Qualifying for Mystic Theurge


Rules Questions


I'm thinking of playing a Mystic Theurge, and was curious about the 7 ranks in Knowledge(Arcane)/(Religion).

Can I go 3wiz/3clr at level 7 takes the 7th skill rank and become a Mystic Theurge ?

Or do I need to take one more level of wizard or cleric for the 7 ranks ?

Cheers :)

-TDL


Note that a Pathfinder mystic theurge only needs 3 ranks in Know: Religion and Arcana.


LOL .. I had the Lore Master qualifications in my mind :P

Alright .. well then it's possible ofcourse ..

I need a break from the computer it seems .. coffeemachine here I come.

-TDL

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TDLofCC wrote:

I'm thinking of playing a Mystic Theurge, and was curious about the 7 ranks in Knowledge(Arcane)/(Religion).

Can I go 3wiz/3clr at level 7 takes the 7th skill rank and become a Mystic Theurge ?

Or do I need to take one more level of wizard or cleric for the 7 ranks ?

Cheers :)

-TDL

You have to qualify the level before you take your prestige class. So the earliest you can take MT is 8th level.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Guys, like, could you read the rules once in a while ? Pathfinder Mystic Theurge has the following requirements:

Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 3 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 3 ranks.
Spells: Able to cast 2nd-level divine spells and 2nd-level arcane spells.

Which means you need to be Clr 3/ Wiz 3 to take a level of MT.

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

Gorbacz wrote:

Guys, like, could you read the rules once in a while ? Pathfinder Mystic Theurge has the following requirements:

Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 3 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 3 ranks.
Spells: Able to cast 2nd-level divine spells and 2nd-level arcane spells.

Which means you need to be Clr 3/ Wiz 3 to take a level of MT.

Actually, while it is not a "class skill" for a druid, a 3rd Wizard/3rd Druid could still qualify under those requirements, since Druid spells still count as "divine" magic.


LazarX wrote:


You have to qualify the level before you take your prestige class. So the earliest you can take MT is 8th level.

Thanks, clarified that up too ... I was wondering about that in general too.

Gorbacz wrote:

Guys, like, could you read the rules once in a while ? Pathfinder Mystic Theurge has the following requirements:

Skills: Knowledge (arcana) 3 ranks, Knowledge (religion) 3 ranks.
Spells: Able to cast 2nd-level divine spells and 2nd-level arcane spells.

Which means you need to be Clr 3/ Wiz 3 to take a level of MT.

Erm ... no need to get all uppity there mate.

See my previous reply.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

No problem, I just get kind of jumpy whenever folks discuss PF rules and don't read the text :) We've had quite a few heated discussions which started due to folks assuming 3.5 stuff is still the same in PF. And yeah Druid 3 / Wiz 3 would work as well. Personally, I am glad that the Witch will be filling the "mixed arcane/divine" spot.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

The general answer to prestige class entry.

You have to fulfill all requirements the level before you take your first entry in the PrC.

Shadow Lodge

Lord Fyre wrote:
Actually, while it is not a "class skill" for a druid, a 3rd Wizard/3rd Druid could still qualify under those requirements, since Druid spells still count as "divine" magic.

It doesn't need to be a class skill because 1) You can still have up to your total level in skill ranks in any skill, cross-class or not and 2) If it's a druid/wizard, Wizards get all the Knowledges anyway, so no problem there.

Any arcane/divine spell casting class that gets 2nd level spells can qualify, so many combinations are possible(and strange),

Liberty's Edge

Dragonborn3 wrote:
Lord Fyre wrote:
Actually, while it is not a "class skill" for a druid, a 3rd Wizard/3rd Druid could still qualify under those requirements, since Druid spells still count as "divine" magic.

It doesn't need to be a class skill because 1) You can still have up to your total level in skill ranks in any skill, cross-class or not and 2) If it's a druid/wizard, Wizards get all the Knowledges anyway, so no problem there.

Any arcane/divine spell casting class that gets 2nd level spells can qualify, so many combinations are possible(and strange),

What, you don't think a ranger/bard/mystic theurge is a good idea?! :P

Divine Casters: Cleric, Druid, Paladin, Ranger, Inquisitor, Oracle
Arcane Casters: Bard, Sorcerer, Wizard, Summoner, Witch

Any combination of an item from list one and an item from list two "works." Personally, I'd trim the list to the following for effectiveness' sake:

Divine: Cleric, Druid, Oracle
Arcane: Sorcerer, Wizard, Witch

Even then, I'd recommend against Oracle because of the curse.

But as for the OP's question: You can take your first level of Mystic Theurge as your 7th level, assuming you invested the requisite skill ranks (3 in each of Know(Arcane) and Know(Religion) and balanced the arcane and divine classes (which were both prepared casters). Since you were asking about the Wizard/Cleric combination, it works if you have the skill ranks.

Shadow Lodge

StabbittyDoom wrote:

What, you don't think a ranger/bard/mystic theurge is a good idea?! :P

Divine Casters: Cleric, Druid, Paladin, Ranger, Inquisitor, Oracle
Arcane Casters: Bard, Sorcerer, Wizard, Summoner, Witch

Any combination of an item from list one and an item from list two "works." Personally, I'd trim the list to the following for effectiveness' sake:

Divine: Cleric, Druid, Oracle
Arcane: Sorcerer, Wizard, Witch

Even then, I'd recommend against Oracle because of the curse.

According to the "Spells per day" part of the MST section, you could be a Cleric3/Druid3/Wizard3/Sorcerer4/Mystic Theurge7 and increase your casting in any of the classes.

I disagree with you on the Oracle though, I wouldn't pass on it because of the Curse.


Dragonborn3 wrote:
Cleric3/Druid3/Wizard3/Sorcerer4/Mystic Theurge7

That guy has a HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE spell list :D

For fun's sake .. I will create one someday :P


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
TDLofCC wrote:
Dragonborn3 wrote:
Cleric3/Druid3/Wizard3/Sorcerer4/Mystic Theurge7

That guy has a HUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUGE spell list :D

For fun's sake .. I will create one someday :P

If you can find on some boards somewhere Treantmonks old 3.5 wizard guide, admiral akbar has something to say to you.


Dragonborn3 wrote:
According to the "Spells per day" part of the MST section, you could be a Cleric3/Druid3/Wizard3/Sorcerer4/Mystic Theurge7 and increase your casting in any of the classes.

Interesting as it would be... I'm afraid not.

PRD wrote:
When a new mystic theurge level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in any one arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class and any one divine spellcasting class he belonged to previously.

That said... I'd totally allow it. And at 40th level, when you have max casting in each class, I'll regret it.

Shadow Lodge

Not to say you didn't, but read the entire part of the "Spells per day"

The Mystic Theurge wrote:
Spells per Day: When a new mystic theurge level is gained, the character gains new spells per day as if he had also gained a level in any one arcane spellcasting class he belonged to before he added the prestige class and any one divine spellcasting class he belonged to previously. He does not, however, gain other benefits a character of that class would have gained. This essentially means that he adds the level of mystic theurge to the level of whatever other arcane spellcasting class and divine spellcasting class the character has, then determines spells per day, spells known, and caster level accordingly. If a character had more than one arcane spellcasting class or more than one divine spellcasting class before he became a mystic theurge, he must decide to which class he adds each level of mystic theurge for the purpose of determining spells per day.

Emphasis mine.


I've always thought the requirements for prestige classes are done a little strangely, and I've actually had DMs that have ruled that qualifying for a prestige class is much like qualifying for a feat: You can take the feat (or the first level in your Prestige class) the level you'd qualify (even if taking the first level in the Prestige class would grant you the qualifications).

Example: Under my old DMs rules, qualifying for Mystic Theurge would require playing Wizard for 2 levels and Cleric for 2 levels, and your 5th level would be in the Prestige class, because taking that level would satisfy the requirement of being able to cast 2nd level spells in both your Arcane and Divine spellcasting classes. He used the same logic for skill points, as well. Originally he claimed that the reason he played it like this is because (and I quote) "A first level Fighter can take Power Attack, he doesn't have to wait until second level".

I know the reasoning is a bit weird, but is it overpowering to allow entry into prestige classes that one (sometimes) two levels earlier?


Convict #24601 wrote:
I know the reasoning is a bit weird, but is it overpowering to allow entry into prestige classes that one (sometimes) two levels earlier?

Um.. yes. It really can. In this particular case, it has a mixed effect (keeping the character *in* balance at the beginning, then overpowered later on). Opinions vary of course, but yes, changing prereqs like that can unbalance classes.

I like the reasoning though.

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