High Level Kingmaker Villains will KILL EVERYONE!


Kingmaker

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Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

Spoiler:
Toki yo, TOMARE!

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Xpltvdeleted wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:

MWA HAHAHAHAHA!

The encounter I just finished developing has a bad guy who casts time stop. AND THAT'S JUST THE BEGINNING!

In case no one noticed, I'm having a blast developing a full-on super-high-level adventure for the first time since the climax of Legacy of Fire.

TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

*cry* As long as he doesn't use it to cast summon monster IX every round he's in there, we should be allright...he doesn't do that, right? Right?!

Actually... wait. Are you spying on me?

Scarab Sages Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4, Legendary Games

Oh, sure, add the tough monsters into #36.

But James, in his crazed mania to make #35 easier for everyone, cut out the bonecrushing grappling/rending monstrosity with 403 hp (not the main boss) and his partner with whirlwind attack, 20 feet of reach, and a disarm CMB of +35... who starts the encounter invisible and also has 241 hp (also not the main boss)... and did I mention you were supposed to encounter both at the same time... along WITH the main boss? And a parade of mook snipers. And terrified servants!

I dunno, maybe it was a little too hard. Maybe I've been playing with disgusting min-maxers for too long. Or been one. Maybe both... :)


Hmm. Richard Pett + Paizo Creative director deprived of powerful villains for too long + end of an adventure path so it doesn't matter how many PCs get wasted = high expected body count in the obituaries thread from GMs?
Oh well, what's the point of having a kingdom unless you can send some flunkies in to soften up the bad guys for you?


Jason Nelson wrote:

Oh, sure, add the tough monsters into #36.

But James, in his crazed mania to make #35 easier for everyone, cut out the bonecrushing grappling/rending monstrosity with 403 hp (not the main boss) and his partner with whirlwind attack, 20 feet of reach, and a disarm CMB of +35... who starts the encounter invisible and also has 241 hp (also not the main boss)... and did I mention you were supposed to encounter both at the same time... along WITH the main boss? And a parade of mook snipers. And terrified servants!

I dunno, maybe it was a little too hard. Maybe I've been playing with disgusting min-maxers for too long. Or been one. Maybe both... :)

Oooh, do feel free to post the original 'director's cut' versions in the GM reference thread, once appropriate. :)


Jason Nelson wrote:

Oh, sure, add the tough monsters into #36.

But James, in his crazed mania to make #35 easier for everyone, cut out the bonecrushing grappling/rending monstrosity with 403 hp (not the main boss) and his partner with whirlwind attack, 20 feet of reach, and a disarm CMB of +35... who starts the encounter invisible and also has 241 hp (also not the main boss)... and did I mention you were supposed to encounter both at the same time... along WITH the main boss? And a parade of mook snipers. And terrified servants!

I dunno, maybe it was a little too hard. Maybe I've been playing with disgusting min-maxers for too long. Or been one. Maybe both... :)

He should put them back in. That way when the players die I can say it was not my fault this time. :)

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Jason Nelson wrote:

Oh, sure, add the tough monsters into #36.

But James, in his crazed mania to make #35 easier for everyone, cut out the bonecrushing grappling/rending monstrosity with 403 hp (not the main boss) and his partner with whirlwind attack, 20 feet of reach, and a disarm CMB of +35... who starts the encounter invisible and also has 241 hp (also not the main boss)... and did I mention you were supposed to encounter both at the same time... along WITH the main boss? And a parade of mook snipers. And terrified servants!

I dunno, maybe it was a little too hard. Maybe I've been playing with disgusting min-maxers for too long. Or been one. Maybe both... :)

Well... since nothing in #36 has over 400 hp, my vote is for the over-the-top category. ;-P

Shadow Lodge

Whew...glad I misread that at first glance. I somehow first read CR 48 instead of AC 48. Yikes!

Scarab Sages

James Jacobs wrote:

MWA HAHAHAHAHA!

The encounter I just finished developing has a bad guy who casts time stop. AND THAT'S JUST THE BEGINNING!

In case no one noticed, I'm having a blast developing a full-on super-high-level adventure for the first time since the climax of Legacy of Fire.

TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

You are a cruel, heartless, brutal, mean-spirited, vindictive, hate-filled, violent, dastardly man.

I knew there was something I liked about you.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

As we say in the Psionics community... "Deep Impact coming online, BA"

There are also some BoRL and BoEM spells that are good debuffers. Though it does answer the question of why one dose of sneezing powder weighs two pounds...

Spoiler:
I'm betting it's one of those oh so high and mighty silver dragons who fell off their high horse.


James Jacobs wrote:
Jason Nelson wrote:

Oh, sure, add the tough monsters into #36.

But James, in his crazed mania to make #35 easier for everyone, cut out the bonecrushing grappling/rending monstrosity with 403 hp (not the main boss) and his partner with whirlwind attack, 20 feet of reach, and a disarm CMB of +35... who starts the encounter invisible and also has 241 hp (also not the main boss)... and did I mention you were supposed to encounter both at the same time... along WITH the main boss? And a parade of mook snipers. And terrified servants!

I dunno, maybe it was a little too hard. Maybe I've been playing with disgusting min-maxers for too long. Or been one. Maybe both... :)

Well... since nothing in #36 has over 400 hp, my vote is for the over-the-top category. ;-P

But ... I want to see bad guys able to take some serious punishment, put them back in, put them back in! ^_^


TriOmegaZero wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

** spoiler omitted **

TOZ, you have just won the thread.

Spoiler:
ZA WOOOOOOOOOOOOORLLLLDO!


James Jacobs wrote:
Maybe about those touch attacks a little bit, but what SPOILER OMITTED wouldn't be worried about touch attacks?)

Ummm, there's no SPOILER OMITTED in my Bestiary.

I have:
SPOILER, ROSEBUD
SPOILER, HE'S DEAD THE WHOLE FILM
SPOILER, SNAPE-DUMBLEDORE, and...
SPOILER, EXPLOSIVE RUNES TRAP.

Is this a template for creatures of the SPOILER type?

Oooh... I bet it's a SPOILER, I'M REALLY A TOMATO!


James Jacobs wrote:

I apologize in advance for the AC 48 monster I just put into "Sound of a Thousand Screams."

The treasure's worth it though.

And yes, I'm a little punchy. It's after midnight at Paizo. I think that's when the blood-drinking ghosts come out of the windows.

Dont Apologize i missed the super challenging BBG like the ones in Rise of the Runelords keep it up


Joey Virtue wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:

I apologize in advance for the AC 48 monster I just put into "Sound of a Thousand Screams."

The treasure's worth it though.

And yes, I'm a little punchy. It's after midnight at Paizo. I think that's when the blood-drinking ghosts come out of the windows.

Dont Apologize i missed the super challenging BBG like the ones in Rise of the Runelords keep it up

We just had our first encounter with Xanesha in RotRL. It did not go well, but I have now bluffed her into thinking I am charmed while everyone else gets away. I'm slightly creeped out by what is to come up in her little nest. *shudder*


Don't forget Spoiler, the Ship Sinks and Spoiler, I'm Your Father

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

Also SPOILER, IT WAS EARTH ALL ALONG and SPOILER, JESUS DIES.

Sovereign Court

Golbez57 wrote:

Cool! Loved the Iceforge; it was a Frostfell location in the planar-themed Eberron campaign I DMed for a few years. Best moment was ** spoiler omitted **

Soooooo--this gives me hope for a Mammoth Lords/Linnorm Kings Adventure Path down the road, seeing how involved you were in this book!

You shouldn't pick on halfling bards so much! :P


Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

** spoiler omitted **

TOZ, you have just won the thread.

** spoiler omitted **

Muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-mudaaaaaa!!!!

Wryyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!

Spoiler:

Soshite, toki ga ugoki desu !!!

Uh, sorry, Araki is one of my favorite mangaka...


The Wraith wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

** spoiler omitted **

TOZ, you have just won the thread.

** spoiler omitted **

Muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-mudaaaaaa!!!!

Wryyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!

** spoiler omitted **

Uh, sorry, Araki is one of my favorite mangaka...

Spoiler:
CEASAR!!!!!!!
Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

*wipes tear from eye*


TriOmegaZero wrote:
*wipes tear from eye*

Remember TOZ, in this campaign, we need headbands of protection so powerful that BULLETS BOUNCE OFF OF THEM!!!


My guess is Ancient Green Dragon.......and right now I'm trying to figure out how to lower his will save and eventually Bind him(in darkness, w/ring o' power).

Paizo Employee Creative Director

oof...

I am now working on the LAST stat block I'll ever have to build for Kingmaker.

It's giving me fatigue, panic, confusion, and some negative levels. Thank Desna for SKR's super-handy excell statblock spreadsheet!

Paizo Employee Creative Director

OKAY you chuckleheads! This latest stat block just hit an AC of 51. THAT makes me feel even more guilty (and delighted).


James Jacobs wrote:
OKAY you chuckleheads! This latest stat block just hit an AC of 51. THAT makes me feel even more guilty (and delighted).

Guilty? Pfhaw ... us chuckleheads need alla nigh-unkillable "official" bad guys that we can get.

Players are frighteningly efficient at racking up bonuses after all ...

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Calixymenthillian wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
but what SPOILER OMITTED wouldn't be worried about touch attacks?)
*Gasp* Dragon!!!

I am guessing hot girl, cause we girls are all worried about constant touch attacks. Hot girls just more than most. :D


At first reading this thread my heart sank how was I expected to cope with these creatures..then I remembered something..

I'm DMing this...!!!

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Looking forward to congratulating Mr Pett on his evil evilness at Paizocon UK


As long as these BBEGs don't deal more than 1d6 with their one attack per round, I reckon my Players will eventually be able to take them. They don't, right?


James Jacobs wrote:
OKAY you chuckleheads! This latest stat block just hit an AC of 51. THAT makes me feel even more guilty (and delighted).

Only 51? Hmmm, what's the touch AC? If that's high I might start being concerned.


51? yikes. You know the Tarrasque has to roll a 14 or better to hit that right? Granted, I built a character a little while back that good ol' T would have only hit on a natural 20, but thats besides the point. ;p


Sounds like the fey finally get their day in a big way.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Yemeth wrote:

51? yikes. You know the Tarrasque has to roll a 14 or better to hit that right? Granted, I built a character a little while back that good ol' T would have only hit on a natural 20, but thats besides the point. ;p

Yup. AC 51 is, more or less the "worst case scenario" the PCs will face. There are plenty of options (either in the adventure itself or via character tactics) to reduce that AC.

Dark Archive Bella Sara Charter Superscriber

James Jacobs wrote:


The encounter I just finished developing has a bad guy who casts time stop. AND THAT'S JUST THE BEGINNING!

I would certainly hope that's just the beginning. What else would you do after casting Time Stop? Have a cup of tea and enjoy the quiet?


James Jacobs wrote:
Yemeth wrote:

51? yikes. You know the Tarrasque has to roll a 14 or better to hit that right? Granted, I built a character a little while back that good ol' T would have only hit on a natural 20, but thats besides the point. ;p

Yup. AC 51 is, more or less the "worst case scenario" the PCs will face. There are plenty of options (either in the adventure itself or via character tactics) to reduce that AC.

Ah, well thats ok then. I just built a 16th level Sword Lord type to see what I could do, and I'm not really getting over a +30 within reason. Unless there's a bard around or some other outside buffing of some sort.


I remember running Savage Tide for 3E characters. High AC didn't mean anything to the party since most were spell casters that had plenty of ray spells handy. Heck even one of our main melee characters was a gish that pretty much used wraith strike on a constant basis. What I needed was monsters with a high touch AC.

The Exchange Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6

P.H. Dungeon wrote:
I remember running Savage Tide for 3E characters. High AC didn't mean anything to the party since most were spell casters that had plenty of ray spells handy. Heck even one of our main melee characters was a gish that pretty much used wraith strike on a constant basis. What I needed was monsters with a high touch AC.

Some of that is a side-effect of allowing Spell Compendium into your game, as it allows touch attacks for all elements and a host of SR-ignoring spells (SR being a potential defense the nastier critters have against touch spells). Wraithstrike in particular is so effective it warps builds just by existing in the game.

Liberty's Edge

I am so happy that you are enjoying your job. Spreading panic and fear through the ranks of gamers around the world must be very fulfilling. I look forward to running in panic as the nasty whatever-they-are's rip into the soft flesh of my fellow party members. :)

Ah well, back to my own filthy evil...


Freehold DM wrote:
The Wraith wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

** spoiler omitted **

TOZ, you have just won the thread.

** spoiler omitted **

Muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-mudaaaaaa!!!!

Wryyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!

** spoiler omitted **

Uh, sorry, Araki is one of my favorite mangaka...

** spoiler omitted **

I just started reading this last week, you guys beat me to it. Win.

Spoiler:
*INCOMING STEAMROLLER*


It goes timestop, mindblank, invisibility, fly (possibly with the aid of contingencies).
Now the PCs have an invisible enemy they can't see even with true sight (don't you just love mindblank's anti-divination effect :D) who unless the PCs have pets with echo location or get lucky with a glitterdust can just fly around spamming summons until the PCs get overwhelmed by sheer weight of numbers.

Edit:
The chief villain probably should have mindblank, invisibility, and fly active, for that matter, from the moment the PCs show up on the horizon. Or invisible stalker assassins with bows and mindblank...


James Jacobs wrote:


Re-read my post. I was a little punchy when I wrote it, and a stray fragment of guilt and empathy momentarily lodged in my thoughts. It's gone now, though.

That's just wrong! When a great game designer has momentary bouts of guilt its a sign. What was it? Oh right, we are so doomed.

RPG Superstar 2011 Top 4

Xpltvdeleted wrote:
*cry* As long as he doesn't use it to cast summon monster IX every round he's in there, we should be allright...he doesn't do that, right? Right?!

No, it's a dragon who burns through his hoard casting Gate under the influence of a prayer bead on elder balors.


Orthos wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
The Wraith wrote:
Freehold DM wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


TIME STOP! AND THIS GUY ISN'T EVEN THE BOSS OF THE CAMPAIGN!

My 15th level Fighter can cast Time Stop. At will.

** spoiler omitted **

TOZ, you have just won the thread.

** spoiler omitted **

Muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-muda-mudaaaaaa!!!!

Wryyyyyyyyyyyyy!!!

** spoiler omitted **

Uh, sorry, Araki is one of my favorite mangaka...

** spoiler omitted **

I just started reading this last week, you guys beat me to it. Win.

** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
"And time begins to flow again" in japanese

James Jacobs wrote:
OKAY you chuckleheads! This latest stat block just hit an AC of 51. THAT makes me feel even more guilty (and delighted).

I was just telling my players how the fights were not hard enough. Man they are not going to be happy.

Dark Archive

James Jacobs wrote:
NOTE: I consider, in my games (and in adventures I develop), the use of the Book of 9 Swords to be cheating. :P

What an odd way of thinking, especially since the warblade is exactly what a heroic fighter should be at higher levels.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Sean Halloran wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:
NOTE: I consider, in my games (and in adventures I develop), the use of the Book of 9 Swords to be cheating. :P
What an odd way of thinking, especially since the warblade is exactly what a heroic fighter should be at higher levels.

Not to me. I was actually okay with how high level fighters functioned in 3.5—they were simple, but that's good. There should be simple options.

And to be honest, I've not read the warblade. I doubt I ever will, since I'm just not interested in that book, to be honest—a large number of the late LATE 3.5 books WotC produced weren't really my cup of tea.

The Exchange Contributor, RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6

Sean Halloran wrote:
What an odd way of thinking, especially since the warblade is exactly what a heroic fighter should be at higher levels.

No. I want my high level fighters more like Boromir, less like characters from "Samurai Showdown". My view of a high-level fighter is just someone shockingly good with his weapons of choice, not someone capable of superhuman tricks.


Russ Taylor wrote:
Sean Halloran wrote:
What an odd way of thinking, especially since the warblade is exactly what a heroic fighter should be at higher levels.
No. I want my high level fighters more like Boromir, less like characters from "Samurai Showdown". My view of a high-level fighter is just someone shockingly good with his weapons of choice, not someone capable of superhuman tricks.

+1

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber
Russ Taylor wrote:
Sean Halloran wrote:
What an odd way of thinking, especially since the warblade is exactly what a heroic fighter should be at higher levels.
No. I want my high level fighters more like Boromir, less like characters from "Samurai Showdown". My view of a high-level fighter is just someone shockingly good with his weapons of choice, not someone capable of superhuman tricks.

So only take the maneuvers that deal damage and the like, and never mention any names. Just say 'I hit him for Xdx and he needs to save against stun' or whatever. Remember, the Warblade is the one that doesn't get any of the mystical powers, just straight damage and status effects against enemies. Edit: If even that, they mostly get things that negate mechanics, hardly anything that has an effect on other creatures besides damage.

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