Firearms + Vital strike


Rules Questions

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

OK here goes:

1. if you vital strike with a firearm, do your extra dice gain exploding dice?

2. Can you vital strike without precision? (i.e. use it against undead constructs etc.) and if so can you use it with the scattergun?

3. On a similar note can you use deadly stroke with firearms, say as a sniper for the first shot.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

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Christopher Van Horn wrote:
1. if you vital strike with a firearm, do your extra dice gain exploding dice?

No. The exploding dice damage is similar in concept to a critical hit or sneak attack. Only the weapon's base damage die/dice are increased by Vital Strike.

Christopher Van Horn wrote:
2. Can you vital strike without precision? (i.e. use it against undead constructs etc.) and if so can you use it with the scattergun?

Yes. Vital Strike works on any target with any weapon you have to make an attack roll to hit with.

Christopher Van Horn wrote:
3. On a similar note can you use deadly stroke with firearms, say as a sniper for the first shot.

Yes, provided (of course) you have Greater Weapon Focus with the firearm.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
James Jacobs wrote:


No. The exploding dice damage is similar in concept to a critical hit or sneak attack. Only the weapon's base damage die/dice are increased by Vital Strike.

But do the extra dice granted by vital strike "explode"? i.e. I use vital strike and roll 6d6 with a scattergun, do all of these 6 dice get to reroll if they roll maximum?

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Christopher Van Horn wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


No. The exploding dice damage is similar in concept to a critical hit or sneak attack. Only the weapon's base damage die/dice are increased by Vital Strike.
But do the extra dice granted by vital strike "explode"? i.e. I use vital strike and roll 6d6 with a scattergun, do all of these 6 dice get to reroll if they roll maximum?

I would be guessing very strongly no. As it's like a critical, Vital Strike is unaffected by it.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Christopher Van Horn wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


No. The exploding dice damage is similar in concept to a critical hit or sneak attack. Only the weapon's base damage die/dice are increased by Vital Strike.
But do the extra dice granted by vital strike "explode"? i.e. I use vital strike and roll 6d6 with a scattergun, do all of these 6 dice get to reroll if they roll maximum?

Nope; they're just extra dice. They don't explode.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Thank You for the clarification. It will make our fighter decide how exactly he wants to do his character a bit more. And keeps the weapon balanced for the rest of us.

Grand Lodge

Liking the sounds of these ideas!


On the subject, where are the rules for firearms in the Pathfinder world? I don't own the setting book so I wasn't sure it appeared there.

Grand Lodge

As far as I know the only place firearms rules appear are the Campaign Setting. Probably wrong though lol

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Krome wrote:
As far as I know the only place firearms rules appear are the Campaign Setting. Probably wrong though lol

Nope; that's correct. The firearm rules are in the hardcover Campaign Setting book and no where else.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

What have I missed, what do you all mean by "exploding" dice?


James Jacobs wrote:


Nope; that's correct. The firearm rules are in the hardcover Campaign Setting book and no where else.

Even more reason to get the book! Thanks for the quick replies.

RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

James Risner wrote:
What have I missed, what do you all mean by "exploding" dice?

Also known as open-ended dice. Roll the max value, you keep it and roll again.

Grand Lodge

James Risner wrote:
What have I missed, what do you all mean by "exploding" dice?

trick dice. When you roll all 6s they explode! So freaking cool!

No... seriously :)

ok ok ok... exploding dice is popularly used in Shadowrun (MIGHT have been introduced in that game as well). Roll your d6 and if the die rolls a 6, reroll it and ADD the second number to the 6. If the second roll was a 6, reroll it and ADD the third roll to 12, etc.

In this way, a single d6 could produce scores into the 20s! or higher. And yeah I had that happen once in Shadowrun. It was AWESOME! :) lol

The use of this rule for firearms allows firearms the potential to be extremely deadly. Something they seriously lacked.

Sovereign Court

Pathfinder Pawns Subscriber

Deadly when rolling max damage, yes. But remember that they backfire on a natural one (and on a natural one and two, in the case of the revolver)

James: I have ruled in my campaign that MW versions are one step better (i.e. backfire on a 1 normally does not backfire if MW; bf on a 1-2 normally only bf on a 1 if MW). I'm also tempted to rule that magical firearms do not backfire. Thoughts? comments?

Cheers,

PDK


Purple Dragon Knight wrote:

Deadly when rolling max damage, yes. But remember that they backfire on a natural one (and on a natural one and two, in the case of the revolver)

James: I have ruled in my campaign that MW versions are one step better (i.e. backfire on a 1 normally does not backfire if MW; bf on a 1-2 normally only bf on a 1 if MW). I'm also tempted to rule that magical firearms do not backfire. Thoughts? comments?

Cheers,

PDK

Good thoughts. I've been allowing some limited firearms in The Council of Thieve AP for the rogue in the party. Those ideas will be really useful. Though for balance, if not for realism, I've decided not to use exploding dice. I hadn't thought about masterwork affecting the backfire. I like that. And I think magic could rule it out.

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