Actually, monks are rad because they can impale with their fists.
*looks at Hamatula feats from Inner Sea World Guide*
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I think that "Negligent Character Design" is
As far as I can tell no-one in this thread has been posting silly or ridiculous ideas he ridicules... Put this in context for a minute...
I hate this thread. It has no logical reason for being and brings nothing of any worth to the online community.
...
I've come to the conclusion that people only play monks for the same reasons people play kender, to piss off everyone else in the party.
If this were a thread about ridiculous monk concepts I could almost understand it but it's NOT. It's an obnoxious rant about how silly he thinks monk players are. Look back to the topic of the thread. Look at the original post, look at this whole thread. How many people are talking about oddball monks?
What does the original post or any of this have to merit such scorn and hostility?
Honestly, pretty much every post RD has dropped in this thread is pretty much outright rude, out out of place, or both.
Honestly, pretty much every post RD has dropped in this thread is pretty much outright rude, out out of place, or both.
You didn't see my second post did you? I'm not trying to offend anyone. I was mostly ranting about some of my own experiences.
Which means you're right. It is out of place. Sorry.
I would edit my initial post to be less rude sounding, but I missed my 1-hour window. Flag it and move on if you want.
Honestly, pretty much every post RD has dropped in this thread is pretty much outright rude, out out of place, or both.You didn't see my second post did you? I'm not trying to offend anyone. I was mostly ranting about some of my own experiences.
Which means you're right. It is out of place. Sorry.
I would edit my initial post to be less rude sounding, but I missed my 1-hour window. Flag it and move on if you want.
i really think we are off topic but.........
i think he was not being a jerk , just throwing out those waves of frustration that any player/dm goes through when a player is being a peanutbutter orc, a kobold landlord, a druid who hates nature and is a nihilsit, or a vanaran monk named monkey monk who climbs stuff and throws his poo, or a ninja who instead of goign along with the party hook of being bought form slavery jumps the table and kills the person who is about to give you the story hookand then the character screams loudly "no man is my master i am spartacus!! has he snaps the characters neck making you as a dm have to come up with something new. and don't forget the guy who gets high before the game, and plays the paladin who does nothing but bang pots and pans together in the kitchen for hours instead of helping the party kill the bbge
starting to slow down here fellas ! the monks suck thread is like blowing up.
we need a pick me up.
ahem....clears throat...... monks are sweet because they can play football and soccer and kick you in the throat.
also if you have a fat drunk monk he is still as dangerous as a skinny neroxic monk they are killers no matter there weight level!
starting to slow down here fellas ! the monks suck thread is like blowing up.
we need a pick me up.
ahem....clears throat...... monks are sweet because they can play football and soccer and kick you in the throat.
also if you have a fat drunk monk he is still as dangerous as a skinny neroxic monk they are killers no matter there weight level!
That's right!
Also monks are rad because they look like humble unarmed farm workers to the innocent highwayman.Also Lobolusk, you've inspired me to write an article on how awesome monks are, called "A Serious Argument for The Monk"
-Moox
Monks are rad because they don't ever get old.
Town laws don't allow weapons unless peacebonded? Advantage: monk.
Controversial disjunction trap destroys the party's gear? Advantage: monk.
Heavy handed GM non-lethals the party into submission, only to wake up in a jail cell without their weapons? Advantage: monk.
GM decides that sunder and disarm are fair game for some reason? Advantage: monk.
Party needs to infiltrate somewhere posing as commoners or craftsmen who would be out of place carrying weapons? Advantage: monk.
GM decides that sunder and disarm are fair game for some reason? Advantage: monk.
That same GM for fairness purposes said bodyparts could be sundered.
Scared the s*$* out of me.
Monks can break land speed world records.
And they don't need a mount.
Also, monks can fly w/o items.
Sundering weapons is valid and fair tactics. Sundering limbs? Unless the enemy has a sword of sharpness, the GM is being a dick. (I never thought I'd say that about a GM's play style - might be the drugs I'm on.)
Oh, it was a one time thing, and part of a thought experiment, so it was all in good fun.
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To be honest the monk has never had a lot of personal appeal to me but there were a couple examples where monks really shined that I recall.
My impression of the monk bumped up about 3 notches against a fairly nasty ghost encounter I GMed. The monk in the party had a ridiculously good touch AC which really made him shine a bit. Similarly against alchemists and any other touch attack based enemies but the ghost one was a lot of fun, turning a potentially nasty enemy into a fairly easy encounter.
Another encounter which was pretty fun I was playing a monk and managed to pull off a 50' running leap which seriously shortened an encounter and honestly was just plain fun.
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Once had an obese monk named Floating Mountain with Spider Step, Cloud Step, Fleet several times, and the Spring Attack tree.
Was a pretty cool character.
Then the Vital Strike/Spring Attack nerfs came along.
Now there's no such thing as a cool monk, or a good mobility build for that matter.
Monks are rad because no other class can have mult 500+post threads about them going at the same time !!
Monks will always have a spot in my heart because of Burl Harvey Nichols. he always played either a monk or a cleric. and he brought benefits far greater than any bonus on the dice.
Monks are rad because SHORYUKEN!!!!
Monks are rad because you never know if the person you are talking to is a monk.
Noble in fancy clothing?
Local Bartender?
Were-Bear?
All of them could be monks(and the last can kill you bear-handed).
Monks are rad because SHORYUKEN!!!!
Monks are Rad because they can ride seahorses on land.
Monks are rad because you never know if the person you are talking to is a monk.
Noble in fancy clothing?
Local Bartender?
Were-Bear?All of them could be monks(and the last can kill you bear-handed).
and the second one can beat you bar-handed.
Monks are rad because they can beat you with 2nd Amendment puns.
Monks are rad because:
1) Even guys on horses can't run away from them
2) They can be anywhere on the battlefield they want to be
3) Their ability to flank pretty much whoever they want to is the fighter's best friend
4) They end up being immune to so much and their saves rock
5) At the dinner party where it is considered impolite to bring weapons or spell components, they are still pretty much at full power
6) Ditto with sleeping in the wilderness - no time lost to grab weapons and no AC lost to lack of armor.
Favorite in-game monk moments
1) The party is defending a city from a barbarian horder featuring behemoths of some sort mounting turrets with cannons. Monk sprints out to one of the behemoths, leaps for, grabs amd then climbs the harness, beats the snot out of the behemoth rider/pilot, forcing him to flee into the turret, grabs the turret door before it slams shut and dives inside, spots the open storage chest with powder bags, pulls out flint and steel, lights a torch and throws it in the chest, dives out a gunport, uses slow fall to reach ground safely, watches turret explode, killing behemoth and crew instantly, surly dwarf in party shouts out: "It still only counts as one."
2) BBEG, after thwarting the party yet again, mocks them from a distance before leaping into a nigh-bottomless pit to flee retribution, counting on using feather fall to break her fall. Monk character sprints to edge and dives right after her, catches and grapples her, and rides her all the way to the bottom.
3) In another defend the city battle, a couple of giants are beating the snot out the party tanks. Monk character circles around behind the first one and attacks. First attack is a critical hit, with the special effect being shattered kneecap, dropping the giant to the ground where it is quickly dispatched. Moves on to flank the second giant, scores critical hit on first attack. Special effect is dazed for 1d4 rounds. It becomes easy meat. Monk character says: What was your problem? Those guys were wimps."
Remember that scene in Babylon 5 where Marcus is in a bar and he says something like "I'll talk to the last person standing?" And then he clears the room by whirling and smacking and being badass? And then he discovers he's knocked every single opponent out, and now he has to wait for one to wake up so he can question them?
That's why monks are so fricking rad.
And here's the thing. All of us who say that D&D/PF monks are not rad? It's because they don't do that. We want them to. They can maybe manage it against classed humanoid NPCs--even there, the dependency on Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, and Constitution (and a 13 intelligence, if they want Greater Trip or Greater Disarm) can make it a tricky prospect, but those are the circumstances where they have the most chance to sign. Against monsters larger than they are--which is honestly most of the Bestiary, especially at higher levels. Stunning Fist won't do squat, they're virtually immune to Combat Maneuvers, and even if you can stand still to flurry (unlikely, given high level enemy movement abilities, and the danger of standing still), a good DR swallows most of that damage.
All right, I'm exaggerating a bit. In the average campaign, Monks will probably do OK, and have fun. But it's gonna be a struggle.
I want the monk to be rad. But a lot of the things that are conceptually rad about them are simply not backed up in the mechanics. If one of the best ways to play the wuxia hero is, mechanically speaking, as a muscle-bound thug with brass knuckles, there's a problem there.
Remember that scene in Babylon 5 where Marcus is in a bar and he says something like "I'll talk to the last person standing?" And then he clears the room by whirling and smacking and being badass? And then he discovers he's knocked every single opponent out, and now he has to wait for one to wake up so he can question them?
That's why monks are so fricking rad.
And here's the thing. All of us who say that D&D/PF monks are not rad? It's because they don't do that. We want them to. They can maybe manage it against classed humanoid NPCs--even there, the dependency on Strength, Dexterity, Wisdom, and Constitution (and a 13 intelligence, if they want Greater Trip or Greater Disarm) can make it a tricky prospect, but those are the circumstances where they have the most chance to sign. Against monsters larger than they are--which is honestly most of the Bestiary, especially at higher levels. Stunning Fist won't do squat, they're virtually immune to Combat Maneuvers, and even if you can stand still to flurry (unlikely, given high level enemy movement abilities, and the danger of standing still), a good DR swallows most of that damage.
All right, I'm exaggerating a bit. In the average campaign, Monks will probably do OK, and have fun. But it's gonna be a struggle.
I want the monk to be rad. But a lot of the things that are conceptually rad about them are simply not backed up in the mechanics. If one of the best ways to play the wuxia hero is, mechanically speaking, as a muscle-bound thug with brass knuckles, there's a problem there.
I think , if i may point out that we all want our characters to be bad ass and always be the hero, with the game mechanics it is not possible you will drop the sword because you rolled a one.
I think maybe you may consider in my humble opinion change your expectations of the monk class. or any class for that matter and allow for failures. and don't because this is what I do expect your tv/movie/book character to exactly fit perfectly into the game with the limited mechanics we have. dnd was once explained to me as make believe with rules. and those rules will there fore limit your ability to do what you want to do. and monks are sweet because they best fit my idea of what a high flying daredevil fist of fury bruce lee knock off, luchador spectacular. represents in my mind.
I think , if i may point out that we all want our characters to be bad ass and always be the hero, with the game mechanics it is not possible you will drop the sword because you rolled a one.You don't drop your sword on a natural one in Pathfinder. You just miss.
regardless you will fail somehow
we treat ones as a real bad fail
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I think , if i may point out that we all want our characters to be bad ass and always be the hero, with the game mechanics it is not possible you will drop the sword because you rolled a one.You don't drop your sword on a natural one in Pathfinder. You just miss.
My DM makes natural ones hit a random square, half or full power depending on level and situation. I had a fight where my barbarian pal made me lose 60 HP in two natural ones.
Did I mention we don't have a healer ? Freakin' natural ones.EVIL, I SAY !
monks are sweet because they dont need to use kitchen utensils when cooking. need to shred some cheese for tacos?.....TIGER CLAW ATTACK!!
need to crush some onions?....IRON HEAD SMASH!!!
OH...the tortillas need some sour cream put on them and i can't find a spoon.........TWO FINGER DOLLOP ATTACK!
Against monsters larger than they are--which is honestly most of the Bestiary, especially at higher levels. Stunning Fist won't do squat, they're virtually immune to Combat Maneuvers, and even if you can stand still to flurry (unlikely, given high level enemy movement abilities, and the danger of standing still), a good DR swallows most of that damage.
All right, I'm exaggerating a bit. In the average campaign, Monks will probably do OK, and have fun. But it's gonna be a struggle.
You're exaggerating more than a bit.
It is actually quite trivial to build a maneuver monk, who — with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents. I actually think that your statement about maneuvers should be true, but it isn't. I've seen a monk wrangle an adult black dragon like a balloon animal at a child's birthday party.
And that's why they're frikkan rad.
You're exaggerating more than a bit.
It is actually quite trivial to build a maneuver monk, who — with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents. I actually think that your statement about maneuvers should be true, but it isn't. I've seen a monk wrangle an adult black dragon like a balloon animal at a child's birthday party.
And that's why they're frikkan rad.
+1 my dream is to wrestle a dragon.
with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents.
Like what? Most large and huge on-par CR opponents will have terrific CMDs. Chances are, the odds will NOT be in the monk's favor, even when enlarged.
(I'd also like to point out that size matters not for grapple in Pathfinder. Your monk can attempt to grapple a huge dragon even without enlarge person.)
My elven cleric being on the receiving end of the half-orc fighters natural ones is the reason I don't use fumbles in my game.
Realizing that a highly trained person failing so badly they hurt someone, hurt themselves, or do something else incredibly stupid 5% of the time is a ridiculous statistic is why I don't use fumbles, but this is a good reason too.
with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents.Like what? Most large and huge on-par CR opponents will have terrific CMDs. Chances are, the odds will NOT be in the monk's favor, even when enlarged.
(I'd also like to point out that size matters not for grapple in Pathfinder. Your monk can attempt to grapple a huge dragon even without enlarge person.)
monks are super frickin rad because i once played a monk prestige class that got regeneration at level 9 (out of oriental handbook) we went to the planes and fought a bunch of rocs you know ...giant birds... i was able to fling my self form sphere to sphere attameting to tackle grapple large birds and if I i missed and hit the concrete like e screaming 90 miles an hour bullet. i healed after a bit and could do it all over again. the rad point i am trying to make is that who cares if the grapple failed what is sweet is that you did in fact attempt to grapple a giant flying bird!
Monks are rad because the class is the only class with only four letters in it's name, allowing to get to writing other stuff down on your character sheet.
Also? Let's see a fighter or barbarian make words from every letter in their class name as easily as this!
Mashing
On
Nooby's
Kidneys
Swiftly
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
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Monks are awesome because everybody still fails a save on a 1. Had a PC monk quivering palm a chapter BBEG in my STAP game. Five Point Finger Exploding Heart Technique'd him to damn DEATH. The monk won initiative, too--nobody else even touched the BBEG.
Monks also rock because of monk/assassins. "A group of unarmed, unarmored commoners walks by. One of them walks over to you and finger jabs you in the throat. Fort save or die."
Monks are awesome because everybody still fails a save on a 1. Had a PC monk quivering palm a chapter BBEG in my STAP game. Five Point Finger Exploding Heart Technique'd him to damn DEATH. The monk won initiative, too--nobody else even touched the BBEG.
Monks also rock because of monk/assassins. "A group of unarmed, unarmored commoners walks by. One of them walks over to you and finger jabs you in the throat. Fort save or die."
+1
Against monsters larger than they are--which is honestly most of the Bestiary, especially at higher levels. Stunning Fist won't do squat, they're virtually immune to Combat Maneuvers, and even if you can stand still to flurry (unlikely, given high level enemy movement abilities, and the danger of standing still), a good DR swallows most of that damage.
All right, I'm exaggerating a bit. In the average campaign, Monks will probably do OK, and have fun. But it's gonna be a struggle.
You're exaggerating more than a bit.
It is actually quite trivial to build a maneuver monk, who — with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents. I actually think that your statement about maneuvers should be true, but it isn't. I've seen a monk wrangle an adult black dragon like a balloon animal at a child's birthday party.
And that's why they're frikkan rad.
All right, then let's see the build. Show me your build for a level ten monk, and let's hash out how he stacks up against CR 10 and 11 creatures from the Bestiary. I want to believe this, but I also want to see the math.
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True story. My 30th level VoP Monk went in against Dozekar the Cursed, CR 38 dragon from Everquest: Monsters of Norrath book. It was a sidebar thing while we waited for our DM to arrive.
Obviously, with DR 20/-, fast healing 100, and 2700+ HP, we weren't going to beat it toe to toe. The guy running it said it was obvious the dragon was bored, toying with us, letting us try to overcome his defenses.
After a few rounds of this, I realized my only chance. The warlock had given up, hiding in the corner. So I began flurrying with touch attacks.
Touch of Golden Ice attacks.
A round or two later, that natural one came up.
His Dex? 7.
His Cha? 39
I gained four levels that night, caps be damned.
All right, then let's see the build. Show me your build for a level ten monk, and let's hash out how he stacks up against CR 10 and 11 creatures from the Bestiary. I want to believe this, but I also want to see the math.Against monsters larger than they are--which is honestly most of the Bestiary, especially at higher levels. Stunning Fist won't do squat, they're virtually immune to Combat Maneuvers, and even if you can stand still to flurry (unlikely, given high level enemy movement abilities, and the danger of standing still), a good DR swallows most of that damage.
All right, I'm exaggerating a bit. In the average campaign, Monks will probably do OK, and have fun. But it's gonna be a struggle.
You're exaggerating more than a bit.
It is actually quite trivial to build a maneuver monk, who — with the aid of enlarge person — can grapple comically large opponents. I actually think that your statement about maneuvers should be true, but it isn't. I've seen a monk wrangle an adult black dragon like a balloon animal at a child's birthday party.
And that's why they're frikkan rad.
wrong thread my friend this is the crazy! ridiculousness monk thread
Awesome
In my past 3.5 Epic campaing, players (11) met at level 34 five five-headed chromatic dragons, one each color, as a deadly encounter (thery were advanced and optimized as hell).
I skip the epic battle, but whereas the other then players struggled a lot to kill the blue, black, white and green.. the Monk...
Killed by natural 1 the Red. Quivering Palm.
AND turned to the party saying: "so? how long it will gets you to kill them? You arre SLOW*"
* 5 rounds and the whole melee frienzed berserk included died. 5 rounds at epic is long. very long.
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Same epic game, party was up against an advanced Blackstone Gigant. Having serious DR, construct traits, and petrification slams, our party decided that retreating would be prudent.
Unfortunately, our NPC ally had gotten grappled.
I ask the party, do we still have those rings of freedom of movement? They answer yes. I ask for one.
"But you have a vow of poverty!"
"It is not for me. It is for him." *points to NPC*
My monk, having freedom of movement from her vow, then proceeds to climb the gigant in order to hand the NPC the ring so that he can escape.