Would Mutants & Masterminds be a suitable replacement for the Rifts Rule-set?


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If I want to keep the flavour of Rifts but use a more sane system would the Mutants & Masterminds with the magic and Mecha supplements be a suitable replacement. Or would BESM fulfil the roll better?

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I'm biased, because I love Mutants and Masterminds.

M&M is a fairly streamlined and brilliant system for superhero games. I highly recommend it.

Dark Archive

I don't know if it would be a suitable replacement, but it's also the first one that ever comes to my mind when I think about it.

So far, in my head I'm also leaning towards the core book, the mecha and manga materials for power armor and whatnot, and book of magic.

All the psy powers, juicers, crazies, etc can be managed with the basic materials.

I'm not sure how to handle the idea between SDC and MDC; might just be as simple as adjusting the power level for certain things.

Anyhow, I've spent months looking for conversion guides online, but so far Palladium has scared anyone away from posting one.


VagrantWhisper wrote:

I don't know if it would be a suitable replacement, but it's also the first one that ever comes to my mind when I think about it.

So far, in my head I'm also leaning towards the core book, the mecha and manga materials for power armor and whatnot, and book of magic.

All the psy powers, juicers, crazies, etc can be managed with the basic materials.

I'm not sure how to handle the idea between SDC and MDC; might just be as simple as adjusting the power level for certain things.

Anyhow, I've spent months looking for conversion guides online, but so far Palladium has scared anyone away from posting one.

I was thinking of ignoring SDC and MDC - as power levels should account for this.


Mutants and Masterminds looks like a great system. However,character generation can be a major problem. My group almost tried it, but no one wanted to try and create a character without help from the GM. He then realized he would also have to generate the villains, and we never got the game off the ground as a result.

If you can get past making characters, I'd say go for it.

Dark Archive

Jason Ellis 350 wrote:

Mutants and Masterminds looks like a great system. However,character generation can be a major problem. My group almost tried it, but no one wanted to try and create a character without help from the GM. He then realized he would also have to generate the villains, and we never got the game off the ground as a result.

If you can get past making characters, I'd say go for it.

What about creating a handful of archetypes, with a few decision points, instead of letting the characters go whole hog on creation?

Some of the archetypes in Agents of Freedom seem about the right power level.

Monsters would be a PIA, but luckily for the most part the Coalition can be represented by only a handful of stat blocks.

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 8

I don't know if it would necessarily be my system of choice for a RIFTS replacement (I'd probably try to do something with d20 Modern instead) but it certainly could work and M&M is nicely flexible in that way. Guy in power armor, a dragon, and a cat-man thief? Done.

The character creation issue brought up by Jason Ellis 350 is easily handled by HeroLab--I think the free demo version will create characters up to PL 10. You can't save characters with the demo, but you can preview their character sheets and then screencap them. I have sort of a love-hate relationship with HeroLab but it's awesome for creating M&M characters I must say.


DeathQuaker wrote:

I don't know if it would necessarily be my system of choice for a RIFTS replacement (I'd probably try to do something with d20 Modern instead) but it certainly could work and M&M is nicely flexible in that way. Guy in power armor, a dragon, and a cat-man thief? Done.

The character creation issue brought up by Jason Ellis 350 is easily handled by HeroLab--I think the free demo version will create characters up to PL 10. You can't save characters with the demo, but you can preview their character sheets and then screencap them. I have sort of a love-hate relationship with HeroLab but it's awesome for creating M&M characters I must say.

I am thinking of buying M&M - I love the Riftverse but hate the ruleset. I have had a look at BESM, M&M, D20 modern and GURPS. As much as I love GURPS its too detailed, Modern is kinda dry and lacks a spark, BESM looks ok but then Im not sure I would be able to sell to tri stat system to my players and the D20 version doesnt seem to have the same quality.

The problem with M&M would be stating every thing up. I am planning an introductory one off based on the final days of Tolkeen where the players have to fight their way out to safety.


Seconding Hero Lab. Also, add Mecha and Manga, and Warriors and Warlocks to your Mutants and Masterminds, and you can pull of ANYTHING in Rifts world.


My replacement for RIFTS would be Barbarians of Lemuria + Barbarians of the Aftermath.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Playing around and reskinning the archetypes is a great way to get fast stats for villains etc. Otherwise yeah, there is a bit of work involved in statting up things. But once it's done, it's done.


I'd go for BESM myself. It's a good rules set to handle pretty much anything the Rifts setting can throw out there. When my group first got our hands on BESM we would come up with the most odd and outlandish character concepts just to see if we could make them and we could. It's far more simpler than Mutants and Masterminds in that respect. We've run a few Palladium style TMNT games using BESM and it worked great.
In the circle of gamers I know there's been only one person that didn't like BESM. Even if you don't go that way with your Rifts campaign you should run them through something with the Tri-Stat system.


I do not have a lot of exposure to RIFTS, so keep that in mind. I do have a lot of experience with G.U.R.P.S. and I would agree, the level of detail is either a feature or a flaw depending on preference.

I believe M&M works great as a cinematic rules set. By that, I mean a lot of 'realism' is going to be ignored in favor action. It is not concerned with how many gold coins you have or how much ammunition. People looking for more realism are going to be disappointed.

If you are willing to overlook that, or deal with that at the GM level, M&M will allow you to provide some balance for wildly diverse characters as say, Superman and Batman. There is an Agent archtype that does not have any powers (unless you include his pistol and car), and yet, he is still viable in combat.

M&M is very versatile and I think once you get the hang of it, it will be much easier than you think. I classify it as more rules light than D&D.


Well, Mutants and Masterminds is one of those systems that you could do theoretically anything with. HERO and Gurps with the relevant splatbooks are the same way. If you're willing to do the work to stat up the various archetypes and such , any of those systems would work.


Davi The Eccentric wrote:
Well, Mutants and Masterminds is one of those systems that you could do theoretically anything with. HERO and Gurps with the relevant splatbooks are the same way. If you're willing to do the work to stat up the various archetypes and such , any of those systems would work.

I bought M&M and it looks like it will work well. I think the first thing I need to do is stat up the races. It will take me while but I will start setting up some race templates.


I don't think M&M is an adequate replacement for RIFTS.

Because, well, it's far too balanced and easy a game. Your RIFTS players will be confused by things actually being balanced and fair... :)


AdAstraGames wrote:

I don't think M&M is an adequate replacement for RIFTS.

Because, well, it's far too balanced and easy a game. Your RIFTS players will be confused by things actually being balanced and fair... :)

Well if you want to simulate the vast well of unfair that is palladium you could have everybody roll a d10 and then pass it to the player on their left and thats that players PL


Jeremy Epp wrote:
AdAstraGames wrote:

I don't think M&M is an adequate replacement for RIFTS.

Because, well, it's far too balanced and easy a game. Your RIFTS players will be confused by things actually being balanced and fair... :)

Well if you want to simulate the vast well of unfair that is palladium you could have everybody roll a d10 and then pass it to the player on their left and thats that players PL

No, no, for a rules light Palladium, the 10s on the d10 would have to be a re-roll and add thing. Any prime numbers would need to be re-rolled and the result added if it were a character that didn't make any sense, and re-rolled and the roll subtracted if the character were 'too much like another game'.

You get extra re-rolls (taking the one of your choice) if the day of the week is a prime number.

Straight d10 is way too predictable.


AdAstraGames wrote:
Jeremy Epp wrote:
AdAstraGames wrote:

I don't think M&M is an adequate replacement for RIFTS.

Because, well, it's far too balanced and easy a game. Your RIFTS players will be confused by things actually being balanced and fair... :)

Well if you want to simulate the vast well of unfair that is palladium you could have everybody roll a d10 and then pass it to the player on their left and thats that players PL

Lol


The 8th Dwarf wrote:
It will take me while but I will start setting up some race templates.

Not to be terse, but, why? If one of your players wants to play a particular race, have them do the write up of their character with the racial requirements built in and then you approve/deny normally.

This leaves them free to explore the flexibility of character creation and frees you up from a lot of extra work.


CourtFool wrote:
The 8th Dwarf wrote:
It will take me while but I will start setting up some race templates.

Not to be terse, but, why? If one of your players wants to play a particular race, have them do the write up of their character with the racial requirements built in and then you approve/deny normally.

This leaves them free to explore the flexibility of character creation and frees you up from a lot of extra work.

Because he wants to use a member of the race for something himself and doesn't want to stat every enemy of a certain type from scratch?


~reads through this thread~ Interesting. I wonder how you would go about converting Nightbane.


Davi The Eccentric wrote:
CourtFool wrote:
The 8th Dwarf wrote:
It will take me while but I will start setting up some race templates.

Not to be terse, but, why? If one of your players wants to play a particular race, have them do the write up of their character with the racial requirements built in and then you approve/deny normally.

This leaves them free to explore the flexibility of character creation and frees you up from a lot of extra work.

Because he wants to use a member of the race for something himself and doesn't want to stat every enemy of a certain type from scratch?

Davi has it. So I have some consistency for NPCs. Dog boys, and other Coalition troops would be the main ones I need to stat up. The race templates will be along the same lines as wizards and warriors and Mecha (Infact because I am lazy they will be the same as the ones in both of those books) - The templates (usually only 10 or 20 points)are also away of giving the PCs an idea at what sort of abilities a race can have. Also unless the PCs have unique mecha as per their character creation I will stat out the Mecha.

My campaign premise is that they are remnants of a unit called the Tolkeen Volunteer Guard. It starts on the eve of the fall of Tolkeen to the forces of the Coalition. I will start with the "final battle" and the every man for themselves order and sandbox it from there.


The initial work would be hefty, but i think HERO would do it great.


I think GURPS would add a nasty bit of realism and danger....


Admiral Jose Monkamuck wrote:
I think GURPS would add a nasty bit of realism and danger....

It would do fine. Vehicles would do the mecha & power armor.


Turin the Mad wrote:
Admiral Jose Monkamuck wrote:
I think GURPS would add a nasty bit of realism and danger....

It would do fine. Vehicles would do the mecha & power armor.

With enough time and effort certainly.


Admiral Jose Monkamuck wrote:
Turin the Mad wrote:
Admiral Jose Monkamuck wrote:
I think GURPS would add a nasty bit of realism and danger....

It would do fine. Vehicles would do the mecha & power armor.

With enough time and effort certainly.

Oh yes, a lot of it.

Back in the day I had done a great deal of work on converting the first two books into GURPS terms (equippage-wise, that is).


I'm in the middle of a Massive SAVAGE RIFTS conversion, using the Savage Worlds Super Powers Companion.

M&M would be a decent conversion, but I'm starting to veer away from d20, I love Pathfinder, but, d20 at upper levels will always be slow to run.


Xaaon of Korvosa wrote:

M&M would be a decent conversion, but I'm starting to veer away from d20, I love Pathfinder, but, d20 at upper levels will always be slow to run.

I have not played many high level campaigns with M&M. I have run one PL15 campaign. I do not think M&M would suffer from the same high level 'problems' other D20 systems do. It already assumes high level at its baseline.

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