I remember the distance of 12 miles being quoted as being "between the centers of two hexes", though I can't find the post.
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In Part 1, p 57 under Movement in the Stolen Lands it says:
"Each hex on the map ... is 12 miles across (between opposite corners) and covers just under 150 square miles of area."
This seems like a mistake - if the hex is 12 miles from corner to corner, that would only be 93.5 square miles. If the hex is 12 miles across from face to face, it would be about 124.7 square miles. Was there ever any official errata about this? (I looked but didn't find any - I found this forum topic instead! :) Or is my math wrong?
Ref: area of a hex: if d is from corner to corner: d * d * 3 * sqrt(3) / 8
if d is from side to side: d * d * sqrt(3) / 2I'm trying to adapt the exploration rules to an old homebrew map with different hex sizes so I was going to use the area to scale the time costs.
Thanks!
Damn how come no one ever caught that?
Hello All, I have tried to compile a list of all the different alternate rules, errata, clarifications and expansions posted on these messageboards by many people. (And especially by James Jacobs and Jason Nelson). I hope this overview helps people who are looking for answers & ideas.
Included are:
Errata and Clarifications
Questions & Answers
Alternate Rules
Non-City Expansions
Nive thread thanx.
A decent guide would be to increase the costs of the buildings by a couple of points per square that it takes up to represent the extra labour and the like that it will take up. I must admit that I personally don't follow the time constraint side of preparing the site, it is too much work for me.
Personally, this seems to follow along the lines of "punishing the players for a cool idea"
If you do this, you should give them something for free, like say, the kingdom has city walls for free since the city is surrounded by stone.
"Underground" is probably even better than "free city walls."
I'd have preparation of the site cost lots (x3 or something), and construction cost double unless you have significant magical support. But the defense bonuses to underground cities are incredible. Free full walls, probably +8 Def for an underground site on top of that, and likely immunity from some disasters.
Dwarves build for the long haul.
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Don't know about underground - I'm still trying to figure out how to
accomodate my PCs wanting to make a tree city... :)However - the 'building up' idea is one that I can wade in on...
To add a second story actually costs less money per square meter than
the cost of building the ground floor. (In the real world)
So taking that into account with other factors e.g. traders & clients
having to traipse up & down multiple flights of steps, potential bridges
between towers etc - I think you could probably do each 'floor' for
the same price as the first. Or maybe a small increase for some other
trade-off benefit as you see fit...Hope that helps.
Cool ideas!
Do bridges HAVE to be built on every hex with a river?
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I love how my players had the drive and creativity to build their first city under ground. I did go with my first idea, also adding in some other ideas from people. by digging down it would take longer to prepare. I treated the time length to be the (terran type) time plus mountine time. But that is each district as per the rules. So it took them 8 months to prepare the city district site. I also doubled the BP cost. It turned out great. I did not increase the cost of buildings. My thinking is they could use the stone/ earth or just carve them right out of the wall. The only increae cost to buildings i did was to the waterfront and docks, and locks. I have not come up with a sytem for building up yet. My players are having fun digging down. Now their first district is complete and they want to go further down. Should i increase the Time/BP Cost for the new district that will be under the one thats already underground !! Or should i leave it the same?
leave it the same. They're having fun -- you are too -- all is good.
Why my players don't have this atitude... :(
My players only want to live in peace and safety for their people, they even cut all conections to Brevoy to not being pulled into the upcomming civil war.
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@Spartacus- Players taking initiative and getting creative really do make this AP come alive. Sounds like you have a great game going there.
@Tryn,
I suggest fixing that "problem". Cutting all ties and avoiding civil war only work if you live on an island or another planet. The two sides in a civil war usually see you as an untapped resource or a potential enemy force that can't be left undisturbed. Have the forces in Brevoy "make them an offer they can't refuse" or two. If they don't negotiate, have one side make a Pearl Harbor type run against them, trying to take them out in one quick nasty sneak attack. Something like a spy to open the gates in the middle of the night combined with an assasination strike on the leader(s).
If you really want to get twisty, have the attackers all dressed as the other side's forces and then have an envoy for the disguised forces follow up immediately with your PCs, express outrage and offer to assist against the now "common foe". Make your spymaster and diplomat work for their titles }:>
Most PCs absolutely hate getting pushed around and bullied by NPCs, so they should make some sort of response one way or the other :)
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@Spartacus- Players taking initiative and getting creative really do make this AP come alive. Sounds like you have a great game going there.
@Tryn,
I suggest fixing that "problem". Cutting all ties and avoiding civil war only work if you live on an island or another planet. The two sides in a civil war usually see you as an untapped resource or a potential enemy force that can't be left undisturbed. Have the forces in Brevoy "make them an offer they can't refuse" or two. If they don't negotiate, have one side make a Pearl Harbor type run against them, trying to take them out in one quick nasty sneak attack. Something like a spy to open the gates in the middle of the night combined with an assasination strike on the leader(s).
If you really want to get twisty, have the attackers all dressed as the other side's forces and then have an envoy for the disguised forces follow up immediately with your PCs, express outrage and offer to assist against the now "common foe". Make your spymaster and diplomat work for their titles }:>
Most PCs absolutely hate getting pushed around and bullied by NPCs, so they should make some sort of response one way or the other :)
Red, I want to play in your campaign instead of running mine. :)
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I am not always that creative, but evidently after reading and watching enough Game of Thrones, "WWWTLD (What Would Tywin Lannister Do?) seems to come to mind fairly readily. Perhaps its the fact that my alarm clock is set to play "The Rains of Castomere". I am still trying to figure out a way to work that song into my game storylines, but no luck so far so that it has some special significance to the PCs.
The fact that NONE of my players has read or seen Game of Thrones almost makes my diabolical plotting seem unfair, if it wasnt for the fact that I gave it to them as recommended reading.
I thought I would mention another source of political intrigue, a set of books called Brother Initiate and Gatherer of Clouds, which is set in a fantasy version of Feudal Japan. The entire plot revolves around a huge kingdom spanning double cross and plots within plots. The coolest part is that everyone has multiple agendas and only the reader can see them all and guess how they will come together.
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I am not always that creative, but evidently after reading and watching enough Game of Thrones, "WWWTLD (What Would Tywin Lannister Do?) seems to come to mind fairly readily. Perhaps its the fact that my alarm clock is set to play "The Rains of Castomere". I am still trying to figure out a way to work that song into my game storylines, but no luck so far so that it has some special significance to the PCs.
The fact that NONE of my players has read or seen Game of Thrones almost makes my diabolical plotting seem unfair, if it wasnt for the fact that I gave it to them as recommended reading.
I thought I would mention another source of political intrigue, a set of books called Brother Initiate and Gatherer of Clouds, which is set in a fantasy version of Feudal Japan. The entire plot revolves around a huge kingdom spanning double cross and plots within plots. The coolest part is that everyone has multiple agendas and only the reader can see them all and guess how they will come together.
Who's the author?
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Sean Russell...
One of my favorite series. Characters stop to ponder which type of paper to send a note on becase of the subtle innuendo implied by its origins. Or who stop in the middle of a war to comtemplate cherry blossoms falling from the trees. Plus Lord Shonto, one of the main characters sort of = Sun Tzu.
IMO required reading for a Oriental Adventures type campaign.
Hi.
Since English is not my native language I might be interpreting the Discount for buildings in a wrong way.
"This cost reduction applies only to the first constructed building of the types listed in this line."
Does that mean I get to choose only one building on the list that will have it's cost halved.
First Example:
1st turn I build a University (78 BP): Discount list -> Academy, Bardic College, Museum, Library, Magical Academy, Military Academy
2nd turn I build a Library (3 BP)
3rd turn my discount is spent and I have to pay full price for Academy or any other building on University discount list.
Or does it mean I get the discount for each of the buildings on the list but only once (or until another building gives me that discount again)
Second Example:
1st turn I build a University (78 BP): Discount list -> Academy, Bardic College, Museum, Library, Magical Academy, Military Academy
2nd turn I build a Library (3 BP)
3rd turn I build an Academy (26 BP)
4th turn I build an another Academy (52 BP)
I'm asking because in the Overlords Guide to Kingdom Building it's heavily implied that 2nd example is the case, and my GM doesn't see it that way.
"It's a trap!" Admiral Ackbar
Don't get suckered into getting discounts with building chains in the early game. Keep it simple and just use a core list of cheap buildings. Buying an expensive building that gives you discounts early on will use all your BP and you will likely never catch up with the delay incurred.
Of course once you have BP to spare and start to add variety then take full advantage of all the discount chains. For example once you have a Castle then certainly build a Town Hall as this opens up cheaper Dumps, Barracks and Watchtowers, which you will be buying a lot of.
Since English is not my native language I might be interpreting the Discount for buildings in a wrong way.
"This cost reduction applies only to the first constructed building of the types listed in this line."
Does that mean I get to choose only one building on the list that will have it's cost halved.
<snip>
Or does it mean I get the discount for each of the buildings on the list but only once (or until another building gives me that discount again)
I'm asking because in the Overlords Guide to Kingdom Building it's heavily implied that 2nd example is the case, and my GM doesn't see it that way.
I feel like this was just asked here recently, but I can't find the thread now. I thought it was the 2nd example, but apparently it's the 1st. As far as I know, your GM is correct.
The Overlord's Guide to Kingdom Building was written in 2011, and is based on the kingdom building rules published in Rivers Run Red. You can tell because it also refers to the magic item economy. Ultimate Campaign was published in 2013 with updated kingdom building rules.
In the RRR rules as written, the half-price discount applied indefinitely and for all the listed buildings in the same city, not just once for the first of them you build - hence "Dumps, Barracks and Watchtowers". A single Academy for example "Halves cost of Caster's Tower, Library and Magic Shop in same city". There was no suggestion that the discount went away after you'd used it once - note the use of the word "and".
I'm not sure if James added the "only once" additional rule in the discussion thread about kingdom building as a clarification of the intent of the rules, but certainly it's there in the Ultimate Campaign version of the kingdom building rules, as you quoted.
I think your GM's interpretation of the rule as written is correct - you're supposed to only get the discount once over all the buildings listed. That said, you might be able to get your GM to agree to allow you to choose whether you apply the discount or not each time it might apply, so you don't blow it on a 6 BP Library rather than a 52 BP Academy you're planning on building later.
Faster overland movement (see Chapter 7 of the CRB).
Dotting