Some excellent French horror movies that come to mind would be the following... and WARNING. These movies are ALL incredibly extreeme and hard core in their content. They're absolutely not mainstream horror. Martyrs and Frontier(s) in particular, are among the most violent/gory movies I've ever seen. Actually... Martyrs IS the most violent/gory movie I've seen, but it might rank at #1 there because if you can endure the gore and violence and grim subject matter, it's also got a very disturbing and freaky and effective message to deliver about the nature of life and death and the meaning of it all. Very very bleak. Do not watch if you want to be happy.
You don't feel that the "1984" movie/novel or the documentary movie "Land Without Bread" give the same bleak message without the gore? Or is the gore necessary for the message?
Would half-human children of Gods be some kind of unique half-outsiders or are they just be normal aasimars and tieflings?
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Thank you, this makes sense, and I do see those grounds for harsher judgment. Likewise with limiting the infinite, though I have follow-up questions (please answer only if doing so feels meaningful):
- Can any of the outer planes serve equally as both a place of reward and a place of punishment, or is this asymmetrical (e.g.; going to an upper plane is almost always a reward, going to a lower plane is almost always punishment)?
- Alternately put, are people commonly punished/rewarded in the plane of the alignment they would claim to have had, the alignment they actually had, or the alignment best suited for punishing/rewarding them? Or any/all of these, for different cases?
Yes. All of the outer planes can serve as a place of reward and punishment... but the good planes skew toward rewards and the bad ones skew toward punishment. If you're being punished, your alignment in life doesn't matter so much as the rest of you. It's absolutely possible (and even normal) for a failed good person to end up being punished in Hell or the Abyss or Abaddon.
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You don't feel that the "1984" movie/novel or the documentary movie "Land Without Bread" give the same bleak message without the gore? Or is the gore necessary for the message?
Some excellent French horror movies that come to mind would be the following... and WARNING. These movies are ALL incredibly extreeme and hard core in their content. They're absolutely not mainstream horror. Martyrs and Frontier(s) in particular, are among the most violent/gory movies I've ever seen. Actually... Martyrs IS the most violent/gory movie I've seen, but it might rank at #1 there because if you can endure the gore and violence and grim subject matter, it's also got a very disturbing and freaky and effective message to deliver about the nature of life and death and the meaning of it all. Very very bleak. Do not watch if you want to be happy.
Never saw Land Without Bread, but 1984 absolutely gives a bleak message. NOT the same message as Martyrs whatsoever at all. Gore is not necessary for a bleak message, but it's 100% necessary and vital to the message in Martyrs, which is about the nature of life and death and how they relate and about how humanity is obsessed with death because in order to know it you have to be dead and then you can't know about it because you're dead and cannot communicate that information to the living.
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Can dwarven clans be continued through adoption if the heir can't have biological kids for some reason, or are such clans doomed to extinction?
Generally no. This is a place where dwarven stubborness and tradition would rather see a clan go extinct. Doesn't mean some alternate-thinking dwarf clan might not try to give it a go... but good luck!
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Would half-human children of Gods be some kind of unique half-outsiders or are they just be normal aasimars and tieflings?
Aasimars and tieflings are generally humans who have outsider blood/DNA in their lineage, but did NOT have an outsider parent unless, perhaps, the outsider parent was a half-outsider.
When a full deity has a child with a human, the result is a unique creature. Doesn't have to be a half-outsider. Could be a full outsider like a nephilim. Most often it ends up being someone who has potential to be a mythic character but is otherwise a normal creature for their race.
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James,
Whats your favorite pizza topping?
Any games you're looking forward this year?
Pizza: Artichokes, chicken, and jalapenos
Games: Horizon Zero Dawn, Torment Tides of Numenera, Call of Cthulhu, Mass Effect Andromeda, Divinity Original Sin 2, Outlast 2, Prey, Red Dead Redemption 2, State of Decay 2
My roommate and I were discussing a story idea involving time travel, and a question came up I thought would be worth asking: Other than Shyka the Many (of the Eldest), which deities are the most likely to take an active interest in (or at least have a strong opinion regarding) time travelers' adventures? Who'd be offended, who'd be intrigued, who might try to take advantage, etc.
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My roommate and I were discussing a story idea involving time travel, and a question came up I thought would be worth asking: Other than Shyka the Many (of the Eldest), which deities are the most likely to take an active interest in (or at least have a strong opinion regarding) time travelers' adventures? Who'd be offended, who'd be intrigued, who might try to take advantage, etc.
Not that I think time travel is a good idea for an RPG (it's great for fiction where there's a single person telling the story, but terrible for a shared experience where multiple people are telling the story)... but the top six deities and demigods that I think would be interested in time travel would be:
Nethys
Brigh
Yog-Sothoth
Pharasma
Zyphus
Abraxus
My roommate and I were discussing a story idea involving time travel, and a question came up I thought would be worth asking: Other than Shyka the Many (of the Eldest), which deities are the most likely to take an active interest in (or at least have a strong opinion regarding) time travelers' adventures? Who'd be offended, who'd be intrigued, who might try to take advantage, etc.Not that I think time travel is a good idea for an RPG (it's great for fiction where there's a single person telling the story, but terrible for a shared experience where multiple people are telling the story)... but the top six deities and demigods that I think would be interested in time travel would be:
Nethys
Brigh
Yog-Sothoth
Pharasma
Zyphus
Abraxus
Have you ever seen ConTinuum by Aetherco, the authors of Yamara? It's a game and setting that takes into account that the players have the ability to time travel at will.
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Have you ever seen ConTinuum by Aetherco, the authors of Yamara? It's a game and setting that takes into account that the players have the ability to time travel at will.
I have not.
That said, if the whole point of an RPG is about time travel, then that's the way to tackle things. You can build stories and settings from the ground up with established rules and expectations that anything that might be real on day one might not be real for long if some sort of paradox happens.
But when you introduce time travel into settings and games that don't include it as the primary theme of the setting/game from day one, my experience is that it's akin to giving the disruptive players in the group a blank check to try to rewrite and undo and destroy the work the GM or publisher has gone through to create the setting in the first place. It is, in other words, simply FAR to distracting for players and ends up being the story, regardless of the author or GM's actual desires.
Not that I think time travel is a good idea for an RPG (it's great for fiction where there's a single person telling the story, but terrible for a shared experience where multiple people are telling the story)... but the top six deities and demigods that I think would be interested in time travel would be:
Nethys
Brigh
Yog-Sothoth
Pharasma
Zyphus
Abraxus
Why Pharasma? Would she un-do Urgathoa?
Are there any sources for lizardfolk culture in Golarion? There's some generic tidbits in the Monster Codex and their Bestiary entry, but I haven't been able to find much that's Golarion-specific.
It's absolutely possible (and even normal) for a failed good person to end up being punished in Hell or the Abyss or Abaddon.
That's scary. Gimmie some examples of a failed good person.
Also, how would punishments work in the upper planes?
For that matter, how would rewards work in the lower planes?
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Why Pharasma? Would she un-do Urgathoa?Not that I think time travel is a good idea for an RPG (it's great for fiction where there's a single person telling the story, but terrible for a shared experience where multiple people are telling the story)... but the top six deities and demigods that I think would be interested in time travel would be:
Nethys
Brigh
Yog-Sothoth
Pharasma
Zyphus
Abraxus
Time travel meddles with destiny. Pharasma doesn't like time travel paradoxes.
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Are there any sources for lizardfolk culture in Golarion? There's some generic tidbits in the Monster Codex and their Bestiary entry, but I haven't been able to find much that's Golarion-specific.
There's the article about them in Classic Monsters Revisited. There's tidbits in numerous adventures. And there's the whole nation of Droon at the southernmost end of Garund, which is a lizardfolk empire about which we haven't yet said much more.
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It's absolutely possible (and even normal) for a failed good person to end up being punished in Hell or the Abyss or Abaddon.That's scary. Gimmie some examples of a failed good person.
Also, how would punishments work in the upper planes?
For that matter, how would rewards work in the lower planes?
It's SUPPOSED to be scary. It's pretty much the very core of how most religions work... and WHY they work.
Fiction and real life are both FULL of examples of a failed good person. What exactly constitutes failure is, of course, a subject of endless debate among us mortals who don't see the big picture. The first example of a failed good person in Golarion that comes to my mind is Father Tobyn from the first Pathfinder Adventure, Burnt Offerings. He was a cleric of Desna, but his failure in raising his adopted daughter Nualia by being an overbearing father who didn't treat his daughter with respect and was overly protective in a bad way and so on eventually ended up with her becoming the main bad guy of Burnt Offerings. He did not go to a happy afterlife when he died.
Punishments generally don't appear in the upper planes, but would likely be something on par with permanent (or near permanent) petitioner status. Overall, it's the evil planes that deal out punishments.
Rewards on lower planes generally manifest in the form of a petitioner being transformed into an outsider. Becoming a devil or demon and being one of the bullies instead of one of the bullied for all eternity is a pretty good reward for an evil person.
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Depends on if becoming a vampire was something the person willingly sought out AND on what they did as a vampire. On average, folks in this situation who weren't evil and became a vampire do end up taking a hit and run a higher chance of being punished in the afterlife, although not to the same extent as someone who willingly became a vampire in order to be evil.It's not easy to bypass Pharasma's judgement, but spells like hellfire ray, being sacrificed during a special ritual, or being turned undead all do that.Hi James! thank you for delving into that question.
--> In the common case of a creature being turned into a vampire and seeing its alignment become evil, how is the soul judged upon the vampire's destruction? (let's assume the soul spent more than half its life as a single lawful good bookbinder splitting his off time between activities led by the Church of Torag and a librarian club sponsored by the faith of Irori)
In "Paths of the Righteous", the Heritor Knight's 'Redeemer of Undeath' ability can allow him/her to hit an undead that was good in life and redeem it of all evil so that his soul reach the proper afterlife (which is pretty badass, I must say!)
Do you know of any other similar abilities, powers or items published by Paizo thus far? Thanks!
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If a paladin of Sarenrae assassinates a clearly evil creature in its sleep, does the paladin lose his powers?
In case the specifics matter, it's sneaking into a hag's hut at night using an elixir of hiding and using smite evil.
Just asking cause we're playing on maptools right now and it just happened. I'm not the GM or the one playing the paladin.
[Edit: we just determined that the paladin is a better assassin than my vigilante .... ]
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In "Paths of the Righteous", the Heritor Knight's 'Redeemer of Undeath' ability can allow him/her to hit an undead that was good in life and redeem it of all evil so that his soul reach the proper afterlife (which is pretty badass, I must say!)
Do you know of any other similar abilities, powers or items published by Paizo thus far? Thanks!
Nope.
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If a paladin of Sarenrae assassinates a clearly evil creature in its sleep, does the paladin lose his powers?
In case the specifics matter, it's sneaking into a hag's hut at night using an elixir of hiding and using smite evil.
Just asking cause we're playing on maptools right now and it just happened. I'm not the GM or the one playing the paladin.
[Edit: we just determined that the paladin is a better assassin than my vigilante .... ]
If a paladin of Sarenrae assassinates...
Stop there. You've fallen. Assassinations are not the way Sarenrae rolls, and pow, Ex-Paladin. Specifics do not matter.
That said, it's not my call. It's your GM's call, and I'll be very disappointed and annoyed if I learn later that you used my reply as leverage against your GM. Not cool if you do that.
Hey James!
Apologies if this question has been asked before, but I just wanted to make sure my character was fully legal!
I'm a multi-classed Sylph Druid/Sorcerer and by 20th level (assuming she survives that long), I'll be CL 17th Sorcerer (thanks to the Magical Knack trait) and CL 5th Druid.
A snippet of the build is below, but as you can see, I'm already of the Rakshasa Bloodline, have taken Eldritch Heritage and Improved, along with Skill Focus for two of the Dreamspun Bloodline powers and Skill Focus and Eldritch Heritage for the first level Stormborn Bloodline power. Is that legal to you? From my interpretation it is, because I've taken Eldritch Heritage and the Skill Focus requirements for a different Bloodline each time, following the feat description of "this must be a different bloodline to one you already have".
Thankyou!
Feat Tree:
1. Skill Focus: Sense Motive
2. Eschew Materials
3. Arcane Armour Training
5. Weapon focus Scythe
7. Skill Focus: Knowledge Nature
9. Eldritch Heritage - Dreamspun: Lullaby
11. Improved Eldritch Heritage - Dreamspun: Dreamshaper
12. Bloodline Feat: Empower Spell
13. Eldritch Heritage - Stormborn: Thunderstaff
15. Improved Critical: Scythe
17. Intensified Spell
18. Bloodline Feat: Deceitful
19. Critical Focus
She's running around with Windy Escape and Cure Light Wounds x2 as a Druid and Shock Shield plus Shocking Grasp for her Sorcerer combat, with 5 electrical resistance. Currently level 3, soon to be 4.
It's a strange mix for a character but so far seems really fun and will be self-buffing a lot later on.
It's absolutely possible (and even normal) for a failed good person to end up being punished in Hell or the Abyss or Abaddon.That's scary. Gimmie some examples of a failed good person.
Also, how would punishments work in the upper planes?
For that matter, how would rewards work in the lower planes?
You don't even have to be a failed good person. If I recall rightly, if you are sacrificed in a proper manner, your soul can be bypassed of Pharasma's judgement, and can be sent directly to Hell or the Abyss no matter what alignment you are? That is how the Lissala Golems work, no?
In regard to Aroden and Abadar, what was the main ideological difference between the two? Besides, Aroden focusing on humanity they both generally seem to to be about bringing about and supporting civilization. Do their faiths have some kind of intrinsically different away about achieving those goals that I'm just ignorant of?
Hello Mr. Jacobs, as a GM who is running his first evil campaign, I have one more question:
1) What would you consider to be the biggest pitfall to look out for as a GM who is switching from traditional heroic adventures (RotRL etc.) to Hell's Vengeance?
This doesn't have to be specific advice for *me*, instead I was wondering more about what you would personally consider to be the general differences between GMíng for traditional and evil campaigns and what might go wrong.
I also realize this might be too big a question for this thread - in this case do not hesitate to let this know and move on to another question! I really do appreciate what you are doing here and would not want to put undue stress on you!
*Edited to say I am a BIG fan of the setting of Golarion that you and your colleageus have created. As someone who is system-agnostic it is the excellent lore, great AP's and the expansive world that are genuinely the biggest reason I am sticking with the Paizo Products. Thank you very much.
This is probably a complicated question, but if Andoran was to ever go to war against Cheliex, what nearby nations would likely come to Andoran's support?
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Nope.In "Paths of the Righteous", the Heritor Knight's 'Redeemer of Undeath' ability can allow him/her to hit an undead that was good in life and redeem it of all evil so that his soul reach the proper afterlife (which is pretty badass, I must say!)
Do you know of any other similar abilities, powers or items published by Paizo thus far? Thanks!
In keeping with the current lore, would you say that the omniscient knowledge of all afterlife fates by Pharasma includes the future knowledge of the souls saved by Heritor Knights? i.e. do they pervert the flow of souls in her opinion, or do they do her a service, undoing the terrible stalling effects of undeath upon a soul, in keeping with the efforts of her clergy?
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If a paladin of Sarenrae assassinates a clearly evil creature in its sleep, does the paladin lose his powers?
In case the specifics matter, it's sneaking into a hag's hut at night using an elixir of hiding and using smite evil.
Just asking cause we're playing on maptools right now and it just happened. I'm not the GM or the one playing the paladin.
[Edit: we just determined that the paladin is a better assassin than my vigilante .... ]
If a paladin of Sarenrae assassinates...
Stop there. You've fallen. Assassinations are not the way Sarenrae rolls, and pow, Ex-Paladin. Specifics do not matter.
That said, it's not my call. It's your GM's call, and I'll be very disappointed and annoyed if I learn later that you used my reply as leverage against your GM. Not cool if you do that.
Don't worry. The GM made his call as I was posting, but we were all curious what you'd say.
I'm curious as to what the call was, but this isn't a Ask Nightdrifter Anything thread, is it? :)
James,
Do you have an anecdote from a game you've witnessed where a paladin was played as you envision them? Or maybe from some other source?
I like using Michael from the Dresden files as an example, but only for a couple facets of being a paladin...
What screams "paladin" to you?
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Hey James!
Apologies if this question has been asked before, but I just wanted to make sure my character was fully legal!
Thanks for sharing, but I don't get to decide if your character is "fully legal." Your GM gets to decide that. I'm not interested in being a surrogate GM, really... I've got enough on my hands dealing with the players in my current games! :-P
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You don't even have to be a failed good person. If I recall rightly, if you are sacrificed in a proper manner, your soul can be bypassed of Pharasma's judgement, and can be sent directly to Hell or the Abyss no matter what alignment you are? That is how the Lissala Golems work, no?It's absolutely possible (and even normal) for a failed good person to end up being punished in Hell or the Abyss or Abaddon.That's scary. Gimmie some examples of a failed good person.
Also, how would punishments work in the upper planes?
For that matter, how would rewards work in the lower planes?
That's absolutely correct. Being sacrificed in a vile ritual is not something you want to happen to you.
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In regard to Aroden and Abadar, what was the main ideological difference between the two? Besides, Aroden focusing on humanity they both generally seem to to be about bringing about and supporting civilization. Do their faiths have some kind of intrinsically different away about achieving those goals that I'm just ignorant of?
Aroden is about humanity and human expansion and human human humans. Abadar is about civilization, which includes all civilization, not just human civilization. Abadar is a much more expansive and well-rounded and older deity than Aroden ever was.
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Hello Mr. Jacobs, as a GM who is running his first evil campaign, I have one more question:
1) What would you consider to be the biggest pitfall to look out for as a GM who is switching from traditional heroic adventures (RotRL etc.) to Hell's Vengeance?
This doesn't have to be specific advice for *me*, instead I was wondering more about what you would personally consider to be the general differences between GMíng for traditional and evil campaigns and what might go wrong.
I also realize this might be too big a question for this thread - in this case do not hesitate to let this know and move on to another question! I really do appreciate what you are doing here and would not want to put undue stress on you!
*Edited to say I am a BIG fan of the setting of Golarion that you and your colleageus have created. As someone who is system-agnostic it is the excellent lore, great AP's and the expansive world that are genuinely the biggest reason I am sticking with the Paizo Products. Thank you very much.
The biggest pitfall to look out for with an evil game is not respecting your players' limits and consent. What's okay for one person may be offensive or distressing to another, so running an evil game requires a LOT more trust between you and your players, and between players themselves, than a normal game. Especially considering the perception that "evil games = PC on PC violence," which is a fallacy.
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This is probably a complicated question, but if Andoran was to ever go to war against Cheliex, what nearby nations would likely come to Andoran's support?
It is indeed a complicated question, made more so because you can choose differently to have different plots.
My take, though, is that if Andoran simply declared war on Cheliax, they'd PROBABLY get support from Isger... and that's it at the start. Taldor would likely take advantage of Andoran's distraction to try to swoop in and claim Andoran while their guard was down, and then presto, you've got a three way battle that could spill into a four way one if Qadira gets worked up enough.
Which is why things are the way they are in a sort of stalemate cold war currently. Andoran knows that if it goes too far in one way, they may well be in trouble in another!
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In keeping with the current lore, would you say that the omniscient knowledge of all afterlife fates by Pharasma includes the future knowledge of the souls saved by Heritor Knights? i.e. do they pervert the flow of souls in her opinion, or do they do her a service, undoing the terrible stalling effects of undeath upon a soul, in keeping with the efforts of her clergy?Nope.In "Paths of the Righteous", the Heritor Knight's 'Redeemer of Undeath' ability can allow him/her to hit an undead that was good in life and redeem it of all evil so that his soul reach the proper afterlife (which is pretty badass, I must say!)
Do you know of any other similar abilities, powers or items published by Paizo thus far? Thanks!
Pharasma doesn't have omniscient knowledge of all afterlife fates. It's not that simple or cut and dry. It's more akin to what she decides BECOMES those fates, and she can't decide AGAINST those fates, but doesn't necessarily know what those fates are until she passes judgement. She does appreciate the heritor knights helping to deal with undead—whether it's by redeeming them or destroying them is kinda irrelevant to Pharasma.
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Do you have an anecdote from a game you've witnessed where a paladin was played as you envision them? Or maybe from some other source?
I like using Michael from the Dresden files as an example, but only for a couple facets of being a paladin...
What screams "paladin" to you?
Ned Stark, from Game of Thrones, is probably my current favorite example of a paladin-type character.
Which may drill down on my primary concern with them. I very much prefer complex worlds and stories with shades of gray and tough choices and the like, with "grimdark" themes to them, such as Game of Thrones has. Those worlds and stories are VERY ROUGH on paladins, and as a result, the strength of the paladin's role in such stories is as a martyr to give other characters who don't, perhaps, have the paladin's strength of personal will, to sacrifice themselves for others, but can take inspiration in those sacrifices.
That's not a great role for a player who wants to play the game to the end of the story.
AKA: I like paladins best when they're NPCs.
I agree, and also enjoy grimdark type games, although I've also played Paladins in them...
In what way do you find Ned Stark akin to a paladin? His code of honor? Keeping promises to his dying sister? Doing all that in spite of the world being very unforgiving?
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Do you prefer the view that paladins are inherently saint and infallible, or that they must always carefully keep their emotions and wants in check and fight a constant inner struggle against temptation?
If one assumes that the latter is true or more interesting, what would be the aftermath (in terms of game effect, paladin falling, etc.) of a night where the paladin gets drunk and while his inhibitions and self-control are lowered, gives way to temptation and/or commits questionable acts?
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I agree, and also enjoy grimdark type games, although I've also played Paladins in them...
In what way do you find Ned Stark akin to a paladin? His code of honor? Keeping promises to his dying sister? Doing all that in spite of the world being very unforgiving?
His code of honor and refusal to compromise and his powerful optimisim in the face of cruelty.
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Do you prefer the view that paladins are inherently saint and infallible, or that they must always carefully keep their emotions and wants in check and fight a constant inner struggle against temptation?
If one assumes that the latter is true or more interesting, what would be the aftermath (in terms of game effect, paladin falling, etc.) of a night where the paladin gets drunk and while his inhibitions and self-control are lowered, gives way to temptation and/or commits questionable acts?
I prefer the view that paladins are mortals and human and have free will and are thus NOT inherently saints or infallible. The capacity to make choices, and thus make the choices against being non-lawful and non-good, is what makes a paladin a paladin. A character who does not have the free will to make the wrong choice and is infallible is something closer to a supernatural scion/paragon of law and good, like an archon, and is not a paladin.
A paladin who gets drunk and loses control made the choice to get drunk, and thus all the things he does while drunk are also, by extent, his choice. A paladin who's drugged or gets drunk against his will is less at risk of falling than one who deliberately does the chaotic thing and gets drunk, but deliberately overindulging in alcohol and submitting to lowered inhibitions is a chaotic act, not a lawful one.
Do you prefer the view that paladins are inherently saint and infallible, or that they must always carefully keep their emotions and wants in check and fight a constant inner struggle against temptation?
If one assumes that the latter is true or more interesting, what would be the aftermath (in terms of game effect, paladin falling, etc.) of a night where the paladin gets drunk and while his inhibitions and self-control are lowered, gives way to temptation and/or commits questionable acts?
I prefer the view that paladins are mortals and human and have free will and are thus NOT inherently saints or infallible. The capacity to make choices, and thus make the choices against being non-lawful and non-good, is what makes a paladin a paladin. A character who does not have the free will to make the wrong choice and is infallible is something closer to a supernatural scion/paragon of law and good, like an archon, and is not a paladin.
A paladin who gets drunk and loses control made the choice to get drunk, and thus all the things he does while drunk are also, by extent, his choice. A paladin who's drugged or gets drunk against his will is less at risk of falling than one who deliberately does the chaotic thing and gets drunk, but deliberately overindulging in alcohol and submitting to lowered inhibitions is a chaotic act, not a lawful one.
Are there any other ways of looking at this question other than the board's favorite binary view, i.e. whether the Paladin gets completely turned off by his sponsor or not?
Do you have an anecdote from a game you've witnessed where a paladin was played as you envision them? Or maybe from some other source?
I like using Michael from the Dresden files as an example, but only for a couple facets of being a paladin...
What screams "paladin" to you?Ned Stark, from Game of Thrones, is probably my current favorite example of a paladin-type character.
Which may drill down on my primary concern with them. I very much prefer complex worlds and stories with shades of gray and tough choices and the like, with "grimdark" themes to them, such as Game of Thrones has. Those worlds and stories are VERY ROUGH on paladins, and as a result, the strength of the paladin's role in such stories is as a martyr to give other characters who don't, perhaps, have the paladin's strength of personal will, to sacrifice themselves for others, but can take inspiration in those sacrifices.
That's not a great role for a player who wants to play the game to the end of the story.
AKA: I like paladins best when they're NPCs.
Interesting.
Grimdark you say? Now I wouldn't picture you a fan but do you like Warhammer 40000?
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Are there any other ways of looking at this question other than the board's favorite binary view, i.e. whether the Paladin gets completely turned off by his sponsor or not?
Of course there are. Whether or not a paladin keeps or loses her powers as a paladin is of course a binary all-or-nothing switch, but what actually serves as the proverbial last straw that makes that switch flip varies immensely between situations, religions, and games. And that's where the internet gets worked up, because the internet THINKS it wants there to be only one switch, even though if that were the case, the internet wouldn't like what it got.