Does it make sense to take a 1-level dip into monk, and then max out wisdom for all it's worth? (In order to tie offense, defense, and casting into a single stat.)
My goal is to get a good utility caster who also has a solid *non-magical* offensive option. And archery is just fun.
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
If you can grit your teeth for three levels' worth, the Zen archer monk uses Wisdom as its attack stat with the bow... That only leaves you a max of 9 levels of cleric, though.
Carpy DM wrote: If you can grit your teeth for three levels' worth, the Zen archer monk uses Wisdom as its attack stat with the bow... That only leaves you a max of 9 levels of cleric, though. Dang. . . I remember a feat from 3.5 that gave the same ability. . . oh well :(
Kingbreaker wrote: Does it make sense to take a 1-level dip into monk, and then max out wisdom for all it's worth? (In order to tie offense, defense, and casting into a single stat.)
My goal is to get a good utility caster who also has a solid *non-magical* offensive option. And archery is just fun.
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
There is a weapon enchantment called Guided from Pathfinder #10 that lets you use your wisdom for hit and damage.
One of my players in ROTRL is playing an elven cleric of desna and he is enjoying it greatly.
The Travel and Liberation domains provide her utility and GREAT mobility, as an elf she got proficiency with the composite longbow.
She has taken all the archery feats avaliable to her:
PBS, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, and Deadly Aim now that she's hit 7th level.
She supports the meleers with her arrows in average encounters, buffing(herself too) on harder fights and patching everyone afterwards with wands.
She is pretty effective; with standard gear she is very well balanced between offense defense and spellcasting.
Any multiclassing would just weaken her IMO.
Unfortunately it requires crafting, which is verboten for pfs.
ntin wrote: Kingbreaker wrote: Does it make sense to take a 1-level dip into monk, and then max out wisdom for all it's worth? (In order to tie offense, defense, and casting into a single stat.)
My goal is to get a good utility caster who also has a solid *non-magical* offensive option. And archery is just fun.
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
There is a weapon enchantment called Guided from Pathfinder #10 that lets you use your wisdom for hit and damage.
ntin wrote: Kingbreaker wrote:
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
There is a weapon enchantment called Guided from Pathfinder #10 that lets you use your wisdom for hit and damage.
Sadly this weapon enhancement is not allowable in PFS. (You can check the link that you gave even as the website maintainer there is very good about putting a 'P' on things allowed in PFS there).
That said, if you don't have other uses for ALL of your feats then you can make a reasonable archer out of an elven, human or (with a racial sub) half-elven cleric (with the later two paying for the proficiency).
Feats: PBS, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Deadly Aim, and Manyshot will take you up through your 9th level feats.
Once you start on the feat path it kind of becomes a waste if you don't continue to take the rest.
-James
james maissen wrote: ntin wrote: Kingbreaker wrote:
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
There is a weapon enchantment called Guided from Pathfinder #10 that lets you use your wisdom for hit and damage.
Sadly this weapon enhancement is not allowable in PFS. (You can check the link that you gave even as the website maintainer there is very good about putting a 'P' on things allowed in PFS there).
That said, if you don't have other uses for ALL of your feats then you can make a reasonable archer out of an elven, human or (with a racial sub) half-elven cleric (with the later two paying for the proficiency).
Feats: PBS, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Deadly Aim, and Manyshot will take you up through your 9th level feats.
Once you start on the feat path it kind of becomes a waste if you don't continue to take the rest.
-James How about abilities?
- My thought would be to put 16 into WIS, a few into INT for skills, and put the rest into dex. Raise dex every level. The idea is that, as a utility caster, spell DC's aren't really a priority. In PFS, more than 16 WIS for utility/heal spells is a waste. For strength (mighty bow damage), bull's strength in a pinch.
- Travel makes a perfect domain for an archer. For a second domain, I'm torn between luck and freedom - Luck for the re-roll ability, and there are some useful spells (true strike, freedom). Freedom, though is probably a lot more practical.
- regarding races, there's an option [Ancestral Arms] in the APG for half-elves which lets them choose a proficiency in any single weapon, which saves that feat.
EDIT: Human is better, the Hunter's Eye Taldor trait grants proficiency with longbows.
Kingbreaker wrote:
How about abilities?
- My thought would be to put 16 into WIS, a few into INT for skills, and put the rest into dex. Raise dex every level. The idea is that, as a utility caster, spell DC's aren't really a priority. In PFS, more than 16 WIS for utility/heal spells is a waste. For strength (mighty bow damage), bull's strength in a pinch.
You don't want to need to cast Bull's Strength in order to avoid a -2 to hit for lack of STR. It's not worth the +2 damage.
As to WIS it is also your bonus spells.. you're talking an extra 4th level, then later 1st, 2nd, 5th & 6th level spells. These add up, especially your top tier spell.
-James
At first level masterwork arrows are really not that expensive for a +1 to damage!
There are also a wide range of arrows in Elves of Golarian that are likely avaiable and not too pricy one or two gives some fun options!
james maissen wrote:
You don't want to need to cast Bull's Strength in order to avoid a -2 to hit for lack of STR. It's not worth the +2 damage.
As an archer, STR is irrelevant to AB. . . but the point holds for damage.
james maissen wrote: As to WIS it is also your bonus spells.. you're talking an extra 4th level, then later 1st, 2nd, 5th & 6th level spells. These add up, especially your top tier spell.
-James
This is a good point - what would you recommend as split between dex and wis?
Kingbreaker wrote:
As an archer, STR is irrelevant to AB. . . but the point holds for damage.
This is a good point - what would you recommend as split between dex and wis?
1. If your STR is below the pull of your bow you suffer a -2 to hit.
2. Well going off of a 20pt buy I'd dump INT down to a 7 with a human build and go with two 16s, two 12s, a 10 and a 7.
As to arrangement of stats and whether you are going to bump DEX or WIS, it would depend if you're trying to be an archer that can heal or a cleric that can shoot a bow.
I'd definitely go with a 12CHA as channel energy is a wonderful way to heal the party. As an archer you'd likely be back rank and could try to get away without selective channeling.
-James
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Kingbreaker wrote: Does it make sense to take a 1-level dip into monk, and then max out wisdom for all it's worth? (In order to tie offense, defense, and casting into a single stat.)
My goal is to get a good utility caster who also has a solid *non-magical* offensive option. And archery is just fun.
This will be a PFS build, most likely.
No, unless you're planning on giving up all forms of armor.
Here are the routes I'd consider.
Cleric with the War Doman and an appropriate diety. (Gives you martial weapon proficiency and weapon focus to start with and other nice things)
Oracle with the Battle Mystery. (just too many good options to list, go have a look at either Paizo's PSRD or PFSRD.org.) I'm currently building as a thought exercise a Joan of Arc type character only focused on the bastard sword instead) I might post if if there's interest when it's done.
No matter what route you choose you're not going to be as optimal an archer as a dedicated ranger or fighter.
The key thing here is not to think of archery as a fall back option instead of your magic, but in complementary to it.
for the best healing archer, 1 Fighter, 4 hedge witch, 5 levels of Eldridge Knight, And 10 of Arcane Archer. you can become healer with almost the same power as a cleric, But without channel and the damage with Hexes on your arrows.
You can do the War domain, be an elf, or take a level of Fighter to get longbow proficiency. (Human fighters can have point blank, precise, and rapid shot by level 1 instead of level 5.) I would go Fighter 1/Cleric X, and focus on buffing and full attacking from the back. Maybe take Reach Spell or something else that lets you cure from long range in a pinch.
LazarX wrote:
Cleric with the War Doman and an appropriate diety. (Gives you martial weapon proficiency and weapon focus to start with and other nice things. Where do you see this? It was the case in 3.5, but PF War domain doesn't grant proficiency or Weapon Focus, per the PRD.
Reynard_the_fox wrote: You can do the War domain, be an elf, or take a level of Fighter to get longbow proficiency. (Human fighters can have point blank, precise, and rapid shot by level 1 instead of level 5.) I would go Fighter 1/Cleric X, and focus on buffing and full attacking from the back. Maybe take Reach Spell or something else that lets you cure from long range in a pinch. they probably wont have a healer if this cleric isnt in the party so you need to take 1 level of cleric than 1 level of fighter, even as a elf you can get point blank shot and precise shot at level 2 and since you are an elf you can have longbow prof at 1st level
you can start with
str 14
dex 16
con 11
int 10
wis 16
cha 14
or dump int for a bit more con
If this is PFS, you can put your PC in the Andoran faction, at which point the Hunter's Eye trait becomes available... which not only gives longbow (or shortbow) proficiency, but removes the penalty for the 2nd range increment while using said bow)
The elf option works, but you'll be starved for feats for a long while.
Worshipping a god with the bow as a favored weapon is easy enough as well (Erastil, for instance)
Not sure why folks are talking about the War domain? I don't see anywhere where this gives proficiency... is that an old DnD 3.5 thing?
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
tribeof1 wrote: LazarX wrote:
Cleric with the War Doman and an appropriate diety. (Gives you martial weapon proficiency and weapon focus to start with and other nice things. Where do you see this? It was the case in 3.5, but PF War domain doesn't grant proficiency or Weapon Focus, per the PRD. If you want to go Human, the Bow is Erastil's favored weapon. You'd have two feats to play with at first level.
I think there are 4-5 deities who give longbow proficiency
A cleric of Erastil will get you the longbow proficiency. You could then take Guided Hand (after taking Channel Smite) to get wisdom to attack rolls with the longbow (Erastil's favoured weapon). You could dip Zen Archer monk for Precise Shot (as a bonus feat), Wisdom to AC and Flurry of Arrows.
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