Hey folks. I've been planning out my next PC and I think I'd like to try a sorcerer for a change, and I'd like to try for the Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil PrC from Complete Arcane (pg 44).
I know wizards are strictly supperior to sorcerers, especially for a requirement-heavy PrC like the Initiate, but I've played plenty of those lately and I'd really prefer something different.
I haven't picked a race yet, nor what feats to grab first, so i'm open to sugestions there. The class requirements make me think human, but I love playing gnomes and halfings for their quirks. I'd like to know what all your prefered choices would be.
I'm also going to need help selecting my spells so as to meet the class rather hefty requirments (for a sorcerer, anyway). I'd like to know what your favourite abjuration spells are, hopefully with out having to "double up" on effects too much (ie, not taking multiple spells that all create a simllar effect). I'd like to embarce the PrC's sub-theme of "colour" magic too, but hopefully without compromising effectiveness too much.
So in short - what races make good sorcerers, and are there other PrCs I should look out for that compliment the Initate of the Sevenfold Veil?
What spells would make good choices?
The sourcebooks I'l be using are the Player's Handbook, Monster Manual, Complete Arane, Complete Divine, Complete Warrior and the Spell Compendium.
Cheers!
As far as going from a Wizard to a Sorcerer, trust me, you're gonna hate it. I've played a Wizard for the last ten years and I've just recently started playing a sorcerer "for a change" in a new campaign and it's driving me crazy, you're going to feel very limited.
I actually talked our DM (I'm cute) into allowing my sorcerer into being a Draconic elf, as it states in the PH that "Some Sorcerers claim that the blood of dragons course through their veins". I'm not sure how that will work with the seven veils that you're looking into, but I chose the gold dragon and conned him into giving me luck once per day. (I'm REALLY cute)
I also recently rolled up a straight fighter (we tend to play two or three games at a time depending on who is prepared to DM that week) and I gotta say, I am having a blast with her, it's kind of nice to be the one to wade into the melee and get in the mages way for a change.
and I thought I was the only one who tried charming the DM... ;)
I know sorcerers can be frustrating as heck to play, I played on years ago, but I'm tired of just playing wizards and clerics (the party roles I often find myself lumped with). But I don't mind a bit of challenge.
I like your Draconic idea. I thought of using the Draconic Heritage feats from Complete Arcane but with the requirements for the PrC I'm going for I won't really have enough feats to spare.
On a side note... I often use artwork or in rarer cases miniatures as inspiration for my characters... more than once have I played a PC based soley on a piece of art or potrait. Does anybosy else do this too?
Heh heh heh, I chose my fighter because of the beautiful artwork on page 20 of the PH2. I also had the perfect mini to represent that picture and painted her those colors.
Great mage minds think alike.
Yeah... the inspiration I got for this character was from a Magic the Gathering card, whch you can see here. Just feel in love with it first sight.
(Art by Michael Komarck. Credit given when credit due!)
OOhhh! I really like that! I never played that game, but I may just go pick up a few cards and check out the artwork. Wait, what am I saying, I have a 13 year old boy with a kazillion of those cards, I'm gonna go raid his room!
OOhhh! I really like that! I never played that game, but I may just go pick up a few cards and check out the artwork. Wait, what am I saying, I have a 13 year old boy with a kazillion of those cards, I'm gonna go raid his room!
Honestly... the quality of some of that artwork is the reason I even play the game. As a player I'm pretty terrible!
Ahem. Back to the OP...
The Initiate strikes me as something elves, humans, and gnomes would go for, from a purely roleplaying perspective. If I was playing this as an elf, I'd tie each of the "colors" to some cosmic principal. If I were to play this as a human, I'd tie it to some ancient culture's lost lore. And as a gnome, I'd tie it to illusions (like color spray and prismatic spray).
To tell the truth, the gnome sounds the most interesting (see below), although I can see a vibrant elf or human getting into it, too.
However, the gnomes ties in more with your desire to capitalize on the class's "theme" more. Color spray will be your signature spell to begin with (and for some time to come)! The nice things about gnomes is that they get a bonus on illusion spell DCs, so you'll be benefitting mechanically from this roleplaying hook. This will really pay off if you have access to the PHB 2, because then you can pick up on blinding color surge as a 2nd level spell, and prismatic mist as a 3rd level spell. Now, the last one isn't illusion, but it carries the theme well.
Note that all of this is done purely considering your roleplaying intentions, and does not take into consideration the wisdom of doing this with a sorcerer. That said, I'm sure you could find a way to min-max a more powerful build, but this will still be more than functional and pretty fun.
I'd also use spells like confusion and touch of idiocy. It doesn't really tie in with abjurations or even colors, but it seems tangetally related to the bewildering effects of color spray and other such spells. But, that's just me.
As for the requirements... well, human is actually best for meeting them. That extra skill point will help, as it can be plugged into Knowledge (nature) without compromising more "useful" skills too much. The feats are also alleviated by being a human. Also, wizard is better as well, due to having all Knowledge skills on their class skill list. Not to mention not having to fret so much about those abjuration spells you've got to know.
All that said, this build is perfectly doable and playabe with a gnome and/or sorcerer if you're still more interested in that option. Simply dump all of your feats and skill points into the required paths as quickly as possible so you can get them out of the way and perhaps invest in something more practical afterwards.
Spells to fit the requirement are a little trickier. Many abjurations need only one casting per battle, so I see you having either a lot of uncast slots per day, and/or being able to sustain your spellcasting through a larger number of encounters than usual. For this reason, I actually suggest looking into the reserve feats Magic Disruption and Mystic Backlash from the Complete Mage, if you have access to it.
Also, if you have access to the PHB 2 and Complete Mage, when coupled with the core PHB spells, you shouldn't have trouble finding a good selection of abjurations that produce relatively unique effects.
Finally, I might suggest looking into Extend Spell or even Sudden Extend spell if you have the feats left over for it- for things like mage armor it can be well worth it. You may also want to look into the Metamagic Specialist sorcerer option in the PHB2- it will help you a lot if you actually plan on using Extend or any other metamagic feat.
Fantastic stuff Saern... exactly the kind of advice I was hoping for. Though prismatic spray is actually an evocation spell, not illusion... :)
Yes, attempting the Initiate as a sorcerer is bound to be fraut with problems, unused spells perhaps being the biggest of them, but I'm game for a little challenge. We don't yet use PHB2 in our games so my options are limited, but the Spell Compendium helps out a great deal. Your idea of using Metamagic, and Extend Spell in particular, was one I hadn't thought of and it's one I think I'll try out.
On the topic of spells, Color spray seems a great little spell at low levels, but doesn't it run out steam past about level 5 or so? To be honest I haven't used it in the current edition of the game. I'm guessing you've had good success with it?
Well you have to realize when you are using Color Spray it's to get the higher more powerful ones. It also fits your theme.
Actually, due to very nature of a small spell list of spells known, what are you envisioning your character doing? Defense and buffs, attacking with spells or the light crossbow?
Oh, yes, one of my closest friends swears by color spray and has used it time and again to awesome effect. It is a devastating spell at very low levels, almost an "instant kill" in effect. Even at the mid levels, it retains some kick; even creatures of 5+ HD are stunned for a round if they fail their save.
Color spray will remain useful more than long enough for you to pick up on other spells, abilities, and items that more or less duplicate its effects. Hands down, it's my favorite 1st level spell.
Well you have to realize when you are using Color Spray it's to get the higher more powerful ones. It also fits your theme.
Actually, due to very nature of a small spell list of spells known, what are you envisioning your character doing? Defense and buffs, attacking with spells or the light crossbow?
You know, I hadn't actually thought about that. I'm too used to playing wizards and clerics. With the focus on abjuation spells, defensive magic would be one sub-theme, while "colour" and "light" being to other. Since most spells that deal with colour or light are offensive in nature that probably showhorns me into being a 'blaster'-type caster as well.
Thanks for th tips on Color Spray. I always did like the look of it, but it didn't occur to me how effect it could be. Cheers guys!