Way of the poison fist. Aka flurry of fort saves.


Rules Questions


Is there anything stopping a monk immune to poison from using injury toxin on their fists?

Would a contact poison be a better choice?

Thinking of poison and it's not even thanksgiving.
~will


Without something like the Alchemist discovery Sticky Poison, you'd have to reapply the poison between strikes.


Gauthok wrote:
Without something like the Alchemist discovery Sticky Poison, you'd have to reapply the poison between strikes.

Between strikes or between flurries? I'm thinking of something like a toxic paste applied to hands/feet/elbows/knees/forehead/spleen et.al

Mind you application would take at least a full minute. It's an idea for a group of LE monks to use to make their first full attacks more effective.

then there is the whole question of contact poision coated armor vs. grapplers.

sigh, violence is complicated.
~will


Monks flurry shuriken to overload the Fort save bonus of their poisoning victims.

Wise monks use +3 adamantine shuriken.

In melee, however, a monk can (by slathering on enough doses of contact poison instead of injury poison) deliver a flurry of blows. The number of body parts that can be coated are: fists, elbows, knees and feet - so an 8-dose limit.


Turin the Mad wrote:

Monks flurry shuriken to overload the Fort save bonus of their poisoning victims.

Wise monks use +3 adamantine shuriken.

In melee, however, a monk can (by slathering on enough doses of contact poison instead of injury poison) deliver a flurry of blows. The number of body parts that can be coated are: fists, elbows, knees and feet - so an 8-dose limit.

I can think of one more, forehead, who doesn't love a poison headbutt.


xJoe3x wrote:
I can think of one more, forehead, who doesn't love a poison headbutt.

Vyvyan from the young ones springs to mind.

You know there may be something in this. Perhaps an amulet or something that makes all attacks poisoned.

Might be worth it even with a low dc. You got to get lucky sometime.

~will


by the time you get enough flurries the make that many attacks the available posions are such a low DC vs creatures you face they're only going to work when the creture rolls low 1-2's

and when you consider that its the same chance as getting a crit

so why not instead invest in a critcal like sickening critical, with 8 attacks the chances of a crit are pretty good if you keen'd to 19-20

if you instead use a keen temple sword 18-20 with 8 attacks your going to be criting almost every round.

just a thought


Pathfinder poisons work a bit differently. In a nutshell, using 8 doses of a low-cost contact poison (admittedly assuming all of them hit, but that's what the various stunning fist goodies are for) increases the save DC by 14 and increases the potential duration by a ghastly amount.

I love the 9th dose via headbutt - Haste anyone? ^_^


Turin the Mad wrote:

Pathfinder poisons work a bit differently. In a nutshell, using 8 doses of a low-cost contact poison (admittedly assuming all of them hit, but that's what the various stunning fist goodies are for) increases the save DC by 14 and increases the potential duration by a ghastly amount.

I love the 9th dose via headbutt - Haste anyone? ^_^

kinda

to apply 8 doses of poison you need to hit will ALL 8 attacks and chances are thats not going to happen on average.

also the cure condition dose not change so saving ends ALL the poisoning

realistically you may hit with 4 of those 8 attacks

so the DC goes up by +6 on average

at the level you getting 8 flurries your facing monster with big fort saves +16 or more is quite common.

and of course many high CR monsters are just outright immune to posion like devils


Granted hitting all the time is a bit much to expect and granted they will save most of the time.

But an amulet that makes all your attacks carry a dc 13 poison (as the spell) would effectively give you a new way to crit.

Sometimes you roll high and crit and sometimes they blow the save and start taking con damage. Might be woth it.

~will


PoorWanderingOne wrote:

Granted hitting all the time is a bit much to expect and granted they will save most of the time.

But an amulet that makes all your attacks carry a dc 13 poison (as the spell) would effectively give you a new way to crit.

Sometimes you roll high and crit and sometimes they blow the save and start taking con damage. Might be woth it.

~will

assuming your GM would allow such an amulet which is a big IF


Phasics wrote:
PoorWanderingOne wrote:

Granted hitting all the time is a bit much to expect and granted they will save most of the time.

But an amulet that makes all your attacks carry a dc 13 poison (as the spell) would effectively give you a new way to crit.

Sometimes you roll high and crit and sometimes they blow the save and start taking con damage. Might be woth it.

~will

assuming your GM would allow such an amulet which is a big IF

Hrmm...

100x normal dosage cost of [insert poison here] as additional material cost, add in requirements for the poison and fabricate spells ... it should work.

With various immunities, delay poison spells and the like, it is not a game breaking effect.

And it wouldn't be cheap, 1/day poison at a DC 14 warrants 6k (dagger of venom less the +1 and masterwork costs).

The other potential drawback, depending upon its construction, is that the amulet may or may not have had a command word built into it to facilitate turning the poisonous touch off ...

malyass root paste amulet 250 x100 = 25,000 - per hit it can facilitate in one round. Add a base cost of 90,000 for use-activated fabricate, reduced it to say 18k for the single-purpose ... it gets pricey fast. 1/round 43k. 8/round totals 218,000.

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