Any passengers? (player spoilers)


Jade Regent

Scarab Sages

Jade Regent Players Guide wrote:
You’ll have opportunities to take on passengers for payments several times during the Jade Regent Adventure Path—your GM will inform you when such opportunities arise.

As there is no mention of it in the first to parts of the AP, should I assume that no one wants to travel from Sandport (if they head back first) or the villages along the way to Kalsgrad via caravan?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Matthew Trent wrote:
Jade Regent Players Guide wrote:
You’ll have opportunities to take on passengers for payments several times during the Jade Regent Adventure Path—your GM will inform you when such opportunities arise.

As there is no mention of it in the first to parts of the AP, should I assume that no one wants to travel from Sandport (if they head back first) or the villages along the way to Kalsgrad via caravan?

Actually... what that line from the Jade Regent Player's Guide is alluding to are NPCs like Kelda Oxgutter, Spivey, and any other NPC that the PCs might meet and befriend along the way.

Scarab Sages

That makes sense. I was thinking that my PCs might be expecting to supplement cash by running a passenger service.

Thanks for the clearing that up!

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Matthew Trent wrote:

That makes sense. I was thinking that my PCs might be expecting to supplement cash by running a passenger service.

Thanks for the clearing that up!

Ah... Yeah. The caravans in Jade Regent are not money-making schemes, despite what some folks might have assumed; they're actually mobile home bases.


James Jacobs wrote:
Matthew Trent wrote:

That makes sense. I was thinking that my PCs might be expecting to supplement cash by running a passenger service.

Thanks for the clearing that up!

Ah... Yeah. The caravans in Jade Regent are not money-making schemes, despite what some folks might have assumed; they're actually mobile home bases.

I'm still not sure if they aren't money graves for the party, though. ^^ They should at least be self-financing.


Well, in the long haul... I wonder how much you could get in Minkai for glasscrafts made by the new Empress? :)

Paizo Employee Creative Director

magnuskn wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Matthew Trent wrote:

That makes sense. I was thinking that my PCs might be expecting to supplement cash by running a passenger service.

Thanks for the clearing that up!

Ah... Yeah. The caravans in Jade Regent are not money-making schemes, despite what some folks might have assumed; they're actually mobile home bases.
I'm still not sure if they aren't money graves for the party, though. ^^ They should at least be self-financing.

No more so than leveling up characters is a money grave.

The point of the caravans I tried to establish is that they're like an "extra" character in your party. A big part of the reward for a caravan is seeing it get more powerful and be able to handle tougher encounters. Just as players enjoy spending money on their characters to get them more gear... that should also apply to their caravans. And just as a geared-up more-powerful PC can then go do tougher missions and thus gain better loot... same for tougher, geared-up caravans.

The game itself is about adventuring. It's not really meant to be a trade/economy simulator. If it were... the way we handle magic item pricing would have had to have been redesigned from the ground up.


James Jacobs wrote:
magnuskn wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Matthew Trent wrote:

That makes sense. I was thinking that my PCs might be expecting to supplement cash by running a passenger service.

Thanks for the clearing that up!

Ah... Yeah. The caravans in Jade Regent are not money-making schemes, despite what some folks might have assumed; they're actually mobile home bases.
I'm still not sure if they aren't money graves for the party, though. ^^ They should at least be self-financing.

No more so than leveling up characters is a money grave.

The point of the caravans I tried to establish is that they're like an "extra" character in your party. A big part of the reward for a caravan is seeing it get more powerful and be able to handle tougher encounters. Just as players enjoy spending money on their characters to get them more gear... that should also apply to their caravans. And just as a geared-up more-powerful PC can then go do tougher missions and thus gain better loot... same for tougher, geared-up caravans.

The game itself is about adventuring. It's not really meant to be a trade/economy simulator. If it were... the way we handle magic item pricing would have had to have been redesigned from the ground up.

I bet you could find quite a number of fans for that particular project. :p

But saying that they are more or less an extra character gives some perspective on them. I'll have to pass this by the group, who so far favor doing the encounters on "normal scale" combat. Thanks for the info!

Paizo Employee Creative Director

magnuskn wrote:

I bet you could find quite a number of fans for that particular project. :p

But saying that they are more or less an extra character gives some perspective on them. I'll have to pass this by the group, who so far favor doing the encounters on "normal scale" combat. Thanks for the info!

We probably COULD find a number of fans for that project. But I'm not as interested in writing that project, and if I can find a project that I AM interested in writing that I feel will have as many or more fans than something like an economy simulator... you can sure as hell bet I'll put that on the schedule before said economy simulator every single time.

But yeah; look at Star Trek. The spaceships in there ARE like additional characters. The Enterprise is as much a character in Star Trek as is Kirk or Spock. This goes for any story that takes place on a shared vehicle type thing—the Pequod is certainly a character in Moby Dick, for example.

The caravan in "Jade Regent" is as much a character as any PC or NPC. That's why there's a character sheet for it.

But if your group favors resolving encounters on "normal scale," my suggestion is that you should probably dump the caravan rules entirely and move them into the background; just have the caravan be the story element that drives the PCs from one location to another and focus on the part of the game that your particular group wants to focus on.


James Jacobs wrote:
magnuskn wrote:

I bet you could find quite a number of fans for that particular project. :p

But saying that they are more or less an extra character gives some perspective on them. I'll have to pass this by the group, who so far favor doing the encounters on "normal scale" combat. Thanks for the info!

We probably COULD find a number of fans for that project. But I'm not as interested in writing that project, and if I can find a project that I AM interested in writing that I feel will have as many or more fans than something like an economy simulator... you can sure as hell bet I'll put that on the schedule before said economy simulator every single time.

To be honest, the actual rules for item creation make me want to tear my hair out. If you allow them, then it becomes a race between the plot and the players, to see if they can overpower it through overgearing the content of the AP's. If you don't allow them, prepare to get reamed for not trusting your players to not wreck your campaign.

But, ahem, that is off-topic. I'm just a bit on the touchy side on that part of the game, because it causes so much heartburn when your players already know how to optimize the effectiveness of their characters.

James Jacobs wrote:

But yeah; look at Star Trek. The spaceships in there ARE like additional characters. The Enterprise is as much a character in Star Trek as is Kirk or Spock. This goes for any story that takes place on a shared vehicle type thing—the Pequod is certainly a character in Moby Dick, for example.

The caravan in "Jade Regent" is as much a character as any PC or NPC. That's why there's a character sheet for it.

But if your group favors resolving encounters on "normal scale," my suggestion is that you should probably dump the caravan rules entirely and move them into the background; just have the caravan be the story element that drives the PCs from one location to another and focus on the part of the game that your particular group wants to focus on.

That probably happens to the roleplaying part. ^^ Although they certainly enjoy situations where they can kill two dire rats via longspears with attacks of opportunity, before those beasts even got the chance to attack them. :p

Anyway, I'll run that by my group and see what they have to say about it.

Scarab Sages

Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
James Jacobs wrote:

...

But yeah; look at Star Trek. The spaceships in there ARE like additional characters. The Enterprise is as much a character in Star Trek as is Kirk or Spock. This goes for any story that takes place on a shared vehicle type thing—the Pequod is certainly a character in Moby Dick, for example.

The caravan in "Jade Regent" is as much a character as any PC or NPC. That's why there's a character sheet for it.

But if your group favors resolving encounters on "normal scale," my suggestion is that you should probably dump the caravan rules entirely and move them into the background; just have the caravan be the story element that drives the PCs from one location to another and focus on the part of the game that your particular group wants to focus on.

I had really liked the idea of the caravan as a way to make encounters versus lots of mooks interesting, but it seems that the combat encounters in The Hungry Storm are tougher than a caravan can handle. What would be the stat block for the Paizo iconic caravan?

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