favorite posts that I wanna look up for research later on.

Sovereign Court

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MONKS... Plan and simple I HATE MONKS.

To me you say Monk... I think of Friar Tuck. Those guys that hide themselves away in monasteries and create books and beautiful works of art in them and make wine. Who are mild and speak peace if they speak at all. Not some Kung Fu, Karate, Jujitsu guy.

2nd would be Gun Slinger. Not a fan of guns in fantasy. Unless the world is Renaissance on up

Alchemist - Just don't think they where needed.

Scarab Sages

#1 Summoner - A fancy wizard
#2 Witch - Another fancy wizard
#3 Oracle - A fancy cleric
#4 Inquisitor - A fancy paladin
#5 Samurai - A fancy fighter
#6 Ninja - Another fancy fighter
#7 Cavalier - A fancy fighter with a mount
#8 Alchemist - A fancy fighter with bombs
#9 Gunslinger - A fancy fighter that violates the entire 'Sword & Sorcery' theme


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Gee, I actually like the Gunslinger, the Alchemist, and the Summoner. I guess my Steampunk and Final Fantasy bias shows.

I am not a big fan of Samurai or Ninja, but I would let them in my game.

I wasn't a fan of the Chavelier until one of players played one. Its actually kind of a cool class.

I don't like Barbarians or Druids. Definately my least favorite classes. I still have nightmares about the Frenzied Berserker and the Planar Shepard even though I never had either in my game.

My games tend to be more 15th to 17th century level tech, so Gunslingers and Alchemists work better than Barbarians and Druids.


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Perry Snow wrote:

#1 Summoner - A fancy wizard

#2 Witch - Another fancy wizard
#3 Oracle - A fancy cleric
#4 Inquisitor - A fancy paladin
#5 Samurai - A fancy fighter
#6 Ninja - Another fancy fighter
#7 Cavalier - A fancy fighter with a mount
#8 Alchemist - A fancy fighter with bombs
#9 Gunslinger - A fancy fighter that violates the entire 'Sword & Sorcery' theme

Translated: GET OFF MY LAWN!


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I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!


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Oh, and i dislike Paladins both to play and to have in the group. Their constant angst about their moral code makes me want to punch babies.

Mechanically I like them just fine (as far as fighter types go), but moral dilemmas gag me.


Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!

I'm in physics class right now. You just about made me laugh out loud.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

I don't HATE any of the classes but classes that I prefer not to play are:
Paladin
Fighter
Summoner

I don't think they are bad and they have their uses. Just nor for me.


cranewings wrote:
Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!
I'm in physics class right now. You just about made me laugh out loud.

That was a totally serious post, BTW. Nothing works me up like some close-minded SCA neckbeards.


Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
cranewings wrote:
Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!
I'm in physics class right now. You just about made me laugh out loud.
That was a totally serious post, BTW. Nothing works me up like some close-minded SCA neckbeards.

I wish they would give the SCA a more correct name, like: LACUSTS (Live Action Conan Universe Stick Tag Society.


Drejk wrote:
Clerics. Specifically the old-school, 1st edition-like, chain-mail wearing semi-fighter with divine spells. There should be no clerics but robe wearing priests. Or better merge wizards and priests into single class with selectable features and more customizable spell list.

this should go for martial classes too.


W E Ray wrote:

Dragonsong,

The Pally is also MAD, do you hate it?

The Pally is my fav but I hate the fact that I have to deal with MAD while half of the PCs don't. My STR is always so much lower and I have fewer HP. Damn it!

Smite generally overcomes the lower STR. Of course I have 14 10 13 10 10 20(headband) with mine at level 6 which I find to be a nice spread as I dont like having negatives. And I play wijht a GM who is stingy on magic but loves having us make saving throws so the +5 to all saves has been a life saver.

And compared to 3.5 where you needed all the fighter stats CHA and WIS to power spells it is less MAD and you can make it down right SAD with either STR or CHA depending on how you want to build.

Liberty's Edge

Gunslinger - Because the gun rules are hopelessly and stupidly complex. Why couldn't they just be glorified crossbows?

Cleric - Because I hate dead levels and being stuck with particular domain choices if I want to pull in enough useful spells to avoid the heal-bot role (and even then, those can only be prepped in those precious domain slots). Sure, I can make one a competent fighter, but I can do that out of Druid or Oracle just as well, but with more power, more versatility (assuming minimal prep time is allowed) and no loss of casting capability.

Rogue - They are in a mechanical dead zone. Not quite good enough at any one thing to keep a player interested (at least, beyond a 1-level dip), not quite bad enough for most to consider a serious power boost of any form. About the only thing they have going for them is some extra skill points, but that doesn't really help that much. Usually any build you could do with a rogue can be done better with something else that dips rogue (or doesn't even do that, sometimes).


Wizards. Or at least, wizards in D&D/PF settings. Yes, I love the thought of wielding magic. But why would a character who has a high intelligence by nature of his class, is usually depicted as studying his ass off for aeons to learn his craft, suddenly have bloody selective amnesia every time he casts spells?? "I've studied Magic Missile as a quintessential wizard's offensive spell for 20 years, used it in practise sessions a further 10, and for the life of me can't remember it until I check my books again...". I know if they lost the need to prepare spells every day they'd become OP sorcerers, but in terms of logic, they just don't make sense.


magus
cavalier
summoner
alchemist


Kyremi wrote:
Wizards. Or at least, wizards in D&D/PF settings. Yes, I love the thought of wielding magic. But why would a character who has a high intelligence by nature of his class, is usually depicted as studying his ass off for aeons to learn his craft, suddenly have bloody selective amnesia every time he casts spells?? "I've studied Magic Missile as a quintessential wizard's offensive spell for 20 years, used it in practise sessions a further 10, and for the life of me can't remember it until I check my books again...". I know if they lost the need to prepare spells every day they'd become OP sorcerers, but in terms of logic, they just don't make sense.

I've always hated the whole Vancian casting system as well.

At-will spellcasting, like the 3.5e Warlock, would be much better IMO.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Kyremi wrote:
Wizards. Or at least, wizards in D&D/PF settings. Yes, I love the thought of wielding magic. But why would a character who has a high intelligence by nature of his class, is usually depicted as studying his ass off for aeons to learn his craft, suddenly have bloody selective amnesia every time he casts spells?? "I've studied Magic Missile as a quintessential wizard's offensive spell for 20 years, used it in practise sessions a further 10, and for the life of me can't remember it until I check my books again...". I know if they lost the need to prepare spells every day they'd become OP sorcerers, but in terms of logic, they just don't make sense.

Well, it's some BS about magic being foreign to the mind and expelled by castingblah blah blah. It makes sense if you read The Dying Earth. Not that I'm sticking up for it mind you, but it provides the reason.

On topic though, I never really cared for Druids. Are they shape changers or casters, do they even know if they're coming or going?

Liberty's Edge

All classess and archtypes that use guns. Gun rules have horrible mechanics.

Not happy with the alchemist. Was hoping for something like the master alchemist out of Magic of Faerun, (loved making wish into a potion).


Maxximilius wrote:
Wizards. D6s, and can't even handle a sword to cut ennemies in two.

What about elven wizards? :P

My least favorite class is the Paladin. It's fine mechanically, but they kill the fun in a party.


Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!

I am your nemesis. I dislike any oriental s%$$

Liberty's Edge

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malhagor wrote:
Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!
I am your nemesis. I dislike any oriental s$$+

I am both your nemeses. I dislike anyone trying to limit the theme options of myself or my players in any way.

(I would like to note that, for the most part, the difference between eastern/western/tribal/what-have-you themes is just how you describe your character and equipment.)


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Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
cranewings wrote:
Nerdrage Ooze wrote:
I dislike every class that is in any way connected with that ridiculous thing called "Europe". Really, how am I to take seriously some idiot in plate armor? Who's swinging some barbaric piece of metal only incidentally called "a sword"? European swords were a a pale shade of what glory Japanese smiths could bring forth with their katanas. It doesn't fit with my anime-inspired vision of fantasy at all, and I would really prefer for all those "western" elements to be excised forever. Sadly, there are far too many folks out there who are hung up on their outdated "sword and sorcery" ideas, or even worse, that Tolkien guy. Sheesh. Bring on my guns and katanas!
I'm in physics class right now. You just about made me laugh out loud.
That was a totally serious post, BTW. Nothing works me up like some close-minded SCA neckbeards.

I know right? they are just as bad as those close-minded weaboo's praising the katana over any other edged weapon in history good thing no one here is one of them....they really burn my chops.

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