I'll be running Crazy Jared's Hut and Bhal Hamatugn (sp?) pretty soon. I'm a bit bothered by the number of dragons in this installment of the AP, and I'd like to toss arround a few ideas here.
I don't like the apparent randomness of Gottrod's attack. I'm considering chucking the entire encounter and replacing it with something less dragon-intensive. On the other hand, that picture of crazy jared running from Gottrod is pretty damned cool.
As I see it, I have a couple of options:
1) Throw out the entire encounter. Just have Jared sit in the sun, saluting peasants (or whatever)
2) Replace Gottrod with something that is not a dragon. I'd prefer another flying creature, nut in a pinch Bullette, or band of ogres should do
3) Tie Gottrod into the AP.
I would prefer to use the third option. First, it enhances the AP. Second I get to show off that pretty picture of Jared and Gottrod. As direction of thought, take a look at this excelent idea by par-a-dox.If I could tie that into the AP, that would be perfect
I basically have the same set of options with Dhorlot. Thing is, I don't want to use two dragons. So whatever I do, one's got to go.
One thought was to replace Dhorlot with some type of fiend. Or maybe a slaad of some type... Acidic tadpoles anyone?
What do you guys think? Anyone change anything in that installment?
Creative Director
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I've never really understood the reluctance to use dragons in adventures. They are, after all, the iconic monsters for the game. Why NOT use them? You can always save the upper age category menaces for campaign masterminds and villains, but not using them seems to me to be like going to a chocolate store and ordering the apple pie. ;-)
I do agree that Gottrod needs to have a stronger reason and more interesting background though. And he'll probably get one in the Shackled City book I'm currently in the process of setting up.
I've never really understood the reluctance to use dragons in adventures. They are, after all, the iconic monsters for the game. Why NOT use them? You can always save the upper age category menaces for campaign masterminds and villains, but not using them seems to me to be like going to a chocolate store and ordering the apple pie. ;-)
Just to be clear, I want to use dragons. I just don't want two unrelated dragon encounters in one adventure. And I don't want an encounter with them to be semi-random either.
I agree dragons are (and should be) an integral part of the D&D world. The dragon is at the top of the food chain. It's not afraid of anything (save a band of foolhardy adventurers). That's what makes them the iconic creatures they are.
Now if that same band of adventurers slays dragons on a bi-weekly basis, the charm soom wears off. It turns dragons into just another monster for the players to kill. And I would be very sorry to see that happen.
There are lots of in game reasons why a dragon would be reluctant to take on a group of adventurers. Especially one who's strength it does not know.
I'm still in Flood Season, but I agree that there are a few too many dragon or dragon like encounters in Zenith Trajectory (Gottrod, Hydra, Dhorlot).
What I'm thinking about doing is having one of Dhorlot's spawn, a halfblack dragon/half wyrven be attacking Jared's hut. Jared in his madness can even put an illusion around the wyrven to make it occasionaly look like a red dragon (although it would make the encounter considerably harder if this was done to the PCs disadvantage).
This idea will foreshadow Dhorlot and his weird...ehem...proclivities, while also preparing the PCs a bit.
What I'm thinking about doing is having one of Dhorlot's spawn, a halfblack dragon/half wyrven be attacking Jared's hut.
bored so here's the stat block i came up with. wasn't really sure what to do with all those extra skill points and i think i did the attacks right but this is really my first stat block. please mention any glaring problems.
Wyrven/Half-black Dragon (Large Dragon)
HD: 7d12 + 21 (66 hp)
Speed 20ft, fly 40ft (average manuverablity)
AC: 22 (-1 size, +1 Dex, +12 Natural) touch 10, Flatfooted 21
BAB +7/Grapple +19
Attack: Sting +14 melee (1d6 +8 plus poison) or talon +14 melee (2d6 + 8) or bite +14 melee (2d8 +8)
Full Attack: Sting +14 melee (1d6 +8 plus poison) and bite +12 melee (2d8 +8) and 2 wings +12 melee (1d8 +4) and 2 talons +12 (2d6 +8)
Space/Reach 10ft/5ft
Special Attacks: Poison/Improved Grab
Special Qualities: Darkvision 60ft, immunity to sleep and paralysis, low light vision, scent
Saves: Fort +8, Reflex +6, Will +6
Abilities: Str 27 Con 17 Int 8 Cha 11 Wis 12 Dex 12
Skills: Hide +11, Listen +13, Move Silently +11, Spot +16
Feats: ability focus (poison), Alertness, Flyby Attack, Multiattack
Environment: Warm Hills
Organization: Solitary
CR: 8
Treausure Standard
But both Gottrod and Dhorlot DO tie into the AP.
Gottrod is the progeny of Hookface (Foundations of Flame), and introduces her existance, forewarning that "there do be dragons here". I've thrown in a couple of legends about a "powerful, ancient red dragon" in the north. Cocky PCs might mistakenly think that Gottrod is it, and go investegating...to their DOOM.
Dhorlot, of course, is the Dragon-father of Zarik-Dhor (Secrets of the Soul Pillars), and it takes something away from that future encounter (even if it isn't a "critical" one) to not include him.
If it's not enough to just replace the hydra and have two unrelated dragon encounters in short succession, and I understand if you feel that way...then there's at least one other possability.
Make Dhorlot a Red (makes the setting a bit trickier to work out right, but it can be done with some fidging). Try to have "Gottrod" get away in the subsequent fight.
Thus, the two dragons are one and the same, healed up by the Kuo-Toa priests and itching for revenge when the PCs get there. Somehow, Dhorlot/Gottrod got wind of the PCs' approach, and took the opportunity to take it to them directly, and off Crazy Jared and his knowledge of the entrance in the process.
If somehow the PCs take down Gottrod...then they're siblings instead of the same dragon.
If you want to expand the theme still further...replace the Cryo-Hydra with a Half-Red Dragon Pyrohydra with less heads. Introduces and reinforces the "dragon father" theme.
hmmm.
I went with one dragon-father: Gottrod, son of Hookface. He fathered the pyrohydra and some of the other creatures attributed to Dhorlot. Only to make it a bit more believable, I upped Gottrod's age category to juvenile. I mean a young dragon is not likely to be all that interested in creating progeny, right?
Anyway, it may have been a mistake. First of all, the party mage loaded up on almost nothing but fire spells. Second, the party was short on ranged attacks. And third, the party never rolled over 10 on an attack roll.
Gottrod dropped the ranger from full hp to -14 (the party's best fighter) in a single full attack. It would have been a TPK if I hadn't jumped in with some deus-ex-machina and had Crazy Jared turn into a gold dragon and drive Gottrod away (a-la Par-a-dox).
I ended the session there. I'm a bit stuck right now. I killed off a character my player (who also happens to be my girlfriend) was very attached to. And my players where discussing dropping this mission and returning to Cauldron to raise their fallen comrade.
One idea I have is to introduce Nidrama right here, and have him/her raise the Ranger. Perhaps at the request of Jared. Or because Nidrama knows about the fate of cauldron and the parties role therein.
What do you guys think? Any other ideas/suggestions?
Crazy jarrad as a gold dragon? Wow I might use that some time it would creap the hell out of my players… Mabye I wont use it… but it was a good idea to keep form a TPK… You killed your girl firend. That is dangerous…. If the players go back to rase their fallend comrade it should not a problem cosidering that there is not much of a tiem constarint on this misssion however make sure that celest (or someone they delt with) approches the pary telling them that they had a mission to complete and they were paid for it (did you give you party half upfromt?) or something like that,…. That;s what I do
I wasn’t too upset with the use of dragons in the AP, especially since I was able to tailor the encounters to work with my version of the story. Gottrod, Dhorlot and Hookface were all knitted fairly well (I think, at least).
I had already started a myth of red dragon rulers that held sway over the volcanic mountain range nearly a millennia ago, until they were forced out by growing magical influences (the spellweavers). Hookface had been mentioned in local rumors as being the last in the line of “old ones.”
Once the group arrived at Crazy Jared’s, the red dragon menace had been played up very ominously and nearly everyone was surprised to see a young red attacking the imaginary monarch. As the attack escalated, Jared would scream that the fabled Flame was trying to once again destroy the kingdom of Anduria.
At the start of that adventure, we had a couple of new players join, one choosing to be a half-minotaur (Dragon 313) dwarf from up north, where a rash of half-dragons had been seen.
He connected Dhorlot with the children found in Bhal-hamatugn and his northern home and took great pleasure in assisting the kill. And to later be faced with another of Dhorlot’s kin, who hoped to exact revenge on a fellow minotaur-blooded freak?! Everyone enjoyed that battle.
I had been planning to use “Old Embers Never Die” from very early on, adapting it for use as a trip to Sasserine adventure. Needing better equipment and to sell everything they had acquired, they took a job to investigate kobold raiders in the mountains surrounding Sasserine. Here they faced the reptilian worshippers of the skeleton of an ancient red dragon. This would have led to the second part of the adventure, but they took the quest so lightly that the kobolds had enough time to prepare and more than half the team was slaughtered. (Here’s where two players thought I had it out for them, despite the fact they positioned themselves between the foes in the final chamber.)
Too bad they never had a chance to fight Hookface, as the fiendish morkoth took them down much to easily. All it took was some work and use of foreshadowing and the “random” dragon encounters became something bigger. Someday soon I’ll tally the deaths from the final chapters we played (Soul Pillars, LoO, FoF).
Well, assuming that your campaign isn't derailed through GF revenge, I think your Nidrama solution is reasonable (I used similar in Demonscar, knowing they were very soon going to be a LONG ways away from the ability to raise) with one of my PCs.
As an "of course" reminder, be sure to adapt the half-minotaur in Secret of the Soul Pillars to be half-red instead of half-black. I'm glad my suggestion was of use!
Oh, and you might want to be sure that Gotrod the Dragon Father has a Ring of Water Breathing...his increased CR should make him easily worth the xtra cash.
As an "of course" reminder, be sure to adapt the half-minotaur in Secret of the Soul Pillars to be half-red instead of half-black. I'm glad my suggestion was of use!
Oh, and you might want to be sure that Gotrod the Dragon Father has a Ring of Water Breathing...his increased CR should make him easily worth the xtra cash.
Good one. Another idea was to have Gottrod fly in/out through some vents / caves in the cavern roof.
As Gottrod's CR is higher than Dhorlot, and one of my party members is going to be short one level, I was thinking of having Jared or Nidrama give the PC's a couple of items to help them fight Gottrod. A +1 shield of fire resistance comes to mind (takes the first 10 points of sting out of the breath weapon. Especially in close quarter combat). Another thought was a +1 dragon bane sword. I'm trying to come up with an in game explenation why Jared would have those kinds of items, though.
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Well, my players saw Gothrod and decided to, well - HIDE until he finished the hut! So I haven't had a fight here!
With replacing Dhorlot - I wouldn't do it, because later on in the AP there is a very cool encounter with a spawn of Dhorlot. This is a half-dragon/half-i-presently-don't-know... Replacing Dhorlot will make you replace this little nasty thing as well, and this was one of the more memorable encounters in my AP!
You may try to substitute Gothrod with two, or even three wyverns... that might do the trick!
Dryder, as already suggested, Chef's Slaad is going to turn the Dragon-Father red, making Gotrod and Dhorlot both one and the same.
So the half-minotaur/half-dragon isn't going away...just turning red as well.
Now I'm wishing I thought of it myself.
CS, you can also tone down the encounter in the temple a bit by just skipping the trap in the room before.
As for the equipment suggestion...I would suggest both. Not only do they provide a reason for Gotrod to be there (hunting down the items), they let Jared spin the tale of Wilfred the Dragonslayer, the finest and bravest Knight-Errant of Anduria, who wielded the fabled Blade of Anduria and bore the ever-ready Shield of Anduria to do battle with Hookfang herself.
It'll give them a chance to have some story behind the items, let them be surprised that they really do work (Wilfred WAS a dragonslayer named Tobias Marthan, who was actively hunting down all these half-dragons...speak with the dead could be valuable if the PCs ask to visit "Wilfred's" grave).
God Andorax, I love you!
In a non-sexual way of course
These ideas are worth their weight in gold.
What does an idea wheigh anyway?
What I'm trying to say is thanks
I’ve been thinking of Carzy jared’s backstory, and why Gottrod would want to attack him. I’ve also been trying to explain away the Deus ex mchina I used to prevent a TPK.
It’s a bit long, and kind of reads like a fairytale. I suppose that’s how Jared would tell it, after all.
The Kingdom of Anduria is real, or at least it used to be. I was founded by a brave Paladin-king, Wilfred the Dragon Slayer. He defeated many of the foul dragons that terrorized the population of his newly founded kingdom. Chief amongst them Gorltrod, a great red wyrm.
Ironically he married a dragon. A gold wyrm that went by the human name of Constantine the fair. Wilfred and Constantine sired a line of wise kings and queens. After Wilfred’s death, Constantine retreated back to her lair, swearing to protect the kingdom of Anduria as long as it exists.
After many peaceful years Azogoth, mate of Gorltrod the mother of Hookface attacked the kingdom, seeking to avenge her mate by killing every last member of Wilfred and Constantine’s bloodline. A great fight ensued between Azagoth and Constantine, leading to the death of both wyrms and laying the kingdom of Anduria to waste.
Some members of the Wilfred line escaped, but where subsequently hunted down by Hookface and his progeny. The only surviving member of this line is Jared, the Last king of Anduria.
Because the kingdom still exists, at least in Jared’s mind, Constantine is still bound by oath to protect it. She is able to manifest (albeit briefly) through the body of one of her descendants. This process is very tiring, both on Constantine’s spirit and the host body. She can only attempt to manifest once a week and only when the kingdom or members of her bloodline are in grave danger.
Back to my campaign/problem:
Gottrod found Jared and was in the process of attacking him when the PC’s show up. He knows Jared is a member of the Wilfred bloodline, but he doesn’t know of Constantine’s oath or her ability to manifest. Naturally he’s a bit shaken when Constantine does just that and immediately makes a tactical retreat (i.e. flees)
Now Jared has to hide again before Gottrod returns. For this, he enlists the help Nidrama. She takes him in and sets him up someplace else. She asks the PC’s to track down Gottrod and defeat him before his father learns of this incident and hunts down Jared himself. She also presents the PC's with the shield and sword that once belonged to Wilfred the Dragonslayer.
Just wanted to post back here that everything went smoothly. The party encountered Nidrama for the first time. They were impressed with Jared and his incredible backstory, and with the weapons he presented them. The encounter with the Pyrohydra (which I subbed for the cryohydra) went pretty well. When the party was resting after that encounter, I had Gottrod make another passover and enter though the Pit of 7 maws. It's pretty likely he's pissed at the party as of now.
Just wanted to post back here that everything went smoothly. The party encountered Nidrama for the first time. They were impressed with Jared and his incredible backstory, and with the weapons he presented them. The encounter with the Pyrohydra (which I subbed for the cryohydra) went pretty well. When the party was resting after that encounter, I had Gottrod make another passover and enter though the Pit of 7 maws. It's pretty likely he's pissed at the party as of now.
Awesome CS! I'm glad that your plan was executed flawlessly. I have really enjoyed this thread as it does wonders to tie in a bunch of dragon NPCs: Hookface, Gottrod, and Dhorlot. I am so stealing the idea that Crazy Jared is a Gold Dragon being hunted by Hookface and her progeny. I also really wanted to alter the rest of the campaign to keep everything on the "red theme," but I am very hesitant for one reason: Dhorlot is cool. I just like the idea of an epic battle against a Black Dragon in a subterranean flooded temple. The other thing I really don't see is how a Red could lower itself to hanging out with Kuo-Toa and passing its "Seed" to the undeserving (kuo-tao, minotaur...etc). This realm of "base experimentation" should be left to chromatic dragons who have no pride and it strikes me that the Reds view themselves as the cream of the crop...a sort of arrogant Gold if you will. I already agree with rewarding the party with Sir Wilfred's arms and armor (Shield of Fire Protection and Sword of Dragonslaying)...I also agree that changing the Cryohydra to a Pyrohydra would be really cool (so that the party can make use of their new toys). I just don't see Gottrod laying down with a minotaur...HOWEVER, I do have an idea that could be somewhat of a compromise between the wonderful suggestions thus far and my own reservations. Please let me know if I am out of line on this one (ie the idea is corny/lame/unbelievable).
It strikes me that Hookface is a pretty old and powerful dragon with a lot of years to rack up some serious treasure. Why not make one of her items a powerful magical tome: the Draconomicon (or something along those lines). This would be an artifact of some power, but not easily controlled. So (ala Disney Fantasia), a curious and young Gottrod (seeking more power to impress his mother) might have snuck a peak at the book and unleashed a powerful spell upon himself. This spell allows him (with time and mastery) to switch his "type" among the 5 chromatic colors (red, blue, black, white, and green). By the time he is hunting down "Crazy Jared" he has already figured out how to "shift" to Black and found a nitch to foster his experimentation...in this case I really do see him hanging out with religious fanatics. I envision him attempting to create a new bread of creature that has all the strengths of the chromatic dragons and none of their weaknesses...unfortunately he still has not mastered his newfound power. Thus, in the air of the open sky, he is Gottrod (a young and powerful red dragon), but in the subterranean realm of the Underdark, he is Dhorlot (a sadistic experimenting Black)...and no one is the wiser (not even the kuo-tao). So, in this case, you could keep both stats and use them as the module was written...but the difference is that he would know all about the party before-hand. It would be interesting to run this encounter as the party most likely would be very confused how the dragon would know all about them. Personally, I picture him pissed off from the loss of the first fight and iching to get some payback (Assuming the party wizard cast Ray of Frost: "Does the acid burn sorcerer? No doubt it feels the same as the burn of frost!!!"). I was also thinking that if he was reduced to half his hp, he could forcibly shift back to this "natural" Red form...creating some serious drama for the campaign. Anyways, let me know your thoughts. I am anxious to run this idea, but don't want to if it is completely implausible.
It's that bad huh? :)
It's that bad huh? :)
Not necessarily . . . would Zarik Dhor still be a half-black or would his minotaur parent have encountered Gottrod before the dragon snuck a peek? Any plans for the PCs actually visiting Hookface's lair (likely between FoF and SoS) . . . need some way to connect the dots . . . otherwise, you likely have Dhorlot changing into a red dragon in Bhal Hamatughn (sp?) with no proper avenue for escape and the sudden risk of alienating / angering / betraying the kuo-toa who have entered into a breeding agreement with the dragon in the first place. If the party is allowed the leisure of researching by way of visiting Hookface's lair, what plans would you have RE: this Draconomicon? I don't suppose you'd like a PC with a ludicrous Use Magic Device check to be able to access the tome's powers . . .
Yeah, Dhorlot is pretty cool.
I like your idea. it ties up some loose ends without resorting to some of the major rewrites of encounters I'm facing right now. You'll need to make it clear to the PC's why/how Gottrod has gained the ability to shift shapes.
Good point about Gottrod being too proud to be in Bhal Hamatung. Hiding in an underground temple with a bunch of frogs is not very red dragon-like. There should be a good reason for Gottrod to hang out there.
I'm kinda committed to there being only one dragon in this installment. So I'm going to leave Gottrod as he is.
Gottrod could be in Bhal Hamatung becasue he's hiding. From Hookface, his own father no less. Gottrod slighted Hookface a few months ago. I'm leaving the nature of the slight vague, but it was something pretty major. And unforgivable. Perhaps Gottrod took some of his father's hoard, or snuck a peak at that Draconomicon he's supposed to have in his lair. Or it could have something to do with Gottrod's fascination with creating progeny. Hookface chased him out of his lair. Gottrod, still too young and inexpreinced to set out on his own, decided to stay close by and hide within his father's domain. The only place he could think of was the underdark shrine of Bhal Hamatung. Mongh, the temple high-priest agreed, but only on the condition that he provide them with dragonspawn Kuo-Toa's. For the protection of the temple and the sea mother.
Gottrod wants to get back into his father's good grace, and has decided that the best way to achieve this is to kill Jared of Anduria and present his body to his father. So Gottrod frequently sets out to search for him.
Hookface, feeling he has been overly harsh, but too proud to talk to his son, has kept tabs on the comings and goings of his child and knows where he lairs. He disproves of the location, but is at least glad his son has not fled his domain.
In my campaign I had the black dragon hiding in the Kua-toa stronghold from Gotrot, and Gotrot was on a rampage because he could not find and kill the sniveling dragon. I purposely left the transgression vague to my players, but hinted that it could have been anything....As they killed Gotrot before they could get the full story and Dhorlot wasn't talking before he did escape. The popular theory revolved around any of the following....
1. Dhorlot stole some to all of Gotrot’s treasure hoard.
2. Dhorlot had mated/raped someone that Gotrot either loved or thought he owned and he felt he had to avenge the transgression.
3. or that it was purely about territory.
This helped explain why Dhorlot was in such a small room and why he had no real stake in staying to help the Kua-toa out when they were under siege.
As Gottrod's CR is higher than Dhorlot, and one of my party members is going to be short one level, I was thinking of having Jared or Nidrama give the PC's a couple of items to help them fight Gottrod. A +1 shield of fire resistance comes to mind (takes the first 10 points of sting out of the breath weapon. Especially in close quarter combat). Another thought was a +1 dragon bane sword. I'm trying to come up with an in game explenation why Jared would have those kinds of items, though.
Another good item that I'm considering, especially in light of the numerous dragon encounters, is the dragonbane (I forget the actual name at the moment) themed sword from Weapons of Legacy. If you've picked up the book, and you're looking to add weapons (especially if you follow the "maybe Jared isn't quite so crazy" option mentioned above), it's a good choice. Probably the best thing about it is that it not only gives extra hooks, but its powers can be unlocked fairly easily within the normal storyline of the AP, without a need for long side-quests. Once unlocked, of course, it can come in very handy against Hookface.
EDIT: After looking at the online gallery on WotC from Weapons of Legacy, I think the sword in question is Crimson Ruination. Check the description just to be sure.
Thread necromancy! Awise thwead! Awise!
IMC we just did the Gottrod encounter and I wish I'd have read this thread beforehand. Basically, the party is very short of ranged weapons and Gottrod was toasting them from his comfortable 30 foot high flybys. After seeing Jared use his rod of splendor, they became convinced that Gottrod was an illusion and wasted some time Disbelieving (after all, they're only 7th level, throwing a dragon at them is crazy!)
I finally had to say, "Guys, it's a red dragon. It's pissed, and you're going to have to deal with it."
So they dealt. The fighter self stabilized at -9, the cleric cast Prot from Elements on Jared, the rogue hid, and the evoker tried to appease the dragon by speaking to it, because they hadn't scratched Gottrod in the previous 5 or 6 rounds.
They got that Gottrod was looking for Dhorlot. A couple of knowledge rolls gave them that Dhorlot was a "notoriously fecund black dragon." Since he's notorious for something the knowledge rolls would tell them, and we all had to look up fecund.
Jared continued taunting Gottrod, and wouldn't listen to repeated pleas from the party to just tell the dragon what it wanted to know. They started flattering the dragon, and it finally landed to eat Jared.
Once it landed the writing was on the wall--
Round 1:
Gottrod chews on Jared.
Jared self stabilizes (it was a good day for blood clotting) at -7
Somebody decided to throw caution to the wind and actually attack Gottrod. Once one of them hits, they all join in, doing about 30pts of damage. Not a big deal for Gottrod.
Round 2:
Gottrod does his full attack on the rogue, who would surely have died, but Gottrod misses with his tail, leaving the rogue with 2hp.
Everyone wails on G. taking him down to 17hp. Yikes!
Round 3:
With 17hp, it's time to head for the hills. Gottrod takes off.
Everyone gets an attack of opportunity. The cleric kills G. with his wand of inflict serious wounds (touch AC is 9, he couldn't miss).
Everyone cheers. They have taken down their first dragon!
They already knew about Hookface, because their map is marked with his (her?) lair. They're pretty sure that Gottrod is the child of Hookface. They know there's another dragon around somewhere, and they know that it likes to give birth to things...
As for tying this stuff in to the main plot, well doesn't that come when they meet Hookface? I've now committed to Dhorlot as a black dragon, and I know they're going to start picking spells to combat a black.
The next thing is the cryohydra. I seem to remember from the magazine version that there were all sorts of chances for the stairs to fall down, but that seems to be gone in the HC (probably because of so many casualties in that encounter, as reported on these boards). I still like the cold, and when the cryohydra breaths I'm going to have the metal stair coated with ice, so the party is going to have to make balance checks to retreat.
After throwing waves of mooks at them in Flood Season, I think giving them these single, big monsters (umber hulk, red dragon, cryohydra) is a nice change of pace.