Stargate in Kingmaker Setting


Homebrew and House Rules


First off let me warn you there are some refereces to the Stargate TV frachise here that might not make sense if you have not seen much of the show.

I am starting a new game Saturday, using the Stargate D20 (Spycraft 1.0)system. I will be using the Kingmaker adventure path as the basis for the adventure and Golarion as the setting. Basically the PCs are the lead team in a new City of the Ancients similar to Atlantis named Camelot.

The whole history of Golarion is fitting in perfectly with the premise so far. The Azlanti were wiped out (fled) from Golarion about 10,000 years ago during Earthfall, which is right in line with the show. One last Azlanti remained and was basically a god (Aroden) and then he raised the Starstone and "ascended". Then other people use this same method to ascend to Godhood. Some good some evil.

Why I am posting is because I am having trouble with the main over-arching villain race. I am thinking so far that the Fey will probably be both the bad guys and the good guys, because of factions within the "race". I know there are good fey and bad so this sounds like it will work, but there seems to be very little official information on them, either Pathfinder or 3.5

I am also thinking the fey will actually be the the never seen member of the alliance of the 4 great races from SG1 the Furlings. Right now the basic history is that that Ancients traveled to the Furlings galaxy and they conflicted with the evil Furlings "fey" while the good Furlings formed an alliance with the Ancients. The 2 races then travel to the Milky Way galaxy where the good furling flourish for a while and form the alliance of the 4 great races with the Ancients, the Furlings, the Nox, and the Asgard.

Does anybody have any suggestions for reference material? or maybe just wants to throw in their 2 cents and riff on the Stargate/D&D idea. Any ideas would be appreciated. Also looking to get a bit more of a technology angle worked in


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I mentioned this in another Stargate-Golarion thread: elven wights as the Wraith (particularly if one makes wights with class levels as per Libris Mortis [WotC, 3.5]. Of course, that name can be rather misleading when mashing up PF and Stargate!


My first thought was that fey would not make sense then i looked deeper and came up with this

The Four Great Races

The Ancients = Humans or possibly Elves. Aasimar would also suit them well allowing for a "celestial" bloodline feat to be taken at first level to allow for people like o'neal with ancient blood

The Asgard = Dwarves structured society, good at making ships and weapons, links to norse mythology

The Nox = Either Elves if the Ancients are human or Halflings due to plant abilities and stealh :)

The Furlings = That leaves gnomes who are fey in origin the only technology that we have seen from the series is the touchstone (weather control) and a teleportation portal both of which can fit in the fey concept well.

I'd suggest using the evil outsiders as the main bad's however as they give you a huge variety of bad guys in one handy catagory becoming an almost infinite number with the half fiend and fiendish templates, also the DR they posses will somewhat offset guns and other modern weapons


Oh, I forgot to mention that this is essentially after the SGI and Atlantis series take place and still in the Stargate "Canon". Late in the show on SGI they began to introduce Arthurian Myth, but they did not ever really do much with it. So I thought it would make a good starting point for a new "series". Basically Dr. Jacksons research turns up information on a new Ancient city.

In short Merlin (from SGI season 10) was an Ancient and he went with the rest of them when they left earth for the Pegasus galaxy. Then when he was approaching the end of his Looong life he decided to live out the rest of his days among the nobles of King Arthur's court. Where he built the weapon that could kill ascended beings (that is all from the show). I am adding that he goes back to the Furlings galaxy hoping to setup a safe base to prepare for the battle with the Ori (evil ascended ancients).

This setup gives me a believable reason for how Golarion is so much like medieval Europe. As Merlin brought some of his Knights of the Round Table back with him (Round Table=Stargate)

So I cant use the wraith (been done). and I don't want to reassign the four great races as D&D races (except the Fey). Just like the other shows there would be very little left of the Ancients. So I don'y need to worry about that.

Thanks for the input. What I really need is some resource material on Fey so I can see how well they will wedge into my ideas.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

For villain races you can't go wrong with Drow, possibly with Aboleths as the even bigger baddie. You don't have to copy EVERYTHING from Stargate after all. And you don't even have to introduce the drow until the players have worked through thier Human front men.


Why not try something new... What about Morlocks, but jack up there INT to 2d6+6. Then have them as the second races of descendent's of Atlantis.

While the Ancients evolved into higher life forms. The Morlocks, were mutated by the disease that plagued there race. Now deformed, and twisted with hate for those that left them, they are now on the rise.

With Morlocks once again becoming more advance, buy relearning the technology that was left behind, they have begun to spread as a wave of destruction.

.........

Drow and Aboleths been done a thousands times.... BORING.


Doppelganger, Aasimar, Efreeti, Tengu, Tiefling, Lizardfolk, & Boggard
are all great "Alien" like Races as well as MindFlair in 3.5.

As far as Fey have seen the new BesTiary 2 there is like 13 new fey bring fey total to 18.

The Exchange

JSIN668 wrote:


Why I am posting is because I am having trouble with the main over-arching villain race. I am thinking so far that the Fey will probably be both the bad guys and the good guys, because of factions within the "race". I know there are good fey and bad so this sounds like it will work, but there seems to be very little official information on them, either Pathfinder or 3.5

I actually think that you are good-to-go. You have a solid concept and having 'Fey' as a group of which the Furlings (as members of the alliance) were a subset gives you free reign to have all different kinds of fey with different powers, inclinations, and motivations. In the same way that the original show had a range of different Goa'uld to use as the story needed.

The 4 races had a distinct policy of non-interference. Perhaps the Furlings instigated this because of the actions of the evil fey. Taking the Gnomes of Golarion as a seed idea, lets presume that the Furlings are the survivors of a previous universe, a more primal, wild and energetic one. They discover that in this one they slowly lose their vital essence. When the younger races arise, they find that they can stir them to wild, reckless, destructive action and syphon off their emotion, fuelling themselves but at a dreadful cost to the youngsters. The Furling subrace of the Fey become horrified by this and take action to protect the younger races by forming the alliance.

There are a vast number of classic literature references to fey. Take an iconic example of each: pixies, leprechauns, faeries, etc. and distill them down to a key concept that encapsulates them. Then define a villain with those concepts and make them the leader of that subrace of Fey. You then have minor Fey of that type acting as the Jaffa for that Goa'uld.

PS: Further confirmation that you are on to a winner of an idea. My wife (for whom I run an SG campaign came in and I asked if I could read something to her. I read your post and then started on the reply I had drafted. "Wait," she said. "I thought you had written that. It sounded really cool - you had me all excited for 30 seconds."


Thanks for the input everyone.

Brock, I really like your ideas. You really seem to "get" where I am coming from on this. I definitely will incorporate that idea about the bleaching being a result of their not being originally from this "time/space" and siphoning their power from the lesser members of their "race" who then use humans to regain their own "essence". Very Interesting, thankfully I don't think I will have to do is mention them obscurely for a while.

Oliver McShade, Devolved Ancients, This I think will use on a some isolated planet somewhere. That would be really good for a a short period of time I think. It does bring up another problem I have had with campaign development so far. No Stargate travel. Since I am using the Kingmaker Adventure Path we will be staying local for a while in the "Stolen Land" area, and that is exactly what I want for now, but if the players are interested in continuing, and I think they will be, I will continue the game in whatever direction it goes (hoping to use more premade adventure).

Ultimately a Stargate game should make use of the gate itself. During my Golarion research I read about the Elf Gates that the Elves used to "travel to their homeland/world". their is also some speculation that the elves are a derivative of the fey themselves. The Elf gates however seem to transport you to a specific location rather than any where. The Ancients had already invented the Stargate before leaving their home galaxy. So they elves may have learned to build their limited version of the Stargate from them. Also this would mean that the Elves and the Ancients were allies (Hmm if they are fey, maybe they are the furlings, not sure). There is a place called the steaming sea in NW part of the map of Golarion, where masked grey elves speak fluent Azlanti and guard an old outpost/building/base with their 'flying skimmers'.

The only other place I found that relates to the Stargate so far was somewhere near the worldwound something about a circle of portals. I have been researching all day and I can't find it again, but that sounded like my best bet to get them into gate travel (after Kingmaker). If anyone know the place I am talking about please post it.

Tom S 820, thanks a bunch for the list of fey that will be very helpful


My only question is how do you make a StarGate

Gate spell = Does not allow travel in same plane.
Greater Teleport = Does not allow travel between planes.
Function = Works more like a Dimension Door spell

So would you need to make the magic item be required to have all three spells (Gate, Greater Teleport, and Dimension Door). for its construction.


Teleportation circle? Even the name fits the shape ;)
Only standing vertical instead of horizontal and with epic level boost to reach interstellar distances (which is beyond teleportation circle maximum distance, I think).

Which is a bit of void as OP said that he is using Stargate D20 which is a bit different system.


Evil Furling for some reason make me think of links to Lycanthropes :)

However looking from a science standpoint the ancients have very "magical" technology, the Asgard have very mechanical technology, the Nox have what i would call Biotech so i would look at doing them as gene splicers who twist creatures into new and more useful shapes to serve their purposes. This would give you access to all sorts of "monsters" with a reasonable stargatey theme and the remaining dark furlings could be things with genomes [gnomes hehe]so twisted each is now a unique monster/entity with possibly a race of degenrate spawn. So for instance one of them may be a unique "manticore of legend" with true manticores being it's lesser ofspring


Drejk wrote:

Teleportation circle? Even the name fits the shape ;)

Only standing vertical instead of horizontal and with epic level boost to reach interstellar distances (which is beyond teleportation circle maximum distance, I think).

Which is a bit of void as OP said that he is using Stargate D20 which is a bit different system.

Ah... but that works as a Greater Teleport. Does not allow travel between planes.

So Teleportation circle + Gate spell for needed spells for the magic item?


there is a spell from another module that should help....

Interplanetary Teleport
Source Pathfinder #14 p54
Level cleric 9, sorcerer/wizard 9, travel 9

Description
This spell functions as teleport, save that there is truly no range limit and you do not need to have seen your destination, though you must have a solid grasp of which world you wish to travel to. If you have a specific location on a planet in mind, you arrive there without a chance of failure, otherwise you arrive at a location that would not immediately be life-threatening. If no such safe landing zone exists on the world, such as someone attempting to travel into the sun without the proper precautions in place, the spell simply fails.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Oliver McShade wrote:

My only question is how do you make a StarGate

Gate spell = Does not allow travel in same plane.
Greater Teleport = Does not allow travel between planes.
Function = Works more like a Dimension Door spell

So would you need to make the magic item be required to have all three spells (Gate, Greater Teleport, and Dimension Door). for its construction.

The beautiful point is with ancient artifacts is that you never have to answer that question save for the reliable stock answer. "It was made by the Ancients, through means now lost to us." That probably is the best definition of a true Artifact, a magical device or item not makeable by standard rules.

That's how it's worked in the series, while the heroes may figure out how to operate the Stargates, no one alive knows how to make one any more.


LazarX wrote:
Oliver McShade wrote:

My only question is how do you make a StarGate

Gate spell = Does not allow travel in same plane.
Greater Teleport = Does not allow travel between planes.
Function = Works more like a Dimension Door spell

So would you need to make the magic item be required to have all three spells (Gate, Greater Teleport, and Dimension Door). for its construction.

The beautiful point is with ancient artifacts is that you never have to answer that question save for the reliable stock answer. "It was made by the Ancients, through means now lost to us." That probably is the best definition of a true Artifact, a magical device or item not makeable by standard rules.

That's how it's worked in the series, while the heroes may figure out how to operate the Stargates, no one alive knows how to make one any more.

The down side to artifacts, is that if players can not make them, i do not allow them in my games.

Have this rule, what the players can do, the GM can do, what the Player can not do, then the GM can not do..... This applies to creating magic items, what spells creature can learn, feats, skills, etc.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

here's the other Stargate thread I started. Might give you some ideas there.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Oliver McShade wrote:
LazarX wrote:
Oliver McShade wrote:

My only question is how do you make a StarGate

Gate spell = Does not allow travel in same plane.
Greater Teleport = Does not allow travel between planes.
Function = Works more like a Dimension Door spell

So would you need to make the magic item be required to have all three spells (Gate, Greater Teleport, and Dimension Door). for its construction.

The beautiful point is with ancient artifacts is that you never have to answer that question save for the reliable stock answer. "It was made by the Ancients, through means now lost to us." That probably is the best definition of a true Artifact, a magical device or item not makeable by standard rules.

That's how it's worked in the series, while the heroes may figure out how to operate the Stargates, no one alive knows how to make one any more.

The down side to artifacts, is that if players can not make them, i do not allow them in my games.

Have this rule, what the players can do, the GM can do, what the Player can not do, then the GM can not do..... This applies to creating magic items, what spells creature can learn, feats, skills, etc.

You and me come from different schools of thought, I'm heavily influenced by my time AWAY from D+D where I took a ten year absence from the game (skipping 2nd and 2.5 edition entirely) and experimented with other games like Ars Magica, White Wolf, and Amber. I don't see a problem with NPC's especially fantastic or long dead ones having access to tricks the PC's can't ever duplicate, especially if those tricks are of the following categories.

1. Acts of gods or other powerful divine beings.

2. Relics of fallen civilisastions from the Age of Great Magic... Nethril, Ancient Suel, The Kaldorei empire of the Pre-Sundering, etc.

If the PC's don't automatically have access or eventual access to every magical trick that exists.... that leaves room for mystery. This is actually mandatory if you're looking to have a campaign that has that Stargate type of atmosphere. In World of Warcraft, Titan relics are that much more fantastic simply because they can't be duplicated by either the most clever mage, or the most gifted gnome tinker.

That's the thing about Artifacts, they should be unique, and if they're lost, they're lost for all time, because the can't be duplicated. Would Stormbringer be Stormbringer if you could set up a production line of them?

I feel that this is even more important in Pathfinder because of the extreme ease of magic item construction as compared to D+D.


I did not say that player had to have access to everything.

I said that player had to have some way to gain access to everything at some point in the game, even if this is near the end like 20th level.

......

Stargate

They started off with a gate they did not understand.

By end of series:

They had build there own space ships
Sarcophagus could be build
Had trade and understand Asgard Shield and Beaming Telnoolgy
They understood How Stargate worked (well for the most part), aka could fix, work on, change there programing, etc.

.......

Which lead back to me saying, I want rules on how magic items are built. The, oh this is Artifact, is just a cop out, and as a player i dislike, as a GM i will not dump on my players.

This goes back to cowboy and Indians, i am looking for a game system, that provide the rules for everyone, both player and DM alike follow.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Oliver McShade wrote:

I did not say that player had to have access to everything.

I said that player had to have some way to gain access to everything at some point in the game, even if this is near the end like 20th level.

......

Stargate

They started off with a gate they did not understand.

By end of series:

They had build there own space ships
Sarcophagus could be build
Had trade and understand Asgard Shield and Beaming Telnoolgy
They understood How Stargate worked (well for the most part), aka could fix, work on, change there programing, etc.

.......

Which lead back to me saying, I want rules on how magic items are built. The, oh this is Artifact, is just a cop out, and as a player i dislike, as a GM i will not dump on my players.

This goes back to cowboy and Indians, i am looking for a game system, that provide the rules for everyone, both player and DM alike follow.

There were still things that they could not even begin to comprehend. Such as actually building Stargates.

The fundamental disagreement I have is with your first statement, I think that no matter how high and powerful the hero rises there should always be that which is beyond his reach. To again take the show as an example, even after his Ascension, Peter Jackson the doctor with the Brainy Specs, still could not build a Stargate. And with the death of the Asgardians, no one else in the galaxy could either.

Do you believe that everything should be able to be put on a production table then? Assembly line Stormbringers, and Maces of Cuthbert? It's not a coput to call something an artifact it's just an acknowledgement that it's beyond your character's reach to create and will always be so.


I don't think the show ever indicated that the Asgard were capable of building a Gate.

Apparently the Ancients have gads of seed ships (SG-Universe) cruising the universe planting gates every which way. I wonder if they are automatically constructed on board the seed ship. seems like it would be more efficient to build them on the ship as they go rather than build them all ahead of time.

That's the closest I can think of to any info on actually building gates.

I think for the purposes of my game it will still be beyond the scope of the players abilities (even at level 20) unless someone specifically wanted to start gearing their character toward that (which I "might" discourage)

FYI the game got delayed due to a rash of illness, so I haven't had the first session yet

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Lazar, JSIN668,

The Tolan were able to build a gate "Ours is bigger" - Jack O'Neill. I'd assume the Asgard could as well.

Universe's seed ships did build their gates on board.

Oh, and it's Daniel Jackson. Though Peter Jackson can't build gates either. He does direct movies though :-)

Some other thoughts. You may want to 'mask' the Gates with terms the players won't associate. "Well of Worlds" is the term I used once

Spoiler:

The grey box hinted that the Realms and Earth were once tightly connected, which is why our legends show up as their monsters. Over time the worlds drifted apart and that's why the Realms were 'Forgotten'. I had an abortive campaign, stealling from Dragon #100's "Land beyond the gate" where the party needed the 9 keys to access the 'well of worlds' to retrieve the McGuffin. They'd only gotten one key, a statue of a pegasus, when the game collapsed. Eventually they were going to find 8 'keys' and make it to the island where the well was, and the 9th 'key' would be engraved on the floor in front of the well/stargate. The players had no clue, and I was expecting things to be thrown at me. The 9th chevron was to 'jump' between the Realms and our world. I was going to have them arrive in the antartic, get the McGuffin, go back to the gate, only to find out that it was gone. Then an effort to find the gate (or break into Cheyene Mountain) would ensue...

The Exchange

Matthew Morris wrote:

Lazar, JSIN668,

The Tolan were able to build a gate "Ours is bigger" - Jack O'Neill. I'd assume the Asgard could as well.

Universe's seed ships did build their gates on board.

Oh, and it's Daniel Jackson. Though Peter Jackson can't build gates either. He does direct movies though :-)

Some other thoughts. You may want to 'mask' the Gates with terms the players won't associate. "Well of Worlds" is the term I used once
** spoiler omitted **

I thought Universe would touch on it but not quite yet. Each Seed ship encountered would be progressivly younger as the oldest ships sent out first are less advanced, and they fail first. So the SGU Team encounter newer and newer ships until their vessel either takes the lead, or falls in behind the most advanced vessels still ahead of them.

So by Gating into the Destiny they have already skipped over a number of older more primitive vessels that may have failed due to inferior tech and old design and age.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
yellowdingo wrote:


I thought Universe would touch on it but not quite yet.

More likely, not ever. the show's been spiked due to low ratings. It has been so far the weakest show in the SG franchise.

The Exchange

LazarX wrote:
yellowdingo wrote:


I thought Universe would touch on it but not quite yet.

More likely, not ever. the show's been spiked due to low ratings. It has been so far the weakest show in the SG franchise.

They marketed it wrong. It is the first SG with an international selection of actors - all of whom seem to be made the bad guys or victims as the writers cull the non-Americans from the passenger list.

They needed to market SGU to the various Commonwealth Nations first...something that requires a more intelligent and ethical storyline rather than this list of self serving 'convicts on a prison barge' who wouldnt qualify for Canadian Citizenship let alone SGC service.

It could have given them the income to sustain and develop it for the US market.

But as D&D setting with Some degree of interest. The vile selection of crew seem ideal for a descent into Madness and depravity. So have chloe become Warlord of Galaxy 10...

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Either way though the general point of contention is that some feel that any item that there are those who feel that any item that's in the game should be ultimately able to be reverse-engineered and duplicated by player characters, whereas I define Artifacts as items that break the rules and can't be duplicated by definition. Some see the latter as a copout, I see it as thematically appropriate as I see the rules as a sprinboard not the ultimate and endall definers of story.


I don't recall the Tolan "building" a gate, but let's assume that you are right, and they could do it.

They got wiped out very early on in the SG1 series. So that puts it right back to no one having the technical capacity to actually buid a gate except a "descended" Ancient (like the one that fell in love with Dr. Carter). That was the only time I ever remember anyone building a gate.


I am a big fan of Stargate the movie, Stargate SG-1, Stargate Atlantis.

To be honest, i dropped my subscription on hulu for Stargate Universe.

Just got tired of being disappointed by the actors, and bad store lines.... I kind of wish they flush the whole lot out the air lock, and gate a whole new cast, were everyone works together vs against each other.

.......

The Tolen, Ancients, Ori, and Ancient Replicators (SG Atlatis) could all build gates.

The Terran (earth), Asgard, Nox, Gauold, plus a few other, learned to Fix, repair, jury-rig, and Re-programs Stargate.

.......

Ya when i first say the movie stargate, first think that came to my mind was Well or Worlds D&D magic item :)


OK, I'm still confused why everyone was hung up on planar travel.


I got nothin' but I am thankful that anyone is willing to riff on some Stargate D20 ideas.


JSIN668 wrote:


I am starting a new game Saturday, using the Stargate D20 (Spycraft 1.0)system. I will be using the Kingmaker adventure path as the basis for the adventure and Golarion as the setting. Basically the PCs are the lead team in a new City of the Ancients similar to Atlantis named Camelot.

This sounds like an EXCELLENT idea for a campaign! I'm going through Kingmaker currently, and you might be interested to know about Sevenarches, a community *inside the River Kingdoms* with what are rumored to be ancient, extremely powerful elf gates, and an active portal to the First World (realm of the Fey). This would be a simple, nearby plot hook if you're interested!

Best of luck running the campaign, and let us know how it turns out!

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