Doug Doug |
Joshua, I understand that you are only playing the cards you have been dealt and that a lot of hard-to-please people are going to be giving you Hell (apologies--myself first and foremost) over the blog entry regarding GenCon. I want you to know that you are appreciated and don't want you to get discouraged by all the complaining some of us do. The easy answer to that sentiment is "Don't complain". Easier said than done. But if you ever have or start to get aggravated with the vocal segment of this community, I hope you understand that we only complain because we enjoy this PFS thing so much and carry very high expectations. Perhaps if Paizo could figure out a way to charge our accounts for receiving and processing complaints you could turn this to your advantage. Just tell me where to send the PayPal credit. We'll trim your mortgage down in no time at all.
OK, with the nicitites out of the way--I'm sure everyone is grumbling about the PRPG rulebook getting released simultaneously as the convention begins. No one likes to wait in line. Which begs the question, will there be a limit on the number of PRPG books an individual can buy? I get a discount based on the number of Paizo subscriptions I receive. Can I buy 20 copies for my friends so they don't have to all wait in line? That's going to shave $150 off your bottom line. Am I going to cause any static? Cause concern over someone re-selling the discounted books to people in the back of the line? Just thinking ahead so you can plan accordingly.
It has been stated that the Season Zero scenarios will NOT be revised & converted to the PRPG rules--such a thing would be too great a time sink for your person. Any conversion of Season Zero scenarios would have to be rendered by the individual GM. However, there will likely be many players who have held off joining the Society until the new rules are instituted, and GenCon will be their first Pathfinder Society experience. These players will be eligible to play only half the scenarios premiering at GenCon. Do you think that you or your contributors could convert just three or four low-tier Season Zero scenarios so new players might have some more play opportunities at GenCon? That is, if there will be any space for pick-up games in the PFS area...
Archiviste |
(...) and GenCon will be their first Pathfinder Society experience. These players will be eligible to play only half the scenarios premiering at...
Even "seasoned" players who did not have the chance to play at least 21 PFS scenarios will be locked out of the last scenario (Drow of the Darklands Pyramid, Tiers 7–11).
As the main DM of our gaming group, I'm not even sure I will be able to level out any character to 5th level. To say I am disappointed is putting it mildly.
Oh well, I heard that Indianapolis has an amazing zoo...
Daniel Mayrand
driving 14 hours to GenCon for... what ?
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Joshua J. Frost |
Please don't run down the road of defeatism.
I'm already giving some thought to running some extra low level scenarios at the show. The highest level scenario only runs four times total throughout the entire show--the emphasis was on low-level play through the 2-part scenario. We also have a Friday night Pathfinder Society event and a Saturday night Pathfinder Society event. They'll be similar, but I've asked Tim and the folks helping him to make them different enough that players can play both. You'll be able to bring your PC, regardless of level, from PFS and play. So that's four scenarios anyone can play and two for folks who've been playing all season. The Friday and Saturday night events will have chronicle sheets, by the way.
That said--we're not WotC and we're not the RPGA. We have one person running the entirety of our org play system and we're not going to be able to get the space they can get at Gen Con because they have the money to throw down the largest sponsorship package and we've got one of the smaller ones. I'll do my best to make additional scenarios available, but please don't everyone throw your arms up in defeat. It doesn't help me, it doesn't help the Society--I'll do my best and that's all I can promise. :-)
As for PRPG and sales at the show, we've made no decisions yet.
Doug Doug |
Please don't run down the road of defeatism.
That said--we're not WotC and we're not the RPGA. We have one person running the entirety of our org play system and we're not going to be able to get the space they can get at Gen Con because they have the money to throw down the largest sponsorship package and we've got one of the smaller ones. I'll do my best to make additional scenarios available, but please don't everyone throw your arms up in defeat. It doesn't help me, it doesn't help the Society--I'll do my best and that's all I can promise. :-)
Thanks for being so responsive Joshua. I don't always get the answer I want, but at least I get an answer :)
That said--we're not WotC and we're not the RPGA.
Yet. Give it a few more seasons and PFS will invade the Wabash Ballroom.
smalenberg |
Please don't run down the road of defeatism.
...
As for PRPG and sales at the show, we've made no decisions yet.
Joshua, can you keep us informed of decisions about how sales will be handled at the show and commit to having something out before event ticket sales begin? Some of us would like to use that information to decide when/if we'll play PFS at the Con. Nobody likes the idea of losing a prime play slot to waiting in line (there are bound to be other events premiering at the same time). Are there any other options that can be considered, such as a Wednesday pre-exhibit hall opportunity for the dedicated fans of the campaign and some of Paizo's best customers to get the book ahead of time?
Will the conversion guide and the beta rules be complete enough to play a new slot without having the book yet? If so, I think most of us would be well pleased and would pick up our books later. The players in my group tend to have set, limited "shopping hours" because we want to play as many events as we can.
Can you be sure you'll have enough copies to meet the demand? Wasn't the campaign setting hardcover the item everyone was lining up for last year (and didn't it sell out?)?
I understand the marketing value of the buzz a line from your booth around the hall will create. There is a lot of value there, but there is also value in treating good customers better than the airline example, where the business traveler who does the most business gets the worst price because he has to buy on shortest notice.
I'm not trying to be defeatist, but it would seem there should be a way to manage this that will keep some of your biggest fans and supporters happier.
Many of us would like nothing more than to see Paizo have clout to match Wizards at the Con because 4E has left such a bad taste in our mouths.
Marion Nalepa |
To all involved.
GenCon is only a few days, and my group and I always fight to get as high a gaming value as possible out of the trip. This means that we play every slot we can -- especially the morning slots.
I have every confidence that given all the information, Paizo will make the right decisions to keep as many gamers excited about their system as possible. But sometimes decisions have unforeseen ramifications. The Star Wars decision to run all their Con adventures in trilogies -- cute considering the movies -- effectively meant that one had to dedicate at lest 3 slots of gencon to that game. This limited them to only the most hardcore players of their system. And ultimately, I think, limited their growth. I don't want Pathfinder to suffer a similar fate.
For myself, I think that if I needed to choose between spending Thursday morning waiting in line for the hardcover rulebook and playing that slot, I will need to skip Pathfinder this year. Which would really be disappointing, as I'm a fan of the system and a happy subscriber to your excellent publications.
Please find a way to accommodate myself and those others that want to play -- whether it be offering the books for sale at the tables, offering them for presale, or whatever. I know there's a workable solution that satisfies your goals and ours.
Thanks, and keep up the great work!
Cpt_kirstov |
I agree completely with the last two posts. Forcing people to dedicate a slot to pick up the book will pretty much guarantee I won't play PF at GenCon.
Who said anything about forcing someone to buy the book... they said the first slot will be converting player characters to PFRPG rules, nothing to do about the book.. other than letting people out who do want the book
Josh, as much as I know for insurance purposes they can't have help setting up the booth... I'm going to be in Indy mon-thur, so if you need help setting anything up before the convention starts...
Dragnmoon |
That's still a waste of a slot -- in that you're not playing. I applaud providing the time and help for those that need or want it, but for those of us that want to have it done before arriving so GenCon can "be all it can be" -- there should be options.
I am confused... Why would missing One slot mean Not playing at all... There are going to be many more slots run then just one.. and that one game you missed will be played in another slot..
confused..
hedgeknight |
Yeah, who wants to play in EVERY slot?? I'm looking forward to just playing a few games (specifically PF), spending a lot of time in the Great Hall, attending a few panels, seeing Indy (maybe catching a pre-season Colts practice), drinking, eating, sleeping in, drinking, gaming, shopping, drinking...notice a pattern here?
As long as there are plenty of PF materials (specifically the new rules book) to go around, I don't care when I get one.
exile RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32 |
Different people want different things out of Gen Con, and what I want even varies from year to year. When I first started going, I wanted to play every slot. Then I wanted to have a nice mix of playing and simply soaking up the con. Then I wanted to hang out with friends and party. Then my wife got involved, and I didn't hardly get to game at all (she was more into hanging with friends and partying to the exclusion of everything else). Now (wife safely at home), I've pretty much come full circle and want to play every slot (with quick runs to the Dealer's Hall in between).
All of that said, I'm not so keen on the idea of burning a slot to make a PFS character. My options. One, look into that Very Important Gamer thing. I think it might actually get you into the exhibit hall a touch early (at great cost). Two, just by the book when I get a chance on Thursday, make my character late that night when my other games are over, and do all my PFS gaming Friday through Sunday.
Chad
Dragnmoon |
Different people want different things out of Gen Con, and what I want even varies from year to year. When I first started going, I wanted to play every slot. Then I wanted to have a nice mix of playing and simply soaking up the con. Then I wanted to hang out with friends and party. Then my wife got involved, and I didn't hardly get to game at all (she was more into hanging with friends and partying to the exclusion of everything else). Now (wife safely at home), I've pretty much come full circle and want to play every slot (with quick runs to the Dealer's Hall in between).
All of that said, I'm not so keen on the idea of burning a slot to make a PFS character. My options. One, look into that Very Important Gamer thing. I think it might actually get you into the exhibit hall a touch early (at great cost). Two, just by the book when I get a chance on Thursday, make my character late that night when my other games are over, and do all my PFS gaming Friday through Sunday.
Chad
What I am trying to say is...
Even if you miss one slot... you most likely get to play every adventure that will be run at the Gen Con.... Though I could be wrong..
From personal experience, games are re run, so if you miss one slot does not mean you miss a game.. In fact you most likely could not even do every slot because there will not be an new game for every slot.
That is why I said you can miss a slot and not miss anything..
Josh will have to clarify this, but that is from my experience.
Doug Doug |
Can the Paizo staff send someone round all the PFS games, with a stack of books on a trolley?
It's actually against convention policy to sell anything game-related outside of the vendor hall. If Paizo were to sell the books at tableside they could be penalized by GenCon. Not going to happen. This is why to get a faction shirt last year you had to view them in the game room, then go to the vendor hall, pay for a shirt at the Paizo booth, then go back to the game room with your proof of purchase and get the shirt. Exercise, ewwww!
As for choosing to miss a slot because of the current arrangement, it's an individual choice what people do with their time at GenCon. There is no right or wrong. Helpful (but unsolicited) advice is probably wasted effort when people are simply trying to make their voices heard. People do come to GenCon for more than just Pathfinder Society... I understand if given the choice between losing a slot of event opportunity and playing [insert your favorite game after PFS] for four hours, a person may make the *individual choice* to skip PFS altogether and play something that better suits their convention goals. I'm not going to pass judgment.
Callarek |
As someoen mentioned, you may not miss all slots od Pathfinder, but you would have to give up at least one slot of gaming in order to spend a slot (or more, depending on line length) to buy the Pathfinder book, followed by th etime needed to read the relevant parts of the book, plus build a nerw character or rebuild an existing character (which raises all sorts of questions for the rebuild, but never mind that here).
So you lose some time if you ant to play PFS at GenCon, and give up 1 or more slots of gaming time to do so. Assuming that all you play is PFS, nnot that big a deal, but if you play other games and/or want to try other game systems out, it starts to grow larger.
As an example, I play LFR along with PFS, and I also sometimes play Magic and/or Yu-Gi-Oh!. I have also played demos in the dealer's room, sometimes go to seminars and/or new system demos, along with various other activities.
Losing playing time to buy a system book for a game system that is low on my list would be a negative sum for that game system. Fortunately for the Paizo guys, I am not going to be able to go to GenCon this year, so my opinion is just opinion...
Dragnmoon |
As someoen mentioned, you may not miss all slots od Pathfinder, but you would have to give up at least one slot of gaming in order to spend a slot
ahh yes.. that is true.. I kept on reading the compliant as missing one pathfinder game... not one game/any.. yes this could cause you to miss a game slot for another game.
Joshua J. Frost |
Our first slot on Thursday will be a conversion and creation Q&A with folks unleashed at 10 AM for the dealer hall when the book goes on sale. There is no other way for us to do this. The first official Pathfinder RPG Season 1 Pathfinder Society slot kicks off at 1:00 P.M. on Thursday. We are not allowed to sell books outside of the dealer hall and our street date for the book is the Thursday of Gen Con. Our hands are tied on this. If you don't want to "waste" the first slot of Gen Con (Thursday 8am-12pm) at the Q&A, you don't have to. You can always convert your character on the fly during a later slot but we're doing it this way to get most everyone converted before the Pathfinder Society slots begin. The volunteer GMs at Gen Con will have access to the final rules before the show and they should be knowledgeable enough to help anyone create or convert a character during the show. Keep in mind, however, that I reserve the right to marshal folks who have PRPG characters first and then seat folks who need to convert or create a character last and that creating/converting will eat into your play time. Thursday morning's seminar is the best way to avoid this.
Joshua J. Frost |
I'll have better details (a) once we're closer to Gen Con and (b) once *I've* seen the final rules (which I haven't). That said, most folks will probably be able to soft-convert the characters using the Beta and then show up and spend a quick few minutes doing a full conversion. Once I've seen and read the final rules, I'll formalize this more.