Before we get started I want to make it clear that this thread should only be for constructive comments and not complaining about how someone bumbed into you.
1) Me and the two friends that went found that the room where the banquet was held was too small and very crowded. As this seemed to be a main focus for the event, we were kind of dissapointed at that. Perhaps there is a movie theater or something similar to handle larger quantities of people for a low price.
2) The room where the Paizo stuff was sold was perferct for the stuff that was there, but we would have liked to see some more things from other vendors(Probably meaning a bigger room or the use of two). When we went to some of the game stores around the area(as we are from Nevada), we found everything we wanted and more. Perhaps some of the local shops might rent a booth or room from Paizo at the Con. The things we were hoping to see where a larger selection of dice, books, and mainly miniatures.
3) While the panels were very informative, they seemed to be lacking the show and tell feeling. I was expecting some powerpoint or maybe doing some hands on stuff, but found mostly Q&A.
RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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Well, I think the event sign-up procedure could be improved.
My personal experience: I signed up to judge a PFS adventure on Friday. Josh overbooked the session (perfectly reasonable) and three of us DMs ended up with nothing to do. If we had known sooner, we could have found other games to play in. (Since we didn't get to actually GM, I don't think we even got the PFS OP GM rewards for running a table...)
- While PFS needs a full muster to determine how many tables get slotted with which tiers and sub-tiers, we shouldn't need to go through the muster to determine that there's only enough players for three or four tables.
On Saturday morning, I'd set up to run my "Pathfinder Academy" adventure. Seven people had entered the lottery and won chairs at my table. Only two showed up.
Now, as it turns out, that was sort of okay, because I was able to scrounge around and find some terrific players to join the game. (Some other people had won seats at a session where it was the GM who hadn't shown up.) Now, even so, it was far from ideal; they didn't get to play in the game they really wanted, and some people who would have liked to play in my game, but didn't make the lottery cut, didn't know to show up. Also, starting 45 minutes late was one of the things that kept us from finishing the adventure.
Scuttlebutt around the convention suggested that this problem was rampant. Two GMs just kind of gave up when their players didn't show, and two others managed to scramble to find fresh players.
- The lottery procedure places an undue value on winning table spots. People win their third and fourth choices, which they're sort of ambivalent about attending, but don't want to just release them without some compensation. There's no price to pay for requesting a seat, and no penalty at all for failing to show up.
- It would be nice for Paizo to emphasize that it's not cool to win a seat at a gaming table and then just not show up. It keeps other interested parties from playing games according to their interests.
Sunday morning, I was planning to play in a game. I didn't give myself enough time to pay the breakfast tab at the hotel restaurant, and I got to the game five minutes late. The GM, perhaps having been burned as I'd been, had overbooked the table, and had to turn me away.
- I don't have an easy answer to this one.
I've been a fan of gaming conventions for years, and I've never seen this kind of problem: not at big shows, and not at small local cons. I'm sure that it's the lottery aspect of PaizoCon game seating, combined with the free game tickets, that's causing these difficulties.
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RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16
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The Hemlock Room (the Dealer's Room) was well-designed and set up for almost all the day.
But registration for the convention began at 9:00, and no games were scheduled to begin till noon. During those three hours, everybody marched down to the Hemlock Room, to pick up their subscription copies or to just shop, because there was absolutely nothing else to do. Having only one check-out desk was a terrific bottleneck, that could have been foreseen, and shouldn't be repeated.
- Either have something else diverting going on during that time next year, or
- temporarily assign a larger sales force to the room.
Having said that, it was delightful to have Lisa come down and chat with those of us waiting in line. (Hi, Lisa. I'm the guy who thinks the Pathfinder GM screen is "too frowny".)
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Sunday morning, I was planning to play in a game. I didn't give myself enough time to pay the breakfast tab at the hotel restaurant, and I got to the game five minutes late. The GM, perhaps having been burned as I'd been, had overbooked the table, and had to turn me away.
Wait, wasn't that my game? I thought you wanted out, you were more than welcome to join us.
The only problem I had at Paizocon was my own physical shortcomings. Wasn't it just Gen Con 2003 when I was able to go out drinking for hours at night and still be able to get up and demo the Simpson's TCG for WotC in the morning? Instead, Friday night "out on the con" and my Saturday was shot. Stupid body! I was there for the full convention and I did feel that Paizo did an amazing job. It really was the most fun I've had at a con since the Gen Con I just mentioned. My second biggest regret was just not having enough time to meet my obligations and hang out with a bunch of people I usually only see once a year these days, if that.
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Well, I think the event sign-up procedure could be improved.
One of the suggestions I overheard while working at the PFS HQ was to have a chart of all scheduled games with available spots posted and have a way for people to swap event tickets. My thought was to post up all the games and show which ones were filled in the online and which have open seats.
The preregistration is hard since there is an inevitable amount of shuffling around once people get to the Con. They meet up with others and change their minds as to how much they want to participate in this or that function.
I'd suggest having tickets available at the Con for people to get into games. This would help alleviate the line of hopefuls waiting at HQ for a game. By having a bunch of tickets ready for each session and make it a first come approach, anyone interested in getting into a game would 'know' they had a spot. It might help get tables filled faster and eliminate the delayed starts, too.
One of the suggestions I overheard while working at the PFS HQ was to have a chart of all scheduled games with available spots posted and have a way for people to swap event tickets. My thought was to post up all the games and show which ones were filled in the online and which have open seats.
A friend of mine has coordinated the gaming for multiple conventions in NC and the method he uses is pre-con registration sign-up to initially fill the advertised games. Then, he includes a notebook for each day of gaming with sign-up sheets sorted according to the start times throughout each day. Those who pre-registered are already printed on the sheets in that day's binder, but he leaves room for people to sign up and fill in the remaining spots to round out a table...or to sign up as alternates in case some of them don't show.
The GMs also know to check the notebooks when they arrive (and throughout the con) to see how many players (and alternates) to expect. Then, when a table musters, they have the alternates on standby until they determine if all the slots are taken. If so, the game commences and the alternates are turned away to form their own game. If not, the alternates get added in the order they signed up. Works pretty well...
Just my two-cents,
--Neil
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6
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I've passed on to Paizo the Gamestorm "cone" idea (which they may well have grabbed from some other con). Basically, HQ gets some small sized orange traffic cones, about 8 inches to a foot tall. If your table needs players, you put up a cone. If you've got all your players, return the cone to HQ or put it under the table. Of course players need to know this system is being used, and that a cone means they can ask a few questions to find out if they want to play the game.
It's worked fairly well at Gamestorm for getting tables filled up in that critical first 15 minutes or so.
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Wait, wasn't that my game? I thought you wanted out, you were more than welcome to join us.Then I'm afraid we both misunderstood one another, Dennis. So:
- Don't presume your communication skills are working up to speed on Sunday morning.
Oh man, I am really sorry, I don't know how I screwed that one up.
*ogre* hangs head in shame
I'd had about 8 hours sleep in 3 days and my comprehension skills were minimal I guess. I'm really, really sorry about that Chris.
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I'll echo all of the major comments above...
- The Con was awesome!!!!
- The restaurant was packed, especially at breakfast, and the staff was really struggling to keep up.
- The vendor room was more then a tad cramped.
- When a full set of tables were going in a ballroom, the noise and heat got to be an issue.
I know the Coast did everything they could to accommodate, and while they seemed to mostly keep on top of it, I couldn't imagine the situation if the year over year attendance growth remains the same. Of the other cons I've been at, I've noticed several practices that really seem to work well:
- Using 1st floor guest rooms for organized game venues. The difference in noise and distraction level is drastic.
- Three day weekends make a ton of difference too. While it may seem like just another day, it also seems to help smooth out transportation plans for most folks, and makes the event generally more approachable.
That said, I know I'm already planning on attending next year. And I thank all the Paizo folks, along with all the GMs, for all their hard work in making the con such a great experience.
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A friend of mine has coordinated the gaming for multiple conventions in NC and the method he uses is pre-con registration sign-up to initially fill the advertised games. Then, he includes a notebook for each day of gaming with sign-up sheets sorted according to the start times throughout each day. Those who pre-registered are already printed on the sheets in that day's binder, but he leaves room for people to sign up and fill in the remaining spots to round out a table...or to sign up as alternates in case some of them don't show.
The GMs also know to check the notebooks when they arrive (and throughout the con) to see how many players (and alternates) to expect. Then, when a table musters, they have the alternates on standby until they determine if all the slots are taken. If so, the game commences and the alternates are turned away to form their own game. If not, the alternates get added in the order they signed up. Works pretty well...
Just my two-cents,
--Neil
That sounds like a great way to adjust as the con goes on.
Fiona
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There was a 'Swap Box' where people were able to drop tickets to events they weren't making it to, but I don't think it was really noticed by many people. Maybe a bigger sign/more notification about it would help.
Next year! BIG SIGN for EVENT SWAP!
Standby lists are great, but you run the risk of people doing the same thing as sign-ups, they standby for every event in hopes that they get into one. When three GMs come looking it gets complicated.
All the hallway hopefuls worked out fine, at least from what I saw. I witnessed Josh Frost clear about a dozen people out of there (all into games) in about 45 seconds.
The lottery/sign up system will improve with time. The only advice I would throw out, is even if you're not assigned to an event, show up. If there is something you want to do, check it out. About 5-10 minutes after events start, usually people are on the lookout for people to fill in.
Next year! Limit on wait/start time, or plan for 10 mins for prep. If (for whatever reason) you can't make the 10 min then the seat should be up for grabs.
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My personal experience: I signed up to judge a PFS adventure on Friday. Josh overbooked the session (perfectly reasonable) and three of us DMs ended up with nothing to do. If we had known sooner, we could have found other games to play in. (Since we didn't get to actually GM, I don't think we even got the PFS OP GM rewards for running a table...)
I was one of those three DMs. I was actually pretty bummed that I wasn't able to play/DM anything that slot. If there could've been one or two people taken from tables and have a table with part DMs and part sign-ups it would've been awesome. This would've at least given the uneeded DMs to play and one to actually DM the adventure. Otherwise I just spent the time going to Fight Club and watching a table play through (and watching Nani almost win... again!).
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My personal experience: I signed up to judge a PFS adventure on Friday. Josh overbooked the session (perfectly reasonable) and three of us DMs ended up with nothing to do. If we had known sooner, we could have found other games to play in. (Since we didn't get to actually GM, I don't think we even got the PFS OP GM rewards for running a table...)I was one of those three DMs. I was actually pretty bummed that I wasn't able to play/DM anything that slot. If there could've been one or two people taken from tables and have a table with part DMs and part sign-ups it would've been awesome. This would've at least given the uneeded DMs to play and one to actually DM the adventure. Otherwise I just spent the time going to Fight Club and watching a table play through (and watching Nani almost win... again!).
So it sounds to me that the muster could have been handled better. I wonder if people couldn't be spread around because of levels being to differant?
I know on Sunday, my game master didn't show up for Master of the Fallen Fortess and I actually volunteered to run since it would have left plenty of player without any game. While I was out of the room to get the mod from my stuff, there was some kinda "upset" for lack of a better term about splitting up some friends. but it couldn't have been to bad as the conversation was over by the time I got back to the table. My players were having a good time and no one was sitting around in our room with out a game.
Mustering is more art than science, it seems to me. you never can tell what will break it.
I know time is an issue to cramp all the awesomeness possible in three short days, but having some 15-20 min period between seminars would be very appreciated, even if that means one less seminar a day.
I had to go running in between seminars all around the Con to try and chat with people, go to the store or grab a bite to eat in order not to miss the seminars or to be too late, something that just could not be done and I was late to most of them (annoying people when barging in) and had to skip a couple in order to go to eat or take a nap.
So, my humble suggestion is:
*Short break between seminars/events to socialize/eat/rest
Sunday morning's hangover, Ugh....
Easy solution for that though, I just pass on picking up the pony keg next time.
From my perpsective most things seemed to go smoothly. I anticipated long lines at registration and the banquet so that didn't bother me.
However, I do think the vendor area/subscription pick up room could have been organized a little better the first day when everyone poured in there from the registration line. There were tables set up for other vendors, who set up later. This took up a good third of the room and blocked the second exit. Maybe on Day 1 you could enter through one door and checkout at the other and set those other tables up after the mad rush?
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I would have liked if each session was specifically named/numbered. I also think I would have liked to have seen an hour break between official game sessions (maybe 8a-1p, 2p-7p, 8p-1a?).
I also agree with Ryan about the sessions. The chairs in evergreen were horrible (at least for me) to sit in for hours on end. I also hate to say it, but the sessions ended up being more watered down then I expected. Most were just Q&A sessions, and the topics greatly meandered from their originally planned topic.
Chief Technical Officer
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Me and the two friends that went found that the room where the banquet was held was too small and very crowded. As this seemed to be a main focus for the event, we were kind of dissapointed at that. Perhaps there is a movie theater or something similar to handle larger quantities of people for a low price.
That's the biggest room the Coast has, and, as long as we're at the Coast, moving the banquet offsite is pretty unlikely to happen. The Coast actually only makes their money from the banquet, the guest rooms, and their lounge, so no banquet at the Coast = no PaizoCon at the Coast.
On the other hand, we're *just* at the point where the Coast is borderline for our event—we could use a little more con space, and a few more guest rooms, so we'll be looking around a bit before we finalize anything for next year. (Currently, though, we think that the next biggest option is going to be *too* big for us.)
The room where the Paizo stuff was sold was perferct for the stuff that was there, but we would have liked to see some more things from other vendors...
Last year was the first time we sold *anything*, and this year was the first time we had anyone other than Paizo selling. We're still learning here. Odds are good that we're going to try to find more space for the dealer room next year, though. However, it is still PaizoCon, so the emphasis will remain on Paizo and 3rd-party products that directly support our game system.
Seven people had entered the lottery and won chairs at my table. Only two showed up... There's no price to pay for requesting a seat, and no penalty at all for failing to show up... I've been a fan of gaming conventions for years, and I've never seen this kind of problem: not at big shows, and not at small local cons. I'm sure that it's the lottery aspect of PaizoCon game seating, combined with the free game tickets, that's causing these difficulties.
That level of no-shows is certainly pretty awful. I don't recall hearing that this was that big a problem last year—was it?
I undersatnd what you mean about how there's no "risk" to entering the lottery, but I also don't want to charge for individual events, or "penalize" people at our show. I'd say the best way to deal with this is to make sure everybody knows about the "take a ticket/leave a ticket" thing, and to get the message out that if you want to play in a game you didn't get a ticket for, be there as a "standby" in case there are no-shows.
Gotta run.. more later.
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Chief Technical Officer
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During those three hours, everybody marched down to the Hemlock Room, to pick up their subscription copies or to just shop, because there was absolutely nothing else to do. Having only one check-out desk was a terrific bottleneck, that could have been foreseen, and shouldn't be repeated.
- Either have something else diverting going on during that time next year, or
- temporarily assign a larger sales force to the room.
I think "both of those" is the answer here. We might as well have events going on, and we should *definitely* run two registers.
(I'm skipping anything related to mustering, because I have zero knowledge or experience there...)
Using 1st floor guest rooms for organized game venues. The difference in noise and distraction level is drastic.
We can't manage that at the Coast because we need all the guest rooms for attendees! They were fully booked on Saturday, at least. Maybe if we go somewhere else... although if we go somewhere else, hopefully they'll just have more nicely sized con rooms.
I wanted to attend all the seminars about Pathfinder, and they were strung together through Friday. This meant a lot of sitting and listening in a row. I would have preferred if these were staggered throughout the weekend, give me a chance to mix in play and socializing between seminars.
I'm sure part of the reason for this is that on Saturday and Sunday, the staffers in most of those seminars were running games... which means we were booked in 5-hour chunks for most of the weekend. And by putting a seminar on the weekend, it meant any staffer attending was unavailable for an entire 5-hour chunk of gaming time.
That's my theory, anyway. :)
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Losing my Camel "Sear"!
Showing up to two games with the GM being late for one and not showing up at all for the second one.
I would like to recommend a slightly bigger dealer room with more then one register to avoid the 1 hour+ wait to purchase items.
It also seemed like this event was just a "playtest" for GenCon where I felt that this was more exclusive then GenCon so there should be more exclusive events only at PaizoCon. (I wanted a pin)
I would strongly suggest selling t-shirts and/or sweathshirts for the year's Con. I would have purchased two of each, even at a premium for the relatively small size of the Con. I did purchase the glass, but its just not the same.
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I would strongly suggest selling t-shirts and/or sweathshirts for the year's Con. I would have purchased two of each, even at a premium for the relatively small size of the Con. I did purchase the glass, but its just not the same.
+1
I loved the glasses that were for sale, and even the regular PFS shirts sold out quickly in various sizes by Saturday Noon :(
I was unable to get some shirts that I wanted in Gamer sizes.
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Chief Technical Officer
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I would strongly suggest selling t-shirts and/or sweathshirts for the year's Con. I would have purchased two of each, even at a premium for the relatively small size of the Con. I did purchase the glass, but its just not the same.
Historically, T-shirts have just not done very well for us. That said, we're definitely considering PaizoCon shirts for next year... but you can expect they'll be very limited.
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I would strongly suggest selling t-shirts and/or sweathshirts for the year's Con. I would have purchased two of each, even at a premium for the relatively small size of the Con. I did purchase the glass, but its just not the same.Historically, T-shirts have just not done very well for us. That said, we're definitely considering PaizoCon shirts for next year... but you can expect they'll be very limited.
They might sell better if the PFS "free reroll" rule extended to those shirts also :)
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I had a great time!!!
That being said
Everything I wanted to do happened on Saturday. I didn't have anything to play on Sunday because I had played all the Society senarios available on friday and Saturday.
Sunday's events didn't seem as exciting as Saturday's and most of the official gaming ended at 2 pm.
I would have liked more variety of the society senario's being run and would have liked the con to have ended with a bang ranther than a wimper.
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...we should *definitely* run two registers.
This was my only complaint the whole weekend. The room and displays were just fine by me. Two registers (with two credit card readers) would help the line problem tremendously.
My complaint to myself: My boredom while the banquet was going on, as I figured I could find something to do while it was going on but never considered looking to see how long it would go. Had no idea it went to midnight, but totally my own fault for not planning that. I'll surely go next year :)
They might sell better if the PFS "free reroll" rule extended to those shirts also :)
But only at that year's and future year's Paizo Cons!
Sunday's events didn't seem as exciting as Saturday's...Counterpoint: The Sunday morning Cursed Lot game was one of the highlights of my time at the Con. YMMV.
I remember Sunday fondly... seems like it was only yesterday.
That was the only slot that I didn't GM, so I picked up my character sheet and headed to game. Sad thing is that I got "stuck" at Doug Doug's table, which I didn't need to travel all the way to Seattle to do. ;-) Imagine my surprise when I found out that our table was the last table Doug Doug would ever GM as a mortal. After Sunday's slot, he was quickly raised to Demi-God status (5-star). Now I am one of only a few hundred players who can tell the stories of Doug Doug's ascension to our grand children.
If you ever have the pleasure of sitting at Doug Doug's table, know this, deep down beneath his stoic exterior, he is but a kid playing the game that he loves.
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For me, the bad thing was not meeting enough of you. I honestly tried to get peoples' names on the boards here when I met them, just so I'd know them later...on the boards. I was truly dismayed at how many people I should have met, but somehow missed.
I agree, we need more messageboard PaizoCon nametags.
It seemed to me like there were fewer scheduled games as compared to last year. It would be great if more module writers and editors from Paizo were running over several days. But all said and done, I was busy the entire time.
My non-verbal posterior is of the opinion that the upstairs chairs were much better for long play than the chairs located on the bottom floor.
I had a great time - wish there were more cons like this in the Northwest.
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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It seemed to me like there were fewer scheduled games as compared to last year. It would be great if more module writers and editors from Paizo were running over several days. But all said and done, I was busy the entire time.
Interestingly, both of the sessions I ran were stacked on Saturday, so I had 8-1 then 1-6 right after each other. Good thing I brought a sack lunch! :)
I got way more involved this year, too. I ran not one, but two sessions of Shadow of the Fellnight Queen to try and maximize the opportunities for everyone. That pretty much took up my entire Friday evening and Saturday morning. And I wanted to make sure I spread those games out across a couple of different days. I also gamed on Sunday, but I was a player in one of the Master of the Fallen Fortress games so I'd get a chance to play rather than GM the entire weekend. Three solid days of gaming. And two-thirds of it devoted to running games for others. Not too bad.
However, I do think Russ hit on an important point. The number of attendees increased again this year...so demand for special event gaming consequently went up as well, and I'm not sure the supply was able to keep up. When the word went out initially for organizing games for the lottery, there weren't a lot of people that jumped into it initially. Maybe folks can start planning ahead for next year so there are more games to meet the demand?
Just my two-cents,
--Neil
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Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games
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It's an interesting conundrum for people who like to run games also. I mean, I had the aforementioned two sessions Saturday.
And on Friday I was running Fight Club (1-4), on panel for the Superstar seminar (4-5), and then running Shadow Lodge (6-11).
Which left me very little time to actually try to find a game to *PLAY* or even just to hang out with peeps in the lobby and halls or otherwise generally socialize.
As Neil said, even people who volunteer to run also like the chance to play. Heck, some of us would like the chance to play in one another's games! I'm not sure what the best way is to make that happen, cuz there are only so many hours in a day, but I'm sure that as the con continues to grow we are going to need more volunteers to keep things rolling.
A friend of mine has coordinated the gaming for multiple conventions in NC ...
You're talking about Ron who does CarolinaCon, MACE and used to do StellarCon?
You're talking about Ron who does CarolinaCon, MACE and used to do StellarCon?
Yes. Yes I am. :-)
...but I'm sure that as the con continues to grow we are going to need more volunteers to keep things rolling.
Yeah! As long as there's still a PaizoCon, I'll still be here to rally the fan-run games. :D