Cavalier Order Names


Advanced Player's Guide Playtest: Final Playtest


I think it was a mistake to swap the names on the order of the dragon and the order of the cockatrice. First of all, dragon's are solitary creatures, so I doubt a knightly order based around teamwork would name themselves after dragons. More importantly, naming the fraternal order of knightly jerks after the cockatrice will lead to constant lewd jokes at the gaming table along the lines of, "Man, that cavalier is such a cock."


Perhaps the following then:

Order of the Dragon - Value friendship and camaraderie (not all Dragons are greedy, selfish, and solitary [take Silver Dragons for instance])

Order of the Hydra - Value greed, acquisition of power, wealth, and fame via any means necessary.

Order of the Manticore - Pledge your loyalty to a member of a noble house or a certain person of royal blood.

Order of the Griffon - Pledge to protect all common folk from marauders, monsters, and other vile beings.

Order of the Angel - Pledge yourself to the powers of Heaven and the angels and archons that dwell there.

Order of the Hellfire - Pledge yourself to the powers of Hell and the Devils and worse things that lurk there.

Order of the Maiden - Pledge yourself to a member of the opposite sex and vow to serve and protect her.


I agree that swappoing the fluff of the Orders of the Dragon and Cockatrice was a wierd move. Seems like an accident i fact, and the Orders section has errors so I wonder if it will be corrected.


Berselius wrote:

Order of the Dragon - Value friendship and camaraderie (not all Dragons are greedy, selfish, and solitary [take Silver Dragons for instance])

I agree with you that not all dragons are greed and selfish, but most varieties are fairly solitary. I just don't think that a dragon would be the best choice of heraldry for a knightly order based around teamwork. Some sort of pack animal would probably be a better choice. "Order of the Wolf" has a nice ring to it.

Paizo Employee Chief Creative Officer, Publisher

Dragons are uber. We decided to give the cavalier we saw as most heroic and/or true to the very basic idea of the class the dragon. It's one of the most important creatures in the game, there are lots of good varieties, and we didn't like the idea of equating dragons with the selfish prick version of the cavalier.

The cockatrice, on the other hand, is a craven little nasty bugger, and fits conceptually better with the selfish dick version of the class. Also, our iconic character came with a cockatrice on his shield, and we always wanted him to be the unwholesome version of the cavalier, so everything sort of fit together in a way that suggested a change.

We didn't realize that the order would now have a very nasty shortened name until a day or two after we decided to make the change, but as that name is more or less appropriate to the type of character who will select that class option, we weren't exactly broken up about it.


Erik Mona wrote:

Dragons are uber. We decided to give the cavalier we saw as most heroic and/or true to the very basic idea of the class the dragon. It's one of the most important creatures in the game, there are lots of good varieties, and we didn't like the idea of equating dragons with the selfish prick version of the cavalier.

The cockatrice, on the other hand, is a craven little nasty bugger, and fits conceptually better with the selfish dick version of the class. Also, our iconic character came with a cockatrice on his shield, and we always wanted him to be the unwholesome version of the cavalier, so everything sort of fit together in a way that suggested a change.

We didn't realize that the order would now have a very nasty shortened name until a day or two after we decided to make the change, but as that name is more or less appropriate to the type of character who will select that class option, we weren't exactly broken up about it.

I needed a good laugh. Thanks.


Fair enough, that makes sense. I just kinda liked it the way it was, glad the iconic is less than wholesome though! Nicely shows the contrast with paladins.


Erik Mona wrote:

Dragons are uber. We decided to give the cavalier we saw as most heroic and/or true to the very basic idea of the class the dragon. It's one of the most important creatures in the game, there are lots of good varieties, and we didn't like the idea of equating dragons with the selfish prick version of the cavalier.

The cockatrice, on the other hand, is a craven little nasty bugger, and fits conceptually better with the selfish dick version of the class. Also, our iconic character came with a cockatrice on his shield, and we always wanted him to be the unwholesome version of the cavalier, so everything sort of fit together in a way that suggested a change.

We didn't realize that the order would now have a very nasty shortened name until a day or two after we decided to make the change, but as that name is more or less appropriate to the type of character who will select that class option, we weren't exactly broken up about it.

I suppose if Paizo is alright with having one of the orders be known as the "Order of the Cock," then I have no problem with it. Cockatrices are horrible little beasts and I always thought naming the teamwork oriented cavalier after them was kind of a weird choice. I still think that Dragon and Teamwork don't fit together that well. If I were to name any of the heroic orders after dragons, it would be what is now called the "Order of the Sword" (unless you were really going for the Arthurian Knight - Excalibur link with that one). Sword cavaliers are heroic, while at the same time solitary, just like many of the good dragon varieties.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Kristopher Miller 644 wrote:
I suppose if Paizo is alright with having one of the orders be known as the "Order of the c!&*," then I have no problem with it. Cockatrices are horrible little beasts and I always thought naming the teamwork oriented cavalier after them was kind of a weird choice. I still think that Dragon and Teamwork don't fit together that well. If I were to name any of the heroic orders after dragons, it would be what is now called the "Order of the Sword" (unless you were really going for the Arthurian Knight - Excalibur link with that one). Sword cavaliers are heroic, while at the same time solitary, just like many of the good dragon varieties.

It takes a lot of people working together to kill a dragon. The order doesn't have to take the virtues from the thing itself, but could be from how you kill that thing.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber
Erik Mona wrote:

Dragons are uber. We decided to give the cavalier we saw as most heroic and/or true to the very basic idea of the class the dragon. It's one of the most important creatures in the game, there are lots of good varieties, and we didn't like the idea of equating dragons with the selfish prick version of the cavalier.

The cockatrice, on the other hand, is a craven little nasty bugger, and fits conceptually better with the selfish dick version of the class. Also, our iconic character came with a cockatrice on his shield, and we always wanted him to be the unwholesome version of the cavalier, so everything sort of fit together in a way that suggested a change.

We didn't realize that the order would now have a very nasty shortened name until a day or two after we decided to make the change, but as that name is more or less appropriate to the type of character who will select that class option, we weren't exactly broken up about it.

Personally, the cockatrace represents cowardice. At least it does in book since I saw Sir Robin's coat of arms as he ran away.

Bravely ran away away.

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