Converting PFS#1 - 28 to PRPG Rules


GM Discussion

The Exchange 5/5

Has anyone thought about making a collective effort to convert the 3.5 Edition Pathfinder Society scenarios to the Pathfinder RPG rules and making the 'conversion guides' available to the membership?

Something struck me as I was advising some of my local players. The Pathfinder RPG Bestiary isn't due to come out until October. All the NPC stat blocks will be convertable under the PRPG rules available in two weeks. The monster stat blocks will not be as easy. Yes, they could be made "close enough" with estimations and educated guesses, but without the Bestiary we won't be able to render exact conversions until October.

Is there a way, post-GenCon of course, that Paizo could assist with the conversion process earlier than October? I don't know the best way to do this. Maybe the monster generation rules, or maybe just the specific stat blocks for the creatures in #1 - #28. It sounds like a pain in the butt either way.

5/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber

I'd be interested, but only in ones I've run/played (which is only three).

I don't think there's any huge rush regarding the Bestiary though - any creature that's in the Bestiary is just a page reference change. NPCs will be doable. The rest could be redone fairly well with just the RPG - feat changes (some new ones for a feat every odd HD, and changes like Toughness x 5 going away), plus adding in CMB/CMD.

2/5 *

One thing I learned about DMing in the last 30 years is that the details don't matter. Whether the bad guy has an attack bonus of +4 or +6 doesn't matter at all to the players. Story matters, the numbers just help to run the game in some kind of ordered fashion.

I won't be converting anything with the exception of CMB/CMD, but I can calculate that on the fly anyway.

The Exchange 5/5 RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

I'd be happy to help.

Paizo Employee Director of Brand Strategy

Jason S wrote:

One thing I learned about DMing in the last 30 years is that the details don't matter. Whether the bad guy has an attack bonus of +4 or +6 doesn't matter at all to the players. Story matters, the numbers just help to run the game in some kind of ordered fashion.

I won't be converting anything with the exception of CMB/CMD, but I can calculate that on the fly anyway.

While I agree with you, we have not seen the official word on conversion from Josh. It may be that more than CMB/CMD needs to be converted to a table to be legal. In home play it's all up to you, but in organized play, maintaining the same play experience for everyone is one of the primary goals. I am happy to help with the conversion effort, but will wait for the official conversion guide to see what should be converted and how.

Sovereign Court

Maybe the conversion document that Paizo was tlaking about putting out will handle that?


Doug Doug wrote:
Is there a way, post-GenCon of course, that Paizo could assist with the conversion process earlier than October?

I think it's great that you guys want to convert season 0 scenarios to PRPG. It's not something I can assist with, however. We plan *not* to convert the scenarios ourselves as the conversion document due out around Gen Con should cover how to do so on the fly.


Joshua J. Frost wrote:


I think it's great that you guys want to convert season 0 scenarios to PRPG. It's not something I can assist with, however. We plan *not* to convert the scenarios ourselves as the conversion document due out around Gen Con should cover how to do so on the fly.

Should some enterprising people do so in a nice legible format, is it acceptable to distribute such for the less enterprising?

-James

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james maissen wrote:
Joshua J. Frost wrote:


I think it's great that you guys want to convert season 0 scenarios to PRPG. It's not something I can assist with, however. We plan *not* to convert the scenarios ourselves as the conversion document due out around Gen Con should cover how to do so on the fly.

Should some enterprising people do so in a nice legible format, is it acceptable to distribute such for the less enterprising?

-James

We plan to play most of the Season 0 adventures post-GenCon, so I'd be interested in this. Although Josh's "one-sheet" will probably suit us, if the more thorough conversion never happens.

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

james maissen wrote:
Joshua J. Frost wrote:


I think it's great that you guys want to convert season 0 scenarios to PRPG. It's not something I can assist with, however. We plan *not* to convert the scenarios ourselves as the conversion document due out around Gen Con should cover how to do so on the fly.

Should some enterprising people do so in a nice legible format, is it acceptable to distribute such for the less enterprising?

-James

So long as all you're distributing is just the portion that needs conversion. That is, you can say "here's the stuff that needs to be changed," but you can't just give out the entire scenario.

You should also endeavor to stay within our Community Use Policy in any other respect.

2/5 *

I take it back. Some conversion guide will be needed. In particular:

1) How prestige will be handled since all new scenarios will allow for 2 possible prestige points per scenario (one easy, one hard). Will the older scenarios have lesser rewards or will it be possible to gain 2 prestige points in them somehow?

2) The amount of possible gold per scenario has slightly increased. Will the amount of gold in old scenarios be increased?

2/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Jason S wrote:


1) How prestige will be handled since all new scenarios will allow for 2 possible prestige points per scenario (one easy, one hard). Will the older scenarios have lesser rewards or will it be possible to gain 2 prestige points in them somehow?

2) The amount of possible gold per scenario has slightly increased. Will the amount of gold in old scenarios be increased?

These are my interpretations:

1) Lesser rewards. No changes.

2) No.


Jason S wrote:

I take it back. Some conversion guide will be needed. In particular:

1) How prestige will be handled since all new scenarios will allow for 2 possible prestige points per scenario (one easy, one hard). Will the older scenarios have lesser rewards or will it be possible to gain 2 prestige points in them somehow?

2) The amount of possible gold per scenario has slightly increased. Will the amount of gold in old scenarios be increased?

Neither of those issues will be addressed. The 3.5 scenarios will stay the way they are.

1/5

I look at it this way, myself. Season 0 has always been clearly stated as season 0. Since there were some really fun adventures in season zero, and because there will be groups that need to have some "filler" adventures where the ones published that month don't quite fit, its really cool that the season zero adventures are still viable, but they were designed under a rules system that won't be in effect and under the trial season of the organized play rules.

In other words, they weren't designed in a format that is 100% compliant with what the final version will be, so the season zero scenarios will never be able to fit quite as well as scenarios that are designed under season one, so if you want your players to keep on the cutting edge, then you probably don't want the majority of the scenarios you run for a "steady" group to be season zero scenarios. But its great if you really had fun with a scenario and want to run the story for your players, or just don't have a season one scenario to run when you need it.

2/5 *

Joshua J. Frost wrote:
Neither of those issues will be addressed. The 3.5 scenarios will stay the way they are.

That's too bad because playing season 0 will be disadvantageous now. I can understand not converting the prestige reward, but there should be some easy formula (+10%?) for increasing GP reward. I'm not mathematically challenged, I can do it!

I suppose I can just be "extra easy" on my players however regarding GP and maybe faction missions.

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Jason S wrote:
That's too bad because playing season 0 will be disadvantageous now.

I doubt it. PFRPG characters are tougher than 3.5 characters, particularly at lower levels, so challenging them with an adventure written for 3.5 means higher chance of success = more likelihood of getting the full gp option. Furthermore, many of the Season 0 faction missions were notoriously easy. I think you'll be much more likely to "max out" Season 0 adventures than Season 1 adventures, so I don't see a disadvantage.

2/5 *

WelbyBumpus wrote:
Jason S wrote:
That's too bad because playing season 0 will be disadvantageous now.
I doubt it. PFRPG characters are tougher than 3.5 characters, particularly at lower levels, so challenging them with an adventure written for 3.5 means higher chance of success = more likelihood of getting the full gp option. Furthermore, many of the Season 0 faction missions were notoriously easy. I think you'll be much more likely to "max out" Season 0 adventures than Season 1 adventures, so I don't see a disadvantage.

These are good points and I'll let my players know when it comes up.

Sovereign Court 3/5

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber

I'll jump on this thread as the best place to ask a general qn about Year 0 conversions.

The one Year 0 mod I have converted so far for Year 1 play was a relatively straightforward replacement of like for like from the Bestiary with tweeks.

The next mod I need to do has a number of NPCs with character levels and that raises a general point I cannot see addressed elsewhere.

In 3.5 a Ranger 3, for example, was a CR 3 encounter; whereas, in PFRPG, it is now only a CR 2 encounter.

Even converting the 3.5 NPC to its PFRPG stats does not change the CR even though it is probably a little more powerful: it is still a CR 2 encounter.

2 choices:

1. Add another level to the NPC - Ranger 4 - thus making it a full PFRPG CR 3, the same CR as in the original Year 0

2. Just convert to PF as a Ranger 3 - CR minus one but retaining the same character level as in the original Year 0.

Thoughts? Guidance appreciated?

Thanks

J


This is a great example and question and shows why I really don't want people to convert the Season 0 scenarios. Please do not add levels, change monsters, etc. Just run them as they are with minor conversions for CMB/CMD.

Sovereign Court 3/5

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber

Thanks Josh for the quick reply.

Liberty's Edge 5/5 *** Venture-Captain, Missouri—Cape Girardeau

Does the "do not change" policy include for creatures updated by the Bestiary? Some of these have changed CR and HP.

Possible scenario spoiler:
For example: In the Asmodeous Mirage, characters in one Tier face a Gargantuan Animated Object (CR 7). Looking at the CR, I adjusted this down to Huge (CR 7)

For Example: Undead have less hit-points then before.


Use bestiary creatures preferably and keep to the CR whenever possible--but wholesale re-creation of NPCs and the like? Not allowed.

5/5

Joshua J. Frost wrote:
Use bestiary creatures preferably and keep to the CR whenever possible--but wholesale re-creation of NPCs and the like? Not allowed.

Should 3.5 domain powers of clerics be changed for the PRPG version in stead?

Should NPCs with heroic classes get the new PRPG class features (e.g. armor training, bloddline powers, etc.)?


No and no. Run them as is.

Those scenarios will eventually be retired or updated.

Liberty's Edge

Is there a list somewhere of the retired mods (with dates) that gets updated?

We'd like to get everything in before it goes, but browsing to every single module's page and checking for updates is tedious.


emperor799 wrote:

Is there a list somewhere of the retired mods (with dates) that gets updated?

We'd like to get everything in before it goes, but browsing to every single module's page and checking for updates is tedious.

Yep, this stickied thread is for that.

Sczarni 4/5

Andrew Phillips wrote:


3. I do not use the 3.5 Monster Manuel; I did not realize WOTC products were needed to participate in Pathfinder Society games. If this is the case maybe it should be in the Pathfinder Society Organized Play Guide. (If it is I apologize for missing it)
4. I did not see anywhere in the Pathfinder Society Organized Play Guide that I was supposed to use the 3.5 version of the monster, the Scenario had no stats for the monster, it calls for huge centipedes.

To quote Josh from This thread:

Joshua J. Frost wrote:
This is a great example and question and shows why I really don't want people to convert the Season 0 scenarios. Please do not add levels, change monsters, etc. Just run them as they are with minor conversions for CMB/CMD.

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