Gaining a bonus feat that you already have...


Rules Questions


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.

This one seems obvious, but I just want to make sure, since I'm building a PFS character. Let's say that you start out with Dodge, and as a waves oracle with the Fluid Nature revelation, later gain Dodge as a bonus. That means you can choose any feat (that you meet the requirements for) as a replacement, right? Again, it seems obvious, but I can't find it in the RAW.


You can't find it because it isn't there -- don't take it early and you won't waste your bonus feat.

Liberty's Edge

Nope, you just get boned.

Otherwise, you could do things like that to replace old feats... which is definitely a no-no

Shadow Lodge

Thats how it worked in 3.5, unless the case said otherwise, allowed you to pick from a specific list, (like ranger style, or monk). But organized play has always been very restrictove so probably not for PFS.


Beckett wrote:
Thats how it worked in 3.5, unless the case said otherwise, allowed you to pick from a specific list, (like ranger style, or monk). But organized play has always been very restrictove so probably not for PFS.

I'm pretty sure that in 3.5 the default was not to allow replacement, unless the ability text said you could choose something else. In PF, it's definitely the case that you lose out if you take a bonus feat early. As a GM, I'd certainly consider allowing a character to take a new feat instead, but only if they were a newish player who might not have been thinking levels ahead, or if they started multiclassing to help the party. I wouldn't allow it for experienced players who are just doing it to benefit from a feat earlier than they ordinarily would.

In PFS, though, you're out of luck.


It seems if an ability is supposed to improve, there is a specific note. For example Rogues and uncanny dodge:

Quote:
If a rogue already has uncanny dodge from a different class, she automatically gains improved uncanny dodge (see below) instead.


Bobson wrote:
Beckett wrote:
Thats how it worked in 3.5, unless the case said otherwise, allowed you to pick from a specific list, (like ranger style, or monk). But organized play has always been very restrictove so probably not for PFS.

I'm pretty sure that in 3.5 the default was not to allow replacement, unless the ability text said you could choose something else. In PF, it's definitely the case that you lose out if you take a bonus feat early. As a GM, I'd certainly consider allowing a character to take a new feat instead, but only if they were a newish player who might not have been thinking levels ahead, or if they started multiclassing to help the party. I wouldn't allow it for experienced players who are just doing it to benefit from a feat earlier than they ordinarily would.

In PFS, though, you're out of luck.

Ouch. At least now I don't feel so silly for asking what seemed to me like a stupid question! I just really wanted to be sure... and now I know. Thanks!

Shadow Lodge

It was either in the FAQ or Sages Advice, but the defualt was you could choose a different feat instead, unless the case said otherwise. I want to say the specifics involved a FS/Ftr that already had WF. But it is still probably no on PFS, and PF has a terrible habit of saying the exact oposite about unclear questions than 3.5's rulings.


If you don´t want to ´waste´ the Feat slot, the only RAW way is taking the Feat (Dodge in this case) as a Fighter Bonus Feat (Combat Feats only), and using the Fighter Class Ability to re-train it to something else once you gain the Feat by other means. Now if only Fighters could cast spells, too... ;-)


Quandary wrote:
If you don´t want to ´waste´ the Feat slot, the only RAW way is taking the Feat (Dodge in this case) as a Fighter Bonus Feat (Combat Feats only), and using the Fighter Class Ability to re-train it to something else once you gain the Feat by other means. Now if only Fighters could cast spells, too... ;-)

It's too bad fighters are the only ones who can retrain.

Grand Lodge

Michael F wrote:
Quandary wrote:
If you don´t want to ´waste´ the Feat slot, the only RAW way is taking the Feat (Dodge in this case) as a Fighter Bonus Feat (Combat Feats only), and using the Fighter Class Ability to re-train it to something else once you gain the Feat by other means. Now if only Fighters could cast spells, too... ;-)
It's too bad fighters are the only ones who can retrain.

Yeah - for instance making a char and giving it a better armour proficiency and then later crossing to fighter leaves you down a feat, almost encouraging anyone who is thinking of multiclassing to do Fighter first before anything else (for either weapon or armour proficiencies)

Liberty's Edge

Austin Morgan wrote:

Nope, you just get boned.

Otherwise, you could do things like that to replace old feats... which is definitely a no-no

+1.

Not cool, definitely frustrating, but that's how it works. Talk to the DM ans ask for a one-time "reset" to fix it this time.

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