The DPR Olympics - or "I'm not the mechanic here, Ironsides! I mostly just hurt people!"

[Andy Ferguson]

SRD wrote:

Monk: A monk weapon can be used by a monk to perform a flurry of blows.

That's all it says about the monk quality. It doesn't mater as far as the damage goes, you can swap out something from the step up line, but I'm pretty sure you have to take the feat to gain profieceny in it, though it would be sweet to be wrong.

[thepuregamer]

I am not sure what you can do to raise hit chance since you are already using irregular stats( just as far as this thread is concerned). since your str starts at 16 instead of 15 you are already squeezing an extra point out there that other melee characters in this thread are not getting.

outflank would give you an extra 2 while flanking.
heirloom weapon is a popular one for people to use.
You are not using a pounce build so you can't benefit from a +2 bonus on charging much. Monks have low to hit. not much to change here. Maybe later on, you would pick up a brilliant energy weapon if you are having trouble hitting.

shadow of death wrote:

And by the way crafting is for cherry picking items, not increasing WBL.

that really isn't a hard and fast rule. Neither is the intent terribly clear on how wbl should be affected by crafting.

On the side that says, crafting does affect wbl:
1. crafting specifically calls out to the fact that the materials to make a item is 50% of the market price.
2. Hedge magician is a trait that reduces the cost of crafting another 5%. What does this trait do if crafting has no effect on how much you can get with your wbl.

***
to andy- while you are right that the monk weapon ability does not give monks proficiency in them, the temple sword specifically states in its description that monks are proficient with it.***

[Shadow_of_death]

Lagauna Sussex wrote:

But, well, okay. Instead of stealing Ki, I just use it exactly as a ~normal~ Monk would. I'll go Flurry a sack of chickens to max out my Ki and HP post fight. *trollface*

On a serious note, I'm not quite sure most folks will be fighting a plethora of undead and constructs before 11.

Alright, checking over my Calculations my +3DPR should be 83.6 on a standard, and bringing it down to a +2 weapon would take it to 73 DPR. Still highly respectable. The issue with the build currently (And still at 15...) is the characters low hit chance. Does anyone have any suggestions to bring it up? =)

Monks are proficient in the Temple Sword, as it's a "Monk" type. Also, recall that you can't use abilities that use Ki through a weapon, unless you enchant it specifically with Ki Focus. Thus, it needs to be a +2 TS (Made into a +1 TS w/Ki Focus) to be able to leech Ki through it as I do.

You may want to read monk proficiencies again, they aren't by RAW proficient with a temple sword, you also forgot to take out weapon focus.

[Jeranimus Rex]

Shadow_of_death wrote:

You may want to read monk proficiencies again, they aren't by RAW proficient with a temple sword, you also forgot to take out weapon focus.

Kinda? They're not in terms of CRB, because the temple sword isn't core.

However, the Temple Sword entry in the APG states that monks are proficient.

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/advancedGear.html

Advanced Player's Guide wrote:

Temple Sword: Heavy blades typically used by guardians of religious sites, temple swords have distinctive crescent-shaped blades, appearing as an amalgam of a sickle and sword. Many have holes drilled into the blade or places on the pommel where charms, bells, or other holy trinkets might be attached. Monks are proficient with the temple sword.

[Shadow_of_death]

Jeranimus Rex wrote:

Kinda? They're not in terms of CRB, because the temple sword isn't core.

However, the Temple Sword entry in the APG states that monks are proficient.

http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/advanced/advancedGear.html

Advanced Player's Guide wrote:

Temple Sword: Heavy blades typically used by guardians of religious sites, temple swords have distinctive crescent-shaped blades, appearing as an amalgam of a sickle and sword. Many have holes drilled into the blade or places on the pommel where charms, bells, or other holy trinkets might be attached. Monks are proficient with the temple sword.

oh that's nice

[wraithstrike]

tejón wrote:

Quandary, have you tried turning off Power Attack? The results you're getting sound like what I see when PA + TWF is attempted without enough of a hit bonus. Half-PA to the off-hand would also account for the numbers being different. (Double Slice does not apply to Power Attack, unless there's been a forum clarification that I didn't see.)

For some reason I always assumed it applied to both attack equally. This does make sense though.

[thepuregamer]

Since the summer is mostly over I thought I would post here.

the shielder:

human guide ranger 6/ master of many styles 1/ weapon master fighter 3
str 15+2 racial +1 lvls+4 enhancement= 22
dex 13+1 lvls=14
con 12
int 10
wis 14
cha 8
HP= 10+8d10+d8+10+6=74.5
AC=10+7armor+6 shield+2 dex+1dodge+1 deflection= 27(24 sometimes)
spd=20
F/R/W=12/11/9
attack bonus= 9 bab+ 6 str+ 3 enhancement+ 3 weapon training+ 1 trait+ 1 wf=+22
shield damage=2d6+2d6 vicious+3 enhancement+ 9str+3 training=29(+4 w/ ranger focus, +9 w/power attack)

traits: will save +1, heirloom weapon(spiked shield +1 trait to hit and +2 trait to bull rush)
ranger : shield slam, shield master
monk : IUS, tiger pounce
fighter bonus feat: weapon focus(heavy shield), dodge
regular feats: Imp shield bash(human), power attack, imp bull rush, gtr bull rush, tiger style(7th lvl feat), shield focus

equipment: +1 breast plate(1.5k), +3 bashing shield(16k), vicious spiked shield +1(8k), ring of prot+1(2k), cloak of prot+1(1k), gloves of dueling(15k), belt of giant str +4(16k) - total(59.5/62k).

so I recently realized that an faq says we can make regular attacks with shields. so here is my janky shielder. He wields a shield in 2 hands and brings the smack down. It is a much deserved smack down.

as someone else posted this video earlier. I thought why not drop it in another thread as well. Its relevant

cool parts: every shield hit is also a free bull rush at the total hit bonus +6(heirloom weapon+imp br + gtr br) and when people hit other critters or walls they fall over prone. plus I can use tiger pounce to move as a swift action after I successfully bull rush people. pretty cool bonus.

side question, let me know where I f'd up. Also I was thinking of doing a build with barbarian in it for the furious enhancement but I am unsure how it would interact with shield master. IE would furious boost the bonus obtained from shield master feat?

[thepuregamer]

here's the shielder's dpr:

dpr math:

full attack w/o ranger focus or PA:
22/17 shield attacks(2d6 +2d6 +15) avg damage per hit=29
.95*1.05*29= 28.9975
.7*1.05*29= 21.315
dpr~50.3125

full attack w/ PA(penalty to ac instead of attack bonus- tiger pounce):
22/17 shield attack avg damage per hit=38
.95*1.05*38= 37.905
.7*1.05*38= 27.93
dpr~65.835

full attack w/ ranger focus:
26/21 shield attack avg damage per hit=33
.95*1.05*33= 32.9175
.9*1.05*33= 31.185
dpr~64.1025

full attack w/ ranger's focus + PA:
26/21 shield attack avg damage per hit= 42
.95*1.05*42= 41.895
.9*1.05*42= 39.69
dpr~ 81.585

some dpr values that include haste:

full attack w/ haste and PA:
23/23/18
.95*1.05*38= 37.905
.75*1.05*38= 29.925
dpr~105.735

full attack w/haste, PA, and ranger's focus:
27/27/22
.95*1.05*42= 41.895
dpr~ 125.685

so here is the dpr. its ok but not amazing but I tend to like that every hit is a bull rush which I think is pretty cool. The haste values are just so we can see some of what a party setting can do.

If this were an 11 lvl build, this would be a very different build but in 10 lvls, using ranger was the only way to make this work. :(

[Merrimac]

Here is my humble submission:

Cathy the Crazy Cat Lady (Summoner 10):

Spoiler:

Race: Whatever you like (Human or Half-Elf is good)

Ability Scores: Whatever as long as Cha is 14 or higher

Saves: Again, whatever -- boost with items/extra feats as needed/desired.

AC/HP/Defense: See above.

Attacks/Offense: See above.

Skills: See above (but probably at least Handle Animal -- she loves cats after all ;).

Feats:
Spell Focus (Conjuration) [Core]
Augment Summoning [Core]
Superior Summoning [Ultimate Magic]

Magic: She uses the Words of Power alternative system for casting [from Ultimate Magic].
She knows the Servitor VI level 4 effect word, Selected target word, and Boost meta word.

Gear:
Handy Haversack
Whatever else you like (except belt).

Terry the (Eidolon) Tiger:

Spoiler:

Base Form: Quadruped

Abilities: Str 32, Dex 16, Con 17, Int 7, Wis 10, Cha 11

AC: 24 (10 +3 Dex, +2 nat from base form, +8 from HD, +2 from Large, -1 size)

Saves: Don't know, didn't calculate.

Attacks:
Bite +18 (+8 bab +11 str -1 size) 2d6+11 +1d6 acid
Claws x2 +18 (+8 bab +11 str -1 size) 1d8+11 +1d6 acid
Rake +18 (+8 bab +11 str -1 size) (2 claws 1d6+11 +1d6 acid)

Feats:
Improved Natural Attack (claw)
Improved Natural Attack (bite)
Power Attack
Hover

Evolutions: 14 pts
Bite [free]
Limbs (Legs) x2 [free]
Claws [1]
Large [4]
Pounce [1]
Rake [2]
Energy Attacks (acid) [2]
Flight (Su) [4]

Skills: Whatever, but probably Fly.

Gear: Belt of Strength + 4

Here's how it goes down: Cathy casts the wordspell Selected Servitor VI Boost as a standard action to summon 1d4+1 Celestial/Fiendish Dire Tigers, plus and additional one due to Superior Summoning. She summons each 10 feet away from the BBEG (who is hopefully not Neutral) from where each attacks to the best of its ability (charge + pounce + rake). Meanwhile, Terry charges from above.

Celestial/Fiendish Dire Tiger:

Spoiler:

N Large animal CR 8

AC: 17, touch 11, flat-footed 15 (+2 Dex, +6 natural, –1 size)

HP: 105 (14d8+42)

Saves: Fort +12, Ref +11, Will +5

Attacks:
bite +18 (2d6+8/19–20 plus grab)
2 claws +18 (2d4+8 plus grab)

Defense:
DR whatever from Celestial/Fiendish template

Special Attacks:
Pounce
Rake (2 claws +18, 2d4+8)
Smite Evil/Good [from Celestial/Fiendish template]

Abilities:
Str 31, Dex 15, Con 21, Int 2, Wis 12, Cha 10
(enhanced by Augment Summoning)

Feats:
Improved Critical (bite),
Improved Initiative,
Run,
Skill Focus (Perception),
Skill Focus (Stealth),
Weapon Focus (bite, claw)

Skills: Acrobatics +6, Perception +12, Stealth +15 (+23 in tall grass), Swim +13; Racial Modifiers +4 Acrobatics, +4 Stealth (+8 in tall grass)

The Math:

Spoiler:

Terry (Eidolon):

Bite +17 (charging +2, power attack -3) 2d6+17 +1d6 acid
0.7(24+3.5)+0.05*1*0.7*24 = 20.09

Claws x2 +17 (charging +2, power attack -3) 1d8+17 +1d6 acid
0.7(21.5+3.5)+0.05*1*0.7*21.5 = 18.2525 x 2 = 36.505

Rend x2 +17 (charging +2, power attack -3) 1d6+17 +1d6 acid
0.7(20.5+3.5)+0.05*1*0.7*20.5 = 17.5175 x 2 = 35.035

All attacks: 91.63

Dire Tiger:

bite +22 2d6+10 19-20/x2 (charging)
0.95*17+0.1*1*0.95*17 = 17.765

claw x4 (2 from Rend) +22 2d4+10 20/x2 (charging)
0.95*15+0.05*1*0.95*15 = 14.9625 x4 = 59.85

All attacks: 77.615

Dire Tiger with Smite Evil/Good:

bite +22 2d6+24 19-20/x2 (charging)
0.95*31+0.1*1*0.95*31 = 32.395

claw x4 +22 2d4+24 20/x2 (charging)
0.95*29+0.05*1*0.95*29 = 28.9275 x4 = 115.71

All attacks (with Smite): 148.105

Here's what you end up with:

Min (Eidolon + 3 Dire Tigers): 324.475 DPR
Min w/ Smite (Eidolon + 3 Dire Tigers): 535.945 DPR

Avg (Eidolon + 4.5 Dire Tigers): 440.8975 DPR
Avg w/ Smite (Eidolon + 4.5 Dire Tigers): 758.1025 DPR

Max (Eidolon + 6 Dire Tigers): 557.32 DPR
Max w/ Smite (Eidolon + 6 Dire Tigers): 980.26 DPR

Can I get a boo-yah?

Note, Terry isn't as optimized as he probably could be, in all honesty. I just built him to match the other cats. It would be cool if another 20 DPR could be pulled out of him to get the max DPR over 1000.

Let the hole-poking commence!

[A Man In Black]

I'd post in the Summer Olympics thread, guys. It uses expansion material and has the expanded rules.

[rat_ bastard]

OK, So here is my Idea.

We need a Conjuration (Creation) Wizard with a Amulet of Adaptation and the spell overland flight.

First you challenge your target to a fight in a area where your enemy will contrast with the surrounding terrain, then you fly up into orbit.

Once in orbit you cast wall of stone spells and major creation spells to drop large rocks and metal pillars from orbit.

Pop Sci has a pretty good article on "Rods from God", I'm not sure how to calculate that into in game damage.

[Wordcaster]

Merrimac wrote:

Here is my humble submission:

Cathy the Crazy Cat Lady (Summoner 10):
** spoiler omitted **

Terry the (Eidolon) Tiger:
** spoiler omitted **

Here's how it goes down: Cathy casts the wordspell Selected Servitor VI Boost as a standard action to summon 1d4+1 Celestial/Fiendish Dire Tigers, plus and additional one due to Superior Summoning. She summons each 10 feet away from the BBEG (who is hopefully not Neutral) from where each attacks to the best of its ability (charge + pounce +...

Except you have made one of the easiest mistakes to make with a wordcaster. Boosting "summon servitor" boosts the TARGET word (selected). Boosting the selected target word raises the level of ALL of the effect words in a spell by 4! This means that you are trying to use a level 10 spell. It's a REALLY easy mistake to make though, so I don't blame you for thinking it works in that way.

[Delenot]

Tagged for later research.

[Elondor]

Someone should be awesome and compile all the top dpr by class in a google doc! This thread makes my inner optimizer giddy.

[Humphey Boggard]

Since I haven't seen a proper treatment of the Samurai when not mounted I present

Samurai Sam (Samurai 10, Order of the Warrior):

(Clearly a close cousin of Falchion Fred - original, not Richie Rich FF)

Ability Scores:
STR: 22 (+6) (15 base, +2 racial, +1 level, +4 belt)
DEX: 14 (+2) (13 base, +1 level)
CON: 14 (+2)
INT: 10 (+0)
WIS: 12 (+1)
CHA: 8 (-1)

HP: 89 HP (10d10+30)

Saving Throws
Fort: +11 Ref: +7 Will: +6
(can reroll Fort/Will save with resolve point,
can remove certain conditions with resolve point,
or use honor in all things to boost by +4, 3/day)

AC: 24 - Touch 14, Flatfooted 22 (+9 +1 O-yoroi, +2 dex, +1 Amulet of Natural Armor, +1 Ring of Protection, +1 Dodge)

Attacks: Katana (2 handed, Power attack, Furious Focus) +20/+12, 1d8+23 dmg (15-20/x2)

Class Abilities:
Challenge 4/day (+10 DAM, successful challenge restores a use of resolve)
3/- DR against attacks by target of challenge
Mount
Resolve 5/day (can use to roll x2 on fort/will saves or remove adverse condition)
Honor in All Things 3/day (+4 to any save or skill check)
Weapon Expertise (katana) (gives Quick Draw for Katana and +2 to confirm crit, allows use of fighter feats)
Bonus feat (6th level)
Greater Resolve (can spend a use of resolve to turn critical hit into regular hit)
Mounted Archer (basically mounted archery feat)
Banner (+2 to AT for allies within 60' upon charging, +3 morale bonus against fear)
Way of the Samurai (standard action, once over the next minute roll an attack
roll, saving throw or skill check three times and take the best result)

BAB: +10 CMB: +16 CMD: 28

Feats:

1 Power Attack
1H Furious Focus
3 Weapon Focus (katana)
5 Weapon Specialization (katana)
6S Dodge
7 Step Up
9 Improved Critical (katana)

Skills:
4/lvl (samurai) + 1/lvl (human)

Gear:
+3 katana
Belt of +4 str
+1 O-yoroi
Cloak of Resistance +2
Handy Haversack
Amulet of Natural Armor +1
Masterwork composite longbow (+6 str mod)
Ring of Protection +1
1000 GP in miscellaneous consumables, gear, non-portable goods, etc.

His usual DPR is 44.55 (29.43 for the first attack and 15.12 for the second).
When challenging he gets 60.75 (40.12 for the first attack and 20.62 for the second).

If he uses Way of the Samurai to roll x3 for his first attack he gets 34.70 (47.33 Challenge) or for the second attack 25.69 (35.03 Challenge). If he goes Sword Saint his Iaijutsu strike looks like 54.14 (61.21 if he uses Way of the Samurai) in a single attack (which is all he gets since Iaijutsu is a standard action at 10th level). So with this in mind we see that when using his Challenge the Samurai is comparable in DPR to Falchion Fred, but is skewed more towards his primary attack and does somewhat better than Fred when given just a standard action. This is even more apparent when using class features like Way of the Samurai and Iaijutsu Strike.

Defensively, his AC is one point lower than Falchion Fred and his will save is one less. However, against his Challenge enemy he gets 3/- damage reduction and he can use Honor in All Things (+4) or a use of Resolve (roll save x2) when faced with will saves so more than a bit better than Fred in this regard.

So in summary, the Samurai when not Challenging is looking better than the non-smiting Falchion Paladin owing to the Fighter Feats allowed by Weapon Expertise (class feature, not feat) and when Challenging is a bit better than the Pally smiting against team Jerk (not team Evil Outsider). The challenge is a bit more flexible since it can be done against any alignment. Samurai Sam does less DPR than Falchion Fred when he isn't challenging and is comparable DPR-wise when he is.

All of this assumes that the Samurai's man-eating killer warhorse is off doing something else. So I think we can safely say that you put together a credible build that isn't based around the mount.

Edited to turn '\' to '/' to make formatting work.

[wraithstrike]

I was trying to add Furious Focus to Tejon DPR calculator.
I can get it to work for the Full Attack, but for single attacks, I am not getting anything. Well I guess it is more correct to say I am not getting the right numbers for the single attack.

I am posting this with the hope that someone better than me can get it to work for the single attack.

modified DPR calculator

[Mischief Mondragon]

Drago (Monk 3 (Master of Many Styles/Monk of Sacred Mountain), Fighter 7 (Brawler)

show:

Ability Scores
STR: 22 (15 base, +2 racial, +1 level, +4 belt)
DEX: 17 (14 base, +1 level,+2 Ioun Stone )
CON: 13
INT: 10
WIS: 12
CHA: 8
HP: 69
Saving Throws
Fort: 12 Ref: 7 Will: 7
AC: 22/ 26 when fighting defensively Crane Style (-1 to hit) – Touch 14/18, Flatfooted 19 (+6 - +2 elven chain , +3 dex, +1 natural armor, +1 dodge, +1 Ring of Protection; when fighting defensively - +4 (+3 due to acrobatics, +1 extra dodge)
Attacks: unarmed (no crane style) +19/+19/+14/+14, 1d10+21 (first hit) or 1d10+18 for remainder (x2)
unarmed (crane style) +18/+18/+13/+13, 1d10+21 (first hit) or 1d10+18 for remainder (x2)
Class Abilities
Stunning Fist
Unarmed Strike
Iron Monk (Toughness and +1 natural armor)
Fuse Styles
Fast Movement (can’t use due to armor)
Maneuver Training
Still Mind
Close Control +2
Close Combat (+2 to hit and +4 to damage)
Menacing Stance
BAB: +9 CMB: 15 (17 with bull rush, drag, reposition) CMD: 28 (30 with bull rush, drag, reposition)
Feats:
Dodge
Crane Style
Crane Wing
Crane Riposte
Two-Weapon Fighting
Weapon Focus (unarmed)
Dragon Style
Dragon Ferocity
Weapon Specialization (unarmed)
Improved TWF
Monastic Legacy

Skills:
High Acrobatics (adds bonus to fighting defensively at 3 ranks) and Perception
Gear:
+2 Brawling Elven Chain
Amulet of Mighty Fists +1
Belt of Strength +4
Cloak of Resistance +2
Monk’s Robe

His average DPR in Dragon Style when not in Crane Style is 69.14, when in Crane Style it is 64.05

[Wind Chime]

Here to prove Double Barrel Guns aren't broken so here is the maths of me trying to break them.

Double Barrel (Brokenness)

Goblin
Fighter (weapon master) 4
Gunslinger (Pisterello) 6

Attributes:
Str: 10
Dex: 21+4= 25
Con: 13
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 06

Feats:
9 feats total (5, 3 fighter bonus, 1 gunslinger bonus)
Point Blank Shot
Precise Shot
Rapid Shot
Deadly Aim
Weapon Focus (Double Barrelled Pistol)
Weapon Specialization (double Barrelled Pistol)
Iron Will
Rapid Reload (Double Barrel Pistol)
Improved Critical (Double Barrel Pistol)

Equipment
Gloves of Duelling 15,000
Belt of Dexterity 16,000
Double Barrelled Pistol (+3) 20,050
Mithril Breast-Plate +1 5350
Cloak of Resistance +2 4,000

Fortitude: 11
Will: 8
Reflex: 14
AC: 25=10+7(armour)+5(dex)+2(dodge)+ 1(size)

AB
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) = 25, 20

AB (deadly aim)
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) = 22, 17

AB: (rapid shot + deadly aim)
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) -2(RS) = 20,20, 15

AB (rapid shot + deadly aim + double firing)

10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) -2(RS) -4 (DF) = 16,16,16,16,11, 11

Damage
1d6+7(dex)+6(DA)+ 3(en)+ 3(WT)+2(WS)
1d6+21

0.95(6d6+126)+0.3(126)
139.65+37.8=177.45

[Chevalier83]

Arcane Trickster DD

Tiefling Magus (Kensai, Fiend Flayer) 5 / Rogue (Knife Master) 3 / Arcane Trickster 2

Traits:
Magical Knack (Magus)
Wayang Spellhunter (Shocking Grasp)

Alternative racial traits
maw and claw (maw)
fiendish tail

Feats:
Weapon Focus (Kensai)
Weapon Proficiency (Kensai)
Canny Defence (Kensai)
Intimidating Prowess (Rogue Trick)
Power Attack
Intensify Spell
Skill Focus Intimidate
Dazzling Display (5th Magus Bonus)
Cornugon Smash
Shatter Defenses

Stats (10 Pt buy)
Str: 17 (+1 level) (+4 Magic Item) = 22
Dex: 8 (+2) = 10
Con: 8
Int: 15 (+2) = 17 (+1 level) = 18
Wis: 8
Cha: 7 (-2) = 5

Intimidate: 10 Ranks , 3 (Class Skill), 6 (Skill Focus), 6 (Strength) = 25

Magus Arcana that matters:

Arcane Strike

Arcane Pool: 4 Intelligence, 2 (Magus levels), 1 (preferred class options) = 7

As a swift action while moveing in the magus will use one arcane point to give his weapon keen and speed:

BAB 6/1

Weapon: Kukri

Spellcombat / Spellstrike:

- Cast Shocking Grasp:

- 1 hit (deliver Shocking grasp)
- 1 hit (speed)
- 1 hit regular hit
- 1 hit second hit
- 1 hit maw

as shocking grasp can be delivered in any of those hits, I will assume, that it is delivered
I will not use the +3 to hit (condition: opponent wears something made of metal, eg. weapon or armor)

the math:
First till third attack:

h = 6 (BAB)
-2 (spell combat) -2 Power attack +1 weapon focus +2 magical weapon +6 Strength
= 11 Base (~35% hit)
d = 2,5 (w4) +6 Strength +4 Power Attack +2
Weapon =
14,5 damage

fourth attack:
h = 11 - 5 = 6 (15% hit)
d = 14,5 damage

bite attack:
h = 4 = 5% hit
d = 2,5 +3 +2 = 7,5 damage

alltogether:
17,75 damage + 31,5 Shocking Grasp = 49,25
throw critical damage in: 49,25 + 13,52 = 62,77

Now it get's interesting:
on the first damage the target will get flat footed due to shatter defence - assuming a AC loss of 2:
59,32 + 16,6 Crits = 75,92
Sneak Attack damage on flat footed:
22,72 (knife master means d8s)

75,92 + 22,72 (Sneak Attack) = 98,64

the damage can be further increased by:
wielding a quicken rod (additional hit and additional shocking grasp damage)
considering the +3 to hit from shocking grasp against metal
flanking bonus +2
using arcane accuracy

examplary the use of arcane accuracy brings me to:
72,42 + 24 (crit) + 35,03 (sneak attack) ~ 130 DPR

[Mark Dyer]

Tripping Falchion Weapons Master Fighter archetype.

(Greater Trip or Tripping Attack to provoke AoO. Allowing for a possible +2 Attacks with Combat Reflexes, 1 from trip, 1 from standing)

Ways to Fight:

*DPR ~ 140+ (reroll miss chance/crit confirmation not calculated in)
A. Start with trip maneuver using Falchion(Trip CMB 25 for 95% success vs avg. 85% chance vs 29 CMD)
B. AoO with no penalty to power attack. (Furious Focus)
C. 2nd Attack vs prone. -4 AC, no Dex bonus (assumed avg -1 ac).
D. 3rd Attack (AoO vs prone when they stand.)

*DPR ~ Unknown (too complicated for me)
A. Attack normally no penalty to power attack.
If Crit, Trip attempt from Tripping Attack, If Trip then AoO
B 2nd Attack. (it's 3rd attack if vs. Prone after tripped AoO).
If Crit, not prone, Trip attempt.
C. Possible 4th Attack if any chances at trip succeed(AoO vs prone when they stand.)

Highlights.
Crit range of 15 - 20.
Automatic trip attempt on crit - uses confirmation roll vs CMD.
Reroll miss or crit confirmation 2 times/day.

15pt buy:
Stats: 22 Str. (+4 magic item)
16 Dex (+2 magic item)
14 Con
14 Int
10 Wis
7 Char

HP: 88
AC: 26 (+3 Full Plate) (higher if Combat Expertise/Fight Defensively with 3 ranks Acrobatics)

+3 Falchion

Trait: Heirloom Weapon +2CM Trip.

Feats:
Dodge
Weapon Focus
Power Attack
Furious Focus
Combat Expertise
Weapon Specialization
Improved Trip
Greater Trip
Combat Reflexes
Improved Critical
Tripping Strike
Critical Focus

Enjoy!

[Havoq]

Mark Dyer, yours is a varation of: Falchion Fred, human fighter 10 from three and half years ago. ...the second build in the thread.

It would be interesting to see a new thread with a 20 point buy using FPS legal characters, but that's just to my taste. Otherwise, we'd see a flood of synthesist summoners, and vivisectionist alchemists, something Gunslinger with advanced weapons, etc.

Shoot, a study of just archers DPR compared: Fighter, Monk, Pally and Ranger, etc. would be a great read.

[Nicos]

Unarmed fighter 5 - Guide 2 - Vivisecsionist 1 - Master of many styles 2

=== Stats ===
Str 18 (20),Dex 16,con 14,Int 10,Wis 14, Cha 7
=== Defense ===
AC: 22* (+6 armor +3 natural armor + 3 dex +1 luck +1 insight +1 def -3 Power attack)
Hp: 82

*26 with shield
=== Saves ===
Fort +18
Ref +17 (plus evasion)
Will +13
=== Attacks ===
unarmed strike: +19/+19/+14 (1d6+19 20/x2)
and
Claws: +11/+11 (1d4+12 20/x2)
and
bite: +11 (1d6+12 20/x2)

Sneak attack: +1d6

=== Traits===
Indomitable faith, Deft dodger

=== Feats and talents===
Tiger style,Tiger Pounce, armor of the pits, Improved unarmed strike, Stuning fist,Power attack, Dragon style,Dragon ferocity
Wepon focus (unarmed), double slice, TWF, Iron will, Aspect of the beast (Claws of the Beast).

=== Skills ===
UMD + 11, Sense motive +10, Perception +12, Swim +10, Climb +10, Acrobatics +11, Survival +7, Knowledge (nature) +6 , Stealth +10

=== Special ===
Weapon training 1 (unarmed, natural), Track, Ranger focus +2 (1/day), Evasion.

=== Gear ===
Belt of str +2
Gloves of dueling
+1 Amulet of mighty fist
Pale green Ioun stone (attack)
Pale green Ioun stone (Saves)
+2 mitral brawling chainshirt
+3 cloack of resistance
+1 Ring of protection
+1 amulet of natural armor
Dusty rose Ioun stone
Jingasa of the fortunate soldier
Eyes of the eagle
Wand of shield

=================0
DPR
Normal attack:
73.67
Sneak Attack only on the 1st attack:
76.47
Sneak Attack on all attacks:
85.40

Mutagen + Ranger Focus:
109,.53
Sneak Attack only on the 1st attack:
112.86
Sneak Attack on all attacks:
125.11

[Mark Dyer]

Havoq wrote:

Mark Dyer, yours is a varation of: Falchion Fred, human fighter 10 from three and half years ago. ...the second build in the thread.

It would be interesting to see a new thread with a 20 point buy using FPS legal characters, but that's just to my taste. Otherwise, we'd see a flood of synthesist summoners, and vivisectionist alchemists, something Gunslinger with advanced weapons, etc.

Shoot, a study of just archers DPR compared: Fighter, Monk, Pally and Ranger, etc. would be a great read.

A MAJOR variation to the Falchion Fred build that is much deadlier and much higher DPR.

This is also the only build to bring in Tripping Strike.

The build is FPS legal as well; just need to add 5 more pts for 20pt buy and it would be even MORE overpowered.

Thanks for looking.

[Otto E. Rector]

So I've seen a couple people use knifemaster rogue... I've got a couple ideas for that.
Knifemaster rogue 4/fighter 6
Str:16(+1lvl4)Wis:12 Cha:8
Con:14 Int:10
Dex:20(+1lvl,+2H)

Defense; AC:26 HP:87 Fort:+11 Ref:+14 Will:+7

Feats:Dodge, toughness, TWF, Wpn Focus:Kukri, Pwr Attack, ITWF, Imp. Crit:Kukri, Point Blank & Precise shot(For versatility's sake)

Gear:2x+2 kukri, +1 composite longbow, cloak of resistance +3, ring of protection+3, +2 Mithral breastplate, belt of STR+2, DEX+2, couple grand in misc.

Special abilities: Sneak atk+2d8(knives), Finesse Rogue, Other rogue talent, weapon training(light blades)+1, Armor training 1

Atk:MH kukri +15/+10(1d4+6,15-20) OH +15/+10(1d4+4,15-20)
Add the Killer racial trait for a +2 damage on all crits and +2d8 SA dmg when flanking/surprising. Another direction would be to use daggers and get the +1 damage to daggers trait(River Rat I think) although you'll give up the higher crit chance of kukris. I son't know how to crunsh numbers well so if anyone wanted to calculate the DPR that'd be greeeat :P

[Charender]

Mark Dyer wrote:

Havoq wrote:

Mark Dyer, yours is a varation of: Falchion Fred, human fighter 10 from three and half years ago. ...the second build in the thread.

It would be interesting to see a new thread with a 20 point buy using FPS legal characters, but that's just to my taste. Otherwise, we'd see a flood of synthesist summoners, and vivisectionist alchemists, something Gunslinger with advanced weapons, etc.

Shoot, a study of just archers DPR compared: Fighter, Monk, Pally and Ranger, etc. would be a great read.

A MAJOR variation to the Falchion Fred build that is much deadlier and much higher DPR.

This is also the only build to bring in Tripping Strike.

The build is FPS legal as well; just need to add 5 more pts for 20pt buy and it would be even MORE overpowered.

Thanks for looking.

There are a few problems with the DPS calculations.

1. You assume you are going to get an AoO from them standing up. Cover, concealment, or choosing to attack/cast from the ground would all negate your third attack. There is also a chance that you would run out of AoOs.
2. By the time you get to level 10, there are quite a few enemies that can not be tripped(like anything that flies)

This is why it is important to put in the base no special attack DPR.

[RtrnofdMax]

Wind Chime wrote:

Here to prove Double Barrel Guns aren't broken so here is the maths of me trying to break them.

Double Barrel (Brokenness)

Goblin
Fighter (weapon master) 4
Gunslinger (Pisterello) 6

Attributes:
Str: 10
Dex: 21+4= 25
Con: 13
Int: 10
Wis: 14
Cha: 06

Feats:
9 feats total (5, 3 fighter bonus, 1 gunslinger bonus)
Point Blank Shot
Precise Shot
Rapid Shot
Deadly Aim
Weapon Focus (Double Barrelled Pistol)
Weapon Specialization (double Barrelled Pistol)
Iron Will
Rapid Reload (Double Barrel Pistol)
Improved Critical (Double Barrel Pistol)

Equipment
Gloves of Duelling 15,000
Belt of Dexterity 16,000
Double Barrelled Pistol (+3) 20,050
Mithril Breast-Plate +1 5350
Cloak of Resistance +2 4,000

Fortitude: 11
Will: 8
Reflex: 14
AC: 25=10+7(armour)+5(dex)+2(dodge)+ 1(size)

AB
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) = 25, 20

AB (deadly aim)
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) = 22, 17

AB: (rapid shot + deadly aim)
10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) -2(RS) = 20,20, 15

AB (rapid shot + deadly aim + double firing)

10 (bab)+7(dex)+1(size)+1(focus)+3(weapons training) + 3(enhancement) – 3(DA) -2(RS) -4 (DF) = 16,16,16,16,11, 11

Damage
1d6+7(dex)+6(DA)+ 3(en)+ 3(WT)+2(WS)
1d6+21

0.95(6d6+126)+0.3(126)
139.65+37.8=177.45

What about the 15% chance per barrel to misfire? You can't hit 95% of the time because on a 2 or 3 you will misfire.

[ShadowcatX]

Human Paladin (divine hunter) 10

Str 14
Dex 18 (22)
Con 12
Int 10
Wis 8
Chr 14 (18)

Feats:
Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Deadly Aim, Weapon Focus (Long Bow), Many Shot, improved critical (long bow)

Attack Routine while smiting:

+10 (bab) +6 (dex) +1 (pbs) +1 (wf) +3 (enhancement), +4 (chr), -2 (rs), -3 (da) = + 20 / +20 / + 15 (first attack does double damage)

1d8 +2 (str) +6 (da) +10 (smite) +1 (pbs) + 1d8 + 19 = 23.5

So for the first 2 attacks:
h = 85%
d = 23.5
t = .1
c = 2

23.97 / first 2 attacks
19.97 for manyshot because it can't crit.

Last attack:
h= 60
d = 23.5
t = .1
c = 2

16.92

So total damage:
23.97 + 23.97 + 19.97 + 16.92
84.83

Keep in mind this is with only a +4 dex belt, +4 chr headband, and +3 bow, with no time to buff.

[Rerednaw]

TL;DR.

Nothing came up in a search for a DPR arcane. Were they excluded because the nature of spells/day makes them burst damage only? Already have seen several blaster builds just not here.

[Taenia]

Crystal Shatter, Onispawn Tiefling Cave Druid 10

The premise of the build assumes you can have Barkskin (100 min), Greater Magic Fang (10 hour), Wild Shape (10 hours) and you have 6/day for 10 min each you have Strong Jaw on you. Level 10 Cave Druid turns into a Carnivorous Crystal.

Ability Scores:
STR: 22 (15 Base + 1 Level + 2 Racial + 4 Belt) 26 in Carnivorous Crsytal Form
DEX: 12
CON: 14 (13 Base + 1 Level)
INT: 10
WIS: 18 (14 Base + 2 Racial + 2 Headband)
Cha: 6 (8 Base – 2 Racial)

HP: 78 (10d8 + 30)
Saving Throws
Fort: 12 Ref: 6 Will: 14

AC – 27 Touch 12 Flatfooted 26 (Armor +10, Natural +4, Dex +1, Insight +1, Deflection +1)

Attacks: Slam +19/+14 7d8 + 20, strong jaw becomes 14d8, Vital Strike 28d8

Special Attacks:

Class Abilities: Wild Shape, ooze immune to crits/sneak attack/poison

BAB: +7 CMB: +13 CMD: 24

Feats:
Weapon Focus Slam
Power Attack
Furious Focus
Natural Spell
Vital Strike

Math

Spoiler:

H= 80%
D= 146
T=5%
C=1
80%(146)+5%x1x80%x146 116.8+46.72 = 163.52

Gear 62000
Belt of Giant Strength +4 16000
Ioun Stone Cracked Pale Green Prism 4000
Dragonhide Fullplate +1 Wild 19300
Headband of Wisdom +2 4000
Ring of Prot +1 2000
Cloak of Protection +3 9000
Dusty Rose Ioun Stone 5000

This doesn't include a level 10 companion to serve as a one round distraction or ooze delivery mechanism and just a quick attempt to put one together.

[Artanthos]

Rerednaw wrote:

Nothing came up in a search for a DPR arcane. Were they excluded because the nature of spells/day makes them burst damage only?

Yes

[Charender]

Rerednaw wrote:

TL;DR.

Nothing came up in a search for a DPR arcane. Were they excluded because the nature of spells/day makes them burst damage only? Already have seen several blaster builds just not here.

There are a few blasters early on in this thread, but blasters suffer from a few problems.

1. Inconsistant Save bonuses, Most CR10 monsters have an AC of around 24, but the various saves on a monster can vary wildly.
2. Burst damage only. Most of the blaster builds can only put out max damage for about 3-5 rounds a day.
3. Resistances and vulnerabilities. Energy damage is a lot more likely to be affected by damage modifiers from resists, vulnerabilities, or immunities.
4. SoS/SOD spells that don't really have a damage value. There are spells that can completely take a creatures out of the fight without actually doing any damage. A successful hold monster followed by a successful CDG does infinite damage.

When you put this all together, it is just plain hard to put a value on the damage capacity of a spellcaster.

[Gator the Unread]

Gelmir wrote:

I present Fal, the Fighter(6)-Alchemist(4)

Despite not precisely following the rules in this thread, I think I have found my next character build...

[Gator the Unread]

Abbey the Aegis
10th level Half-giant Aegis

Dirt simple, not including all the bells and whistles
DPR 83.44
Attack +1 5.96
Damage +1 1.68
Extra Attack 53.64

Just the bare bones:

Str 26 (15 base, +2 race, +1 level, +2 Size, +6 Brawn)
Dex, Con, Wis 12-ish
BAB +10
AC: Starts as 21 (+11 armor, at least +1 dex, -1 size) and goes up on magic items
Saves:
Fort +7 base, plus at least +1 Con, plus items
Reflex +3 base, plus at least +1 Con, plus items (he will never be good at this)
Will +7 base, plus at least +1 Con, plus items

Attack: +21 Huge Great sword +3 (includes -1 size)
2d6 base, 3d6 large, 4d6 huge, 6d6 augment weapon

Weapon: Huge-size Greatsword +3*
Weapon is too big for Abbey to use until unless she (or her armor) is at least large-size. Thus, the weapon is not under the effects of expansion or similar effects
Armor: Full Plate +1

Astral Suit Customization (14 pts)
Augment Weapon (2 pts), Brawn x3 (6 pts), Crystallized Weapon (2 pts), Improved Damage (2 pts), Increased Size (2 pts)

Feats: Power Attack, Furious Focus, Weapon Focus (big honking sword), Improved Critical (big honking sword), plus one more

Items: +3 weapon, +1 Full Plate, appropriate items to equal out saves and such

I think I followed the rules, and all that. If anyone can spot problems, let me know.

Some one who knows what they are doing can do better. Speaking of which, that person ought to do a Psychic Warrior.

[Gator the Unread]

Whoops. Aegis is not proficient in Medium or Heavy Armor. Sorry. His full plate would work. Back to the drawing board.

[Slacker2010]

Is there any nice person that wants to sift through this thread and post the findings? Or can they point me to a location of the compiled results?

[Broken Zenith]

The Guide to the Builds is parallel to what you are looking for. It draws mostly from outside this thread, but it is a completed list of builds and some associated DPRs.

[Humphry B ManWitch]

Calculate this

Halfing Jinx Witch 10

DPS = ~0.0

Opponent disabled or dead second round

Max int Generally 24 or so at 10th

1st round.
Quickened ill omen, Standard action Evil Eye Hex. combined with Halfling Jinx trait -7 to all saving throws -4 if they make the saving throw twice against evil eye cackle as a move action extends evil eye.

2nd round
Phantasmal killer DC 23 (their save at max average +13 -7 = +6) Roll twice take the lowest = less than 1% chance of saving

[lovecheese45]

Humphry.. The halfling jinx trait is a standard action to use and is only a -1 to saves. Thus giving you -5, not -7.

With Quickened Ill omen being cast first... The charges would be used up for both evil eye hex and halfling trait hex.

[Sir Thugsalot]

People, please use the new thread for DPR entrees.

[Kurotoshi]

hi, i really do not understand how to calculate that dpr... maybe i wrong something with your formula... is there an automatic calculator?

[Potato disciple]

Gratz on reviving a 3 year old thread dude...

[Vemnic]

Unfortunately, rods from god won't be coming from wall of stone. Or at least you can't create them there. Because, wall of stone states...

This spell creates a wall of rock that merges into adjoining rock surfaces.

However, there may be a way to achieve a similar effect from the ground using teleport. Use an immovable rod to mark a location over the target, summon an elephant. Load it to it's max carrying capacity. polymorph your elephant into a fish. teleport your elephant below the rod. dismiss your polymorph on the way down. Even if the DM rules that the elephant disappears before transferring it's momentum, the stuff the elephant was carrying can be unloaded in the air.

Unfortunately, even that won't be too impressive as the system has a built in max fall damage of 20d6. It's much better for damaging structures than enemies. You only need to be about 200 feet in the air to drop bricks that each take 20d6 when they hit, presumably transferring some amount of damage to the structure in return.

Seems more useful honestly as an inciting incident for the players. They walk out of a tavern to alchemist fire laden bricks falling from the sky with no enemies in sight to kill. Then one smart player pulls out a spy glass and climbs a roof to finally spot a squad of flying assailants ridiculously high in the air unloading objects from large sacks over the city.

Air superiority is vastly underutilized in campaigns.

rat_ bastard wrote:

OK, So here is my Idea.

We need a Conjuration (Creation) Wizard with a Amulet of Adaptation and the spell overland flight.

First you challenge your target to a fight in a area where your enemy will contrast with the surrounding terrain, then you fly up into orbit.

Once in orbit you cast wall of stone spells and major creation spells to drop large rocks and metal pillars from orbit.

Pop Sci has a pretty good article on "Rods from God", I'm not sure how to calculate that into in game damage.

[LordKailas]

you're responding to a thread where the last person posted 3 years ago and that person was pointing out that the thread was 3 years old at that point. So, whoever you're responding to posted 6 years ago and is unlikely to see your response.

[Goblin_Priest]

Level 10 bloodrager lizardfolk

Base strength score of 16, +2 racial, +2 for level 4 and 8. +4 belt of strength, +2 amulet of mighty fists. Power Attack.

Has Enlarge Person, Blessing of Fervor, Haste, Prayer, Good Hope, Inspire Courage.

3 claw attacks (1d6=3.5), 1 bite (1d4=2.5). +26/+26/+26/+26. 20/x2 critical.

+23 damage per hit (+10 str, +6 power attack, +2 amulet of mighty fists, +1 prayer, +2 Good Hope, +2 Inspire Courage).

95% hit chance (2-20).

Claw attacks deal an average of 25.175 damage. Bite deals an average of 24.225 damage. Total, an average of 99.75 damage.

5% crit chance. Might not be doing this one exactly right, but 5% x 95% x 1 x 99.75 damage equals 4.738.

Which means a total of 104.488 damage per turn, on average, on a full attack, on a creature with 24 AC and all of my buffs on. Plus a free grapple check if the bite attack lands, and Greater Grapple. And 15ft reach.

But admittedly I usually won't have ALL of these buffs, most enemies at our table have much more than 24 AC at this level, and that still requires me being able to full-round attack and not be stuck moving around.

Glad to know a lot of people have much higher DPR, means I didn't cheese things too much. :)

[Wonderstell]

As mentioned above, this thread is meant to stay dead. Remember to check the timestamp for the thread before entering it.

===

@Goblin_Priest

Get a +1 Furious AoMF instead of a +2 AoMF. It counts as a +3 AoMF as long as you rage.

Buy an Animal Mask for another natural attack. It's just 2700 GP to get a Gore attack and scent, and it's activated as a swift action.

[Slim Jim]

Not only was the thread dead, but it was superseded by another one (see a half-dozen posts up).

[Scott Wilhelm]

And by at least 1 more before that, I think. The first post was back in 2009.

[Goblin_Priest]

Oh, yea. Our table banned Furious, because it's cheesy. But otherwise, indeed it'd be more optimal.

As for the animal mask, I presume that would override my existing bite attack. There's a spell on the bloodrager spell list that lets me turn a leg into a hoof, so I can gain 2 more natural attacks that way, but at level 10 my spell slots are few so I'm not throwing all of my highest level spell slots into that (though for the sake of calculating max DPR potential, I guess I could have).

[Slim Jim]

Goblin_Priest wrote:

Our table banned Furious, because it's cheesy.

A doodad that is slightly better for one class? --That's most of the magic items in the game.

[Wonderstell]

Goblin_Priest wrote:

As for the animal mask, I presume that would override my existing bite attack.

Nah, there's a bunch of monsters that have both Bite and Gore. I think there's some discussion about slams and claws, though.