CMB / Size Bonus of Halflings


Combat & Magic


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This may be noted as an error already,
but under the Halfling race section,
they are listed as receiving +1 to-hit from Size (small),
yet in the CMB section Size (small) receives a -1 penalty to CMB.

It seems like CMB is basically using the same mechanics as attack rolls,
so perhaps this is an error...


It sounds correct to me. The +1 to hit is due to a basic size difference; it's usually easier to strike something larger than you. However, CMB takes other factors into consideration. In particular, it's usually easier to overpower something that's smaller than you.

That said, it's important to note that the halfling's +1 to size is usually factored into the situation anyway. To perform a combat maneuver requires one to make an attack roll, which would benefit from the bonus due to a small character's size; in this situation, the bonus due to size and the CMB penalty end up canceling each other out.


Actualy, this is correct. The BAB and the CMB, while similar, have different mechanics. The BAB uses the 3.5 rule that smaller size helps to both hit and not be hit. The CMB, which governs bull rushes, trips, grapples, etc. , uses size mods differently. The theory is a small creature is at a disadvantage once a larger opponent gets ahold of them. Fortunately for those of us that think small is beautiful, there are feats which help us out. 'Defensive Combat Training' gives its possessor a +4 bonus to defend against CMB-based attacks. 'Agile Maneuvers' replaces the strength bonus factor in the CMB with the character's dex bonus, which is often higher for the small races.


Hopefully things like this will get explained more clearly, once it's getting towards being ready for print...
I just was putting together a halfling character using the Alpha rules, and couldn't figure out what the hell I was reading between two different sections' rules :-)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Heaven's Agent wrote:

It sounds correct to me. The +1 to hit is due to a basic size difference; it's usually easier to strike something larger than you. However, CMB takes other factors into consideration. In particular, it's usually easier to overpower something that's smaller than you.

That said, it's important to note that the halfling's +1 to size is usually factored into the situation anyway. To perform a combat maneuver requires one to make an attack roll, which would benefit from the bonus due to a small character's size; in this situation, the bonus due to size and the CMB penalty end up canceling each other out.

This is mostly correct, but the +1 size bonus to AC is *not* factored into a combat maneuver attack. Armor class is not used in combat maneuvers at all. You make your Combat Maneuver attack (1d20 + your CMB + misc mod) vs. a DC of 15 + their CMB.

Essentially the size bonuses got swapped - from +1 for small, to -1, and -1 for large, to +1.


Majuba wrote:

This is mostly correct, but the +1 size bonus to AC is *not* factored into a combat maneuver attack. Armor class is not used in combat maneuvers at all. You make your Combat Maneuver attack (1d20 + your CMB + misc mod) vs. a DC of 15 + their CMB.

Essentially the size bonuses got swapped - from +1 for small, to -1, and -1 for large, to +1.

We're not talking about the +1 they get to AC at all, only the +1 such a character gets added to attack rolls.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Heaven's Agent wrote:
Majuba wrote:

This is mostly correct, but the +1 size bonus to AC is *not* factored into a combat maneuver attack. Armor class is not used in combat maneuvers at all. You make your Combat Maneuver attack (1d20 + your CMB + misc mod) vs. a DC of 15 + their CMB.

Essentially the size bonuses got swapped - from +1 for small, to -1, and -1 for large, to +1.

We're not talking about the +1 they get to AC at all, only the +1 such a character gets added to attack rolls.

Ahh. They won't get that either, but I suppose that does need clarification, good point!

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