Any plan on Paizo gussing things up?


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that was great!


Arnwyn wrote:

Wow. I can't believe the number of people opposed to making improvements to Paizo's rather simplistic site. Amazing.

I'm also shocked at the number of people making silly false dichotomies that it's either no-feature Paizo or the abomination of Gleemax. Whatever.

QFT

I don't understand why people think its all or nothing, or why supposed 'Paizo Fans' want to handicap the company for their own selfish reasons.

You have all the time in the world to look at Websites when you get home...

Cpt_kirstov wrote:
its one of those things that I can find anything on this site better than most sites, and I'm not distracted by evil flashy avatars and signature lines, and it is very professional and plain looking so I don't feel bad being on it at work...

Who said anything about "Flashing Avatars" or Sigs? Lord NO! I hate those as much as the rest of you.

I LOVE Paizo simplistic design when I am posting here in the forums, but the site itself is a little intimidatinng for Newcomers to navigate, and have a 'cover page' with some Graphics (NOT moving - those Flash thingies should always be an option IMHO) - with a sitemap. Then have the forums broken down into easier to visually recognize groups - and PLEASE keep those Customer Service Cancellations OFF the top of the page! CS is a wonderful thing, but newbs don't need to have that be the very first thing they see.

I like the idea of a faded-out map of Golarion in the background - good call whoever said that.

We are not talking about turning Paizo in Slime-green Gleemax, or having this place look like a three-ring circus. Just a tiny bit of eye-candy and some linked information for beginners to get them started in the right direction. That only need be on the first page, and anyone who wants can just save the second page in their favorites, so regulars need not ever see it. That should even make you slackers happy. ;)

Liberty's Edge

The other thing is that for people who don't know Paizo, I'd like to find ways to keep them here . . . and coming back.

Obviously, we all know this site, but I'd like to see Paizo make a bigger draw. I wonder how many people out there feel inclined to go to WotC because they know of no alternative. I'm saying make Paizo's site an alternative . . . but people won't realize it's an alternative without spending time here exploring.

The faded map of Golarion seems a spin-off of my idea linking parts of Golarion to various links within Paizo's site. Or perhaps, have background of various regions linked in to the world map. (My thought was to have this as the cover page . . . but if Paizo had other ideas as cover pages, I'm open. The blog is also nice, and perhaps having a nice picture and link to the blog cover page would be nice.)

Comics. That's a big draw. See if the creator of Goblins would like to join your order. Or Order of the Stick. Or simply link through their latest comic to their home sites.

Freebies. Occasionally have a monster or a NPC available as a html (with perhaps a .pdf link to download the same). Adventure hooks and mini-adventures are also great.

Spin-offs. The what ifs. Have a page for Pathfinder Modern, Pathfinder Past, or Pathfinder Future. Devote just a little time to addressing other eras of play. You know, rule tweaks, NPCs, adventure hooks, background. Not talking about a lot of time - just a nod.

Messageboards. These are simple and clean. Me likes. However, one thing I would really like to see when I hit reply, is the thread below the reply box - in case my Quote doesn't capture the entire statement I want to quote.


Ok, I don't post often, but this topic scared me.

Paizo's site is leaps and bounds better than WotC's, and many other similar sites, because it lacks a ridiculous amount of graphics. Many of you have commented on the benefits of less graphics on load times and--yes--work-time viewing, but perhaps the biggest argument against the OVER use of graphics in an GUI or UI is, irronically, usability and clarity.

For example: to a search for "interface design" and take a look at any professional interface design company's website and you see something much closer to Paizo's site than any other gaming site I've seen: especially WotC's.

Paizo's aite is clean, easy to navigate, loads quickly, and has a clear focus (another hot topic that some over at EN World have said Gleemax failed do to a lack of).

All of that said, there are some things that I think Paizo could add to their site:
- A good-sized graphic on the splash page that links to a portion of the site dedicated to Paizo specific news, products, and other (teaser?) posts.
- Perhaps some of the tools that Gleemax once thought it would be able to offer, that I actually have more confidence in Paizo's team pulling off well, like User Blogs and a Regional Meeting System of some kind.

All-in-all, Paizo has done a fabulous job providing a professional site that is easy to use and not hard on the eyes.

Keep it up Paizo!

----
Brandon

Liberty's Edge

I guess that the problem is that I spend way too much time here. I'm looking for stuff to keep me here - updates, downloads, snaz.

Yes, the messageboards are clean.

Yes, I like the store.

But I want more than a business website. I want a gaming website. Either I'm missing some critical links . . . or I'm not.


Definitely think that Paizo's site here is a great example of "substance over style"... there's plenty to keep you interested and posting, without the fancy graphics and slothlike download times...

I personally wouldn't change a thing, but if changes are made, hopefully they'll just be "tweaks"? Part of the appeal of the site is familiarity - I bet we all have our traits and routines when using the site, but the fact that the majority of us aren't posting ongoing complaints about navigation problems, confusion and lack of "paizite friendliness" I think speaks volumes about how right these guys are getting it.

Grand Lodge

Mallias wrote:


For example: to a search for "interface design" and take a look at any professional interface design company's website and you see something much closer to Paizo's site than any other gaming site I've seen: especially WotC's.

Paizo's aite is clean, easy to navigate, loads quickly, and has a clear focus (another hot topic that some over at EN World have said Gleemax failed do to a lack of).

Brandon

Ok I just did a search on Interface design. The OVERWHELMING majority of the sites were NOT like Paizo. Sorry. There were liberal use of graphics and color.

The vast majority of site designs for sale also do not look like Paizo, but are more modern.

If the extent of comparison is WOTC or Gleemax, you guys need to get out more often.


Krome wrote:


If the extent of comparison is WOTC or Gleemax, you guys need to get out more often.

Sorry, Krome, we'll have to agree to disagree... I could start posting links, but it's really not worth the time...

Graphics are important, I am not saying they are not... At all...

What I am saying is that it is important to understand when to use graphics and when not to...

Just about every major site who's main focus is to disseminate information via articles and posts, looks a lot more like Paizo than: WotC's site, Gleemax (which I probably shouldn't even include here), even ENworld.org.

Does that mean they don't make use of graphics or animation, no, of course not. Just that they do so wisely.

Enough said.


Another vote for clean, simple, and work-friendly. Petitioning for other sections? Fair enough. But priority should be store-function, messageboard-function, then "candy".

Dark Archive

There's a discussion of Paizo's forums over at ENworld. Interesting many find them "slow" (I have to agree...but I have the same problem with ENworld) and difficult to navigate (mixed feelings on this):

Paizo's Pathfinder Forums

Paizo Employee Chief Technical Officer

joela wrote:

There's a discussion of Paizo's forums over at ENworld. Interesting many find them "slow" (I have to agree...but I have the same problem with ENworld) and difficult to navigate (mixed feelings on this):

Paizo's Pathfinder Forums

It looks like when they say "slow," they're not talking about page load time, but rather how quickly people are posting in any given thread compared to ENWorld. I'd agree—it's usually a bit quieter here, but I personally think that we have better signal-to-noise as far as posted content goes.

Grand Lodge

Mallias wrote:
Krome wrote:


If the extent of comparison is WOTC or Gleemax, you guys need to get out more often.

Sorry, Krome, we'll have to agree to disagree... I could start posting links, but it's really not worth the time...

Graphics are important, I am not saying they are not... At all...

What I am saying is that it is important to understand when to use graphics and when not to...

Just about every major site who's main focus is to disseminate information via articles and posts, looks a lot more like Paizo than: WotC's site, Gleemax (which I probably shouldn't even include here), even ENworld.org.

Does that mean they don't make use of graphics or animation, no, of course not. Just that they do so wisely.

Enough said.

I am not sure of really any website that does not "disseminate information via articles and posts"

I think every website I have ever visited is trying to disseminate information.

And absolutely nobody here who does want a nicer looking website has even once mentioned they want it to resemble Gleemax or WOTC, so why on earth do you still use those as examples? That is as irrelevant as saying we want the website to look like Cookie Monster.

I specificlly listed links to sites I liked the layouts for and not one was WOTC or Gleemax. Please try to stay with the conversation and not try to lead people astray.


Krome wrote:
And absolutely nobody here who does want a nicer looking website has even once mentioned they want it to resemble Gleemax or WOTC, so why on earth do you still use those as examples? That is as irrelevant as saying we want the website to look like Cookie Monster.

First, I can understand your concerns about navigability raised in your previous post. Making the web site more user friendly is always good and there are a few jagged edges around here.

You mention the d20SRD site and that is an awesome site. The perfect example of why websites don't need bling to rock hard. The only use of graphics on that site are the parchment background. You talk about "Web 2.0" but d20 is all straight html and hrefs with a touch of CSS. Other than the nav bar that slows down page scrolling I think d20SRD is a perfect example of why Paizo shouldn't change.

Worth1000 is a totally different concept for a site.

Renderocity... I'm just not sold on what makes discussion any richer on that site than here. The white on black text is tough to read. The signal (amount of stuff you want to read) to noise (blingy stuff, adverts, and non-message stuff) ratio is quite poor. On my rather large screen I loaded a page and less than 25% of the real estate on initial page load was actual messages. On a similar Paizo page more than 60% of the page is actual message. The other WoW based site was ok but I fail to see how it was any better than Paizo. Discussion is discussion, having a tan textured background does not make it any more relevant or interesting.

Compare: Renderocity versus Paizo

If bling is so important why is the worlds most successful websites one of the least blingy? http://google.com

Here is a very popular mountain biking forum (generally 300+ users online at any given time) I use: http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=425705
Other than the necessary adverts it is a very simple site, very readable and usable. People are drawn to content... not bling.

Also, considering Paizo is first and foremost a web retailer Paizo's home page bears a striking resemblance to the most successful web retailer out there.

If you want to talk about hunting down the post monster that eats posts at random... I'm with you there. Some incremental upgrades supporting a few more BB codes and maybe image or attachment support in posts, I'm cool with that also but overall it meets the task of enabling discussion quite well. If it ain't broken why fix it?

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