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Lost Omens Campaign Setting General Discussion

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The Exchange

Hi Vic that's an interesting insight. I'm guessing i'm also in the manual queue then. Well that or at the end of the automated one :)


Bagpuss wrote:

Still, the pdfs are on my machine.

Bah.

Lucky you...

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber
Bagpuss wrote:

Godamnit, my UPS shipment just got rescheduled (I didn't note the previous expected delivery date, but I imagine this is now later than it was). Still, the pdfs are on my machine.

Bah.

Oh, go ahead, Rub it in. Stupid Planet Stories subscription (And that's not a real complaint. I just wants my precioussss PDFs ;-) )

Dark Archive

Vic Wertz wrote:
KaeYoss, your order hasn't shipped because it's kind of weird. We process all the common shipments through a largely automated queue that's optimized for volume, while the more unusual shipments go through a manual queue. It turns out that there aren't very many subscribers who have Planet Stories but are set to hold for Pathfinder—most Planet Stories subscribers choose to ship monthly. Thus, the uniqueness of your configuration means you're going through the manual queue. We expect to clear even the manual queue before the end of the week, though.

Tehe, that's my settings too, but mine shipped yesterday....You have my email KaeYoss if you want a return of an old favour ;)


Finally! This morning, I had some juicy new download options!

Didn't have the time to read into it much, but I did take a look at the shiny pictures and a few of the texts.

Gods of Golarion: That list is HUGE. I counted something like 60 deities there, and while not all of them are suitable for everyone, it's still a great start.

Calistria: I must say, her picture is a bit of a disappointment. It doesn't quite fit the description we got (especially not the suggestive smile), and the wasp suit is weird.

Desna: I'd say she looks even hotter than in the last picture from PF2. No wonder she's goddess of dreams...

Pharasma: Not exactly ugly, either, though of course, she's a real cold one.

Serenrae: She's indeed hot, and not just because of the flaming hair.

Shelyn: Not quite what I had expected. I must say that for the goddess of beauty, she's just a bit too... substantial. And the lock on her face - that was what I was expecting from Calistria. I'd say the same goes for her clothes. Not that I'm complaining about hot chicks showing too much flesh, but, again, I expectd something like that more from Cal. But all in all I'll survive it. Now, someone tell me how to convince my players that Shelyn's the romantic type and Cal the saucy wench after those pics ;-P

And since we're talking about pictures of deities, we might as well talk about the males, too:

Abadar: pretty much like the one from PF8, but that's not a bad thing. I think I'll be going for that look, in fact - gold armour and all. In fact, make it orange, and I'll be the new mascot for Industrial Defender :D

Cayden Cailean: Another good one, though his sword in PF14 was way cooler.

Erastil: Quote okay. For a furry :P

Gorum: Hits the nail on the head. Killing it instantly.

Gozreh: Now that's a great picture, and weird, too.

Irori: Awesome. I would have pictured him older, but that's okay.

Nethis: Awesome, too. Younger than I'd have thought, too, but that's okay, too. The dual aspect looks great.

Norgorber: Good one. You'll have to look twice before you see what's missing. Could someone give him a straw head? He wants to go stab a fighter who likes swords ;-)

Rovagug: Now he can say "I'm a MONSTER!"

Torag: Looks dwarven. Not much more to say.

Vic Wertz wrote:


KaeYoss, your order hasn't shipped because it's kind of weird. We process all the common shipments through a largely automated queue that's optimized for volume, while the more unusual shipments go through a manual queue. It turns out that there aren't very many subscribers who have Planet Stories but are set to hold for Pathfinder&#8212;most Planet Stories subscribers choose to ship monthly. Thus, the uniqueness of your configuration means you're going through the manual queue. We expect to clear even the manual queue before the end of the week, though.

What's the difference between the two, when all is said and done?

Sovereign Court

Paul Watson wrote:


Oh, go ahead, Rub it in.

The Golem clearly loves me more than it loves you.

Unfortunately, UPS is from a different faction.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

As i previously stated: Shelyn is just lovely. Having some flesh on her bones just added to that. The weird wasp-like suit Calistria is wearing really pushes up her "revenge" aspect, i think. Not a bad choice, and wow... was this "called cheesecake" not taken?

Still, some more clothes on Sarenrae, Desna and Shelyn wouldn't have hurt anyone. :)

Silver Crusade

TerraNova wrote:
As i previously stated: Shelyn is just lovely. Having some flesh on her bones just added to that.

Absolutely agree.

TerraNova wrote:
Still, some more clothes on Sarenrae, Desna and Shelyn wouldn't have hurt anyone. :)

I find fun, instead, that all of the good-aligned goddesses wear reveling clothes... Except for the goddess of lust. :-)

Paizo Employee Creative Director

TerraNova wrote:

As i previously stated: Shelyn is just lovely. Having some flesh on her bones just added to that. The weird wasp-like suit Calistria is wearing really pushes up her "revenge" aspect, i think. Not a bad choice, and wow... was this "called cheesecake" not taken?

Still, some more clothes on Sarenrae, Desna and Shelyn wouldn't have hurt anyone. :)

Desna's not fond of clothes.

Shelyn's the goddess of beauty (among other things), so she's not too interested in clothes
Sarenrae comes from the sun and/or the desert, where clothes are uncomfortable.

And yeah; the easy solution for Calistria was to show her wearing pasties and a thong, but again, she's not just the goddess of lust. She's also the goddess of revenge and trickery. And what better trick to play than to give the goddess of lust non-revealing clothes? :)

Sovereign Court

James Jacobs wrote:


And yeah; the easy solution for Calistria was to show her wearing pasties and a thong...

The easiest solution would surely be to omit the pasties and the thong?

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

James Jacobs wrote:
Shelyn's the goddess of beauty (among other things), so she's not too interested in clothes)

A fashion designer's nightmare, she is. :)

I'm not complaining, though. Some Cheesecake is ok, just when everything remotely female has clothing measured by square inches, I begin to grow annoyed.

Silver Crusade

James Jacobs wrote:
And yeah; the easy solution for Calistria was to show her wearing pasties and a thong, but again, she's not just the goddess of lust. She's also the goddess of revenge and trickery. And what better trick to play than to give the goddess of lust non-revealing clothes? :)

Just what I thought. ;-)

Grand Lodge

Vic Wertz wrote:


Avemar, your order hasn't shipped yet because you're holding for a monthly shipment, and we expect to the next Planet Stories book to arrive before the end of the month, so your shipment is waiting on that.

Vic, thanks for the response. Such a logical reason! I guess I'll just have to wait patiently.

Oddly enough, it does help to know that the e-mail is not imminent. I can relax now and do something else.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Bagpuss wrote:
James Jacobs wrote:


And yeah; the easy solution for Calistria was to show her wearing pasties and a thong...
The easiest solution would surely be to omit the pasties and the thong?

Those looking for pasties and a thong (is a thong still a thong if it's strapless?) will have to wait until Pathfinder #18's illustration of Nocticula, Demon Queen of Darkness and Lust.

Sovereign Court

James Jacobs wrote:


Those looking for pasties and a thong (is a thong still a thong if it's strapless?) will have to wait until Pathfinder #18's illustration of Nocticula, Demon Queen of Darkness and Lust.

She doesn't much sounds like the sort of girl one could take home to mother.

Depending on who one's mother is, I guess.


Bagpuss wrote:


She doesn't much sounds like the sort of girl one could take home to mother.

That would make her a Superfreak.

Superfreak.

Superfreaky.

Spoiler:
Yeah, that's an Eighties / Rick James reference. The stuff of high school dances in '83


James Jacobs wrote:


Shelyn's the goddess of beauty (among other things), so she's not too interested in clothes

Who's goddess of pretty dresses, then?

I'd have though that sewing those would be an art, too. She's more dressed like a needlewoman from Ankh-Morporkh (all hail the Sacred Seamstress!)

James Jacobs wrote:


And yeah; the easy solution for Calistria was to show her wearing pasties and a thong, but again, she's not just the goddess of lust. She's also the goddess of revenge and trickery. And what better trick to play than to give the goddess of lust non-revealing clothes? :)

I don't know. She's hiding the lust aspect pretty well. She looks seconds away from whipping the skin off some poor sod.

In fact, I can see a skit with this, someone calling a phone sex hotline and ending up talking to Calistria:

"I AM CALISTRIA, DID YOU F-ING UNDERSTAND THAT? I WILL MAKE YOUR WILDEST DREAMS COME TRUE, YOU HEAR ME YOU BASTARD?"
"Uh, did I call the fetish hotline again by mistake?"
"WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT, HUH? LOOKING FOR TROUBLE? YOU BETTER LISTEN BEFORE I COME OVER AND RIP OFF YOUR HEAD AND FILL YOUR NECK WITH WASPS!!! I'M WEARING THIS KINKY BEE SUIT, RIGHT? I'M F-ING TAKING OFF THE TOP NOW, AM I ABSOLUTELY CLEAR? MY PERFECT F-ING CHINA-F-ING-WHITE SKIN F-ING GLISTENS IN THE F-ING CANDLELIGHT!! YOU BETTER LIKE CANDLES! I GOT THEM FOR THE MOOD! IF YOU NOT SOUND HORNY RIGHT NOW I'LL SHOVE THEM CANDLES UP YOUR *!#@§, AND I WON'T PUT THEM OUT FIRST! YOU HEAR ME? YOU *HEAR* ME?????"
*click* *run* *hide in closet* *rock back and forth in fear* *uncontrolled sobbing*

But come to think of it - this kinky playing at dressing up does have its merits. Just give her one of those latex nurse costumes next time ;-)


My version of Shelyn (I haven't seen the Gods & Magic version yet).


Lilith wrote:
My version of Shelyn (I haven't seen the Gods & Magic version yet).

Yeah, that's more like it.

Funny that your depiction has more clothes than the official one, given your Fan Services. :)

Again: I like the G&M picture, but I do think this one is the better fit.


KaeYoss wrote:


Yeah, that's more like it.

Funny that your depiction has more clothes than the official one, given your Fan Services. :)

Again: I like the G&M picture, but I do think this one is the better fit.

I really like Lilith's interpretation, but I respectfully disagree.

The one in G&M was the one I relayed to my players back when Pathfinder#1 came out. (I started my original campaign before #2 shipped)

When the Gazeteer (or maybe the Campaign setting) made Sheyln more chaste and proper I scratched my head, and for my campaigns I ignored it. Consequently, I'm happy to my initial impression of the Goddess is the one that is now depicted in G&M.

YMMV


Lilith wrote:
*cries, lusts after book*

Your secret benefactor has taken care of it. It should be shipping soon.

Sovereign Court

Bagpuss wrote:

Unfortunately, UPS is from a different faction.

Indeed, it appears that it's going to take them eight godamned days to get the stuff to me from the time that I got the email. I went for the UPS version for tracking and (in theory) it being a little quicker, but I am less than inspired by this (for which I obviously don't blame Paizo).


Relic of Malice wrote:
Your secret benefactor has taken care of it. It should be shipping soon.

Squee! ^_^


Watcher wrote:


The one in G&M was the one I relayed to my players back when Pathfinder#1 came out. (I started my original campaign before #2 shipped)

When the Gazeteer (or maybe the Campaign setting) made Sheyln more chaste and proper I scratched my head, and for my campaigns I ignored it. Consequently, I'm happy to my initial impression of the Goddess is the one that is now depicted in G&M.

Actually, only the picture supports that, the text are universally that of a more "chaste" deity. (Note that she's not against carnal pleasures, but she's not about pursuing them for their own sake - that's Calistria's domain):

"She always wears tasteful clothing and jewelry that accentuates her beauty without revealing too much of it."

"She preaches and practices that true beauty comes from within, and she favors relationships not based solely on carnal desires, which often puts her at odds with Calistria. She does not oppose such relationships among mortals, but only hopes they blossom into something more meaningful."

"Formal garb for the church is a pair of leggings and a long tunic for men or a calf-length dress for women, cut and tailored to make the wearer attractive but not overtly sexual."

Those quotes are from Gods and Magic.

I don't think the picture in the book quite fits that image.


KaeYoss wrote:


Actually, only the picture supports that, the text are universally that of a more "chaste" deity. (Note that she's not against carnal pleasures, but she's not about pursuing them for their own sake - that's Calistria's domain):

"She always wears tasteful clothing and jewelry that accentuates her beauty without revealing too much of it."

"She preaches and practices that true beauty comes from within, and she favors relationships not based solely on carnal desires, which often puts her at odds with Calistria. She does not oppose such relationships among mortals, but only hopes they blossom into something more meaningful."

"Formal garb for the church is a pair of leggings and a long tunic for men or a calf-length dress for women, cut and tailored to make the wearer attractive but not overtly sexual."

Those quotes are from Gods and Magic.

I don't think the picture in the book quite fits that image.

No, it doesn't quite match the image that the text conjures up. On that I agree.

But I'm not trying to tell you that you're wrong. If you want someone to be right and someone to be wrong, don't read any further. That's a waste of time and energy. I'm trying to tell you that I disagree with you that the more chaste version is the best one.

Its a matter of subjective taste.

As I said, for my campaigns when I'm GM, my interpretation of Sheyln is closer to the image in Gods and Magic.

Now someone can point to later texts and shout to the mountains on what is canon and what is not canon. It doesn't matter. Heck, when I started Skinsaw Murders, I would go to every Paizo Chat and beg James Jacobs to tell me more about Iomadae and the Starstone. He finally said to me, "You got me. I don't know any more than you do, Watcher. You'll have to ask Erik."

I was disappointed with the answer at first, but later I saw that there was a certain liberty being extended by that answer.

So yeah, getting back to Sheyln, I guess I'm telling you that I know what the text says. And I'm telling you that the text is wrong! Ha! Maybe not for you. Maybe not for a whole lot of other people. But it is for me. That doesn't make me mad at Paizo or anything like that, lololol. I just change Sheyln to be the way I like her and I move on, still a happy superscriber. Hakuna matata, or whatever.

If you want a less existential reply, I wager the image of any deity can waver slightly to match the expectations and imagination of the local worshippers, so long as they're in the same general domains and portfolios. Elves and Varisians may worship Desna the Dreamer, or Desna the Lucky, or Desna the Traveller, each with slightly different interpretations.

A Goddess should not be as narrowly defined as an illustration in a book.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Ughh!! Still waiting on my order to ship or something. I'm dying to see my download of this book to check all the cool stuff folks are talking about.


Watcher wrote:

I'm trying to tell you that I disagree with you that the more chaste version is the best one.

Its a matter of subjective taste.

As I said, for my campaigns when I'm GM, my interpretation of Sheyln is closer to the image in Gods and Magic.

No accounting for taste, of course.

Watcher wrote:


So yeah, getting back to Sheyln, I guess I'm telling you that I know what the text says. And I'm telling you that the text is wrong! Ha! Maybe not for you. Maybe not for a whole lot of other people. But it is for me. That doesn't make me mad at Paizo or anything like that, lololol. I just change Sheyln to be the way I like her and I move on, still a happy superscriber. Hakuna matata, or whatever.

I'm not mad either. As I said: The picture's not bad. But I think Lillith's version fits better.

Watcher wrote:


If you want a less existential reply, I wager the image of any deity can waver slightly to match the expectations and imagination of the local worshippers, so long as they're in the same general domains and portfolios. Elves and Varisians may worship Desna the Dreamer, or Desna the Lucky, or Desna the Traveller, each with slightly different interpretations.

A Goddess should not be as narrowly defined as an illustration in a book.

I'm not defining her by the illustration, but I think that the picture in the ultimate reference for the gods is best if it matches the most wide-spread depiction of these gods.

Those books aren't about small cults, but about the church as a whole. I think the picture should reflect that.

And Shelin's most wide-spread depiction is that of the goddess of beauty, art, and romantic love, who places higher importance on deeper feelings than lust.

In fact, the lust part (i.e. lust of its own sake) isn't even part of her portfolio - that belongs to Calistria.

Shelyn won't smite you if you end up in bed with someone less than a day after meeting him/her, but if nothing more than a quick adventure will come of this, it's Calistria who gets a power boost out of it, not Shelyn.

No one has to adher to canon. Everyone's entitled to their own version of things. Well, everyone except the books who will tell us what the canon is.


KaeYoss wrote:


In fact, the lust part (i.e. lust of its own sake) isn't even part of her portfolio - that belongs to Calistria.

Shelyn won't smite you if you end up in bed with someone less than a day after meeting him/her, but if nothing more than a quick adventure will come of this, it's...

If we can not come to an impasse on Sheyln, judging from your previous posts, we CAN agree about the illustration of Calistria. That representation doesn't personify lust very much at all.

:) I just like the Sheyln picture for Sheyln, as completely subjective opinion.

Sovereign Court

I actually don't really care about the art quality all that much, although I know that companies have to put good art in nowadays in order not to get laughed at. In fact, I sort of resent the extra money it adds to the price of the material (although my resentment is tempered by the fact that I don't know how much that art actually does add to the cost).


Now, see, this kills me. I'd love an online art gallery, like WotC had up on their site when their books came out. The galleries were something I always loved to peruse when a new book was released, and all this talk... it makes me sad to be bereft of pictures, at least.

Paizo Employee Creative Director

Watcher wrote:
KaeYoss wrote:


In fact, the lust part (i.e. lust of its own sake) isn't even part of her portfolio - that belongs to Calistria.

Shelyn won't smite you if you end up in bed with someone less than a day after meeting him/her, but if nothing more than a quick adventure will come of this, it's...

If we can not come to an impasse on Sheyln, judging from your previous posts, we CAN agree about the illustration of Calistria. That representation doesn't personify lust very much at all.

:) I just like the Sheyln picture for Sheyln, as completely subjective opinion.

Again... Calistria's not the goddess of lust. She's the goddess of lust, revenge, and trickery. I happen to really like the art for her, and I'm pretty pleased that Calistria's not all splayed about the page in a bikini AND that Shelyn doesn't need a sandwich. As for her art not matching the text... <shrug>. You can levee that complaint to a LOT of RPG art. Sometimes it happens.


Bagpuss wrote:
In fact, I sort of resent the extra money it adds to the price of the material

No art means less people buy, meas they have to increase the price, means less people buy, means we have a nasty little vicious circle.

Plus, I don't think that they get the most expensive artists out there. Just good ones. Bad ones should not get big jobs.

Watcher wrote:


If we can not come to an impasse on Sheyln, judging from your previous posts, we...

I thought that sentence would end "...need to solve this like men. At dawn. Near the creek"...

Watcher wrote:


CAN agree about the illustration of Calistria. That representation doesn't personify lust very much at all.

... but this works, too.

Disciple of Sakura wrote:
I'd love an online art gallery

Me too.


Sheyln doesn't fit the western "anorexic supermodel with boob job" concept of beauty... big deal, she is definitely easy on the eyes in her own way. People who like the ribcages showing can enjoy Urgathoa, I'll enjoy Sheyln for what she is.

Lilith: Your portrayal is also quite excellent!

Overall, I think the artwork in G&M is pretty awesome.


James Jacobs wrote:


Again... Calistria's not the goddess of lust. She's the goddess of lust, revenge, and trickery./QUOTE]

"Iconography of the faith depicts Calistria as the ideal of elven beauty, dressed in revealing gowns with long graceful ears, slender limbs, and a suggestive smile playing across her lips."

That's from the Gazetteer and the Campaign Setting. And Gods and Magic.

James Jacobs wrote:


I happen to really like the art for her, and I'm pretty pleased that Calistria's not all splayed about the page in a bikini

That wouldn't fit the thrice-written text, either :P.

James Jacobs wrote:


As for her art not matching the text... <shrug>. You can levee that complaint to a LOT of RPG art.

Sorry, but we're a lot sterner with you guys than with other RPG stuff. :P

We're not trying to slam you (well I'm not. And I'm sure the others aren't either), and the pictures are good. I just think they could have been more fitting.


Bagpuss wrote:
I actually don't really care about the art quality all that much, although I know that companies have to put good art in nowadays in order not to get laughed at. In fact, I sort of resent the extra money it adds to the price of the material (although my resentment is tempered by the fact that I don't know how much that art actually does add to the cost).

That's funny, I love the artwork in Paizo's stuff, maybe it's a bit much in adventures but in work like G&M I think it adds almost as much as the flavor text does. Things like the cover art for example which depict Saranrae is a$s-kicking mode versus a description or static text in particular are cool.

In my eyes a book like this is almost a coffee table book that you flip through as much for illustrations as the text.

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