Is there any counter to scent, blindsight, or tremor sense?


Advice

Scarab Sages

Are there any items, magics, or techniques that can allow a rogue to hide when the enemy has these abilities?


Mcarvin wrote:
Are there any items, magics, or techniques that can allow a rogue to hide when the enemy has these abilities?

For 3.5 there is the Nightstalker feat from WOTC: Lords of Madness. It allows you to use Stealth vs. Blind & Tremor Sense. They are hard to get around that is for sure. For Scent I believe there are some alchemical items that mask it for a day or so.


Mcarvin wrote:
Are there any items, magics, or techniques that can allow a rogue to hide when the enemy has these abilities?

Nothing in PF. This came up in another thread about a week ago.


Flight counters tremor Sense. Silence will also counter blind sight/sense based on sound.

Otherwise, I know there are some feats out there from some of the 3.5 material that helped to counter these types of things.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Mcarvin wrote:
Are there any items, magics, or techniques that can allow a rogue to hide when the enemy has these abilities?

APG has an anti-scent spell.

Sovereign Court

Well scent is reasonably subjective to the wind and other outside factors as well as having I believe a few counters in the Adventurers' Armory.

Tremor sense can easily be defeated by....umm...oh! Taking 3 levels of Cave Druid and getting the Lightfoot Class ability. Druid/Rogue, surely that's not the oddest class combination out there.

Scarab Sages

thanks for the suggestions guys... I like straight rogue so i won't be dipping to get lightfooted however i'll have to check out the adventure armory and getting other misc. items to help it seems. boots of flying and some sort of silence for myself.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Mcarvin wrote:
thanks for the suggestions guys... I like straight rogue so i won't be dipping to get lightfooted however i'll have to check out the adventure armory and getting other misc. items to help it seems. boots of flying and some sort of silence for myself.

Don't forget ranks in UMD and scrolls/wands of useful spells as counters are a valid option.

Sovereign Court

Boots of levitation, winged boots and horseshoes of the zephyr can defeat tremor sense. As stated above, flight beats tremor sense.

The negate aroma spell from the APG deals well with scent.

Blind sight/sense are difficult to beat because of the non-specific why it is describe. Other then sonar effects and silence it is pretty hard to do without.

Though I have never understood that because to sonar having a silence zone move towards you is like a sighted person seeing deeper darkness moving towards them. It is blatantly obvious there is an area that we can't see into.


Mcarvin wrote:
Are there any items, magics, or techniques that can allow a rogue to hide when the enemy has these abilities?

There is a feat in the APG for scent.

Normally there is a distance on the range of blindsight, stay away.

And flying/being off the ground works for tremor sense.

-James


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path Subscriber

gaseous form

Well, except for scent. That one you'll need something like ethereal jaunt.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32

Doctor Smite wrote:


Blind sight/sense are difficult to beat because of the non-specific why it is describe. Other then sonar effects and silence it is pretty hard to do without.

Though I have never understood that because to sonar having a silence zone move towards you is like a sighted person seeing deeper darkness moving towards them. It is blatantly obvious there is an area that we can't see into.

Begin physics:

Sonar is a bit different than sight here. The important thing to know is that sonar uses sound emitted from the creature, whereas we see light from other sources. Imagine being in a dark room with a flashlight - you can get a decent picture of the layout of the room by shining your light around, but if there is an area where the wall is too far away, that region will just seem to suck up the light. Now if you lived in a world with magical darkness, you wouldn't be able to tell if that area was magically dark, or just has distant walls. Silence to sonar would be like that - it would seem like any objects in the silence were too far away to sense. An intelligent creature using sonar might conclude something was screwy if walls or previously sensed objects suddenly started "disappearing."

End physics derail. Sorry, compulsive teacher at times.


For scent you have to be aware of prevailing winds, or create your own. Being downwind of the opponent in any sort of breeze should at least count as enough concealment to allow a stealth check, while something as simple as wind wall should block scent from passing either direction across it, as it specifically says that gases cannot pass through. Alchemists should also be able to whip up something to overload the sense of smell as well, like oil of peppermint, essentially "deafening" the ability for some period of time.


bittergeek wrote:
For scent you have to be aware of prevailing winds, or create your own. Being downwind of the opponent in any sort of breeze should at least count as enough concealment to allow a stealth check,

Scent, at best pinpoints the square but does not let you observe the individual.

So you certainly would have concealment.. the full, upgraded version.

Likewise blindsense doesn't let you observe the target, rather it just tells the person what square they are in.

-James


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Dust Form, and other spells/effects granting incorporeal form.

"An incorporeal creature moves silently and cannot be heard with Perception checks if it doesn’t wish to be. It has no Strength score, so its Dexterity modifier applies to its melee attacks, ranged attacks, and CMB. Nonvisual senses, such as scent and blindsight, are either ineffective or only partly effective with regard to incorporeal creatures."

If you want to be really sneaky, just ditch your physical body.

Teleport works too


Do you think folks were waiting nine years for that advice?


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Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

Imagine how relieved they must be, nine years later. <g>


Scent: There is a level 1 Ranger Spell called Negate Aroma. It makes you inosmible.

Blindsense and Blind Fighting: The Dirty Tricks Combat Maneuver can be used to make your opponents Deaf as well as Blind.

Tremorsensse: Fly

Remember also that neither Tremorsense nor Scent negate Blindness nor Invisibility. Those abilities let you locate the Invisible Rogue, but that's all. The Rogue still enjoys Total Concealment. The target still does not get Dex Mod to AC. The Rogue still gets Sneak Attack Damage.

Wheldrake wrote:
Imagine how relieved they must be, nine years later. <g>

meh, people still keep asking basic rules questions. It's probably still relevant.

Grand Lodge

If someone asked a question about the topic, it would be a plausible cause for a necroposting. Giving an opinion nine years later though is more problematic because it invites questions about the off-timing. It's still probably relevant, but because of that, that's weird.

The Exchange

Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I used this pull ring of scent since it’s an animal archive item I got gm approval first. Add mindblank for added fun.


Flying (or otherwise not in contact with the ground/surface) while under the spell Pass without Trace will block both Tremorsense and Scent. Depending on how the Blindsight works it may stop or reduce its effectiveness as well (DM's judgement).

The Exchange

The Feat: Go to Dampen Presence You may use the Stealth skill to hide from any creature attempting to perceive you using blindsight or blindsense, even if you are clearly in that creature’s perceptual field. This feat does not confer any advantages against other forms of perception, such as scent, vision, or tremorsense.

The Item: Skulking Sniper’s Blowgun. A skulking sniper’s blowgun is crafted of fine hardwood that shifts color between brown and dark green under different lights. The wielder of this +3 distance greater sniping blowgun isn’t automatically detected by tremorsense, blindsense, blindsight, or similar supernatural senses while she’s attempting to move unnoticed. Creatures with these abilities must attempt a Perception check opposed by the wielder’s Stealth check to notice the wielder. Such a creature gains a +10 bonus on this Perception check if the wielder is within half the maximum range of the sense ability. The wielder can still be detected by other senses (such as vision, hearing, or smell) as normal.


Blind Spot Vigilante Talent (gained through Stalker Advanced Talent). You are not auto detected and enemies get +20 perception for every sense you are not avoiding another way.

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