Ranger choosing Loremaster Prestige Class


Rules Questions


I've poured over the new book and it appears that Rangers cannot qualify for the Loremaster Prestige Class until level 14. I would appreciate it if someone could prove me wrong.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Actually I believe a Ranger could qualify for Loremaster at lvl 10. Not that I'm puzzled why he would want to :)


LOL I was ready for that comment!

Anyway I would appreciate it if you could explain how he can get it a level 10. Loremaster requires the ability to cast 7 divination spells, one of which must be at least 3rd level. I don't think Rangers get a 3rd level spell until level 11 and, unfortunately, none of them is a divination spell. Rangers do get a level 4 divination spell, Commune with Nature, but can't cast it until level 14.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Pathfinder Rangers can have 3rd level spells from lvl 10 on (providing they have high enough Wisdom to get a bonus 3rd level spell).

As for the lack of divination spells... well, Spell Compendium is an evil book, but I believe there are enough divination ranger spells there to fill 7 slots :)


I will be restricting spells to those in the new Core Rulebook in my campaign, at least at the beginning. That said, Rangers do get 7 divination spells: 5 at level 1; 1 at level 2; and 1 at level 4.

I suppose if I stick to the Core Rulebook, then level 14 (level 13 with a Wisdom bonus) is the earliest a Ranger can choose Loremaster.

The Exchange

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Wu Chi wrote:

I will be restricting spells to those in the new Core Rulebook in my campaign, at least at the beginning. That said, Rangers do get 7 divination spells: 5 at level 1; 1 at level 2; and 1 at level 4.

I suppose if I stick to the Core Rulebook, then level 14 (level 13 with a Wisdom bonus) is the earliest a Ranger can choose Loremaster.

With core rules only that is correct, since a ranger does not have any 3rd level divination spells. I think it still begs the question of why a ranger would want to?


I truly doubt they will "want to" given that they can't get it until level 13 or 14; however, having said that, I can understand how a Ranger/Loremaster could be crucial to discovering those places and things that adventurers so much like to see and feel.


Obviously not a direct answer to your question, but by loosening the terms up a bit, maybe a level or few dip into Druid or Cleric would prove to be optimal?


I know where you're coming from, but I think under the circumstances it would be better if a player simply chose Druid/Loremaster or Cleric/Loremaster rather than try to work in the Ranger class.

It's too bad because Rangers, in my opinion, are uniquely suited to the "field" work of the Loremaster, though they may have a problem with being locked up inside with all those books the rest of the time.


I think the loremaster is meant to be more of a bookish sage type. It would be easy enough to make a class for more militant types. There was a class in the iron kingdoms monsternomicon that would probably work well.

The Exchange

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
Wu Chi wrote:

I know where you're coming from, but I think under the circumstances it would be better if a player simply chose Druid/Loremaster or Cleric/Loremaster rather than try to work in the Ranger class.

It's too bad because Rangers, in my opinion, are uniquely suited to the "field" work of the Loremaster, though they may have a problem with being locked up inside with all those books the rest of the time.

Tried responding to this much earlier in the day, but the website was... well... dying. I think another good option for the characters (or NPCs if you want) would be Ranger/Pathfinder Chronicler. Since you're DM you can even rule that you don't need to be a Pathfinder for it. It fits the description / type of character that you're looking for (the ability to look/delve into old history, gain knowledge) but is more melee oriented than the Loremaster. The ranger would also be able to qualify for the Chronicler much much sooner.


There will be no Pathfinder Chroniclers in my campaign. It is a niche Prestige Class that fits in well with Pathfinder Society or with campaigns set in Golarion. My campaign is neither of those.

[WARNING: RANT] Why can't the core rules and the campaign settings be completely separated? Many DM's have their own campaign. They have taken the time and expended the effort to create a coherent universe for their players that has absolutely nothing to do with the commercial campaign settings (e.g., Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Faerun, etc.) or the characters that exist within those campaign settings (e.g., Mordenkainan, Otiluke, Leomund, etc.), yet these places and names constantly appear in core rulebooks throughout the history of D&D. I was hoping that Pathfinder would refrain from this. For the most part they have; however, I see one glaring example (i.e., the Pathfinder Chronicles Deities listed with the Cleric Domains). Listing those deities was wholly unnecessary to the core rules. The domain descriptions were enough. The power sources for those domains are best left to the DM to decide. A lesser example would be the aforementioned Pathfinder Chronicler Prestige Class. No doubt I will find more before I finish reading the Core Rulebook. Thanks for allowing me this rant (though I doubt few will read it since it is buried in the rules section of the message boards) and please don't flame me with the typical "just ignore the place and name references in the core rules" because I've been doing that for 35 years now.

The Exchange

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Card Game, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Well, if you made a campaign setting neutral book, then there would be quite a lot of beginning (or even not beginning) DMs who would have to create a setting out of thin air. In the grand scheme of things, the addition of a deity tables gives DMs a good baseline to create a world if they so choose. It's not like you simply can't tell a PC "that isn't available". Past that the other things tied to a campaign like the names, are just simply taken off.

Final note: Rename the Pathfinder Chronicler to Chronicler and it works fine. The prestige class itself has no requirements to be from the Pathfinder Society nor anything Golarion specific. In fact under the description for the class the Pathfinder Society isn't mentioned once. All it is described at is someone who goes searching for adventure/treasure and chronicles the stuff.

Liberty's Edge

You could use the Unearthed Arcana optional rule of making the prestige classes test-based instead of class ability based. That way, he would just have to cast a 3rd-level divination spell (possibly from a scroll or wand if he has ranks in Use Magic Device). I've always thought the test-based prestige class requirements were more interesting anyway.


Wu Chi wrote:

[WARNING: RANT] Why can't the core rules and the campaign settings be completely separated? Many DM's have their own campaign. They have taken the time and expended the effort to create a coherent universe for their players that has absolutely nothing to do with the commercial campaign settings (e.g., Greyhawk, Blackmoor, Faerun, etc.) or the characters that exist within those campaign settings (e.g., Mordenkainan, Otiluke, Leomund, etc.), yet these places and names constantly appear in core rulebooks throughout the history of D&D. I was hoping that Pathfinder would refrain from this. For the most part they have; however, I see one glaring example (i.e., the Pathfinder Chronicles Deities listed with the Cleric Domains). Listing those deities was wholly unnecessary to the core rules. The domain descriptions were enough. The power sources for those domains are best left to the DM to decide.

I think it's also to do with the creators fondness for the names. The name of spells for example. A lot of people probably use and know the names of countless spells named after characters they've never heard of (Bigby, Leomund and Rary to name a few).


Alizor wrote:
Well, if you made a campaign setting neutral book, then there would be quite a lot of beginning (or even not beginning) DMs who would have to create a setting out of thin air.

OMG what an awful thing to have to do! I'm amazed that I managed to do exactly that about 35 years ago, long before all those supplements people now refer to ever existed.

Alizor wrote:
In the grand scheme of things, the addition of a deity tables gives DMs a good baseline to create a world if they so choose.

Doesn't this information appear in other Pathfinder publications?

Alizor wrote:
It's not like you simply can't tell a PC "that isn't available".

LOL I have to do that all the time!

Alizor wrote:
Past that the other things tied to a campaign like the names, are just simply taken off.

Maybe that works for you, but it doesn't work for me. There is a character and a storyline related to those spells and/or magic items, and I don't want my campaign carrying that baggage in any way, shape or form.

Alizor wrote:
Final note: Rename the Pathfinder Chronicler to Chronicler and it works fine. The prestige class itself has no requirements to be from the Pathfinder Society nor anything Golarion specific. In fact under the description for the class the Pathfinder Society isn't mentioned once. All it is described at is someone who goes searching for adventure/treasure and chronicles the stuff.

Please name one campaign that refers to Pathfinders in general and Pathfinder Chroniclers in particular other than Pathfinder Society or Golarion. This is a purely niche Prestige Class unique to the Pathfinder campaign setting. I would think that would be obvious given the name Pathfinder before the word Chronicler. I'm quite sure they didn't name it just Chronicler because someone, sometime, would have realized that the prestige class they just created was, in fact, a bard.


stardust wrote:
You could use the Unearthed Arcana optional rule of making the prestige classes test-based instead of class ability based. That way, he would just have to cast a 3rd-level divination spell (possibly from a scroll or wand if he has ranks in Use Magic Device). I've always thought the test-based prestige class requirements were more interesting anyway.

I will be using only the Core Rulebook and the Bestiary for my campaign. I'd like both myself and the players to have a firm grasp of the core rules before we expand into any supplements. Hopefully, we won't have to use any supplements at all. Though I must admit that a test based, as opposed to a class based, prestige class is a very good idea and lends itself to a narrative (roleplay) scenario far better than automatic advancement.

Shadow Lodge

Wu Chi wrote:


Please name one campaign that refers to Pathfinders in general and Pathfinder Chroniclers in particular other than Pathfinder Society or Golarion. This is a purely niche Prestige Class unique to the Pathfinder campaign setting. I would think that would be obvious given the name Pathfinder before the word Chronicler. I'm quite sure they didn't name it just Chronicler because someone, sometime, would have realized that the prestige class they just created was, in fact, a bard.

I haven't spent a lot of time with the Chronicler PRC but I would generally agree it functions very much like a bard ...

But... (I assume your mileage will be different) I like this PRC as example of Journalist/Explorer genre instead of the Performer/Enthraller the bard is typically seen as. Granted its mostly fluff but I'd still find it useful out side of Golarian.


Pathfinder Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

right, but there are examples of characters who fit the description of a chronicler, per the PrC description (which makes no mention of the society, or anything Golarion Specific).

Volo comes to mind immediately...


Wu Chi wrote:
OMG what an awful thing to have to do! I'm amazed that I managed to do exactly that about 35 years ago, long before all those supplements people now refer to ever existed.

Creating one's own setting isn't for everyone, though, especially for folks new to the hobby. Having a "baseline" setting makes it easier for a majority to learn and play the game.

Wu Chi wrote:
Doesn't this information appear in other Pathfinder publications?

It does, but there's no way to guarantee that someone purchasing the Core Rulebook has any of that supplementary material. Or even knows it exists.

Wu Chi wrote:
Maybe that works for you, but it doesn't work for me. There is a character and a storyline related to those spells and/or magic items, and I don't want my campaign carrying that baggage in any way, shape or form.

So change those stories for your campaign when said elements surface, or remove them entirely. You're capable of doing and have the time to accomplish what many GMS only dream about: creating your own unique setting. You truly are playing your own version of the game, and you strike me being very capable of altering such content in short order and without much difficulty.

Wu Chi wrote:
Please name one campaign that refers to Pathfinders in general and Pathfinder Chroniclers in particular other than Pathfinder Society or Golarion. This is a purely niche Prestige Class unique to the Pathfinder campaign setting. I would think that would be obvious given the name Pathfinder before the word Chronicler. I'm quite sure they didn't name it just Chronicler because someone, sometime, would have realized that the prestige class they just created was, in fact, a bard.

I can't think of another setting, and rightly so as the terminology, or at least its implementation in this manner, is Paizo's property. That said, the game itself is the Pathfinder Role Playing Game; why can't the word "Pathfinder" before Chronicler simply be a reference to the core game? Just because the prestige class holds greater significance in a given setting doesn't mean it's a niche prestige class in this instance.

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