Yucale, welcome to the boards. Hope you find what you're looking for here.
Creative Director
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Welcome to the boards, Yucale! And I hope that folks drop in to chat! :-)
And for the record, I agree 100% with your observation about how a lot of gamers are pretty dense and unwelcoming to new gamers. I'm not sure why that attitude exists, but it does, and it frustrates me as well.
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Judging by 600 posts Yucale isn't new to the boards Mair...
Edit: And JJ too :P...
I'm sorry you've had a negative experience thus far on these forums and any others Yucale. I had similar problems when I was a few years younger joining the Games society at my university. People were not new person friendly, and tried to continually tell me the RP systems I played and the books I read are bad because 'blah blah blah' (not willing to bother writing the drivel they said). It aggravated me to an extreme, but I found like-minded people eventually, or at least people who can accept a difference in opinion.
Anyway, your thread struck a cord with me so I thought i'd at least say hello- and i'm happy to discuss 4E, Lotr, Twilight and the Legend of Drizzt books. I only finished Salvatore's last book a few months ago, and only got to reading them in the first place a couple of years back in my late teens.
Try and remember on forums, people don't often post to agree with something; they are likely to simply have lurked and read the posts- they may read through and only react if they feel negatively about something, which is often how it happens on forums sadly.
I too find the attitude frustrating, and always do all I can to try and welcome people to the hobbies I love.
Hello Yucale,
I'd like to think you'll find some folks on here who are agreeable. Of the books you mentioned, I am interested or a fan of some of them. I'll have to get back here at later to add to the discussion.
For now, I'm sorry to hear you have had a rough go of it here.
Gamer mentors - what a wonderful idea! Would be so much more fun than being introduced to what you correctly perceive as an often immature and confrontational hobby group (irony intended).
Welcome, and when you're ready to talk board games, let me know! ;)
Hello!
I hope you find what you are looking for as well. As an old gamer, I can still remember running into situations like you’ve mentioned, especially in regards to not knowing any gaming mentors. Figuring out this hobby was hard enough. If there was an internet when I was your age and if I had run into some of the elitist attitudes that can be found on the boards, I may have not pursued the hobby much further.
I also recall trying to join a RPG club in college. I ran into more elitist attitude there than I did when I checked out fraternities during rush. Luckily, I was able to find some friends who were also interested in gaming, and some of us are still getting together for games 20 to 25 years later.
Regarding the books, I read some of those years ago. I really enjoyed Salvatore’s work with Drizzt. I think some of the negative attitude toward that character may stem from the number of DMs are on these boards, and these old DMs have seen far too many Drizzt copies and such brought as PCs to their games. But there’s a reason that so many people would like to play a drow ranger fighting with two scimitars, right? Salvatore created a very interesting fantasy character. I have friends who still re-read the books, enjoy them, and wouldn’t mind playing such a character in my games.
Hello, and welcome to the boards!
I understand your frustration, as well. Enjoyment of fantasy, regardless of medium, is a personal experience; I've found that my own enjoyment of a thing--in regards to gaming, books, etc.--mainly depends on one thing: it captures my imagination.
Everybody has different tastes, and unfortunately us fantasy-lovers sometimes forget that our own personal inclinations are not the "right" or "only" way. It is not "badwrongfun" to enjoy reading tales of Drizzt or Hogwarts or teenage vampires any more than any other fantasy story, if that's what you enjoy. I'm just glad the genre is still alive, and going strong.
I think that sometimes our imaginations are so captured by stories that thrill us that we forget that not everyone has they same views or preferences. I, too, have been guilty of this! But, at the end of the day, there is no "wrong" way to imagine--or a "right" way.
Have fun, use your imagination, and be yourself--regardless of what anybody else's tastes are! I hope that Pathfinder, 4E, or any other game you play is as rewarding for you as it is for me!
It is odd that in an already marginalized group, we gamers tend to further marginalize each other rather than accepting that we're all glorious geeks.
At the same time, it is worth noting that almost everything that anyone says on the Internet should be read with an, "in my opinion" at the end. Some folks unfortunately have a habit of writing their opinion so it seems like they're trying to present facts.
As to the topics you listed, I absolutely love three of the five there, and I'm eager to read Mistborn at some point. I'm not keen on Drizzt, but I can civilly discuss why I'm not a fan while acknowledging that Salvatore does have a lot of strengths as a writer, if that helps.
Hi Yucale,
For a 13 yr old you have a way with words.
I agree with you for the most part the hobby "should" be alot more newbie friendly and with people like you speaking out maybe it will be.
As far as authors I have never read terry prachet either and I dislike Lord of the rings and the hobbit so much it can't be described in words strongly enough. I fully acknowledge tolkiens contributions in creating the genre we have today but I look at his work like a car. His work was the model A that barely got 35 miles an hour but for the time it was top of the line. Now days it's a little too boreing.
I used to love the drizzit series and have read the first 6 or 7 in the series but after that I just couldn't care anymore. I liked the war of the spider queen series better and the daughter of the drow was much more enjoyable to me. My favorite FR series is "The Darkwalker on the Moonshae" series by Dougals Niles. I recommend that to anyone that loves the realms.
The narnia series is a little too religious for my taste, a good read but I didn't care for the overly christian nature of the series.
I have played war craft for years and see no reason why you shouldn't love it as much as everyone else does just remember "FOR THE HORDE!!" and that the undead are people too. :)
One last thing I would like to bring up in defense of us "old guard" depending on the type of gameing groups your trying to join the adults may not know how to relate to you as a young lady.
The youngest person in my gameing group is the new guy at 28 and he's bringing his wife along so she can get back into gameing after haveing finishd her aerospace engineering degree. None of us have kids and I think that could be a similar situation in your case. The adults may seem hostile to you but they simply do not know how to relate to you becaause of the age diffrence. If your trying to game with a group of teenage boys thats a whole other situation because of their immaturity. I wish you luck in finding a good group. Hope to hear more from you, I think you perspective as a young adult will be very intresting.
Team Jacob.
Hey, welcome Yucale. I'm sorry you've had such trouble with older gamers or finding gaming mentors, and no, you should not be ashamed of what you love. I've been where you are before, and in many cases I am still there now- many of my opinions are unpopular(I hate Buffy, Firefly, Dollhouse, Xena and Hercules), but noone here has ever did their best to keep me from expressing them, although I do get ribbed for it every now and again. I've never read Twilight though my friends love to make fun of it, and I hate Drizzt with a burning passion that cannot be put into words, but I have no problem with LotR, Earthsea, or Narnia(love the movies), and I LOVE BRANDON SANDERSON AND CAN'T WAIT FOR HIM TO FINISH THE WHEEL OF TIME!!!! I find it's better to build on what we have in common than fight over the things we don't. This genre is too small to be as exclusive as it can get sometimes.
Yucale, welcome aboard.
The attitude that annoys you is, I'm afraid, a symptom of the legendary social ineptitude of our people synergized by the anonymity of the internet. Speaking as an old guy, I find it annoying too and must constantly be on guard not to develop it myself.
If it is not condescending, you write very well indeed for a thirteen year old.
Regarding what you want to talk about --
I would like to discuss the following topics on this thread, if others will reply with lack of negativity or condescension;
-The Legend of Drizzt
-The Earthsea Cycle by Ursula K. Le Guin
-Mistborn by Brandon Sanderson
-Narnia
-LotR
Let's start with Earthsea. I'm a fan. World flavor, naming magic, writing style, characterization. LeGuin got them all right I think.
I used to LOVE the story of Drizzt, but I think the character has outgrown himself.
And what I mean by that I feel his development has stagnated.
Now a series I do love and others might not feel the same about: Raymond Feist's Midkemia novels are always good for me.
I did cut my teeth on Tolkien, and love The Hobbit to this day. The LotR series will always hold a special place in my heart, but doesn't hold a spot in my top 10-100 lol.
Though I will admit I've read just about every Dragonlance novel ever produced with always the heart of the 10 year old I was when I picked up Dragons of Autumn Twilight.
As far as gaming goes I'm running a group with my best firends son, 14, and a friend of mine who's never gamed before in her life. It's a matter of finding a group that is willing to work with you.
I started a new group for kingmaker this last weekend, and had someone I'm giving another week before I ask him to not come back. He's the type of gamer that feels they know everything about gaming and every game and tried to brag throughout of his knowledge of this, that, and the other, to the point where he became condenscending to my youngest group member, and my friend who's playing her second char ever. Please don't let the "elitest" gamer turn you off from enjoyment of a game.
I've never seen him/her before, so he's/she's new to me...and I can easily imagine 600 total posts being a new person.
Yucale: Love LeGuin, though I've only read the first two books, and I came to her work as an adult. Love Narnia: I'm cautiously hopeful for the new movie. As far as Tolkien is concerned, I'm listening to the Silmarillion audio book right now. If you haven't read it, I recommend starting with the audio book, especially if you can find it at your local library, instead of trying to read it for the first time. What are most kids your age playing these days? 4e? I guess that makes sense, although it's not where I'd recommend anybody start, for what it's worth.
Howdy and to echo the sentiments of a few other posters, very well written and interesting, thought provoking post.
I think that those of us who would be welcoming and warm tend to be quieter than the vocal minority of people who make you feel the way you do perhaps because of temperament.
Throughout my life I have tried to get young people into gaming because it provided such a powerful and positive valence in my life and I would love for others to experience the joy of discovery and the deeply informative process of exploring archetypes and even participating in and coming to ownership of classic story lines the way I did when I was younger.
I started gaming at around 8 or 9 years old. I was lucky to have a great group of guys to play with even back then. My experience with gamers has been universally welcoming and satisfying, but I recognize I have been lucky.
My 12 year old daughter played Pathfinder with us over the last two weeks while she was visiting from Colorado, and my group made every effort to make her feel inclusive and cut the "That's what she said" and the like to a minimum. I am so proud of them and also of her. She embraced the core concepts better than some (adult) gamers who have been playing as long as I have and fully embraced role playing.
She was an active and thoughtful participant and made me feel like she really had something to offer the group. At the end of Monday's session, I presented her with her own set of dice (my old "character killers") and a dice bag. I think she's a full fledged gamer now.
I hope your experience continues in a more positive vein and look forward to discussing some of your literary choices. I myself cut my teeth on Narnia and Tolkien's universe and continue to hold those books and many others in high regard. I think the idea of a world greater than ours where ordinary people could do and become extraordinary things is what appealed most to me about the books and eventually the game.
Thanks for posting and getting this discussion going!
Where to begin? ...
Yucale, the "age discrimination" you describe isn't just a gamer thing - as you get older and out into the greater world, you'll find its a symptom of social elitism that we, as humans, enjoy. You'll see it in school, high school or university, where the Senior class scoffs the Freshmen (though only a few years separate them, age wise, and neither has any experience). You'll see it in industry, where folks with 30 years in the job will raise a condescending eyebrow to the 20-year old turk with the new ideas.
Don't get frustrated, just see it for what it is... If you run into that attitude, just nod and smile, while secretly plotting their public humiliation! :)
I admire your bold post! Not all gamers are social introverts, and any grouping of people has its collection of jerks. Often the jerks are just more vocal.
"Geek Culture"
Oh, that's a tempting phrase...
It is difficult to learn about and integrate yourself in a subculture wherein each member seems determined to prove that he/she knows best and will not budge an inch from that opinion, even when they allow others their own opinion. While I admire individualism and understand the desire to converse intelligently about a subject one has a passion for, is it any wonder that the current generation of young gamers is leaning towards World of Warcraft and 4E when the more traditional, "sophisticated" group of geeks are so apparently anti-newbie? Not all of us are fortunate enough to have gaming mentors or older, well-read friends in real life.
Since you are young, you have obviously not been introduced to the first rule of being a member of the geek culture on the internet. That rule is this: While we must all like the same things, we must not like each other. We will expect you to adjust your attitudes accordingly from the point on.
Seriously, though, while I see what you mean, I'm not sure I agree with your implication that pen & paper gamers are chasing new players into WoW with their inhospitability. I've always seen a lot of welcoming of newbies in p&p gaming, but World of Warcraft is one of the most newbie-hostile games I've ever seen.
As for fiction preferences, the ability to discuss something critically does not mean that negatively critical views should be taken as condemnation. The problem with doing so in a discussion forum is that people take criticism of something they like as condemnation of themselves. If one person says that he found a particular series of books [insert a negative adjective], someone else who enjoyed them will take offense to that as a personal insult to his literary tastes, or even his character.
There's a lot of overlap of what we like in this group. If you were to make a multi-dimensional Venn diagramm, there wouldn't be a lot of circles with just one layer. But people do tend to focus on those differences, rather than the similarities. But you do have to admit that that does make for more interesting discussion. To paraphrase the old saying, when two people in a conversation agree on everything, then one of them is unnecessary.
I'm a "gamer mentor" in that I'm introducing my kids to gaming. My wife and I have been quite open about gaming systems and have taught the kids the basics of D&D 3.5, D&D 4E, and Pathfinder.
Of the book series you mentioned...
The Legend of Drizzt - I've read up through The Thousand Orcs and just recently introduced my 13 year old son to the series. He is enjoying them immensely.
The Earthsea Cycle by Ursula K. Le Guin - I haven't read it but my wife has and enjoyed it.
Mistborn by Brandon Sanderson - I havent' read it but my wife says that Sanderson's continuation of Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time is actually better, in some ways, than Jordan's own books.
Narnia - Loved this series as a kid, tried introducing it to my kids who found it boring. :P
LotR - Loved the movies, found the books hard to get through.
And, as an aside, I happen to thoroughly enjoy the Twilight series as well. :D
Good gaming to you and I hope the negative attitudes you've encountered don't dissuade you from continuing in the hobby. :D
when two people in a conversation agree on everything, then one of them is unnecessary.
Nice quote, now I have to look it up.
Yeah I know, I did not add anything to this conversation.
Yucale,
For the record I despise both Twilight and Drizzt. But I'd never deride you for enjoying them. I know what that feels like to be on the receiving end of that sort of thing. It's one thing not to care for something, it's another thing to put someone else on blast for liking those things. The first is fine, the second is someone being a douche. Dont tolerate the 2nd. Those same older gamers who do that may know a lot about fantasy literature and gaming but they obviously know very little about being a decent human being. Move on.
I'm also not a fan of 4E. But if that's what floats your boat? Go for it. Enjoy yourself. As long as you're having fun who gives a fig what some greybeard thinks about your unabashed love for all things Edward (or Jacob. or Whatever...).
You'll find that the RPG is just a polarized as any other group. 4E people dont like Pathfinder people. 3.5 players dont like pathfinder. Old-school gamers hate everything that isnt old school. Hero system hates Mutants and Masterminds. PC's hate Macs. In the end I personally have resolved to love my hobbies even though I have a pretty high level of contempt for the fandom. Find people that you like to game and spend time with and hold on to them for as long as you can. That way is the path to WIN. Anything else = FAIL.
Welcome!
You're obviously a bright 13yo as your use of language betrays your intellect.
That said, I'm the father of almost 11yo twins who are now fully getting into gaming. They share my biases though and stay away from 4e. Not that they could afford to buy the insane amount of books WotC puts out these days, it's a larger amount than I remember from 3e.
I steered away from WoW because I was an EQ player and WoW was full of cheating Battlenet jerks. It wasn't original in the least, it was just a melting pot of other games, true Blizzard must have done something right, (of course saying you have 11 million people playing when clearly there are basementers who run 6 accounts, and the number of dual accounts probably dwarfs EQ's dual accounts, is clearly misleading.)
I have not read the Legend of Driz'zt or Narnia. I have read lots of the original Driz'zt novels, and my kids currently have them in their trunk of stuff to read. (along with 100 other books.)
I did read lots of the Dragonlance novels when they came out...
I attempted to read Lord of the Rings, but it was not written in a style I enjoyed.
I haven't read the Twilight series, I have read Anne Rice instead. Just not interested.
If you enjoy Alice in Wonderland, you should try Unlondon by China Mieville! It's fantastic.
If you enjoy Steampunk try the Mortal Engines series by Phillip Reeves.
If you want a cheap RPG with endless possibilities, check out Savage Worlds.
If you want a classic that has depth and character, and doesn't have a Vancian magic system check out Earthdawn 3e. High Fantasy at it's finest.
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Well, I'm sorry that you've had bad experiences here, and with gaming in general. Not all of us "old-school" geeks are anti-newbie.
I don't care for Twilight, but other than the ridiculousness of sparkly vampires I don't really have anything against it either.
MMOs like WOW have never really appealed to me.
The Forgotten Realms have never really interested me, either as a setting or the fiction. I read the Silverfire Saga, and it just seems overly bloated with ridiculously powerful characters for my tastes.
4e doesn't appeal to me for a variety of reasons. From what I've seen, they made random fluff changes for no real reason that I can fathom. And mechanically it seems that your choice of class is more of a superficial thing than having any real impact on how you play the game.
Never read any Earthsea or Mistborn.
I like the earlier Narnia novels, but the last few got a bit preachy, and the last one was so amazingly transparent in it's agenda that I could barely stomach it.
LotR is obviously a classic.
If you like horror and science fiction as well as fantasy, I suggest trying out H. P. Lovecraft.
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-The Legend of Drizzt
-The Earthsea Cycle by Ursula K. Le Guin
-Mistborn by Brandon Sanderson
-Narnia
-LotR
Well, you are a person after my own heart...while I started reading Fantasy with David Eddings, you're starting with some more "adult" style fiction. Good for you, on that.
Now, not sure what you're looking to discuss relative to each of these collections, and not sure where you are in the reading of them, but...
Drizzt is a good place to start with fantasy novels. It's fast paced, has lots of action, and lots of interesting, memorable characters. A lot of people are sick of Drizzt himself not for Salvatore's writing, but the endless swarm of clones that character spawned. There's just something about a "lone wolf, exiled Good Drow" that sets some people's teeth on edge.
There ARE some excellent graphic novels following the 1st couple of books of his cycle. I highly recommend checking them out.
Earthsea, I remember reading back in the day. I don't remember much of it, but it was decent for me at the time. Nothing really stood out there, though.
Mistborn, I am not familiar with. Sorry.
The Chronicles of Narnia, I love and enjoy immensely. It's written in such a manner as to be accessible to younger readers, but still carries a lot of narrative punch and honest liturgical weight. Excellent choice!
And, of course, The Lord of the Rings. I'm not going to lie, Tolkien irritates me more than almost any other author I've read. He switches tenses, changes characters without a good break, and introduces parts of his stories in the most inopportune times, only to drop the thread and pick it back up much later. He's still the king of Fantasy Lit for a couple of reasons.
1: The language is simple gorgeous, and flows very well. Try reading passages out loud sometime, I think you'll be surprised.
2: he was first. no other speculative fiction author has changed the frame of reference so much
Well, that was lot of nothing to say, eh?
I recommend
The Saga of Recluce by L.E. Modesitt Jr. It's about 14 or 15 books deep now, and ranges from "sci-fi refugees vs. barbarians" to "world-spanning-imperial war stories" to "boy meets girl" bits. Very well executed, lively language, and excellent world-building background.
The Belgariad and Mallorean chronicles by David Eddings are each 5 book cycles centered around a World-Creation and World-Destruction mythos. The characters are memorable, the action is lively, and it's very satisfying in total.
Terry Pratchet, as you've heard of, has fantastic work, all over the place and generally laugh yourself silly funny.
China Mieville's Perdido Street Station is absolutely fantastic. It mixes social-dynamics, magic/technology, morality, and corrupt politicians into a spectacular novel.
Finally, as a little more "adult" themed, Matthew Woodring Stover's "Heroes Die" "Blade of Tyshalle" and "Caine Black Knife" are amongst the best action-stories I have ever read. Caine himself is fantastic, and the various characters you get to know all stand on their own as believable and realistic. Be warned, there are some very nasty, twisted things that take place.
It's very good to see youngsters in search of good fiction, keep it up!
Why is everyone treating this post as a new person post and saying welcome aboard? Lol...
Indeed. Weird.
RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
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Dern kid. Get off my lawn.
But srsly though, congratulations on being so articulate for a 13 year old!
If folks on these boards seem intolerant and angry, that's because we are. We're opinionated and huffy and often downright rude. Then we step away from the keyboard and turn back into decent human beings. Just remember that message boards are where people go to discuss and for some folks "discuss" means "argue."
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
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Also, peoples' tastes change over time. You might dig on Twilight now, then in a few years decide that Heinlein or Dan Simmons are more your speed. Or you might like Twilight forever. I got into RPGs at age 11 with the Robotech RPG, which appealed to me because I grew up watching those cartoons. I recently bought the Robotech DVD boxed set and you know what? I still like it. Yep, the American Macek version that all the hardcore anime geeks nerdrage on because it isn't the Japanese original. So geek out on whatever you like and don't worry if your immediate geek community doesn't share your tastes. (P.S. the very most hypocritical geeks are sports geeks. If you can quote baseball statistics do not tell me that I'm a geek because I play Dungeons and Dragons.)
I've read the Silmarillion twice :). Haven't gotten through the Lost Tales yet, though.
I'm impressed! You're ready for the Children of Hurin, then.
Hi Yucale,
I think I know what you mean about a certain kind of attitude. Maybe it's not what you mean, but I can tell you that there will always be those who drop into threads for no other reason than to crap on them. It really has nothing to do with your age.
You might be 13, but you're now at the maturity level where you can say "I like what I like, you telling me you think it's stupid is not going to change that," which basically puts you at a maturity level past many adults I know.
Personally, I have way more respect for people who share opinions about what they think is awesome, as opposed to those who only post to say something is lame.
Anyway, that makes you awesome in my book!
By the way, if someone seems like they are just saying really crappy things to you, my best advice is to not respond, because they feed off the conflict.
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I'm not a fan of Twilight, but I can tolerate it (and I even enjoyed the first book). I simply used it as an example of what background knowledge I have acquired.
1.) Edward looks like a creepy clown with a bad makeup job
2.) sparkly vampires? really?
Never read them and dont plan to ever see the movies. Not saying it doesn't appeal to some but for me: If it sparkles and can go out in daylight w/o bursting into flames, that's not a vampire, that's a fey....
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I can't quite join the intense debates (murderous opinion battles) yet, until I'm better read in the general field of literature and other aspects of "geek culture".
I'm flattered by how many posts this thread has got.
Oh, I dunno, most people I know have never let their lack of information about / understanding of a certain topic get in the way of a good argument. And yes, on occasion, I include myself in that.
As for drawing lots of replies, I think most of us here like to think this is a fairly friendly community. So if you express that you don't find it to be so, lots of us will want to know how we can try to make it better for you. That's all just speculation on my part, though.
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If it sparkles and can go out in daylight w/o bursting into flames, that's not a vampire, that's a fey....
Would you be interested in attending a carnival? It's especially prepared for people who think like you.
The other way around. I think the books are better, except for the fact that the books can have a definite racist and sexist tone.Welcome to the madhouse!
Just curious about Narnia, did you come to the books from the movies, or the other way 'round?
Hi, Yucale!
You might be interested to read an essay called "Masking the Misogynist in Narnia and Glome" by Kath Filmer, a Celtic researcher and authority on CS Lewis. I encountered it in "Bloom's Modern Critical Views: C.S. Lewis." Public libraries often have volumes in this series. If they don't have it, ask them to order it. I think most libraries will gladly order recent literary criticism about a popular 'serious' writer.
Oh, if you haven't tried them yet, you might also be interested in Mervyn Peake's 'Gormenghast' novels. They are widely recognized as classics in the genre. You might find the style and vocabulary a bit stiff (I don't mean because you are a young reader, because judging from your posts you are a stronger reader than most adults, but simply because it is frankly challenging.)
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If it sparkles and can go out in daylight w/o bursting into flames, that's not a vampire, that's a fey....Would you be interested in attending a carnival? It's especially prepared for people who think like you.
** spoiler omitted **
*scratches head* not sure what you're trying to say Kthulhu...I was commenting how, from what I've heard, the author didn't know much about traditional vampires which is why hers seem to stand out...
I can't quite join the intense debates (murderous opinion battles) yet, until I'm better read in the general field of literature and other aspects of "geek culture".
I'm flattered by how many posts this thread has got.
Oh, I dunno, most people I know have never let their lack of information about / understanding of a certain topic get in the way of a good argument. And yes, on occasion, I include myself in that.
As for drawing lots of replies, I think most of us here like to think this is a fairly friendly community. So if you express that you don't find it to be so, lots of us will want to know how we can try to make it better for you. That's all just speculation on my part, though.
Part of the problem is that we as messageboard writers and readers often forget that it is difficult to convey tone through this medium. This kind of misunderstanding pops up often, someone writing something which is simply misconstrued.
When speaking of Narnia and LotR, it's interesting that Tolkien and Lewis were close friends. Even more interesting is that Tolkien was a devout Catholic whereas Lewis was either agnostic or atheist.
Also interesting is that they were two leading scholars and academicians who are immensely popular. I probably wouldn't put it this way, but in typically scathing Harold Bloom fashion, he says,"That a major Renaissance scholar, C.S. Lewis, should now be a hero to millions of Americans who scarcely can read is merely social irony." I'm guessing he would extend that comment to Tolkien and his fans.
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When speaking of Narnia and LotR, it's interesting that Tolkien and Lewis were close friends. Even more interesting is that Tolkien was a devout Catholic whereas Lewis was either agnostic or atheist.Also interesting is that they were two leading scholars and academicians who are immensely popular. I probably wouldn't put it this way, but in typically scathing Harold Bloom fashion, he says,"That a major Renaissance scholar, C.S. Lewis, should now be a hero to millions of Americans who scarcely can read is merely social irony." I'm guessing he would extend that comment to Tolkien and his fans.
lol thanks for that, about snarfed my drink onto my keyboard :)
Edit: Wow, just looked and I only have 580+ posts and I've been here since AoW lol.
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RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16, RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16
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I've read the Children of Hurin. I own it.
+1. I was about your age, I suppose, the first time I read the Silmarillion. Clearly, anyone who can handle such heady stuff at that age is destined for greatness.
I can't quite join the intense debates (murderous opinion battles) yet, until I'm better read in the general field of literature and other aspects of "geek culture".
The good news is you have plenty of time. And you have a good head start on the classics (Tolkien, Lewis, Le Guin).
If you want some good fun reads, pick up some Arthur Conan Doyle: Sherlock Holmes or The Lost World. I'm reading this one right now. Got all the original illustrations.
I enjoyed Fred Saberhagen's Swords series. You'll probably like Michael Moorcock's Elric books... he was Drizzt before Drizzt was. Do try to find them in the original order, though--the anthologies they publish nowadays are all jumbled.
To join the discussion on Narnia, cmon folks. They are OVERTLY Christian. I don't read Phillip Pullman expecting him to affirm my religious beliefs. When you read Lewis's fiction, his Christianity shows because he intends it to. I mean, really.... you don't read Dante and Milton and walk away disappointed because ZOMG IT WAS SO PREACHY.
P.S. If you like WoW, and LotR, try LotRO.
Speaking of Lewis, try his Space Trilogy. I liked it better than Narnia. The 2nd one is the best, and the 3rd one is very different (my wife hates it, but I like it).
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When speaking of Narnia and LotR, it's interesting that Tolkien and Lewis were close friends. Even more interesting is that Tolkien was a devout Catholic whereas Lewis was either agnostic or atheist.Lewis was a dedicated Anglican, and it strongly influenced his writing.
Hmm, not going to dispute that. Now I need to figure out where I got that Lewis wasn't very religious. Maybe I misconstrued something I read or watched about Middle Earth or Tolkien. Hope it wasn't in the appendices to the LotR Movies...course it has been awhile since I watched those.
Edit: I've also read Lewis' Space trilogy but it's been awhile. I bought Children of Hurin and tried reading it but after an hour or so couldn't go on. I slogged through Lucas'/Claremont's Willow follow up books which were pretty dense but I couldn't push through Hurin :(
Hmm, not going to dispute that. Now I need to figure out where I got that Lewis wasn't very religious. Maybe I misconstrued something I read or watched about Middle Earth or Tolkien. Hope it wasn't in the appendices to the LotR Movies...course it has been awhile since I watched those.When speaking of Narnia and LotR, it's interesting that Tolkien and Lewis were close friends. Even more interesting is that Tolkien was a devout Catholic whereas Lewis was either agnostic or atheist.Lewis was a dedicated Anglican, and it strongly influenced his writing.
He was an atheist who converted to theism and then to Christianity as an adult.