It's Official: Tian Xia scheduled for August 2011


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Liberty's Edge

I also foresee this conversation.

Player:
"Cool! Tian Xia! I wanna be a ninja!!!"

DM:
"Uuuuuh, Pathfinder has decided that ninjas are just rogues in ninja suits."

Player: mystifiedly;
".....oh......"


Heathansson wrote:
meh....I want a ninja class that's not a "rogue in a ninja suit."

IIt seems to me, all the quibbling aside here, that it would be good marketing to just take the base classes and Orientalize them with a few different characteristics and lots of new fluff, to adapt to a different cultural context.

In the end (and I say this having studied Chinese literature for my undergrad degree) that more or less the military classes/archetypes seem the same--just with some different kinds of weapons (esp. with less tendency toward heavy armor)--where I get a different feeling is from the magical types (which IMO have a lot more in common with middle eastern magic archetypes). But really... who cares. It's our game. We need not use additional classes even if they were provided.


Heathansson wrote:

I also foresee this conversation.

Player:
"Cool! Tian Xia! I wanna be a ninja!!!"

DM:
"Uuuuuh, Pathfinder has decided that ninjas are just rogues in ninja suits."

Player: mystifiedly;
".....oh......"

Ok you ninja'd me with that. That is what I meant when I said it'd be a good thing for marketing.


yet its the suit that makes the Ninja :)

Liberty's Edge

I think it would be absolute horsecrap for marketing, but nobody ever listens to me; they just tell me I was right a year or two from now.
Cassandra: it's my karma.


To be honest, I'm not that riled up on one side or another of the "ninja is or is not a class" themed discussion. I'm just hoping for mechanics that support the storyline and flavor of the material presented.

Now, after saying that, what I would like to see, I feel in my case, is best expressed by saying what lost me in previous "asian" themed settings.

In general, I think Rokugan was a stronger setting than Kara-Tur, but Rokugan never really felt like a D&D setting so much as a setting that was adapted to D&D (which I get is the case).

What lost me in Kara-Tur was the fact that long, long tracts of the setting material was eaten up by restating real world history and changing all of the proper names with Kara-Turn names. As a byproduct of this, there wasn't much "fantasy" in the background material.

While there were scattered references to the Copper Demon of Tros or the creation of the Dragonwall, we got a lot higher ratio of "The Emperor of X Dynasty sent upteen thousand troops to Y," and "The Society of A bribed many officials in the government of B," with hardly a mention of dragons or oni or giants or what have you in the modern era (which I emphasize, because most of the "fantasy" references occur long in the past of the setting).

What I did like in the setting had to do with the material that broke away from the above mold. The early Kara-Tur information was very much reworked historical material with very light fantasy flavoring, but Jeff Grubb's adventures (Ochimo the Spirit Warrior and Mad Monkey versus Dragon Claw), for example, really embraced supernnatural martial arts, spirit creatures, artifacts that can bind extra planar entities, demons, and rogue demi-gods.

So I guess what I'm saying is, I'd rather Tien Xia looked more like the "Grubbian" Kara-Tur than the really dry "desperately trying to be historically accurate for no good reason" initial supplements.


i like Cirno-Sama's idea of a Wuxia Hero style class with archtypes to represent samurai and ninja. i think the swordsage would be a fairly decent source of inspiriation. maybe a similar class with "Real" Class features and not just 2 "Virtual Feats" in 15 levels. and please don't just make it feel like a "per encounter caster." the manuevers should be something really special and nothing like what a spellcaster or magic item can do.

Liberty's Edge

Heathansson wrote:
meh....I want a ninja class that's not a "rogue in a ninja suit."

Why not? That's what a ninja is. The black pajamas are entirely a creation of Noh theater, where stagehands wore black uniforms to represent being "unseen." Ninja characters wore similar outfits, then took off their hoods to represent "appearing out of nowhere." Almost all of the huge lore about shadow warriors comes from Noh theater and later things; originally, shinobi were just spies and assassins with the occasional hint of minor mystical powers. Sounds like a rogue with minor magic (and maybe major magic) to me. Even if you take later black-clad, super-jumping, weird-powers ninjas... That's a monk with maxed-out Stealth. Or a rogue or monk with the shadowdancer prestige class.

A rogue reflects a ninja in the same way that it can reflect a pirate, a mobster, a street thug, a spy... You see where I'm going with this. We don't need a separate ninja class. If there's some sort of class archetype to represent a specific cultural thing, that's fine. But a new class is going too far, as would be a sub-class. There's no need. The existing rules work just fine.

Jeremy Puckett

Liberty's Edge

Kruelaid wrote:
It seems to me, all the quibbling aside here, that it would be good marketing to just take the base classes and Orientalize them with a few different characteristics and lots of new fluff, to adapt to a different cultural context.

While I dislike the term "Orientalizing," this can basically sum up my view on it too. The existing classes are broad enough to represent just about any concept, especially with the addition of class archetypes.

Jeremy Puckett


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
KnightErrantJR wrote:

To be honest, I'm not that riled up on one side or another of the "ninja is or is not a class" themed discussion. I'm just hoping for mechanics that support the storyline and flavor of the material presented.

Now, after saying that, what I would like to see, I feel in my case, is best expressed by saying what lost me in previous "asian" themed settings.

In general, I think Rokugan was a stronger setting than Kara-Tur, but Rokugan never really felt like a D&D setting so much as a setting that was adapted to D&D (which I get is the case).

What lost me in Kara-Tur was the fact that long, long tracts of the setting material was eaten up by restating real world history and changing all of the proper names with Kara-Turn names. As a byproduct of this, there wasn't much "fantasy" in the background material.

While there were scattered references to the Copper Demon of Tros or the creation of the Dragonwall, we got a lot higher ratio of "The Emperor of X Dynasty sent upteen thousand troops to Y," and "The Society of A bribed many officials in the government of B," with hardly a mention of dragons or oni or giants or what have you in the modern era (which I emphasize, because most of the "fantasy" references occur long in the past of the setting).

What I did like in the setting had to do with the material that broke away from the above mold. The early Kara-Tur information was very much reworked historical material with very light fantasy flavoring, but Jeff Grubb's adventures (Ochimo the Spirit Warrior and Mad Monkey versus Dragon Claw), for example, really embraced supernnatural martial arts, spirit creatures, artifacts that can bind extra planar entities, demons, and rogue demi-gods.

So I guess what I'm saying is, I'd rather Tien Xia looked more like the "Grubbian" Kara-Tur than the really dry "desperately trying to be historically accurate for no good reason" initial supplements.

Mad Monkey vs Dragon Claw was right out of a kung fu movie in style. loved that one and still have it ;)


Rathendar wrote:


Mad Monkey vs Dragon Claw was right out of a kung fu movie in style....

That was the first D&D adventure I actually ran from a module (I had run plenty of "my own" before), and it was the first time I really got into hamming up my portrayal of an NPC during the island training sequence.

I wish the whole OA line was more like that adventure.


Alright. Build that rogue = ninja (N)PC with the oriental flair. Pony it up.


can anyone post a 3rd level 25 point build pathfinder character that emulates the concept of the shrine maiden? without traits, while having the feel of Hakurei Reimu? using only the core ruelbook and the advanced player's guide?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Shuriken Nekogami wrote:
can anyone post a 3rd level 25 point build pathfinder character that emulates the concept of the shrine maiden? without traits, while having the feel of Hakurei Reimu? using only the core ruelbook and the advanced player's guide?

Take a bit of flavor tweaking to monte cook's runecaster. Instead of runes, they're ofuda. Change key stat to wisdom and tweak the class skills. ta daa.


hida_jiremi wrote:
Kruelaid wrote:
It seems to me, all the quibbling aside here, that it would be good marketing to just take the base classes and Orientalize them with a few different characteristics and lots of new fluff, to adapt to a different cultural context.

While I dislike the term "Orientalizing," this can basically sum up my view on it too. The existing classes are broad enough to represent just about any concept, especially with the addition of class archetypes.

Jeremy Puckett

Hehe. Not to be mistaken with Edward Said's Orientalism, yet still somehow in the line of tacky colonialist assumptions of the East, cuz that's what fantasy is about, right?


It seems a bit sad that with a whole continent to steal ideas from the only things most people seem to interested in talking about are ninjas and katana.

That said I would like rules for playing a stupid barbarian who dual-wields Katana and has a dog as an animal companion.

Also: Totoro


Ahhh yes Totoro. Anything from any Miyazaki movie for that matter, or Journey to the West and all the Chinese spinoffs.

Ninja. Katana. By and large westerners don't know much about Asia. For my part I can't wait to do a Tian Xia campaign and put my east Asian studies and a decades of China/Japan life to use in my gaming. I'll be back home permanently by the time Tian Xia comes out. There's just so much to distinguish a campaign fluff wise--I really frankly don't think classes need to be a big part of it. But still... Stuff I love:


  • Shinto nature spirits.
  • Chinese civilization, empire, and the struggle against social chaos. God emperors.
  • Tibetan sages.
  • Transforming fox femme fatales.
  • Daoism.... oooh Daoist mages and magic through self mastery.
  • Tai qi (soft style) fighters--like some old dude with a crooked staff who can turn your own attacks against you. Seriously bad ass close-in fighting.
  • The Chinese knight/hero/paladins, the youxia: sort of itinerant fighter heroes who were sworn to social justice.
  • Samurai. Not just knights? And ronin of course.
  • Geishas.
  • We already have monks, so Shaolin is done... nothing left there.
  • Chinese zodiac and associated feats.
  • A whole library of martial arts feats.
  • Wonder what they'll do with the gods. I really love the Chinese pantheon of gods.
  • Monsters. New dragons are a must.
  • Sentient animal heroes.
  • Architecture and civil engineering. Walls. Pagodas. Tiny winding streets in 2000 year old cities.
  • Ancient, round erosion blasted mountains. Young jagged peaks with frozen monasteries.

<giggle>

So excited.

Shadow Lodge

Kevin Mack wrote:
Not sure where you are getting the idea they were honourable unless you are going by modern versions of them. Kind of funny that many people are asking for an asian themed class yet want the westernised version of them.

Agreed. If anything, ninjas gained the reputation because of their distinct LACK of honor. Their focus was on stealth and quick kills...not combat in general. So once again...very much akin to the rogue.

Sovereign Court

Carpy DM wrote:
threadjack chit-chat continues
Spoiler:
CarpyDM wrote:

I'll send you a copy of my thesis when I finish it. ;)

I have a rather postcolonial view of British Renaissance and medieval literature, particularly in the wake of the Conquest (though the tradition of the British Isles getting flattened by some Continental imperial power and then slowly adapting to and absorbing elements of that power into the native cultural milieu goes back a long, long way). In particular, the view of the English toward their own culture, literature and language seems to reflect a deep disconnect between a nascent nationalism that runs throughout the period and an equal sense of inadequacy as compared with their Continental rivals, in particular France, with whom they shared a huge amount of complicated and bloody history. That kind of internal conflict is almost diagnostic of colonized cultures, and I think it explains a lot of English - and, in large part, British - history as a result.

To be honest, I think it's hard to describe any invaders of the British Isles except for the Romans as an 'imperial power'. Scandinavian and Norman chancers who took advantage of systemic problems within the British kingdoms would be more like it.

If we start with The Mabinogion and Beowulf, progress to Gerald of Wales and Geoffrey of Monmouth, then meander into Piers Plowman, Gawain and the Green Knight and Chaucer we eventually walk slap bang into Le Morte D' Arthur. After that it's Thomas More and then we bounce along to Wyatt, Spenser, Shakespeare, Marlowe and Kyd before the biggest beast in the room strolls up to you: The King James Bible. Obviously I'm skipping along at a pace but if we then hit Pope, Defoe and Fielding we can accelerate into the Lake poets, Blake, Byron and the Shelleys, Austen and Scott, Dickens, Carroll, Doyle, Wells, Tennyson, Dylan Thomas, Wilde, Hardy, Kipling, Eliot aargh - face melting from g-force, going too fast...

Of course, literature isn't the whole of culture but still. I think you can take my point that 'so much' of this cultural history is not absorbed with proving itself not-france.

I've not formally studied literature so I may not be appreciating what 'post-colonial' means.


GeraintElberion wrote:
Carpy DM wrote:
threadjack chit-chat continues
** spoiler omitted **...

[threadjack intrustion]

Spoiler:
Anything stepping back, or stepping out of the baggage of colonialsim and looking at it from the outside (trying anyway) is more or less 'postcolonial'. It's an interesting perspective (or group of theories whatever) in that it also implies the value of wanting to disengage our culture from our colonial roots, or fight against it--roots which are still part of our culture today (or are observed to be, anyway).

Postcolonialists like to rattle us into seeing how we're still part of the same old colonial/imperialist/sexist forces from which most of western culture is derived.

[/threadjack intrustion]

Silver Crusade

Kruelaid wrote:
Ahhh yes Totoro. Anything from any Miyazaki movie for that matter,

If you're going down that route I demand analogues of Lupin III and his gang operating across Golarion.

You did say any Miyazaki movie. ;)

Which actually opens it up for bringing in Earthsea elements, if you go crosseyed with it.


Pual wrote:

That said I would like rules for playing a stupid barbarian who dual-wields Katana and has a dog as an animal companion.

Also: Totoro

Only if you name the dog Ruferto. And I'm not sure if it counts as an animal companion if he's only still alive because things keep distracting your master from eating you. ;)

Sovereign Court

Kruelaid wrote:
GeraintElberion wrote:
Carpy DM wrote:
threadjack chit-chat continues
** spoiler omitted **...
[threadjack intrustion]** spoiler omitted **[/threadjack intrustion]

Thankyou Kruelaid, that's my 'something new' I learnt today :D


I don't really care if there's a ninja class or not.

I just find it kinda dumb that people are claiming we can't have any new base classes at all.

Liberty's Edge

ProfessorCirno wrote:

I don't really care if there's a ninja class or not.

I just find it kinda dumb that people are claiming we can't have any new base classes at all.

hell; just don't use the class. Why is that such a big deal.


hida_jiremi wrote:
Heathansson wrote:
meh....I want a ninja class that's not a "rogue in a ninja suit."

Why not? That's what a ninja is. The black pajamas are entirely a creation of Noh theater, where stagehands wore black uniforms to represent being "unseen." Ninja characters wore similar outfits, then took off their hoods to represent "appearing out of nowhere." Almost all of the huge lore about shadow warriors comes from Noh theater and later things; originally, shinobi were just spies and assassins with the occasional hint of minor mystical powers. Sounds like a rogue with minor magic (and maybe major magic) to me. Even if you take later black-clad, super-jumping, weird-powers ninjas... That's a monk with maxed-out Stealth. Or a rogue or monk with the shadowdancer prestige class.

A rogue reflects a ninja in the same way that it can reflect a pirate, a mobster, a street thug, a spy... You see where I'm going with this. We don't need a separate ninja class. If there's some sort of class archetype to represent a specific cultural thing, that's fine. But a new class is going too far, as would be a sub-class. There's no need. The existing rules work just fine.

Jeremy Puckett

No, that's what a HISTORICAL ninja is.

We're talking fantasy ninja when we ask for a Ninja class. No, not a Rogue/Sorcerer or Monk/Sorcerer. We want something that's a mixture of monk and rogue without resorting to all the multiclassing. It needs to be unique. It needs to also have staple ninja abilities that neither the rogue nor the monk grants.

Now, I don't mean Naruto ninja, what I do mean is something close to the ninja WotC produced in Complete Adventurer, if not a lot better.

Also, according to your logic, we have no need for a Barbarian, Bard, Monk, Ranger, or Paladin.

A Barbarian can just be a Fighter with a tribal background.
A Bard can be a Rogue/Sorcerer with ranks in Perform.
A Monk can be a Fighter/Rogue/Sorcerer with Improved Unarmed Strike feat.
A Ranger can be a Fighter/Druid with TWF or Archery feats and maxed out Survival.
A Paladin can be a Cleric/Fighter.

However, all of them are their own class with very unique and distinct abilities. A Ninja can be the same thing

Liberty's Edge

Razz wrote:
hida_jiremi wrote:
We're talking fantasy ninja when we ask for a Ninja class.

Did you miss me mentioning the fantasy ninja in there? Go back and read my post again. You still don't need a new base class for that.

Jeremy Puckett


hida_jiremi wrote:


Did you miss me mentioning the fantasy ninja in there? Go back and read my post again. You still don't need a new base class for that.

Jeremy Puckett

Agreed.


I'd like to ask that we move on from the Ninja.

There are like, three ninja threads, ACTIVE.

If you people think the only thing in east Asia worth playing in an RPG is a ninja or a samurai, please recall that there is 5000 years of Asian history with some truly amazing and epic stories that played out before ninja and samurai ever came onto the scene much later and in a tiny corner of the domain of interest.

Can we have some discussions about that? Because if Golarion's Tian Xia ends up like Rokugan II I am jumping ship NOW.

I think "Sage" would be an awesome class. He could have wuwei powers, battlefield control stuff, all deriving from his harmony with the universe. I'll take that over a ninja any day.

Shadow Lodge

Ninja build at 1st, 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels. 20 point buy. Core Rules + APG only. Fairly mystical version of the ninja.


Kthulhu wrote:
Ninja build at 1st, 5th, 10th, 15th, and 20th levels. 20 point buy. Core Rules + APG only. Fairly mystical version of the ninja.

Take it to a ninja thread please. We discuss Tian Xia here.


Evil Lincoln wrote:

I'd like to ask that we move on from the Ninja.

There are like, three ninja threads, ACTIVE.

If you people think the only thing in east Asia worth playing in an RPG is a ninja or a samurai, please recall that there is 5000 years of Asian history with some truly amazing and epic stories that played out before ninja and samurai ever came onto the scene much later and in a tiny corner of the domain of interest.

Can we have some discussions about that? Because if Golarion's Tian Xia ends up like Rokugan II I am jumping ship NOW.

I think "Sage" would be an awesome class. He could have wuwei powers, battlefield control stuff, all deriving from his harmony with the universe. I'll take that over a ninja any day.

Yeah, I tried to throw in my issues with how Kara-Tur worked for me, but it only "re-railed" things briefly, ;)

Dark Archive

Adds nothing to the conversation:
I'm of the opinion that a ninja should just be a monk archetype. I honestly would consider not picking up a book with a full Ninja class in it, but I'm weird that way.

==
AKA 8one6


Ninjas for the most part are Rogue base class and maybe some Monk class. Monk makes sense as many ninja are lawful following strict codes and are masters of hand to hand combat and are big on the meditation. Just add the feat throw anything...

Those that are more combat orientated have some Fighter for the many and varied weapons they use and the emense skill in wich they use them.

Some have Ranger for the bush survival and cammoflage.

For the Wu-Jen you would use the Witch or the Alchemist from the Players Handbook 2. As the Wu-Jen are crazy hermit Witches or Wizards anyway. And pare up with Rogue.

For the Sohei or warrior priests depending on the temple you could go Cleric/Rogue or For the more Lawful Good Shinto Temple - Paladin/Rogue; stealthily moving to boldly intercept enemies of the temple like Demons and Ogre Mages :)

For the assasinating Ninja go for the Rogue and take levels in Assassin :) Or Monk/Assassin or Monk/Rogue/Assassin :)


And as I have mentioned Asia is filled with examples of Psionic class people - The Yogi (Psion), Various Tibetan Priests (Psion), Various East Indian Warriors using Kalaripayutu - (Psiwarrior)... Shaolin Monk- Monk and in some stories Monks with Psion or Fist of Zuoken, and throughout China and much of Asia Wandering Psiwarriors Chi (Ki) Masters... that wernt monks. Dirvishes in the middle east - (Psiwarriors) and (Psions). Wandering Dessert Mystics (Psions or Wilders), the Muslim Al-Jeddi; Mystics Warriors with Swords of Light (Jedi Knights) or (Soulknives).

Mind there were the Witches and Wu-Jen, Alchemists, Warrior Priests (Clerics or Paladins), Shukenja (Clerics), Sages, Shamans up in Siberia and Mongolia and Northern Japanese Islands (the Ainu, who were white by the way) and who knows how many other great and wonderful things... :)


greatamericanfolkhero wrote:

** spoiler omitted **

==
AKA 8one6

I disagree; it does add something to the conversation.

If enough people agree with YOU, then everything I am saying is a moot point, and I have to stfu or look like a douche.


I hope they do something more with the overland rout from Tian Xia to the Realm of the Mammoth Lords. That sounds like a fun thing.

And I hope that their Oriental realm is just a bid different :) I dont want it to be anything like Rokugan and I loved Kara Tur, but I would like somethig a little different. Oriental to be sure.

India (Vudra) has the Psi they have alluded to... maybe Mongolia with some Iceage, white Dragons and such. Thailand with Dinosaurs. Chinese with hot air balloon flying ships with balista.


I was thinking, a place called Xaos, with chaos monks.
I don't know what chaos monks are, but they're chaotic.
AND they're monks. They can punch you, and I think your skin melts off in smoking chunks of protoentropy.

Sovereign Court

Shizvestus wrote:


I hope they do something more with the overland rout from Tian Xia to the Realm of the Mammoth Lords. That sounds like a fun thing.

Something more than an entire Adventure Path.

I'm tired or I would throw up some links, try searching for Jade Regent.


Heathansson wrote:
ProfessorCirno wrote:

I don't really care if there's a ninja class or not.

I just find it kinda dumb that people are claiming we can't have any new base classes at all.

hell; just don't use the class. Why is that such a big deal.

+1


Jade Regent Cool thanks :)


Spanky the Leprechaun wrote:

I was thinking, a place called Xaos, with chaos monks.

I don't know what chaos monks are, but they're chaotic.
AND they're monks. They can punch you, and I think your skin melts off in smoking chunks of protoentropy.

Me wants shiny munchkin xaos monk plz.

Liberty's Edge

Ainu analog and Orang-pendak please.

*holds finger over "THE BUTTON"*


Is there a write up anywhere that describes what is or may be in the Tian Xia source book?

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Kerobelis wrote:

Is there a write up anywhere that describes what is or may be in the Tian Xia source book?

Nope. Not yet. And despite the title of this thread... we haven't officially announced a Tian Xia book yet, in the sense of "Putting a product page up for the book."

Silver Crusade

Studpuffin wrote:

Ainu analog and Orang-pendak please.

*holds finger over "THE BUTTON"*

Considering how badly the Ainu get ignored in Japan itself, YES, THIS.


James Jacobs wrote:
Kerobelis wrote:

Is there a write up anywhere that describes what is or may be in the Tian Xia source book?

Nope. Not yet. And despite the title of this thread... we haven't officially announced a Tian Xia book yet, in the sense of "Putting a product page up for the book."

Thanks for the update. I admit your secret plan of open playtesting the ninja / samurai have made me think fondly of playing 3.0 Oriental adventures again...


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Mikaze wrote:
Studpuffin wrote:

Ainu analog and Orang-pendak please.

*holds finger over "THE BUTTON"*

Considering how badly the Ainu get ignored in Japan itself, YES, THIS.

Well, at least we got Utawarerumono. :p


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

With the right mix of Kara-Tur fluff, the 3.0 Oriental Adventures creates some WONDERFUL adventure opportunities "in the East."

One of the reasons I'm *Soooooo* excited about Tian Xia is that the folks here at Paizo seem to have captured (re-discovered?) that classic "Grubb-ian" (BTW, what a great adjective, KnightErrantJR) feel of great tabletop fun mixed with "serious" fantasy; add Monte Cook to that list also. If the Design Teams here at Paizo can bring the same creative magic to Tian Xia that they've created in Golarion then it should be a tremendous boon to the whole system!

TO: KnightErrantJR and Rathendar:
I know it's a great risk to wonderful memories; HOWEVER, if you haven't gone back and played *Ochimo* or *Mad Monkey* with a 3.X refit then you're missing out. It still brings tons of smiles around the table!

To J.J.
*THANK YOU* for not handing Tian Xia off to a group of new writers or treating it like a "back-burner" project. It was great to read that every author involved in the Jade Regent AP has experience writing for an earlier AP. I can hardly wait! Thank you, thank you, thank you!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
NorthernOkie wrote:

With the right mix of Kara-Tur fluff, the 3.0 Oriental Adventures creates some WONDERFUL adventure opportunities "in the East."

One of the reasons I'm *Soooooo* excited about Tian Xia is that the folks here at Paizo seem to have captured (re-discovered?) that classic "Grubb-ian" (BTW, what a great adjective, KnightErrantJR) feel of great tabletop fun mixed with "serious" fantasy; add Monte Cook to that list also. If the Design Teams here at Paizo can bring the same creative magic to Tian Xia that they've created in Golarion then it should be a tremendous boon to the whole system!

TO: KnightErrantJR and Rathendar:
I know it's a great risk to wonderful memories; HOWEVER, if you haven't gone back and played *Ochimo* or *Mad Monkey* with a 3.X refit then you're missing out. It still brings tons of smiles around the table!

To J.J.
*THANK YOU* for not handing Tian Xia off to a group of new writers or treating it like a "back-burner" project. It was great to read that every author involved in the Jade Regent AP has experience writing for an earlier AP. I can hardly wait! Thank you, thank you, thank you!

i consider it from time to time. it's on one of my back burner simmering ideas. mostly waiting for a good pc party that would enjoy it.

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