4th Edition Elves


4th Edition

Dark Archive

Just saw the information about 4th elves on the WotC site. I have to say I like it, they now prefer "natural magic" over "arcane magic", and they are descended from fey.

I think this is a step in the right direction, I never really cared much for the elves before. They seemed a bit too "super" for my taste, trying to cover to many bases...

The pro 4th side gains another point in my book.

What does everyone else think?

Dark Archive RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32

Atrocious wrote:

Just saw the information about 4th elves on the WotC site. I have to say I like it, they now prefer "natural magic" over "arcane magic", and they are descended from fey.

I think this is a step in the right direction, I never really cared much for the elves before. They seemed a bit too "super" for my taste, trying to cover to many bases...

The pro 4th side gains another point in my book.

What does everyone else think?

Sounds like they're going back to their roots. Back in 2nd Ed (and probably 1st too, but I've never played 1st and don't know for certain), elves were actually considered 'fey' and that was the explaination for their penchant for magic, their attraction to nature, and their various immunities and resistances.

Check out the Complete Book of Elves for some really eye-opening facts about the elven race as it existed in 2nd Ed. I think it'd be cool if they brought the 2nd Ed. elven flavor back in 4th Ed and that seems to be exactly where they're headed. Good stuff.

Dark Archive

Fatespinner wrote:

Sounds like they're going back to their roots. Back in 2nd Ed (and probably 1st too, but I've never played 1st and don't know for certain), elves were actually considered 'fey' and that was the explaination for their penchant for magic, their attraction to nature, and their various immunities and resistances.

Check out the Complete Book of Elves for some really eye-opening facts about the elven race as it existed in 2nd Ed. I think it'd be cool if they brought the 2nd Ed. elven flavor back in 4th Ed and that seems to be exactly where they're headed. Good stuff.

Yep, I might actually consider playing one now that they've narrowed down their niche a bit. I always thought of playing elves as roleplaying a (stereotype) french guy in D20 Modern...


3rd Edition seemed to, despite pulling from Greyhawk (with all the finesse of a drunken sailor) for its deific material, look to Forgotten Realms for its racial material. The 3rd Edition elves always reminded me of FR Elves than the old generic 2nd Edition PGB ones.

This puts a point towards the core rules being either A: absent of a specific campaign setting, and just setting a starting point, or B: a simple, easy to grasp new campaign setting. While I would prefer A, I can easily deal with B, due to their comments regarding new/old settings coming out down the line.

They get a point back, and with this taken into the bigger picture, mayhaps a few points more relative to other less well received announcements.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

The Black Bard wrote:

3rd Edition seemed to, despite pulling from Greyhawk (with all the finesse of a drunken sailor) for its deific material, look to Forgotten Realms for its racial material. The 3rd Edition elves always reminded me of FR Elves than the old generic 2nd Edition PGB ones.

This puts a point towards the core rules being either A: absent of a specific campaign setting, and just setting a starting point, or B: a simple, easy to grasp new campaign setting. While I would prefer A, I can easily deal with B, due to their comments regarding new/old settings coming out down the line.

They get a point back, and with this taken into the bigger picture, mayhaps a few points more relative to other less well received announcements.

Death to the cricket! I wonder if the mechanics are going to pigeon hole the elves into fey roles. kind of seperating the race vs culture thing.


Honestly, as some people have said, this has pretty much been how elves were, and should be, portrayed, especially in a "generic" setting lacking large tracts of details.

It looks like eladrin are now the celadrin from Eric Boyd's FR planetouched article with their c cut off.

Sovereign Court RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

KnightErrantJR wrote:

Honestly, as some people have said, this has pretty much been how elves were, and should be, portrayed, especially in a "generic" setting lacking large tracts of details.

It looks like eladrin are now the celadrin from Eric Boyd's FR planetouched article with their c cut off.

Oy vey, they've been C-ircumsized?


Now that I've said something almost positive, let me throw this out there. How does having an "almost by not quite" elf race, and elf race, and potentially drow fit into the stated goal of not having subraces? I know, "eladrin" are most likely highly magical fey creatures with celestial blood closer to their fey roots than elves.

So then elves are basically a subrace of eladrin then?

My point being, they still sound pretty much like another race of elves to me.

Liberty's Edge

I think "descended from fey" is a good idea to riff on. It's what always seemed natural to me. Not sure I grok to the "natural vs. arcane" magic thing. I always thought elves kicked massive butt when it came to magic.


I like it. All of it. The drow stuff, the nature stuff, the cousin to eladrin stuff. I enjoyed it . . well-written. I remain optimistic for 4e.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

Another "thumbs up". It's a riff I've already been using for a while.

In my homebrew, elves were once full-blooded fey, but Something Happened (which the fey won't speak of, and which the elves can't remember) and they were cast into the mortal realm.

Along those lines, my campaign's half-elves aren't the offspring of an elf and a human; they're what now comes of two elves mating.


The fourth edition elf ranger is hotter than Mialee.

Dark Archive RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32

Sir Kaikillah wrote:
The fourth edition elf ranger is hotter than Mialee.

So is roadkill. What's your point? ;)


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Fatespinner wrote:
Check out the Complete Book of Elves for some really eye-opening facts about the elven race as it existed in 2nd Ed. I think it'd be cool if they brought the 2nd Ed. elven flavor back in 4th Ed and that seems to be exactly where they're headed. Good stuff.

Seems like 2nd Ed feel is where they're going.

{Marks down another reason to skip 4th edition}

Sovereign Court

Majuba wrote:
Fatespinner wrote:
Check out the Complete Book of Elves for some really eye-opening facts about the elven race as it existed in 2nd Ed. I think it'd be cool if they brought the 2nd Ed. elven flavor back in 4th Ed and that seems to be exactly where they're headed. Good stuff.

Seems like 2nd Ed feel is where they're going.

{Marks down another reason to skip 4th edition}

Actually, 2nd edition feel with 3.5 (or better) mechanics sounds like another reason to be optimistic. But then, I grew up playing a lot of 2nd edition in high school.


Fatespinner wrote:
Sir Kaikillah wrote:
The fourth edition elf ranger is hotter than Mialee.
So is roadkill. What's your point? ;)

I like what I read about 4th edition elves.

Scarab Sages

The Last Rogue wrote:
I like it. All of it. The drow stuff, the nature stuff, the cousin to eladrin stuff. I enjoyed it . . well-written. I remain optimistic for 4e.

I quite agree. 4e has potential.

Thoth-Amon


Sir Kaikillah wrote:
I like what I read about 4th edition elves.

Ditto.

For a good while, I've been wondering why elves in D&D didn't have favored classes of Druid or Ranger... Or at /least/ sorcerer with a fey lilt, given that magic is supposed to be something that comes intuitively to them. I mean, I get how they have all that time to study books and whatnot, but they never really seemed the 'bookish' type. Y'know?

I'll just be glad when spring rolls around and we actually get to see the material in its final form. At least then we'll be able to make sound, informed decisions on whether to embrace or cast 4th Edition aside.

Liberty's Edge

Cool. Still not buying it.


The Eldritch Mr. Shiny wrote:
Cool. Still not buying it.

Right there with you in sentiment on elves and 4th ed. And I LOVE the new avatar btw.

Dark Archive RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32

The Eldritch Mr. Shiny wrote:
Cool. Still not buying it.

I'm gonna buy two copies and mail you one just so WotC gets their money anyway. :D

Liberty's Edge

Fatespinner wrote:
The Eldritch Mr. Shiny wrote:
Cool. Still not buying it.
I'm gonna buy two copies and mail you one just so WotC gets their money anyway. :D

And I'll distribute illegal pdf copies of it to Hasbro / WotC's competitors just to sow the seeds of anarchy. It's what I do best.

Seriously, though, the whole 'elves and nature magic' thing seems more like a campaign / setting thing than a RAW thing.

Freehold DM wrote:
Right there with you in sentiment on elves and 4th ed. And I LOVE the new avatar btw.

Thanks. My new avatar can kick my old avatar's ass.

"Alright, you crazy bastards. Let's give that dragon his little piglet back."


Fatespinner wrote:
Sir Kaikillah wrote:
The fourth edition elf ranger is hotter than Mialee.
So is roadkill. What's your point? ;)

This made me spit my cream soda out. Hahahahaha


I have mixed feelings about the elven write up. I won't bore you with the details. However, I'm curious what sort of effects the rumored racial levels will have on gameplay--in other words, if I don't like the core version of elves, how hard will it be to change them in my campaign? In 3.5, if I didn't like the fact that elves had wizard as a favored class or automatic proficiency in certain martial weapons, I could alter that with a minimum of effort. I have concerns that 4E might not be so easy...


Hmm, so Noldor like myself are no longer elves eh? First Thingol gets on our case after Fëanor runs amok and now WotC too? Damned Sindarin hippies...

The Exchange

I suppose that would tie in well with an elf culture who abandons the natural world to live on flying ships in the sky.

They would have to abandon the natural magic and take up arcane magic.

Meanwhile back in Crooked wood:

"Im a little concerned..." Hugh scrached at his beard and hurried a little faster to keep pace with Franz.
"How So?"
"Just thought I saw something moving out of the corner of my eye..."
Moisture sprayed across his neck from the nearby tree foliage and Franz wiped at it.
"Like what?" Franz waited for a reply yet nothing came.
"Hugh?" Franz turned to find something standing in the chest cavity of his friend's corpse. It was eating an organ.

Franz stepped back. The second elf took him from the side and he didn't even have a chance to scream...

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