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Paizo Employee Creative Director

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ikarinokami wrote:
Would you guys ever consider putting out a book of "myths" regarding Glorion gods? maybe as part of the tales line?

We just did this to a certain extent with Inner Sea Gods.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

2 people marked this as a favorite.
j b 200 wrote:
Do you get as excited about reveling new products to us (the fans of Paizo) as we get waiting for the reveal?

Judging by the passion on these boards... we get excited, but not that excited! :-)

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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xavier c wrote:
do inevitables have emotions

Yes.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
xavier c wrote:

1)What is the best way to get a outsider cohort? do you have to go to the outer planes?

2)if you guys do a temples of the inner sea book will you make the churches of the gods joinable organization like in Occult Mysteries?

3)who was the angel that Ordellia Whilwren prayed to to save Magnimar?

1) Take Leadership as your feat, tell your GM, and your GM will figure it out for you.

2) Dunno.

3) Soralyon

Paizo Employee Creative Director

xavier c wrote:

1)why did Desna not help Count Andachi drive back the orc horde after he prayed to her several times? eventhough he worships her

2)why did Zon-Kuthon aid him after he prayed to him once? eventhough he did not worship him

3)why do gods answer some prayers and not others?

1) Who says she wasn't providing aid? She likely was, but he wasn't wise enough to figure it out.

2) Because he sensed an opportunity and struck while the proverbial iron was hot.

3) Because they move in mysterious ways, and often those who pray aren't faithful or wise or perceptive enough to understand an answered prayer if it bit them on the nose.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Desril wrote:

One more question about Nocticula.

Let's say she did ascend into divinity and neutrality, what would her Obedience be? Or would she retain her Lust domain and have the same Deific Obedience as her current Demonic Obedience?

On a different note, how many times have you played or run Rise of the Runelords? How many people has Xanesha killed in games you've been a part of?

Her obediences would change. That's about an hour of design work for me, more or less, so I'm not gonna do it until I need to.

I've never played and never run Rise of the Runelords. I've run several parts of Burnt Offerings as a playtest, but never as a whole adventure, alas... the point at whcih I was writing it was crazy busy—I was launching Pathfinder at the same time as I was finishing up the last half dozen or 8 issuses of Dungeon at the same time, after all...

Paizo Employee Creative Director

2 people marked this as a favorite.
JaC381 wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

I saw your secret message in the wrath of the righteous aventure path.so

when will we be getting this demon lord redeeming Adventure Path
When I decide the time is right.
I missed it. Could you please point out where the message is?

Bottom of the credits page, after all the legal text and the "Printed in China" bit, in every 6th AP volume.


Did you ever pick up Bound by Flame? I can grab it for a huge discount through a work program and would love an opinion on it before I did...


Do you have any suggestion on what/which entity that might be the mystery of a Time Oracle with the Neutral Good alignment?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Kairos Dawnfury wrote:
Did you ever pick up Bound by Flame? I can grab it for a huge discount through a work program and would love an opinion on it before I did...

I did. I got it for a discount via the Steam Sale and then played it for about 20 minutes and it looked good ... but then got distracted by Divinity Original Sin and other stuff. So... don't have a strong opinion yet.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Dracoknight wrote:
Do you have any suggestion on what/which entity that might be the mystery of a Time Oracle with the Neutral Good alignment?

Mysteries aren't "entities" really. And keeping them mysterious is part of the fun. I'd let your GM run with it and see what she/he comes up with.

(If it were my game, though... it'd be something involved with Brigh.)


James Jacobs wrote:
Kairos Dawnfury wrote:
Did you ever pick up Bound by Flame? I can grab it for a huge discount through a work program and would love an opinion on it before I did...
I did. I got it for a discount via the Steam Sale and then played it for about 20 minutes and it looked good ... but then got distracted by Divinity Original Sin and other stuff. So... don't have a strong opinion yet.

Is the new Divinity game good? I played a demo of the last one and couldn't get into the combat.

Edit: On looking up the game, I think I'm thinking of a different series...


James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)What is the best way to get a outsider cohort? do you have to go to the outer planes?

2)if you guys do a temples of the inner sea book will you make the churches of the gods joinable organization like in Occult Mysteries?

3)who was the angel that Ordellia Whilwren prayed to to save Magnimar?

1) Take Leadership as your feat, tell your GM, and your GM will figure it out for you.

2) Dunno.

3) Soralyon

3)he came to save Magnimar himself. he must really like Magnimar. is it rare for a god to do that.


James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why did Desna not help Count Andachi drive back the orc horde after he prayed to her several times? eventhough he worships her

2)why did Zon-Kuthon aid him after he prayed to him once? eventhough he did not worship him

3)why do gods answer some prayers and not others?

1) Who says she wasn't providing aid? She likely was, but he wasn't wise enough to figure it out.

2) Because he sensed an opportunity and struck while the proverbial iron was hot.

3) Because they move in mysterious ways, and often those who pray aren't faithful or wise or perceptive enough to understand an answered prayer if it bit them on the nose.

1)so how was she aiding him then?

3)what are some of the mysterious ways a god would answer a prayer


James, as the creative directive of the setting, can you discuss why in narrative reasoning the gods keep a fairly hands off approach to Golarion? Why is their not more defific interference?

I understand that the narrative of campaigns would then become to focused on the actions of the gods, instead of mortals (like the PCs) which would ultimately make for a poor game/story for us to play. It's fine as a myth or story to read, like Zeus killing Cronus, or the gods gifting fire to man, or whatever. But for players it sucks because you feel like a bit player in the story.

But what has actually happened between deities that the don't regularly show up and kick ass.

Did they all just literally agree (with perhaps some exceptions like Rovagug) that they would not directly intervene on the material plane after eons of destructive activity of doing so?


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Hello Mr. Jacobs!

I hope today finds you well! I have a few questions for you today.

1. I read somewhere before that you were not too keen on the Blood War between the evil outsiders back in the 3.5 days, why is that?

2. I am also curious how do the devils, demons, and daemons get along with each other? Do they stay strictly separate or are they capable of working together to kill some good outsiders?

3. Lahmashtu has stolen from the devils, killed a horseman of the apocalypse, but what do the devils and daemons do in retaliation?

4. In your homebrew game, what happened to the necromancers(the proto-runelords) that your party woke up?

5. Also what became of Xanderghul in your home game?

Thank you for your answers!

RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32

Which three Golarion deities would you use if converting Thee Faces of Evil from the Age of Worms AP?

I was thinking of Zon-Kuthon, Norgorber, and Rovagug.


1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?


1)can a outsider be terrified of a mortal? (like running away screaming scared)

what would make a outsider that terrified of a mortal anyway?

2)can a dragon be terrified of a human? and what about the human would make a dragon run away screaming

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
xavier c wrote:


2)can a dragon be terrified of a human? and what about the human would make a dragon run away screaming

The face of Alfred E. Neuman?


Are there Celestial/Inevitable/Protean equivalents to Nascent Demon Lords/Daemon Harbingers/Infernal Dukes/etc.? Do they have names yet or is that more an "If you want to include these things, you come up with names for them" idea?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Kairos Dawnfury wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Kairos Dawnfury wrote:
Did you ever pick up Bound by Flame? I can grab it for a huge discount through a work program and would love an opinion on it before I did...
I did. I got it for a discount via the Steam Sale and then played it for about 20 minutes and it looked good ... but then got distracted by Divinity Original Sin and other stuff. So... don't have a strong opinion yet.

Is the new Divinity game good? I played a demo of the last one and couldn't get into the combat.

Edit: On looking up the game, I think I'm thinking of a different series...

It's quite fun! It's really hard but in a good way. The magic and stuff really works in an interesting way with the environment. For example, poison clouds are flammable. Some monsters are tough in that they breathe out or generate clouds of poison, and if you can light them on fire, they blow up.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
xavier c wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)What is the best way to get a outsider cohort? do you have to go to the outer planes?

2)if you guys do a temples of the inner sea book will you make the churches of the gods joinable organization like in Occult Mysteries?

3)who was the angel that Ordellia Whilwren prayed to to save Magnimar?

1) Take Leadership as your feat, tell your GM, and your GM will figure it out for you.

2) Dunno.

3) Soralyon

3)he came to save Magnimar himself. he must really like Magnimar. is it rare for a god to do that.

3) It's absolutely rare... but more common for demigods to get involved than deities. You'll note, of course, that Soralyon is the god of monuments (among other things) and that Magnimar is called the "City of Monuments" and has lots of powerful magic monuments in it. That's not coincidence.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
xavier c wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why did Desna not help Count Andachi drive back the orc horde after he prayed to her several times? eventhough he worships her

2)why did Zon-Kuthon aid him after he prayed to him once? eventhough he did not worship him

3)why do gods answer some prayers and not others?

1) Who says she wasn't providing aid? She likely was, but he wasn't wise enough to figure it out.

2) Because he sensed an opportunity and struck while the proverbial iron was hot.

3) Because they move in mysterious ways, and often those who pray aren't faithful or wise or perceptive enough to understand an answered prayer if it bit them on the nose.

1)so how was she aiding him then?

3)what are some of the mysterious ways a god would answer a prayer

1) Unrevealed. And not the point of his story, really.

3) Omens, dreams, portents, luck (bad or good). Inner Sea Gods lists lots of ways the gods can show their favor or disfavor.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

1 person marked this as a favorite.
Claxon wrote:

James, as the creative directive of the setting, can you discuss why in narrative reasoning the gods keep a fairly hands off approach to Golarion? Why is their not more defific interference?

I understand that the narrative of campaigns would then become to focused on the actions of the gods, instead of mortals (like the PCs) which would ultimately make for a poor game/story for us to play. It's fine as a myth or story to read, like Zeus killing Cronus, or the gods gifting fire to man, or whatever. But for players it sucks because you feel like a bit player in the story.

But what has actually happened between deities that the don't regularly show up and kick ass.

Did they all just literally agree (with perhaps some exceptions like Rovagug) that they would not directly intervene on the material plane after eons of destructive activity of doing so?

Yeah. It's primarily for the same reason we don't have a huge number of high level, powerful, good guy NPCs. Because the job of being the heroes of Golarion is the job of the player characters. And if the gods took a more active role in protecting Golarion... then it becomes more us telling the story of the world, rather than your characters telling the story of the world.

If we were developing Golarion as a shared world for novels or video games or the like, for a genre that removes a lot of the player's control as world shaping and world-saving... perhaps we would have taken a different tack.

The Deities DO show up to kick ass... but more so in the history, not the present. So you have things like Sarenrae and Asmodeus and the others teaming up to defeat Rovaggug. Aroden coming in to defeat Deskari. Desna invading the Abyss to avenge the death of a favored worshiper. And so on. Stuff that happened in the past, not the present, where the PCs do that job.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

3 people marked this as a favorite.
Generic GM wrote:

Hello Mr. Jacobs!

I hope today finds you well! I have a few questions for you today.

1. I read somewhere before that you were not too keen on the Blood War between the evil outsiders back in the 3.5 days, why is that?

2. I am also curious how do the devils, demons, and daemons get along with each other? Do they stay strictly separate or are they capable of working together to kill some good outsiders?

3. Lahmashtu has stolen from the devils, killed a horseman of the apocalypse, but what do the devils and daemons do in retaliation?

4. In your homebrew game, what happened to the necromancers(the proto-runelords) that your party woke up?

5. Also what became of Xanderghul in your home game?

Thank you for your answers!

1) Because it shifts the primary interest and compelling story reasons for fiends to be fighting other fiends, rather than letting them focus on fighting mortals, aka fighting the PCs. The Blood War made PCs a distraction to the story rather than the focus. But also, with Pathifnder, abandoning that concept allowed us to not step on intellectual property of Wizards of the Coast while also building up our OWN intellectual property.

2) They don't always get along, but in most cases they're not 100% antagonistic. There are exceptions. Qlippoth, for example, hate demons... but even then, that element is set up in a way to involve the PCs and mortals—the qlippoth hope that by wiping out mortals with the free will to sin that they can wipe out demons, who NEED sin to be created. But for the most part, fiends tend to stick to their own. You can have a devil working with a demon if the story is compelling; there's nothing hard-wired into our canon to prevent that... but it's not the norm.

3) Turns out, Lamashtu's kind of a bad-ass, and retaliation against her is something that the devils and daemons HAVE tried, and been defeated.

4) There were 5 of them in all. The 5th one, the leader of the old empire, was named Cyrus, and the PCs defeated him. We didn't include him in Pathfinder at all because his name is, today, compromised by Miley Cyrus's fame, of course—that wasn't an issue for me two decades ago. The other four necromancers (Belimarius, Krune, Nocticula, and Janus) all established their own new nations throughout the world. (Nocticula ended up being something entirely different in Pathifnder, and there's no Janus at all since his name is stolen from a Roman god and I didn't want to do that in Golarion.)

5) Xanderghul wasn't a necromancer in my game. He was a powerful paladin who fell from grace and was corrupted by Obox-ob into the most powerful death knight in my setting. He ended up getting a shot at redemption during the PCs' war against Cyrus and was slain after managing to atone for all the misdeeds he did; his sidekick, Karzoug, became more powerful and was put down by a different group during a trip to Baba Yaga's hut.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Ross Byers wrote:

Which three Golarion deities would you use if converting Thee Faces of Evil from the Age of Worms AP?

I was thinking of Zon-Kuthon, Norgorber, and Rovagug.

Sounds good to me! I'd consider replacing Rovagug with Urgathoa, but I like how your choices cover the 3 alignments of evil.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

xavier c wrote:

1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?

1) Because she's not a happy deity.

2) Because she doesn't have a lot to smile about; she's not a friendly happy deity either. She's a hard case who is very serious and isn't here to be your friend.

Good does not mean Always Cheerful. In the same way Evil doesn't mean Always Angry.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

xavier c wrote:

1)can a outsider be terrified of a mortal? (like running away screaming scared)

what would make a outsider that terrified of a mortal anyway?

2)can a dragon be terrified of a human? and what about the human would make a dragon run away screaming

1) As long as the outsider isn't immune to fear, yes.

Depends on the outsider. Just as different things make different people frightened.

2) Same.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Graeme Lewis wrote:
Are there Celestial/Inevitable/Protean equivalents to Nascent Demon Lords/Daemon Harbingers/Infernal Dukes/etc.? Do they have names yet or is that more an "If you want to include these things, you come up with names for them" idea?

I suspect there are. They don't have names yet.


3 people marked this as a favorite.
Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

what would make a outsider that terrified of a mortal anyway?

[...]

Depends on the outsider. Just as different things make different people frightened.

Something like a CR 4 schir demon hearing, "Hello goat demon! I am Kassandra Tienoore, twentieth level mythic paladin, and this is my holy avenger. Augury is not a paladin spell, yet I feel you are going to have a bad day."


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Mr. James Jacobs,

Does Zon-Kuthon like Kool Aid or its Golarion equivalent?


James Jacobs wrote:
Glutton wrote:
Are Gripplis purposely pushing the boundaries of Tiny size?
Ummm... Grippli are Small, not Tiny. SO I guess they are pushing that boundry.

Sorry my computer went crazy and the rest of my post had to be snipped off. I was wondering About the normal tiny size ("1 to 2 feet") and the fact the average male Grippli is 1 ft 11 inches, while females clock in at 1 ft 9 inches. Is this kind of thing frowned upon in the design department, much like a medium race over 8 feet tall?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

The NPC wrote:

Mr. James Jacobs,

Does Zon-Kuthon like Kool Aid or its Golarion equivalent?

Nah.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Glutton wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
Glutton wrote:
Are Gripplis purposely pushing the boundaries of Tiny size?
Ummm... Grippli are Small, not Tiny. SO I guess they are pushing that boundry.
Sorry my computer went crazy and the rest of my post had to be snipped off. I was wondering About the normal tiny size ("1 to 2 feet") and the fact the average male Grippli is 1 ft 11 inches, while females clock in at 1 ft 9 inches. Is this kind of thing frowned upon in the design department, much like a medium race over 8 feet tall?

In Bestiary 2, we say "A grippli stands just over 2 feet in height and weighs 30 pounds."

In Advanced Race Guide, we say "Gripplis stand just over 2 feet tall..." at the start of the grippli entry on page 190.

Which tells me that whoever built Table 5–9 on page 250 of the book messed up, frankly. That's something that should be flagged for errata. I'd suggest moving the male base height up to 1' 11" and the female base height to 1' 10".


So Thor's a girl; your thoughts?

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?

1) Because she's not a happy deity.

2) Because she doesn't have a lot to smile about; she's not a friendly happy deity either. She's a hard case who is very serious and isn't here to be your friend.

Good does not mean Always Cheerful. In the same way Evil doesn't mean Always Angry.

For all that, she does have her rare moments... including one I've gone through in Wrath. Because she's overall so grim, those moments are that much more special.

Would it be fair to say that the price of becoming a deity, is that you become a bit less of a person, because of the all consuming focus of your portfolio? Like the Elders in Marvel Comics, the Collector, the Gardener, the Gamemaster, each of whom is immortal because of their overwhelming singular focus? That Iomedae is Iomedae because she is first and foremost a Crusader?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Mark Hoover wrote:
So Thor's a girl; your thoughts?

About time!

AKA: I approve.

Dark Archive

1 person marked this as a favorite.

James, why are you chasing those two poor explorers on page 128 of the Inner Sea World Guide?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

LazarX wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?

1) Because she's not a happy deity.

2) Because she doesn't have a lot to smile about; she's not a friendly happy deity either. She's a hard case who is very serious and isn't here to be your friend.

Good does not mean Always Cheerful. In the same way Evil doesn't mean Always Angry.

For all that, she does have her rare moments... including one I've gone through in Wrath. Because she's overall so grim, those moments are that much more special.

Would it be fair to say that the price of becoming a deity, is that you become a bit less of a person, because of the all consuming focus of your portfolio? Like the Elders in Marvel Comics, the Collector, the Gardener, the Gamemaster, each of whom is immortal because of their overwhelming singular focus? That Iomedae is Iomedae because she is first and foremost a Crusader?

Yes. Becoming a deity does make you less of a "person" and more of a force. You give up something of your humanity if you become a deity.

Liberty's Edge

James, how do you roleplay a paladin's immunity to fear effects? Does it mean he feels no fear at all?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

7 people marked this as a favorite.
Cr500cricket wrote:
James, why are you chasing those two poor explorers on page 128 of the Inner Sea World Guide?

Someone just asked this a few pages back...

It's because they shot arrows into my neck. Wouldn't you chase someone, given that situation? If only to give them back their arrows?

Spoiler:
I did not do that. I ate them. Jerks.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Paladinosaur wrote:
James, how do you roleplay a paladin's immunity to fear effects? Does it mean he feels no fear at all?

That's exactly what it means. No fear at all. She understands the nature of a situation that causes fear, and will retreat from combat or a situation if it seems prudent, but not from fear.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
Paladinosaur wrote:
James, how do you roleplay a paladin's immunity to fear effects? Does it mean he feels no fear at all?
That's exactly what it means. No fear at all. She understands the nature of a situation that causes fear, and will retreat from combat or a situation if it seems prudent, but not from fear.

Would you compare them to Green Lanterns then?


James Jacobs wrote:
Claxon wrote:

James, as the creative directive of the setting, can you discuss why in narrative reasoning the gods keep a fairly hands off approach to Golarion? Why is their not more defific interference?

I understand that the narrative of campaigns would then become to focused on the actions of the gods, instead of mortals (like the PCs) which would ultimately make for a poor game/story for us to play. It's fine as a myth or story to read, like Zeus killing Cronus, or the gods gifting fire to man, or whatever. But for players it sucks because you feel like a bit player in the story.

But what has actually happened between deities that the don't regularly show up and kick ass.

Did they all just literally agree (with perhaps some exceptions like Rovagug) that they would not directly intervene on the material plane after eons of destructive activity of doing so?

Yeah. It's primarily for the same reason we don't have a huge number of high level, powerful, good guy NPCs. Because the job of being the heroes of Golarion is the job of the player characters. And if the gods took a more active role in protecting Golarion... then it becomes more us telling the story of the world, rather than your characters telling the story of the world.

If we were developing Golarion as a shared world for novels or video games or the like, for a genre that removes a lot of the player's control as world shaping and world-saving... perhaps we would have taken a different tack.

The Deities DO show up to kick ass... but more so in the history, not the present. So you have things like Sarenrae and Asmodeus and the others teaming up to defeat Rovaggug. Aroden coming in to defeat Deskari. Desna invading the Abyss to avenge the death of a favored worshiper. And so on. Stuff that happened in the past, not the present, where the PCs do that job.

I get all that, but why?

Is there no in setting reason to explain why the gods don't show up in person anymore? I understand ruining the story for PCs, and thats a completely valid reason not to have the gods constantly showing up and taking care of business. But why don't they do so?

Is there no in setting reason at this time? Are there plans to ever cover that sort of information? Or is the only justification because it would be bad for the game from the perspective of players?


James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?

1) Because she's not a happy deity.

2) Because she doesn't have a lot to smile about; she's not a friendly happy deity either. She's a hard case who is very serious and isn't here to be your friend.

Good does not mean Always Cheerful. In the same way Evil doesn't mean Always Angry.

Who are some evil deities who are usually cheerful or friendly?(if there are any. The possibility I find intriguing at least.)

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:
LazarX wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
xavier c wrote:

1)why does Olheon look so mean?. she is always glaring in her art

2)why doesn't Iomedae ever smile?

1) Because she's not a happy deity.

2) Because she doesn't have a lot to smile about; she's not a friendly happy deity either. She's a hard case who is very serious and isn't here to be your friend.

Good does not mean Always Cheerful. In the same way Evil doesn't mean Always Angry.

For all that, she does have her rare moments... including one I've gone through in Wrath. Because she's overall so grim, those moments are that much more special.

Would it be fair to say that the price of becoming a deity, is that you become a bit less of a person, because of the all consuming focus of your portfolio? Like the Elders in Marvel Comics, the Collector, the Gardener, the Gamemaster, each of whom is immortal because of their overwhelming singular focus? That Iomedae is Iomedae because she is first and foremost a Crusader?

Yes. Becoming a deity does make you less of a "person" and more of a force. You give up something of your humanity if you become a deity.

Is it worse for the vast majority who were never mortal at all?


1 person marked this as a favorite.

What's a good source for learning about the mathematics behind game design? Aside from college.


James Jacobs wrote:
Mark Hoover wrote:
So Thor's a girl; your thoughts?

About time!

AKA: I approve.

Kinda been done already.

PS I love Earth X and think the end bit with Galactus should be official Marvel stance. Did you ever pick it up?


As a question about hindsight/retrospect, are there any secret societies of Golarion or similar things that you would have liked to see in Occult Mysteries, but which had to be left on the cutting room floor, for one reason or another?

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