So in an upcoming plot of a game I'm GMing (homebrew world) I have a character (two handed archetype fighter) who will be embarking on a quest to win a Valkyrie as a bride (he's a mad Scotsmen covered in woad tattoos wielding a claymore- think a human version of the Nac Mac Feegle). In order to prove his worth- and pass through a wall of divine fire (thing Volsung saga) he must slay and eat the hearts of Five dragons (the dragon heart eating thing is from the Volsung saga as well- the Fafnir bit) to gain immunity to fear. I was also planning on it giving other benefits (the eating of dragon hearts that is). Any ideas?
Also, I'm not sure what should represent a Valkyrie mechanically- since I see them as being chaotic good-ish (using the great wheel of planescape for cosmology) I figured an azata would be appropriate. At first I thought I'd just use a Ghaele- but now I'm thinking the Brijidine (only using ice instead of fire) would work too... Thoughts?
I don't think valkyries are powerful outsiders. Half-celestial humans maybe. They're choosers of the slain, after all - they don't have to kill the suckers themselves.
Ok I would have the dragon heart eating thing do the following:
+6 enhancement bonus to strength
+6 enhancement bonus to Constitution
Fire Immunity
Fear Immunity
And "cost" out of his wealth by level 150,000 gp. I would have this scale over the number of dragons he has eaten:
First dragon: +2 to Con, Fire Resistance 10 = 24,000 gp
Second dragon: +2 to Str, +2 versus fear = 34,500 gp
Third dragon: +4 to Str, Fire Resistance 20 = 67,500 gp
Fourth Dragon: +4 to Con, +4 versus fear = 99,000 gp
To achieve these "prices" I used the cost of the belts of physical stats, rings of elemental resistance and gave double bonus from a cloak of resistance against fear only at the same price as a normal cloak of resistance until immunity was established.
As to the Valkyrie: Why not use a Monadic or Movanic angel that uses a spear instead of their normal weapon?
A benefit for eating dragon hearts, eh? I suppose it depends on whether you want each individual heart to grant a benefit, or just one large benefit for eating all five. Assuming the latter, I'd give this Scotsman a trait that is typical of all dragons. I'd recommend either of the following, both may be too much:
Immunities (Ex): Every dragon is immune to sleep and
paralysis. -omitting irrelevant text that would make ability OP for a human-
Dragon Senses (Ex): Dragons have have darkvision 120
ft. and blindsense 60 ft. They see four times as well as a
human in dim light and twice as well in normal light.
As for the Valkyrie, the Azata looks spot-on.
I don't think valkyries are powerful outsiders. Half-celestial humans maybe. They're choosers of the slain, after all - they don't have to kill the suckers themselves.
Possibly- but do angels need the power they have to fulfill roles they have in the bible? Not really- save for the warrior angels that fought off Lucifer's hoard. Also, I don't think valkyries stood around and did nothing during Ragnarok. If other mythologies get powerful outsiders then why not the Norse? (though half celestials could definitely work, I'm thinking of Valkyries being a title rather than a race...not sure)
Either a Ghaele Azata reskinned or maybe just an Aasimar with x number of class levels. Half-Celestial (minus any wings) would also work pretty decently.
Ghaele is nice because it handles outsider, clerical abilities, and a high degree of martial skill and it's you don't have any heavy lifting to do generating a stat block.
Some sort of flying steed would be nice as well.
If I was building from scratch though some combination of Bard or Cleric and Ranger would be appropriate.
Either a Ghaele Azata reskinned or maybe just an Aasimar with x number of class levels. Half-Celestial (minus any wings) would also work pretty decently.
Ghaele is nice because it handles outsider, clerical abilities, and a high degree of martial skill and it's you don't have any heavy lifting to do generating a stat block.
Some sort of flying steed would be nice as well.
If I was building from scratch though some combination of Bard or Cleric and Ranger would be appropriate.
This is why I wanted to use The Ghaele- the statblock is already figured out for me.
Also: Dragon Horse. The steed for all your slain choosing needs.
Ok I would have the dragon heart eating thing do the following:
+6 enhancement bonus to strength
+6 enhancement bonus to Constitution
Fire Immunity
Fear ImmunityAnd "cost" out of his wealth by level 150,000 gp. I would have this scale over the number of dragons he has eaten:
First dragon: +2 to Con, Fire Resistance 10 = 24,000 gp
Second dragon: +2 to Str, +2 versus fear = 34,500 gp
Third dragon: +4 to Str, Fire Resistance 20 = 67,500 gp
Fourth Dragon: +4 to Con, +4 versus fear = 99,000 gpTo achieve these "prices" I used the cost of the belts of physical stats, rings of elemental resistance and gave double bonus from a cloak of resistance against fear only at the same price as a normal cloak of resistance until immunity was established.
As to the Valkyrie: Why not use a Monadic or Movanic angel that uses a spear instead of their normal weapon?
I was thinking that each heart would boost the bonus vs fear, and when finished he'd be immune. Not sure of the energy resistance though- He'll be fighting dragons of every energy type. I should point out the inspiration's benefit was wisdom (as defined by Norse mythology) and just by tasting the blood the hero gained the ability to speak to birds.
I'm looking for a balance between weirdness and usefulness.
These are all good ideas.
Just for the flavor. You may add "two paths" when he consumes a heart. Maybe embracing the power of the blood or refining it, hint him via visions the result of his choice, that way he can choose each benefit.
You can also, enhance those benefits based on the type of dragons killed.-
As a guideline for the powers, you can look the Dragon Disc. Prestige, and remove the -Draconic- Elements (i.e Wings, claws, breath) and replace them for Fear resistance, a bonus feat, etc-
I made a Valkyrie using a heavily revised Eryines.
XP 4,800
LG Medium outsider (good, extraplanar, lawful)
Init +6; Senses darkvision 60 ft., see in darkness, true seeing; Perception +16
Defense
AC 23, touch 17, flat-footed 16 (+6 Dex, +1 dodge, +6 natural)
hp 94 (9d10+45)
Fort +11, Ref +12, Will +7
DR 5/evil; Immune acid, elec; Resist fire 10, cold 10; SR 19
Offense
Speed 30 ft., fly 50 ft. (good)
Melee +1 spear +15/+10 (1d8+8/20)
Ranged +1 shock composite longbow +14/+14/+9 (1d8+6/×3 plus 1d6 elec)
Spell-Like Abilities (CL 12th)
Constant—true seeing
At will— shout (DC 19), greater teleport (self plus 50 lbs. of objects only), minor image (DC 17), holy smite (DC 19)
1/day—summon (as Silver Horn of Valhalla, [pg39, Classic Treasures Revisited])
Statistics
Str 20, Dex 23, Con 21, Int 14, Wis 18, Cha 21
Base Atk +9; CMB +14; CMD 31
Feats Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Mobility, Point-Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Shot on the Run
Skills Acrobatics +18, Bluff +17, Diplomacy +14, Escape Artist +12, Fly +19, Intimidate +17, Knowledge (planes) +8, Knowledge (religion) +8, Perception +16, Sense Motive +10, Stealth +15
Languages Celestial, Common; telepathy 100 ft.
Ecology
Environment: any (Heaven)
Organization: solitary or trio
Treasure: triple (+1 spear, +1 shock composite longbow [+5 Str bonus])
Most valkyrie stand just under 6 feet tall and weigh approximately 140 pounds, even with their ivory-feathered wings that stretch over 10 feet wide.
I made a Valkyrie using a heavily revised Eryines.
** spoiler omitted **
This one's pretty cool, but I was planning on them being chaotic (for the purposes of this campaign) I'm not sure I'd make them archer's either... I like the horn of Valhalla though.
Angels show up in other middle eastern faiths other than biblical, ie tora, bible, koran... and Dragon Hearts are said to give the ability to speak/understand birds...
How about rather than killing the dragons, he convinces them to surrender? Benefit: Five new dragon friends.
But, but..their scales aren't shiny...
That said, I have a feeling that if a Valkyrie told this specific character "You must slay five powerful evil dragons to earn a place in my bed" neither the character nor the player would think twice before reaching for a +1 keen dragon's bane greatsword (not that they have one).
I might create some metallic dragon allies once word gets out that a character is going on an evil dragon killing spree.
Eating a dragon heart gave Siegfried the ability to understand birds - I believe there is another Germanic myth where it conveys the ability to understand all languages. Bathing in dragon blood made Siegfried invulnerable (natural skin armor? acts likes Bracers of Armor perhaps?).
As for the Valkyries, I don't know that angels are a good comparison. Valkyries are the bar-wenches of Valhalla, but they have names like Rota ("sleet and storm"), and are sometimes referred to as the Death-maidens. I like using an Eryines ("Fury") for Valkyrie stats.
Personally I see the invulnerability as being DR- probably DR/magic as that's what dragons have.
And Azatas make awesome bar-wenches. That's the point of being chaotic good, you can be boisterous and battle crazed, but you're fighting for good.
Minstrel, have you considered not giving him anything and instead letting him make class choices to fill the in the abilities?
After all if he's a barbarian then taking invulnerable rager would make sense, along with the energy resistance and fear immunity rage powers he would just about be there, and you don't have to worry about balancing his new powers. Just every now and then throw a dragon in the way for him to eat and gain his new power as the party levels.
Leadership and he's got his girl too.
Minstrel, have you considered not giving him anything and instead letting him make class choices to fill the in the abilities?
After all if he's a barbarian then taking invulnerable rager would make sense, along with the energy resistance and fear immunity rage powers he would just about be there, and you don't have to worry about balancing his new powers. Just every now and then throw a dragon in the way for him to eat and gain his new power as the party levels.
Leadership and he's got his girl too.
Well, he's already an eigth level fighter, and wasn't planning on multiclassing... and I was planning on these boons to be counts as treasure (I'm a big fan of re-flavoring magic items and alternatives to standard gold and magic items as rewards for quest, in an earlier draft I was going to have him collect artifacts from the slain robots, then I remembered Siegfried's stories and there you go.)
If you want inspiration, When Siegfried ate the heart of the dragon he killed, he gained the power to understand the speech of animals.
I would strongly suggest that you go for flavor in your choice of granted boons rather than lumping more and more power to the character.
I agree that they shouldn't just be pure power, but I don't see the player being excited over a 'talk to birds" power. And in game terms, thats a very minor bonus.
What happens when he kills his 6th dragon and eats its heart? Or is it not the "eating of the dragon's hearts" that is giving him his gifts? Just something to think about.
I agree that they shouldn't just be pure power, but I don't see the player being excited over a 'talk to birds" power. And in game terms, thats a very minor bonus.If you want inspiration, When Siegfried ate the heart of the dragon he killed, he gained the power to understand the speech of animals.
I would strongly suggest that you go for flavor in your choice of granted boons rather than lumping more and more power to the character.
Just remember that's far easier not to give than to take away later. It's also justifiable to rule that eating a dragon's heart gives you nothing but indigestion.
And depending on the story and campaign that power can be rather important. Siegfried for example found out how his dwarven mentor was going to kill him for the dragon's treasure because of that bird speech. So it might help to keep to things that further the story along rather than just handing out more and more power.
Because if you do that and if the player sounds like what you're hinting about, he'll be hunting dragons from now til the end of time.
Luckily Dragons are rare enough that finding one is at the Gm's discretion in this campaign.
In all seriousness, Just adding power isn't what I want to do, and I think the player would prefer strange but useful abilities to straight out bonuses. (this particular player style is odd to describe- he's played optimized characters and weak comic relief mostly, he likes to roleplay but isn't into melodrama- he's one of my easiest players to please honestly, his favorite characters he's played include: A 7 foot tall paladin based on the tick, a cowardly elven rogue that was in a thieve's guild- who later became an insane vampire who wore faces, and a goof Germanic alchemist whose love of science is only eclipsed by his love of explosions.)
But I also would like abilities that the player would not only use, but use creatively.
What happens when he kills his 6th dragon and eats its heart? Or is it not the "eating of the dragon's hearts" that is giving him his gifts? Just something to think about.
It's possible.
Well, he's already an eigth level fighter, and wasn't planning on multiclassing... and I was planning on these boons to be counts as treasure (I'm a big fan of re-flavoring magic items and alternatives to standard gold and magic items as rewards for quest, in an earlier draft I was going to have him collect artifacts from the slain robots, then I remembered Siegfried's stories and there you go.)
Awesome -- I'm all for reskinning, and all -- I wasn't sure of the level and if he was low enough I thought it might be an option for working it into his build.
What happens when he kills his 6th dragon and eats its heart? Or is it not the "eating of the dragon's hearts" that is giving him his gifts? Just something to think about.It's possible.
What if each heart gave him a quality of his future loved one, as well? The first heart makes her fair, etc.
Or it might come with a glimpse of her.
This might throw in complications as he begins to deal with the jealousies of the gods along the way--mixing in some Greek myth, here, but not much.
What happens when he kills his 6th dragon and eats its heart? Or is it not the "eating of the dragon's hearts" that is giving him his gifts? Just something to think about.It's possible.What if each heart gave him a quality of his future loved one, as well? The first heart makes her fair, etc.
Or it might come with a glimpse of her.
This might throw in complications as he begins to deal with the jealousies of the gods along the way--mixing in some Greek myth, here, but not much.
Could do that- but that's not treasure.... I think he'll get the whole talk to birds from one of the hearts, as it's from the inspiration, and if he can't think of a use for it,, another character might think of uses (wait, can't you talk to birds?)
I agree that they shouldn't just be pure power, but I don't see the player being excited over a 'talk to birds" power. And in game terms, thats a very minor bonus.If you want inspiration, When Siegfried ate the heart of the dragon he killed, he gained the power to understand the speech of animals.
I would strongly suggest that you go for flavor in your choice of granted boons rather than lumping more and more power to the character.
Well, if I remember correctly, the power to understand birds prevented Siegfried from getting whacked by Fafnir's brother.
Is that power ever mentioned for the rest of the saga? Like, wouldn't his romance with Brunhilda have gone a lot better if the birds had kept talking to him? Could've saved him a lot of grief.
Stupid birds.
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Tongues is a cool ability. It might start with just birds, but it doesn't have to stay there.
Energy resistance is a nice thing, too, but so is immunity to sleep, paralysis, petrification, 120-foot darkvision, blindsense, blindsight, an aura of fear...
... the ability to command dragons (+12 Intimidate vs. Dragons)...
Lots of good stuff.
Tongues is a cool ability. It might start with just birds, but it doesn't have to stay there.
Energy resistance is a nice thing, too, but so is immunity to sleep, paralysis, petrification, 120-foot darkvision, blindsense, blindsight, an aura of fear...
... the ability to command dragons (+12 Intimidate vs. Dragons)...
Lots of good stuff.
Actually, since I've been reading up on Skyrim (elder scrolls 5), I got an idea on that front. The developers mentioned the player speaking the "tongue of the dragons" and that the dragons can speak fire(?) I'm not sure what that means, but the last language taught could be a fire breath attack.
Also I could give a scaling bonus vs sleep paralysis etc rather than immunities.
I really like the intimidation bonus vs dragons (though he might get it as a situational bonus anyway as he has a hobby of killing and eating them).
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The last language COULD be a fire breath attack.
But it could ALSO be the language of fire. We'll call it Old Ignan for now.
Old Ignan is a language normally disallowed for all characters because mortals usually can't pronounce it, but it is the only language that fire understands. The ability to speak Old Ignan confers the following benefits:
- 1/day you may declare a successful save vs. fire.
- You may command regular fire to spread at will, and you may command it to extinguish itself with a successful intimidate check.
- Any magical fire-based effect (such as Wall of Fire) you may command with a successful social skill roll (diplomacy, intimidate, or bluff). The DC is 10 + Caster Level. You may only do this on your own turn.
- 1/day you may completely negate a fire-based magical effect as an immediate action.
- If you are near a source of fire, you may command it to surround you as a shield. This lasts your HD in rounds, and will deal your HD in damage to anyone who successfully attacks you in melee until then. This effect occurs on each successful attack against you.
- +6 Circumstance modifier to all social interactions with fire creatures (fire elementals, magmins, salamanders, etc.)
Or other stuff like that. You like?
The last language COULD be a fire breath attack.
But it could ALSO be the language of fire. We'll call it Old Ignan for now.
Old Ignan is a language normally disallowed for all characters because mortals usually can't pronounce it, but it is the only language that fire understands. The ability to speak Old Ignan confers the following benefits:
- 1/day you may declare a successful save vs. fire.
- You may command regular fire to spread at will, and you may command it to extinguish itself with a successful intimidate check.
- Any magical fire-based effect (such as Wall of Fire) you may command with a successful social skill roll (diplomacy, intimidate, or bluff). The DC is 10 + Caster Level. You may only do this on your own turn.
- 1/day you may completely negate a fire-based magical effect as an immediate action.
- If you are near a source of fire, you may command it to surround you as a shield. This lasts your HD in rounds, and will deal your HD in damage to anyone who successfully attacks you in melee until then. This effect occurs on each successful attack against you.
- +6 Circumstance modifier to all social interactions with fire creatures (fire elementals, magmins, salamanders, etc.)Or other stuff like that. You like?
Yeah forget the breath attack, I really love these ideas.