Wand Rules Question


Rules Questions


Can a ranger use a wand that is a second level ranger spell if he can currently only cast first level spells? What if he doesn't have a high enough wisdom to cast second level spells?

I've read under use magic device where it says it normally needs to be on their spell list, but my DM thinks they need to be able to currently cast it as well and I'm looking for clarification.

Thanks!


You can use wands as long as the spell is on your list and you have the possibility of ever casting it.

So a first level Paladin could use a wand with a third level Paladin spell on it. There is no mention of minimum ability scores in the wand section so that should not matter IMO.


It just needs to be on the list and he can use it. Level doesn't matter, wisdom doesn't matter. The wisdom rule is for scrolls.

So yes, if you have a druid in your party who's willing to craft wands you can play a ranger with all the self preservation instinct of a lemming.

Dark Archive

this also goes for sorcerers. If the spell is on the class spell list, even if it is not on the sorcerer's personal known list, they can still use the wand.


Thanks everybody!

Lantern Lodge

That is broken. If i am a ranger and can't cast a spell before the third level what is the possible justification for using a wand? At first and second levels you could be training to cast a particular spell, but hey no matter, just by signing up to be a ranger lets me use a wand. Why not take on level of cleric, one level of magic user and then become a fighter who now can use every wand or scroll in the game?

I am playing a sorcerer for the first time, so a couple of third level players, buy up some wands, and since he can use other peoples items during the course of a module, he now becomes a caster only limited by what his cronies can buy and hold for him.

This game has been outstanding in avoiding all the the rules that broke all previous "living" games. Why ruin it now with this kind of broken. BS. I mean a wand with 50 charges for someone who can't even cast a spell is insane.


I appreciate you stating your opinion Norm, but is it really necessary to do so on every thread about this topic?

Do you really see 1-3 level spells being used by 2 more classes is really going to break PFS? If you do I would love to hear how to better educate myself of potential pitfalls.


Norm Roth wrote:
That is broken. If i am a ranger and can't cast a spell before the third level what is the possible justification for using a wand? At first and second levels you could be training to cast a particular spell, but hey no matter, just by signing up to be a ranger lets me use a wand. Why not take on level of cleric, one level of magic user and then become a fighter who now can use every wand or scroll in the game?

I have to disagree too Norm. Sure, a 1st level Ranger could get a wand with a spell on his list and use it, but how is that going to break the game? The wand will have limited charges, even 50 will run out, and depending on the caster level it will not be cheap. Wands don't grow on trees, and even if a party member makes one it is going to take time, resources, and if I recall correctly XP to make one. If your munchkin-gamer took a triple-class character like that the DM could easily counter by making wands really scarce in loot, and even making the base materials for constructing them hard to get. To say nothing of the penalties for being multi-classed.

Dark Archive

Norm Roth wrote:
Why not take on level of cleric, one level of magic user and then become a fighter who now can use every wand or scroll in the game?

that is a nice hit on the BAB for some wands, go for it!

Say a 1st level fighter takes his next level in Cleric, and then a level in Wizard. At this point, he is a 3rd level character with a +1 BAB (same as a 3rd level wizard). Sure, they can use almost any 1st - 3rd level wand in the game (would need to take a level of bard and a level of druid to use 99% of them, at a bigger cost in bab), but as a fighter they are behind. They now pretty much have to use the wands to buff themselves to keep up.

If you took all the casting classes (druid, bard, cleric, and wizard) and then went fighter, at 5th level, you would have a bab of +1! Congratulations, the Sorc/Wizard will be hitting more often in melee/ranged then you (with their bab of +2 by 5th level).

Also, this only covers wands. Scrolls can blow up in your face if you try to use one at a greater level then you can cast.

Lantern Lodge

That is fine in a home game, but what about organized play?


Norm Roth wrote:
That is fine in a home game, but what about organized play?

what about it? the rules as written fully support rangers and paladins of below 4th level being able to use wands of any spell on their lists. Since organized play tends to stick close to the RAW, there should be no problem with it.

Shadow Lodge

So Rangers and Paladins (the only classes where this is relevant) casting spells wands at low levels is 'broken'? Why? Why is it less broken in the hands of a cleric? Or a rogue using UMD?

FWIW it was the same in 3.5.

Silver Crusade

Think wands are bad read staves.

Grand Lodge

Norm Roth wrote:
I am playing a sorcerer for the first time, so a couple of third level players, buy up some wands, and since he can use other peoples items during the course of a module, he now becomes a caster only limited by what his cronies can buy and hold for him.

A third level character in PFS can have a maximum of 22 PA, and probably much less, which caps the items he can buy at 8,000gp. He can only get a third level wand from a chronicle sheet. Also, why would your fellow player spend most of his gold on a wand for you rather than a +2 weapon or +3 armour for himself?

After one session, these cronies of yours will be 4th level, so if you're in the same session you'll be a 1st level sorcerer playing a tier 4-5 module. Many encounters could kill you outright in one hit. Some could kill you outright if you make your save.

More generally, you'll find in organised play you can't depend on other people to make your character effective.

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