What are some things about the Pathfinder rules that you think most people do not know?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion

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Liberty's Edge

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Pathfinder Maps Subscriber

When grappling you take a -4 penalty to Dex, which means CMD and Escape Artist are at -2 even.

When pinning someone you also lose Dex bonus to AC and thus CMD, so your CMD becomes worse of normal CMD -2 or normal CMD minus Dex bonus.

A pinned character does not take a penalty to Dex (though they are flat footed and take a further -4 to AC) and so his Escape Artist checks are better than when just Grappled.

If you break free when pinned you are completely free (unlike in 3.5 when you go from pinned to grappled).

Take all of the above into account and it is easier to break free when pinned than just grappled, or no harder at least.

Sczarni

Dotted. I will actually contribute after I've read the whole thread.


- Dodge feat applies to CMD
- Initiative rolls are made before determination of aware combatants and the surprise round happens
- You need combat reflexes to get AoOs when you are flat-footed
- Crawl is a move action and lets you move 5 feet (doesn't matter your speed)

EDIT: - you don't need the rogue's trapfinding ability to find a trap, unless it's a magical one. Also, only the rogue (maybe RAI everyone who has the trapfinding class ability) can bypass a trap, without disarming it, with a disable device check.

The Exchange

Dot


I like Pathfinder well enough, but threads like these remind me why I keep pining for something like Savage Worlds. ;-)

More to the point: Grease doesn't seem to allow for sneak attacks like it did in 3.5. I say "seem to" because I can't find a 100% clear ruling either way.


Cheapy wrote:
Another one is that Lesser Restoration has a three round casting time.

But not from a Wand...


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jesterle wrote:

According to the PRD it is entirely true:

Quote:

Energy Immunity and Vulnerability

A creature with energy immunity never takes damage from that energy type. If a creature has fire immunity, it also has vulnerability to cold. If a creature has cold immunity, it also has vulnerability to fire. Vulnerability means the creature takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from that energy type, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed or if the save is a success or failure.

I'm terribly sorry - that was a misinterpretation on my part. That rule was discussed in this thread.

And the developer's comments were

Sean K Reynolds wrote:


*facepalm*

I'm going to errata the hell out of that.

and

James Jacobs wrote:
Nope; vulnerabilities shouldn't automatically carry linked immunities at all.

I really loved these comments; but until the errata is official, i guess you (and the glossary) are correct. :-)


A lot of great information here.

In terms of what's different, I could be wrong about this but, Wizard Specialization is quite different. In 3.5, you couldn't take spells from the opposing class, now they just cost double slots.


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Wizard can begin play with a bonded object instead of a familar. The bonded object lets you cast a spell that you know with out having it perpared or using a spell slot.

More improtantly if you choose a weapon it automatically begin play with a masterwork version of it for free and if your a half elf you can trade out the free skill focus for a free weapon prof feat and also begin play prof with that masterwork bonded weapon. GO GO BONDED SHOTGUN!!!


bugleyman wrote:


More to the point: Grease doesn't seem to allow for sneak attacks like it did in 3.5. I say "seem to" because I can't find a 100% clear ruling either way.

Oh it does, it's just buried.

PRD link
Grease:
PRD wrote:

A grease spell covers a solid surface with a layer of slippery grease. Any creature in the area when the spell is cast must make a successful Reflex save or fall. A creature can walk within or through the area of grease at half normal speed with a DC 10 Acrobatics check. Failure means it can't move that round (and must then make a Reflex save or fall), while failure by 5 or more means it falls (see the Acrobatics skill for details). Creatures that do not move on their turn do not need to make this check and are not considered flat-footed.

Emphasis mine.
As you can see only when you are not moving you aren't considered flat-footed, which means that if you move you are flat-footed.

Liberty's Edge

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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Force cage has reflex negates.

But by rules, it doesn't negate anything, or affect any creature in the area in any way.

No one knows what happens if you pass the save. Does the spell fail? Can you pass through it? Did you jump out of the way? Where the hell are you on the map now? Can you get that kind of free not-an-action-out-of-turn movement for anything else? If enough casters cast forcecage and you pass every save, can you go faster than light as you chain hop away? It's the Supercasting Supercollider, that accelerates adventurons to arbitrary speeds!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

A change from 3.5 to PF that my players and I didn't catch until after an argument (the nature of which will be clear once I describe the rule)...

The detect <alignment> spells don't register an aura based on alignment alone unless the target creature has at least 6HD. (unless they're a cleric of particular deities, or undead, or outsiders)

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Someone above mentioned a half-dragon template. Something that is easy to overlook in that is that the breath weapon is based off racial hit dice instead of total hit dice now, so your half-dragon human has a lousy breath weapon.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pawns, Rulebook Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
leo1925 wrote:
bugleyman wrote:


More to the point: Grease doesn't seem to allow for sneak attacks like it did in 3.5. I say "seem to" because I can't find a 100% clear ruling either way.

Oh it does, it's just buried.

PRD link
** spoiler omitted **

In any situation where you are required to make an Acrobatics check to move, you are considered flat-footed while moving. (The relevant rules text is in the Acrobatics skill description.)

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
MythicFox wrote:
The detect <alignment> spells don't register an aura based on alignment alone unless the target creature has at least 6HD. (unless they're a cleric of particular deities, or undead, or outsiders)

WHOA so if you just walk around with that active in town, it's guaranteed to pick out the people who matter?

The game I'm running has a character who can detect evil (a pixie, but a paladin would work just as well). They were at the World Fair, which had quite the mix of power levels present. Some folks he detected as evil have a shot at being bad guys or minions later, others are just greedy folks who have every intention of screwing over others for personal gain... but this rule changes that ability to something MUCH more powerful.

Interesting.


stuart haffenden wrote:
Cheapy wrote:
Another one is that Lesser Restoration has a three round casting time.
But not from a Wand...

Are you sure? This is what I'm seeing in the Core Rulebook

Activation: Wands use the spell trigger activation method,
so casting a spell from a wand is usually a standard action
that doesn’t provoke attacks of opportunity. (If the spell
being cast has a longer casting time than 1 action, however,
it takes that long to cast the spell from a wand.)

Liberty's Edge

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cfalcon wrote:

Force cage has reflex negates.

But by rules, it doesn't negate anything, or affect any creature in the area in any way.

No one knows what happens if you pass the save. Does the spell fail? Can you pass through it? Did you jump out of the way? Where the hell are you on the map now? Can you get that kind of free not-an-action-out-of-turn movement for anything else? If enough casters cast forcecage and you pass every save, can you go faster than light as you chain hop away? It's the Supercasting Supercollider, that accelerates adventurons to arbitrary speeds!

I have always assumed that the Reflex save causes the spell to fail, and justified it by the idea that the force effects won't come into existence where there is already an object, so a quick enough response to the spell's effects manifesting, such as by swinging a sword through the edges or something similar, can disrupt the walls or bars as they form.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

Well, certainly no reason to cast that in your games then.

That's a valid interpretation, but that makes the spell pretty terrible.

Note that it doesn't actually affect a creature- it just encloses a space- but obviously they meant something when they added Reflex Negates and one-thirdified the casting materials required down to 500 gp ruby dust.


Shisumo wrote:
I have always assumed that the Reflex save causes the spell to fail, and justified it by the idea that the force effects won't come into existence where there is already an object, so a quick enough response to the spell's effects manifesting, such as by swinging a sword through the edges or something similar, can disrupt the walls or bars as they form.

Nice. I'll be filing that one away for future use...

Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as FAQ candidate.
Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pawns, Rulebook Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
cfalcon wrote:
Note that it doesn't actually affect a creature- it just encloses a space- but obviously they meant something when they added Reflex Negates and one-thirdified the casting materials required down to 500 gp ruby dust.

Yeah, by RAW the "Ref negates" bit is meaningless, because you have to be a target to make a save, and there is no target for forcecage. But as you say, they clearly meant something, so...

If it helps, you might limit the use of the save to creatures who threaten a square on the opposite side of the wall as it forms (i.e., they have to be next to a forming wall or have reach enough to affect it from a greater distance); that would still be logical but might improve its utility for you.


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This recently came up in a discussion with a friend of mine, and it appears that it's frequently ignored from what I've read on the forums:

Ranger's 2nd lvl Cure Light Wounds =/= Cleric's 1st level Cure Light Wounds.

E.g. a Ranger/Paladin shouldn't be able to use a cheap 750gp wand of CLW without rolling Use Magic Device, but rather have to get the 6000gp version made by a ranger.

I mean, why else have different prices for wands made by different casters?

Another example if this is ignored: Why would a wizard ever buy a wand of summon monster 3 made by a wizard when he could get a wand of summon monster 4 made by a summoner for the same price (or a wand of summon monster 5 even).


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Not sure if this is carried over from 3.5 or not.

A rogue does not add sneak attack unless his regular attack makes it through all of the targets Damage Reduction.

It totally makes sense. Just learned that at pfs last week.


Venomblade wrote:

Not sure if this is carried over from 3.5 or not.

A rogue does not add sneak attack unless his regular attack makes it through all of the targets Damage Reduction.

It totally makes sense. Just learned that at pfs last week.

Really? That's a new one on me.

Shadow Lodge

1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

Off Topic :)

cfalcon wrote:

Well, certainly no reason to cast that in your games

then.

That's a valid interpretation, but that makes the spell pretty terrible.

Note that it doesn't actually affect a creature- it just encloses a space- but obviously they meant something when they added Reflex Negates and one-thirdified the casting materials required down to 500 gp ruby dust.

This is actually the same with many of the Shapable Wall Spells. They offer Saves, but how does that work? Passing a Save DOES NOT mean the spell fails to function, but ratherthat it doesn't have a full affect of that individual. Lets say you have a Wall of Stone, shaping it so that it makes a full 45ft diameter circle naround a target. So they gt a Save to avoid, but they can't make it out of the "trap" with a single move action. So why is there a save at all?

Liberty's Edge

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bugleyman wrote:
Venomblade wrote:

Not sure if this is carried over from 3.5 or not.

A rogue does not add sneak attack unless his regular attack makes it through all of the targets Damage Reduction.

It totally makes sense. Just learned that at pfs last week.

Really? That's a new one on me.

I'm about 97% certain that's not true.

Liberty's Edge

Venomblade wrote:

Not sure if this is carried over from 3.5 or not.

A rogue does not add sneak attack unless his regular attack makes it through all of the targets Damage Reduction.

It totally makes sense. Just learned that at pfs last week.

Is is a conflation from the rule on whether poison and similar effects happen if no damage. Poison and other "plus" effects require that the initial damage takes place. Sneak attack just adds to the damage to see if it takes place. (Could be wrong, happy to see a citation to learn from.)

Shadow Lodge

bugleyman wrote:
Venomblade wrote:

Not sure if this is carried over from 3.5 or not.

A rogue does not add sneak attack unless his regular attack makes it through all of the targets Damage Reduction.

It totally makes sense. Just learned that at pfs last week.

Really? That's a new one on me.

I'm pretty sure this is false.

You might be thinking of a similar situation with for example an injury poison whose attack didn't get through DR, and thus didn't actually injure the target and is wasted. Then again, I may be wrong.

Liberty's Edge

If damage is less due to strength penalties such that damage would be less than 1, the damage in PF is 1 point of non-lethal. In SRD/D&D, the damage is reduced to 1 point of lethal.

Liberty's Edge

Leonal wrote:

This recently came up in a discussion with a friend of mine, and it appears that it's frequently ignored from what I've read on the forums:

Ranger's 2nd lvl Cure Light Wounds =/= Cleric's 1st level Cure Light Wounds.

E.g. a Ranger/Paladin shouldn't be able to use a cheap 750gp wand of CLW without rolling Use Magic Device, but rather have to get the 6000gp version made by a ranger.

I mean, why else have different prices for wands made by different casters?

Another example if this is ignored: Why would a wizard ever buy a wand of summon monster 3 made by a wizard when he could get a wand of summon monster 4 made by a summoner for the same price (or a wand of summon monster 5 even).

There are all sorts of games that can be played by pulling spells from different lists. However, the requirement to use a wand is that the spell is on the spell list of the user. That is generally interpreted to have the same name, not the same name and level. This can play out in different ways from a role playing and plot perspective. but it doesn't impact who can use which wands.


cibet44 wrote:
kikanaide wrote:
cibet44 wrote:
InfoStorm wrote:

In 3.5, if you shot a ranged attack into melee and missed by 4 or less, you hit the other person in the melee (often an ally).

That's not in 3.5 to my recollection.
My group played that way as well. Now I'm trying to figure out why.

You might be thinking of "firing into a grapple" in which case you roll randomly to see who you potentially hit.

See here:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatModifiers.htm

The OP is probably thinking about the 3.0 cover rules, which were fairly arcane. They went something like this:

1. If an ally is providing cover for an opponent, the opponent gets +4 AC (or +2 or +7, depending on how much cover the DM rules it to be).
2. If the cover bonus to AC makes the difference between a hit and a miss, the attack may instead hit the cover. Apply the same attack roll to the covering person.
3. If the cover's Dex/Dodge bonus to AC makes the difference between a hit and a miss, the attack goes back to hitting the original target. Basically, since the cover dodged the attack, it still goes on to hit its original target.


Rangers and Paladins don't have caster levels until 4th level, so they can't use magic items (like wands) until then. At 4th, there caster level is level-3. (Rather than 1/2 level in 3.5)

Also, when you pick your smite target, you gain your Cha bonus as a deflection to AC against them. Most people probably know this, but the people I know don't.

Edit: If your attack has posion on it, the attack has to deal atleast 1 point of damage for the posion to work. Also another rule overlooked by people I play with.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pawns, Rulebook Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
Beckett wrote:
Lets say you have a Wall of Stone, shaping it so that it makes a full 45ft diameter circle naround a target. So they gt a Save to avoid, but they can't make it out of the "trap" with a single move action. So why is there a save at all?

That would require a 29th level caster, so maybe it's enough of a corner case that no one bothered worrying about it. ;)

In general, though, the rules on Reflex saves are weird. Every time I see "Reflex negates" in a way that seems to demand movement, I twitch slightly.


Howie23 wrote:
If damage is less due to strength penalties such that damage would be less than 1, the damage in PF is 1 point of non-lethal. In SRD/D&D, the damage is reduced to 1 point of lethal.

If your attack does not make it through the targets defenses how are you supposed to hit those vital spots for the extra sneak attack damage.

Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury poison, a monk's stunning, and injury-based disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

Attacks that deal no damage because of the target's damage reduction do not disrupt spells.

I thought sneak attack was a "special effect"

I hope I am wrong!! I will get off more SA that way!

Liberty's Edge

A couple stemming out of missing clarification text and/or diagrams, in the category "same as, but now confused..."

1. Reach weapons for small and medium creatures have a reach of 10 feet. Despite a diagram that says otherwise, they can still attack two squares on a diagonal.

2. Double weapons are two-handed weapons with special properties regarding two-handed fighting. If a double weapon is used in one hand, only one end can be used. The missing text that clarifies things is that using a two-handed weapon with one hand only happens if it is sized smaller than you or you have an additional rules resource to permit it.

Liberty's Edge

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Snopaws wrote:
Rangers and Paladins don't have caster levels until 4th level, so they can't use magic items (like wands) until then.

Not true - see the Spell Trigger items section in the Magic Items intorduction. A 3rd level paladin using a wand is specifically called out as legal, in fact.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Shisumo wrote:
If it helps, you might limit the use of the save to creatures who threaten a square on the opposite side of the wall as it forms (i.e., they have to be next to a forming wall or have reach enough to affect it from a greater distance); that would still be logical but might improve its utility for you.

I just play it exactly like 3.5 (and I bump the cost back up, I mean exact). The devs sort of don't talk about high level anything, and this is one of those things that just looks too lazy for me to take seriously "Well, forcecage is too good so, how about it get a reflex save? Ok, done."

Quote:
Another example if this is ignored: Why would a wizard ever buy a wand of summon monster 3 made by a wizard when he could get a wand of summon monster 4 made by a summoner for the same price (or a wand of summon monster 5 even).

The wizard version of SM3 is SL3 and CL5, so 3x5x750= 11250, right?

The summoner version of SM4 is SL4 and CL10, so 4x10x750=30000.
The wizard version of SM4 is SL4 and CL7, so 4x7x750=21000.

Quote:
This is actually the same with many of the Shapable Wall Spells.

More stuff to ignore for now, good catch.

Liberty's Edge

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Snopaws wrote:
Rangers and Paladins don't have caster levels until 4th level, so they can't use magic items (like wands) until then.

This is false. Having a caster level isn't a requirement wands and it is specifically called out in the activation section that they can use wands.

"Spell Trigger: Spell trigger activation is similar to spell completion, but it's even simpler. No gestures or spell finishing is needed, just a special knowledge of spellcasting that an appropriate character would know, and a single word that must be spoken. Spell trigger items can be used by anyone whose class can cast the corresponding spell. This is the case even for a character who can't actually cast spells, such as a 3rd-level paladin. The user must still determine what spell is stored in the item before she can activate it. Activating a spell trigger item is a standard action and does not provoke attacks of opportunity."

Shadow Lodge

Snopaws wrote:
Rangers and Paladins don't have caster levels until 4th level, so they can't use magic items (like wands) until then.

This is wrong.

"Spell trigger items can be used by anyone whose class can cast the corresponding spell. This is the case even for a character who can't actually cast spells, such as a 3rd-level paladin. "
From Using Magic items

Quote:
At 4th, there caster level is level-3. (Rather than 1/2 level in 3.5)

This bit is right.

Edit: Ninja'd by Howie


Cartigan wrote:
Matthew Winn wrote:
Aldin wrote:
Let's add: Identify just gives a bonus to Spellcraft checks

More importantly, it can be used on more than one item at a time. I don't remember if that was a 3.5 change, but casting it on every single item in 3.0 was horrible.

No, it was single use in 3.5. Wizards must have caused clams to go extinct from the excessive use of 100gp pearls that had to be expended in identifying magic items. You had to get to Analyze Dwomer or something before you could batch identify things. And that ends up being cheaper because it only has a focus!

I don't have my 3.0 PHB available at the moment, but as I recall the versions went something like this:

3.0: Identify affects 1 item/level, but only identifies the most basic function of an item. A Staff of Power would register as a +2 quarterstaff. To get more information, you'd need Analyze Dweomer.
3.5: Identify affects one item, period. However, you do get complete information on what the item does.

There's also the 2e version of the spell, which identified one function per level, but wouldn't tell you exact bonuses. It was also fairly unreliable, only having a level*10% chance of working on each function (and a failure would invalidate the rest of the spell) with a small chance of providing inaccurate information. Plus, after casting it you lost 8 Con, getting one point back with each hour of rest.

Shadow Lodge

Sill Of Topic. . .

Shisumo wrote:
Beckett wrote:
Lets say you have a Wall of Stone, shaping it so that it makes a full 45ft diameter circle naround a target. So they gt a Save to avoid, but they can't make it out of the "trap" with a single move action. So why is there a save at all?

That would require a 29th level caster, so maybe it's enough of a corner case that no one bothered worrying about it. ;)

In general, though, the rules on Reflex saves are weird. Every time I see "Reflex negates" in a way that seems to demand movement, I twitch slightly.

I was more using it as an example. The time that it happened to me involved existing barriers, and I don't think it was Wall of Stone. I'm just saying though. I agree. I honestly don't think over half the things that offer Reflx saves deserve them, and are just there to play to Rogues and thrice-bedamned Evasion.

Just out of curiosity, how would you (all) rule on Ranged Attack spells that offer a Refl Save? Exactly what happens on a confirmed crit?

Does the Crit beat Evasion or does Evasion negate the Crit?


0gre wrote:
Edit: Ninja'd by Howie

You both got ninja'd by Shisumo. =P

I'm aloud to be wrong (as I am all the time), I didn't see the spell trigger rules, just the stuff under ranger and pally that says no spell caster level until 4th. Its my bad for assuming you needed a spell caster level for those kind of magic items.


cfalcon wrote:


Quote:
Another example if this is ignored: Why would a wizard ever buy a wand of summon monster 3 made by a wizard when he could get a wand of summon monster 4 made by a summoner for the same price (or a wand of summon monster 5 even).

The wizard version of SM3 is SL3 and CL5, so 3x5x750= 11250, right?

The summoner version of SM4 is SL4 and CL10, so 4x10x750=30000.
The wizard version of SM4 is SL4 and CL7, so 4x7x750=21000.

Actually SM4 is a 3rd lvl spell for the summoner and CL7. Summoner spell list

So wands made by a summoner:
SM4 3x7x750=15750gp
SM5 4*10*750=30000gp

A summoner could also craft a staff of SM8 as a 6th lvl spell rechargable by a wizard with a 6th lvl spell with this ruling.

edit: I guess it depends on whether one sees a spell as identical to another spell cast by another caster as long as the spell name is the same (as Howie23 mentioned), and whether divine or arcane.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Pawns, Rulebook Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

You are right for spell completion items like scrolls, but spell trigger stuff works differently.

Shadow Lodge

Venomblade wrote:
Howie23 wrote:
If damage is less due to strength penalties such that damage would be less than 1, the damage in PF is 1 point of non-lethal. In SRD/D&D, the damage is reduced to 1 point of lethal.

If your attack does not make it through the targets defenses how are you supposed to hit those vital spots for the extra sneak attack damage.

Whenever damage reduction completely negates the damage from an attack, it also negates most special effects that accompany the attack, such as injury poison, a monk's stunning, and injury-based disease. Damage reduction does not negate touch attacks, energy damage dealt along with an attack, or energy drains. Nor does it affect poisons or diseases delivered by inhalation, ingestion, or contact.

Attacks that deal no damage because of the target's damage reduction do not disrupt spells.

I thought sneak attack was a "special effect"

I hope I am wrong!! I will get off more SA that way!

I'm 99.9% sure that Sneak Attack counts as the type of "weapon" that is used to inflict it, so it is added before the DR, not after. That also means if you Sneak Attack a White Dragon with Scorching Ray, you multiply the Scorching Ray and the Sneak Attack by 1.5. This is not true with Crits, though.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

From the Perception Skill description:

"Identify the powers of a potion through taste"
DC = 15+Potion's Caster Level


Beckett wrote:
I'm 99.9% sure that Sneak Attack counts as the type of "weapon" that is used to inflict it, so it is added before the DR, not after.

This is CORRECT. A rogue Sneak Attacking adds his extra dice as *normal damage* before the DR. As for the SA ray, I think it'd be separated, or at least that's how I'd rule it.

Now, to add something to the mix: Wizards only gain the +2 spells to their spellbooks when they take a Wizard class level. A big detriment to those multi-class characters who do not. It gets EXPENSIVE buying scrolls for each level!


Squeeks wrote:


Now, to add something to the mix: Wizards only gain the +2 spells to their spellbooks when they take a Wizard class level. A big detriment to those multi-class characters who do not. It gets EXPENSIVE buying scrolls for each level!

Or you know just pay very little money and copy the spell from another wizard's spellbook. (i am not sure if this is an option for PFS play, i don't play in PFS)


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joshwitz wrote:


From the Perception Skill description:

"Identify the powers of a potion through taste"
DC = 15+Potion's Caster Level

boggle

Wow. Never thought of that before.


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joshwitz wrote:


From the Perception Skill description:

"Identify the powers of a potion through taste"
DC = 15+Potion's Caster Level

/finds unlabled potion

/Takes taste...

/swishes around mouth....

Yep.. That's Poison!!! hmmm... Pretty nasty stuff toooooooo.....

/dies

Or to quote the great philospher socrates.... "I drank WHAT?!?"


Tarlane wrote:
Someone above mentioned a half-dragon template. Something that is easy to overlook in that is that the breath weapon is based off racial hit dice instead of total hit dice now, so your half-dragon human has a lousy breath weapon.

I hadn't thought of any half-dragons without racial hd this is really good to know. Also it means that the Half-white Red Dragon (aka the Pink Dragon) is even more insanely powerful than I first thought (especially as immunity to a type of damage makes a vulnerability to that damage moot.)

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