Trap the soul waste of money or money maker?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


A few people on the here have said that trap the soul is a pretty bad spell because it cost so much to do (a gem worth one 1000 per HD). However when I read the spell it says that the creatures soul is trapped in the gem. Meaning that after the spell you still have the gem with a soul in it. I think a gem with a soul in it would be worth more than a gem without a soul in it. How much more?


Especially if you use said gem to power your unstoppable construct minion to usurp your brothers kingdom. <insert evil laugh here>


The use of the spell normally is that you keep the gem and don't sell it, to make sure that foe will never return.

If my group would sell those gems regularly I would either have the opponent return (because his henchman stole the gem and let him free) or the spell would sometimes spoil the gem. It's still a gem, but loses it's colour or otherwise isn't worth much of its own.

One way or the other, there sure are some people that would buy a gem only for the sould you trapped, but they might be very very evil fallen mages ...


Richard Leonhart wrote:


One way or the other, there sure are some people that would buy a gem only for the sould you trapped, but they might be very very evil fallen mages ...

*points to himself* Who me? I would never do such a thing.

<supressing evil chuckle>


Well... you could cast it on yourself to make you "immortal"....plus can be used by a literal genie who is asked to make the wish maker immortal...


fictionfan wrote:
I think a gem with a soul in it would be worth more than a gem without a soul in it.

I don't know about gold piece value, but it'd most certainly be tastier. >:)


Tegresin the Laughing Fiend wrote:
fictionfan wrote:
I think a gem with a soul in it would be worth more than a gem without a soul in it.
I don't know about gold piece value, but it'd most certainly be tastier. >:)

I guess it depends on the market then. If you can plane shift over to somewhere demons are common, maybe you can sell it for more. On the material plane, however, the main demand for those gems would be for use as spell components, and you've already used this one. I don't think it could be used again- it's occupied. Would you buy a toilet that was already occupied?

Contributor

Also, details forthcoming in BotD III on the planar soul trade: buyers and sellers etc. Can't say much more at the moment yet.

The Exchange Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

I thought you were supposed to launch the soul-gems into space so they eventually crash into some other planet unleashing untold destruction on innocents until someone else from your planet (who happened to have crash landed on their planet also) puts a stop to them....

Silver Crusade

There's certainly a market for filled soul gems, but you're pretty much going to hell for it considering who 99.999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999999% of the buyers are and what they do with souls.


I think they have awesome potential for use in crafting fun & creative magical items using the captured soul to help fuel/charge the item with some aspect of the captured soul & wish the spell (or something somewhere) would mention the possibility so more people would consider it... plus, all those intelligent items had to get that intelligence somehow. I always thought it was a hugely underdeveloped spell with so much wasted potential because of that omission

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
tetrasodium wrote:
I think they have awesome potential for use in crafting fun & creative magical items using the captured soul to help fuel/charge the item with some aspect of the captured soul & wish the spell (or something somewhere) would mention the possibility so more people would consider it... plus, all those intelligent items had to get that intelligence somehow. I always thought it was a hugely underdeveloped spell with so much wasted potential because of that omission

Really looking to develop the Evil part of your alignment, eh?


LazarX wrote:
tetrasodium wrote:
I think they have awesome potential for use in crafting fun & creative magical items using the captured soul to help fuel/charge the item with some aspect of the captured soul & wish the spell (or something somewhere) would mention the possibility so more people would consider it... plus, all those intelligent items had to get that intelligence somehow. I always thought it was a hugely underdeveloped spell with so much wasted potential because of that omission
Really looking to develop the Evil part of your alignment, eh?

The spell is not "[evil]" as it is. putting the gem to use doesn't necessarily need to be an evil act. there are plenty of reasons why someone might be willing to go through it... Plus, it's not like intelligent items are exactly helpless either


I'd be curious as to exactly how the souls and bodies are released once the gems are destroyed. Could I trap the soul of oh, say, half a dozen dire wolves, then use them like a instant summon? (obviously you wouldn't control them, but that is not always necessary)


tetrasodium wrote:
LazarX wrote:
tetrasodium wrote:
I think they have awesome potential for use in crafting fun & creative magical items using the captured soul to help fuel/charge the item with some aspect of the captured soul & wish the spell (or something somewhere) would mention the possibility so more people would consider it... plus, all those intelligent items had to get that intelligence somehow. I always thought it was a hugely underdeveloped spell with so much wasted potential because of that omission
Really looking to develop the Evil part of your alignment, eh?
The spell is not "[evil]" as it is. putting the gem to use doesn't necessarily need to be an evil act. there are plenty of reasons why someone might be willing to go through it... Plus, it's not like intelligent items are exactly helpless either

I could totally see a crown with the trapped souls of past kings shortly before they would have died. They speak to the new ruler and offer him advice and wisdom, gained over centuries of experience. With each ruler a new gem is added.

<--adding this to a campaign at some point.


Caineach wrote:

I could totally see a crown with the trapped souls of past kings shortly before they would have died. They speak to the new ruler and offer him advice and wisdom, gained over centuries of experience. With each ruler a new gem is added.

<--adding this to a campaign at some point.

Awesome idea! I could also imagine the crown driving someone insane to the point of prying certain gems out and destroying them.

Or some of the older kings turning senile inside the gems, both tortured and preserved by their captivity.


Gruuuu wrote:
Caineach wrote:

I could totally see a crown with the trapped souls of past kings shortly before they would have died. They speak to the new ruler and offer him advice and wisdom, gained over centuries of experience. With each ruler a new gem is added.

<--adding this to a campaign at some point.

Awesome idea! I could also imagine the crown driving someone insane to the point of prying certain gems out and destroying them.

Or some of the older kings turning senile inside the gems, both tortured and preserved by their captivity.

Don't think of it like "living' in he gem. Think of it more like an echo of the creature frozen in time with the item the gem is built into being capable of drawing upon that echo's knowledge and abilities within the limits designed into the item's construction. Particularly powerful echo's might be capable of exceeding those limitations and exerting some measure of influence over particularly weak wielders, or when the item is put to use in a way particularly opposed to the intentions of the design behind the limitations. Something like that aligns perfectly with the existing rules on intelligent items while allowing for huge flexibility in putting them to use and making them plot devices with lots of depth potential that the players can continually interact with or see the influences of.


Todd Stewart wrote:
Also, details forthcoming in BotD III on the planar soul trade: buyers and sellers etc. Can't say much more at the moment yet.

Tiefling Cashier - Next!

Distracted Diabolist - (dumps purchases all over counter, begins casting sending)

Tiefling Cashier - (rolls eyes and slowly appraises purchases, giving the buyer time to finish casting)

Late-for-work Brimorak - (gets in line, looks at pocketwatch)

Tiefling Cashier - All right, your total's 1800gp.

Distracted Diabolist - (tosses two soul-trapped gems onto counter) Take it out of these two. (begins casting another sending)

Late-for-work Brimorak - (sighs)

Tiefling Cashier - (routinely has Cacodaemon aide lick gems)

Cacodaemon Assistant - (licks first gem, nods, licks second gem twice, Snoopy blegh, shakes head)

Tiefling Cashier - (hands back second gem) This gem's declined, 258gp left.

Distracted Diabolist - (spell interrupted, annoyed, wipes gem off, hands it back to cashier) Try it again.

Late-for-work Brimorak - C'mon berk! Drop the coin and pike it.

Distracted Diabolist - (evil look towards brimorak, looks at cashier) Try it again.

Tiefling Cashier - (bored/annoyed look, hands gem to cacodaemon again)

(more customers join line)

Cacodaemon Assistant - (looks at customer like they're insane, licks gem very slowly, Snoopy blegh) Still empty...

Distracted Diabolist - Well, can you take the gem as is?

Tiefling Cashier - (points to sign that reads "NO DRY GEMS")

Distracted Diabolist - (angry) What kind of a policy is that?!

Tiefling Cashier - Coin's always good, but I don't take raw gems. Too many xorns...

Distracted Diabolist - (sighs, digs through coin-heavy purse and pulls out another soul-trapped gem) Fine...try this one. (begins casting another sending)

Late-for-work Brimorak - ARGH! (unsheathes blade, guts diabolist, grabs purse, tosses to cashier, steps over bleeding diabolist, inhales/exhales) Grease scroll--just one. (hands over coins, leaves shop)

Tiefling Cashier - Come again, cutter. Next!

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