Starfinder Adventure Path #31: Waking the Worldseed (Devastation Ark 1 of 3)

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Starfinder Adventure Path #31: Waking the Worldseed (Devastation Ark 1 of 3)

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The discovery of a series of millennia-old ruins sets off a chain of events that puts an ancient titanic spacecraft on course to the Pact Worlds. When the vessel—which belongs to an evil, warmongering civilization long thought dead—begins destroying all other ships in its path and attacking important resources to increase its power, the heroes must rescue millions of lives from destruction and find a way to stop the ship and all aboard it. Will the heroes be triumphant? Or will the alien species take the Pact Worlds as its new home and conquer the galaxy?

Rescuing a xenoarcheological team on a distant, frozen world from weather gone haywire, the heroes unearth more than they bargained for as an ancient ruin rises from the ground and kicks off a series of events that could change the face of the galaxy forever. The tower contains secrets of a warlike civilization thought long dead and is strangely connected to small moon in the Pact Worlds. Returning to explore a previously unknown facility under the moon's surface that threatens to overheat and destroy all life there, the heroes learn that the moon is signaling a gigantic alien craft, drawing it toward the system with lethal intent!

“Waking the Worldseed” is a Starfinder Roleplaying Game adventure for four 13th-level characters. This adventure begins The Devastation Ark Adventure Path, a three-part, monthly campaign in which the players stop the threat of an ancient alien civilization in Starfinder's first high-level adventures! This volume also includes a gazetteer of the moon of Hibb and a selection of deadly threats.

Each monthly full-color softcover Starfinder Adventure Path volume contains a new installment of a series of interconnected science-fantasy quests that together create a fully developed plot of sweeping scale and epic challenges. Each 64-page volume of the Starfinder Adventure Path also contains in-depth articles that detail and expand the Starfinder campaign setting and provide new rules, a host of exciting new monsters and alien races, a new planet to explore and starship to pilot, and more!

ISBN-13: 978-1-64078-260-0

Waking the Worldseed is sanctioned for use in Starfinder Society Organized Play. The rules for running this Adventure Path and Chronicle sheets are available as a free download (5.1 MB PDF).

Note: This product is part of the Starfinder Adventure Path Subscription.

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Finished running this part yesterday

5/5

I was between 4 and 5 stars throughout entire book, but I finally decided on 5 stars after finishing book and sleeping night on it ;D

I'm gonna go through rough spots first but not in any particular order.

First obvious thing about the book is that where normal starfinder ap books covers two levels worth of adventuring and ends on third level up, this one covers 3 levels worth of adventuring and ends on fourth. So basically a LOT happens in the book and lot of it is facing foes of equal or higher CR giving book much more difficulty spikes than ap books usually have. Book also as result has LOT of very high CR traps. Gives Sivvs nice "well they were really into overkill" feel ;D

While that is noticeably weird, I wouldn't consider it a bad thing as characters on these levels are tough enough to handle it and it is nice to have extra challenge once a while. I DID run the ap for five characters(two soldiers, techomancer, mystic and envoy, one of the soldier players has to leave rest of the campaign though so I'll be running book 2 and 3 with four players) without adjusting encounters and didn't feel particularly like they had easy time :D I am curious to hear though more experiences from parties with four players if they felt about same as I did while running this.

Second thing is the usual Starfinder AP npc problemo: Unless AP book is focused on single NPC for most of the story or keeps bringing back same npcs on every book, NPCs fill feel bit flat. Like yeah, book does do good job of giving Nifri, Ms. Nott and Uso more or less memorable personalities and I can infer what they are like as person, but I know absolutely nothing about their background or who they are otherwise. I don't hold this against this book though because that is general trend on starfinder aps.

Another thing related to that though is that while it is nice book has lot of small roleplaying moments, it does kinda feel like book rushes through them to get to the encounter parts. Like I wonder if with more page count there had been more focus on the Abadarcorp and Bantrid relations? But then again I do think its good thing book doesn't have Dead Suns part 1 problem of putting too much focus into secondary conflict that is irrelevant for rest of the adventure path. Still its cool book has big consequences on Hibbs' future and Bantrids' society causing nice potential status quo shakeup.

I do find it extra funny though how book gives more examples of Abadarcorp being much more reasonable and ethical than in Starfinder Society overall. Like sure there is one misanthrope in adventure who believes they would misuse quantum technology and cause disaster, but if players do try to snub bantrids in favor of the megacorp, they actually reprimand players for that(even though they will still buy the data xD) and continue working together with bantrids anyway. I still do like roleplaying potential given by questions raised by npcs in character.

On note of something that I don't consider con per say but should be mentioned is that exp in adventure is very tight. If players start on exp amount of 13th level and do absolute everything exp giving perfectly, they have 3600 xp extra of level 16th limit. I do think this is good thing honestly though because adventure's design means players are likely to do everything(its fairly linear adventure in design) so if they do miss some you have room to include your own stuff.

One more small nitpick isn't really nitpick but more of joke: I find it funny how commercialized Christmas resort spot looks like basically Christmas wonderland resort even though there is no Christmas equivalent in pact worlds ;D Like I get most of it, having singing and jolly decorated trees in dark winter makes universally sense, but why they connect dwarves and elves with winter resort decorations is part I'm way too amused with.

This adventure's version of atmospheric starship combat has one problem: all custom stunts are dc 20 plus ship tier and have consequences for failure so uh... Yeah 15 plus ship tier is considered hard dc, so the all stunts are just too impractical to use even if they are cool.

But yeah and the final negative or nitpicks I have is some parts of

scene with Izu:
So I just start with obvious: Why exactly is it DC 30 life science or culture check to know that bantrids have anxiety if they stay still? Like sure that is easy DC at these levels, but still its example of silly DC inflation at high level adventures. I'm pretty sure that isn't obscure information in universe.

But yeah that one is the nitpick, here is the negative: DC 38 perception check to notice anything off about Izu is kinda ridiculously high for most characters. Like yeah, players would get multiple chances to roll it, but if they are trusting types(my party didn't think initially there was anything weird about lone bantrid in place), they could bring Izu through entire dungeon without ever getting chance to get exp from him and he would get away without anyone wiser. And in event they are both paranoid and lucky is that if they confront Izu before fixing quantum core... Well the exp is tight that they level up just before entering command deck pre fighting Izu if they did everything. Yeah fixing quantum core and catwalk is what pushes pcs to level up. So there is small chance of pcs fighting creature higher cr than difficulty chart allows as that goes up to only +3 the apl x'D Though as spellcaster monster he isn't that bad to deal with. Either way, while I like concept of encounter, I do think it has lot of holes that would need adjustment.

Like in my case party is really trusting until they eventually stop being unlucky and get good roll on dice. After that they get him to reveal the fake form and after that since they have telepathic communication and don't know what to make of Izu, they basically are like "sure yeah we'll give data to abadarcorp(maybe, we'll decide later)" which means that since Izu doesn't have good sense motive listed(though I presume it would require similar dcs as spotting him), Izu might as well leave now that they know he isn't just bantrid and his mission is done. Which again wouldn't give them exp since they didn't beat encounter where they do what bad guy wants x'D But yeah, in my case I required DC 38 bluff check and direct statement "Yes we are going to do this" without wiggling around, and players didn't just say that directly, so I had Izu decide to try his luck with next team and try to murder them.

Now to the good/great parts:

Foreshadowing in the adventure is stellar. Not just foreshadowing for rest of the AP, but foreshadowing on Jedarat that you can later learn full truth of Worldseed's historical data. One of my players had really nice "OH. All the loose ends click together in way I understand them" moment when they finally learned of what was happening in Jedarat and how it connected to Worldseed xD (I think they didn't initially realize that Jedarant facility was military research facility, so they were unsure of how this random ruin is connected to Worldseed and Ark Prime besides names being mentioned in data files. I think they might have been unsure of connection between bantrid rebels, why they were on worldseed and events as well until that point)

Second thing is that Sivv Dominion is delightfully ridiculously cruel and evil in most inhuman ways possible. Later books continue this trend and I do think they might be bit too cartoonishly evil since its kinda easy to get into "maybe they ARE completely irredeemable" feeling, but more on that in later books. Either way, what I want to say is that writers did good job of highlighting why you don't want Dominion to come back and how horrifying it is. Heck these books make it much easier to get picture of what life in Sivv Dominion was like compared to me still being unsure of whether Kishalee were militaristic or not, whether they were democratic or not and such ;D I do also notice lack of term "Rel-State" in favor of "Quantum Hyperspace" this book, but I don't mind it

Third is something personal: there are lot of high level monsters I want to use more but can't because aps don't go that high and this book uses some of my favorites ;D Thank you for including certain aberration here <3

Fourth is again something personal: so throughuot the campaign, one of the two soldiers had gotten bit too over confident, so they stopped taking 10 minute rests to restore stamina even when rest of the party does. So there was something really satisfying with bear moving to melee and getting crit for 141 damage and getting ko'd by CR 18 combatant array robot ;D Made them go like "oh s$@! this is actually going to be really painful" even more than animated armor earlier did(which was pretty dangerous as well). That keeper drone was hardest encounter in entire campaign starting from dead suns up to this point and it was delightful since I knew players wouldn't die from it, but they did take beating before beating it.

Basically I want to say that I love absurdly high damage in high levels, it really feels like things have gotten real and seeing creature deal one third of characters entire pool combined in single attack and mystic heal them to almost full of hp book in retaliation is nice :D

Oh and before I forget articles as usual are nice, and I liked that adventure had nice "you made big discovery" moment with

discovering:
fifth/final Eloritu's rune depending on whether party has played Dawn of Flame as well ;D
I do hope starfinder writers eventually do sequel to all six being discovered and to have further lore on its meaning.

(in general I found ways all previous aps had different missions and ways to get involved amusing. Though I do some of them make more sense than others since some of them don't require party to know there is already ongoing emergency before arriving)

P.S. <3 Nifri-2


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Alright, I just ordered Alien Archive, Operations Manual, Armory and Pact Worlds in Germany. I wasn't joking around when I said I'd buy some products as soon as the devs start putting out high-level content.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

By the way, what happened to that January blog post promised by Jason? I've been looking for it ever since, but unless it stealthily disguised itself as something else, it doesn't seem to have been published yet.


So exited about that one. I do wonder what team from AP's will my player choose to tackle this one with.

Thank You Paizo!

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I wonder if this AP has suggestions on how to continue it from other previous APs, or if it makes particularly sense for single of them.

Like based on book 3's articles, I could see this as being Dead Suns continuation in a way


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I dearly hope we get a good long article on how to connect this one to the prior AP's (especially the one before it), since that is exactly my plan.

Sovereign Court Creative Director, Starfinder

19 people marked this as a favorite.

Devastation Ark is designed to be played as a sequel to any Starfinder Adventure Path that ends at 13th level, though it has the most connections to Dead Suns (but having played Dead Suns is NOT a requirement to play Devastation Ark).

The adventure begins with a section of adventure hooks for each AP published so far to bring characters from those APs into this one (but these are incorporated into the adventure itself, not in a separate article).


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Adventure, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Robert G. McCreary wrote:
The adventure begins with a section of adventure hooks for each AP published so far to bring characters from those APs into this one (but these are incorporated into the adventure itself, not in a separate article).

That's a great idea.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Most excellent! Thanks, Robert!


2 people marked this as a favorite.
Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber
Robert G. McCreary wrote:
The adventure begins with a section of adventure hooks for each AP published so far to bring characters from those APs into this one (but these are incorporated into the adventure itself, not in a separate article).

Love this. Really happy to hear that it's being included.


YES YES YES! So excited for this! Thank you!

Given the timing, it might even be possible that my group actually finishes Dead Suns in time to continue with this, which would be awesome!

Dark Archive

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Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

THis is great news I can do 3 Adventure paths all the way up to 18 level. Start with Aeon Throne then go to Signal of Screams then finish with Devastation Ark.

Paizo Employee Developer

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ra9662 wrote:
THis is great news I can do 3 Adventure paths all the way up to 18 level. Start with Aeon Throne then go to Signal of Screams then finish with Devastation Ark.

You sure can!

I don't envy those PCs at all.


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Pathfinder Adventure, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Starfinder Superscriber

Hey, they get a lovely little vacation at a Space-resort midway through.


ra9662 wrote:
THis is great news I can do 3 Adventure paths all the way up to 18 level. Start with Aeon Throne then go to Signal of Screams then finish with Devastation Ark.

My AP group is actually doing the APs in-Society, so each book gives us one level.

Thus, we alternated Dead Suns and Against the Aeon Throne; now we're doing Dead Suns and Signal of Screams alternatingly. If we survive to level 13, we'll need a second (and maybe even a third) 13+ AP in order to get through them the way we've been going.

Dataphiles

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FYI, I will spend money on Roll 20 assets for this AP (And for the 2nd half of Dead Suns should they appear)!

hint

Second Seekers (Luwazi Elsebo)

Pathfinder Starfinder Society Subscriber

Dumb question: is there a way to pre-order the PDF version of this?

I've heard Paizo people talk about pre-order sales being an important metric that the company tracks, and since I am super pumped for this AP, I'd like to pre-order and show my dollar support. But, for all the reasons people usually list (cost/time of international shipping, COVID has closed down in-person gaming, convenience and weight, etc) I prefer the PDF to a hard copy. Problem is: there doesn't seem to be a way to pre-order just the PDF. Unless I'm missing something?

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

There is not a way to preorder the PDF to my knowledge, aside from subscribing and getting the PDF when your physical book ships.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Soon, soooon, we'll have cover to marvel :3 I wonder if there will be bantrid on cover


Pathfinder Adventure, Maps, Pathfinder Accessories, PF Special Edition Subscriber; Starfinder Superscriber
Kishmo wrote:

Dumb question: is there a way to pre-order the PDF version of this?

I've heard Paizo people talk about pre-order sales being an important metric that the company tracks, and since I am super pumped for this AP, I'd like to pre-order and show my dollar support. But, for all the reasons people usually list (cost/time of international shipping, COVID has closed down in-person gaming, convenience and weight, etc) I prefer the PDF to a hard copy. Problem is: there doesn't seem to be a way to pre-order just the PDF. Unless I'm missing something?

I believe the preorders are more useful for hardcopies (since that guides the size of print-runs) hence it's really subscribers (who get both hardcopy and PDFs) that Paizo cares about tracking the most there.

Preordering a PDF would still require the same number of clicks (you'd just do some now rather than on streetdate) so they don't see a huge upside in providing that facility for those who currently buy the PDFs.


High level content! Yes, very nice Paizo. Thanks a lot. Also love the 3 part series rather than 6 parts.


Pathfinder Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Anyone else checking this page every day to see if they've updated the cover art? As far as I know, the only bit of non-placeholder art we've gotten for this AP is this fantastic logo, and I am craving some more.


Oooo trippy.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Well we did see some art from ap in one of gencon streams(it was iconics fighting sivvs. I know they are sivvs since I saw sivv concept art in Paizocon stream. They kinda look like shrimps on land :p Well not best description, but best description would be "like this aliens in that one scifi game/series/book/comic" xD)


Any update on when this releases?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber
LinkDead wrote:
Any update on when this releases?

Street date is August 26th.


John Mangrum wrote:
LinkDead wrote:
Any update on when this releases?
Street date is August 26th.

Thanks John Mangrum :) Will have to set a reminder on my calendar!

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

BIG NOSE

Also is that a tarot card on golden chain?


Paizo Charter Superscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Pathfinder Accessories Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

Oh, so it's "The Devastation Ark", not just "Devastation Ark". Interesting.


Starfinder Superscriber

Bantrids! Yay!!


CorvusMask wrote:

BIG NOSE

Also is that a tarot card on golden chain?

I mean there is a tarot card called The tower so maybe?


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CorvusMask wrote:
Also is that a tarot card on golden chain?

I think it's an ancient bantrid hibernation tower:

Pact Worlds (pg.211) wrote:
However, less than 5 years ago, previously unnoticed machinery under Hibb’s surface began to stir. All across the moon, apertures opened in the ground, from which rose tall towers with spiraling ramps. Heretofore unknown creatures emerged from these towers, their small visual sensors adjusting to the light of the distant sun. The members of this sentient species, who call themselves bantrids, had slumbered in stasis for eons before their ancient computers woke them. Because of the Gap and faulty data-storage drives, however, the bantrids had no knowledge of the solar system’s current political climate and no recollection of why their people entered stasis in the first place. Some believe they were hiding from an imminent threat or natural disaster, while others posit that bantrids were the first sentient species in the system and that they put themselves to sleep to wait for others to interact with.

The pendant is probably some sort of emblem of office or something. Also, I'd be willing to bet that the mysterious reason for the bantrid's hibernation is gonna be evident pretty soon!


Considering the scope of the AP according to the teaser I wonder if the books will describe how the Pact Worlds will react to this threat and why it is up to the PCs to save the system, considering that the Pact was created to defend against exactly this scenario.


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Ixal wrote:
Considering the scope of the AP according to the teaser I wonder if the books will describe how the Pact Worlds will react to this threat and why it is up to the PCs to save the system, considering that the Pact was created to defend against exactly this scenario.

I wouldn't say 'exactly' this scenario. Invasion from an outside force, sure. Invasion from a force with a ship half the size of Apostae with the ability to deactivate the Starstone? That probably wasn't on anyone's contingency list.


FormerFiend wrote:
Ixal wrote:
Considering the scope of the AP according to the teaser I wonder if the books will describe how the Pact Worlds will react to this threat and why it is up to the PCs to save the system, considering that the Pact was created to defend against exactly this scenario.
I wouldn't say 'exactly' this scenario. Invasion from an outside force, sure. Invasion from a force with a ship half the size of Apostae with the ability to deactivate the Starstone? That probably wasn't on anyone's contingency list.

The Starstone and Absolom Station isn't all that important to the Pact System, so even with that I do not see why the Pact wouldn't be able to handle it on their own. From the description the PCs just seem to be there first which suggest a very tight timeline for the AP.

Dark Archive

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I mean it is ancient super weapon, as we all know the older super weapon is more powerful it is ;P

But seriously, this is the empire that built weapon that collapses stars, if ark had space ship stats it'd probably be tier 25 or something in scale :P


CorvusMask wrote:

I mean it is ancient super weapon, as we all know the older super weapon is more powerful it is ;P

But seriously, this is the empire that built weapon that collapses stars, if ark had space ship stats it'd probably be tier 25 or something in scale :P

It is still just one ship while the Pact likely has hundreds tier 15+ ships and also many, many lvl 15 or higher characters.

Thats no direct complain, the PCs don't have to be "the chosen ones" who are the only ones able to save day system. I would actually like it more for versimilitude reasons that the Pact would also be able to handle the Ark, with losses, should the PCs fail.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I mean that is also a scifi trope: Enough big ship with enough many guns can take on entire fleet even if that seem logistic wise unplausible ;p

Plus again super powered technology that shuts down enemy base without them having chance to react presumably also applies to other stuff

But yeah, thing with level 20 campaign is that even if pact worlds can survive it, it should come with HEAVY as hell losses or otherwise it wouldn't feel like consequence for losing level 20 adventure. Like it should be really pyrrhic victory like entire pact worlds economy and military power collapsing as result :p


CorvusMask wrote:

I mean that is also a scifi trope: Enough big ship with enough many guns can take on entire fleet even if that seem logistic wise unplausible ;p

Plus again super powered technology that shuts down enemy base without them having chance to react presumably also applies to other stuff

But yeah, thing with level 20 campaign is that even if pact worlds can survive it, it should come with HEAVY as hell losses or otherwise it wouldn't feel like consequence for losing level 20 adventure. Like it should be really pyrrhic victory like entire pact worlds economy and military power collapsing as result :p

Thing is, its rather unbelievable that the PCs are the only lvl 16+ characters in the Pact system with billions of inhabitants. Also the Pact fought off the swarm un the past which is not a low level enemy. So there is no real reason besides circumstance why the PCs need to stop the Ark instead of the pact fleet or its soldiers.

Sadly Paizo APs tend to cast the PCs into the role of the "chosen ones" which alone can save the world/system/universe which gets stale after a while and also a bit unbelievable.

So I rather want a opposite result. If the players fail the pact world does it with some losses but far from being a pyrrhic victory, except maybe for the immediate area.


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Not gonna bother with all of the assumptions going on with how this AP is going to play out before it's even released, yes in both Starfinder and Pathfinder the PCs are unqiue, not just random nobodies of no importance. That's kinda the point of playing the hero in an adventure.


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I think a recent developer stream suggested that at one point the PCs participate (or help lead) an armada-esque battle between the defenders of Absalom Station and the Ark and its fleet of attack drones.


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Ixal wrote:
FormerFiend wrote:
Ixal wrote:
Considering the scope of the AP according to the teaser I wonder if the books will describe how the Pact Worlds will react to this threat and why it is up to the PCs to save the system, considering that the Pact was created to defend against exactly this scenario.
I wouldn't say 'exactly' this scenario. Invasion from an outside force, sure. Invasion from a force with a ship half the size of Apostae with the ability to deactivate the Starstone? That probably wasn't on anyone's contingency list.
The Starstone and Absolom Station isn't all that important to the Pact System, so even with that I do not see why the Pact wouldn't be able to handle it on their own. From the description the PCs just seem to be there first which suggest a very tight timeline for the AP.

The point was not necessarily that the Starstone itself was of vital importance.

The point was that the sivv apparently possess the power to turn off an artifact powerful enough to bestow godhood. That is not insignificant.

Looking at this as jsut a big ship is probably a mistake.


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Is there something wrong with the bantrid on the cover? They appear to be motionless. :>

Dark Archive

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Ixal wrote:
CorvusMask wrote:

I mean that is also a scifi trope: Enough big ship with enough many guns can take on entire fleet even if that seem logistic wise unplausible ;p

Plus again super powered technology that shuts down enemy base without them having chance to react presumably also applies to other stuff

But yeah, thing with level 20 campaign is that even if pact worlds can survive it, it should come with HEAVY as hell losses or otherwise it wouldn't feel like consequence for losing level 20 adventure. Like it should be really pyrrhic victory like entire pact worlds economy and military power collapsing as result :p

Thing is, its rather unbelievable that the PCs are the only lvl 16+ characters in the Pact system with billions of inhabitants. Also the Pact fought off the swarm un the past which is not a low level enemy. So there is no real reason besides circumstance why the PCs need to stop the Ark instead of the pact fleet or its soldiers.

Sadly Paizo APs tend to cast the PCs into the role of the "chosen ones" which alone can save the world/system/universe which gets stale after a while and also a bit unbelievable.

So I rather want a opposite result. If the players fail the pact world does it with some losses but far from being a pyrrhic victory, except maybe for the immediate area.

You do remember what is logic of level ranges in Pathfinder right?

You are kinda doing the classic D&D thing of assuming the system as simulation instead of story telling device. Like that "well eventually there would have to be lot of high level characters who are practically immortal since lot of high level classes have reliable way to get access to immortality". When its more like "Well Vel Vinder is level 7 commoner despite having lived his entire life in small town without doing anything noteworthy. Why? Because we need commoner who could beat level 1 character's ass semi reliably for the scene" its reality

Level range explanation I'm arguing with here:

Level 1-5 in pathfinder assumes PCs are local small village/town heroes in start of their career. They are tougher than regular civilians or npcs(in 1e terms "level 1-5 warriors"), but not by much and they are still subject to really anticlimactic deaths.

At level 6-10 PCs are becoming regional heroes, they travel a lot more around and their competence level is now "expert" or "professional", they are much more capable of being consistently competent and definitely much stronger than than regular civilians.

11-15 is the part where PCs are famour heroes in a country and the part where their competence level is straight up heroic. They do things that normal people would never be able to do.

16-20 is when pcs become living legends(which in practice means everyone in continent probably has heard of them) and where their competence level is straight up super human compared to normal folk.

Note that there are just in general :p Some campaigns might assume that PCs are obscure conspiracy theorist types whose words are ignored by general public for their entire career even if its kinda stretching it due to how powerful they get.

Now the part where that becomes silly if you view roleplaying rules as "how physics of the world work" is that threat level of enemies always scales to PCs level, meaning that in campaign with human enemies as the main category, eventually in level 20 you are going to have tons of level 16-19 mooks even if it doesn't make sense that every town guard, royal guard, high ranking thief or whatever is capable of soloing level 1-5 village with a tiny dagger :p Unless you are going with shonen battle manga logic, but most of settings don't seem to presume that. Either way, enemies are that tough because they need to be to fight PCs, not because they have long history of becoming living legends themselves.

But yeah, I digress, back to the point:
First Pathfinder and Starfinder have different core assumptions. Pathfinder uses the "heroic monarch" trope of leaders of nations being competent badasses on their own as well, so they tend to be around level range of 7-16 depending on nation. Starfinder uses assumption that politicians for most part are just civilians with oratory skills :P This is is purely because of what kind of stories they are telling and not because "it makes sense for leaders to be high leveled because then they had high enough skills to become leaders in first place!"

Secondly, due to the fact that starfinder avoids telling the levels of npcs, it becomes completely relative to pcs what is actual level range of npcs. Like, you could face veskarium general who is level 18 in one campaign while in another campaign they could be level 12 or even lower. Is easy to assume that all High Despots are level 16 or higher(as Veskarium military rewards higher positions based on meritocracy at least officially), but for all we know they could be level 12 or even level 7 characters. We already saw captain of tier 20 spaceship in Deadsuns and they were CR 12.

Thirdly, unlike Pathfinder, Starfinder barely has any characters who are famous in scale of setting. Pathfinder had plenty of legendary figures who were famous continent wide, but Starfinder doesn't have lot of npcs who are famously powerful in the galaxy. In starfinder scale, the "country wide fame" is pretty much the system wide fame. Which at end of most level 1-12 aps ps likely get. In case of Pact Worlds, I'd say highest level npcs besides probably knights of golarion and hellknight leadership, are probably eoxian bone sages since necrovites tend to be cr 13+. And with how magic works differently in Starfinder, even if bone sages weren't type to let their minions do work they wouldn't really be as big deal as equivalent powerfully mages in pathfinder.

But yeah, that was probably too long post on this subject, but its one of those topics I like to discuss :p Either way, its silly to assume that Starfinder HAS to have even thousand level 16+ characters in it due to scale of galaxy since you are using scale of pathfinder on starfinder instead of recognizing that level ranges in starfinder work on higher scale. Level 16-20 npcs who are actually recognized as legendary are in dozens in pathfinder, so same should be in starfinder as well.

Put those long essays in spoilers so anybody reading this forum like normal poster not wanting to see long rants doesn't have to have their eyes bleed out :3 But anyway, wanted to also say that if the ap's losing condition is "Pact world's takes care of it without major problems", that would be absolutely anti climactic and frustrating since it diminishes player effort. Who at level 20 SHOULD be super big deal.

(besides, even if you argue with "rules are simulation of world's reality!" then you do realize that way starship rules work, if devastation ark is equivalent of tier 25 or higher ship, it could actually pretty easily decimate fleets of tier 20 ships? Not that it matters since final book is gonna use armada rules as it has fleet of probably super high tier drones :p)

Dark Archive

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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

So anybody willing to share juicy details about this? :3


Strange that there is no board for this AP yet.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

Upside/downside comments:

Upside: I'm pleased that the "default" story hook for PCs who don't come to this AP through one of the other published APs slots in nicely for PCs who come to it through a Campaign Mode game of Years 1 and 2 of Starfinder Society. (One need merely assume that the hiring organization is now reaching out to make amends.)

Downside: For the only time I can remember, the front cover is presented as a single image. Which means the portrait of the bantrid on the cover can't be easily separated from the background. Hope this is a fluke!


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
CorvusMask wrote:
So anybody willing to share juicy details about this? :3

The file size is 339mb, so, no. My iPad will cry if I try to download it.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Pawns Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber
AnimatedPaper wrote:
CorvusMask wrote:
So anybody willing to share juicy details about this? :3
The file size is 339mb, so, no. My iPad will cry if I try to download it.

I posted on the Website Feedback last week about that, but it seems there is no update. FWIW, the per chapter option is ~500mb :)


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber

There's a mechanical timing issue in the first part of the adventure that GMs will need to work around.

1. The PCs are called in for their expertise when an emergency arises.

2. When the PCs arrive, it's stated repeatedly that the emergency started a week earlier.

3. But the thing is, the PCs get the call on Absalom Station and the emergency is taking place in the Vast. So 6 days is the bare minimum amount of time for the request for help to be transmitted to Absalom Station (1 day) and for the PCs to respond (5 days). Average die results suggest that PCs will typically arrive 3 weeks after the emergency began and might not arrive for up to 5 weeks.

This matters because the emergency has some time-critical elements.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

"Once known as somalcygots—named after the Azlanti designation of Lost Golarion’s only moon, Somal—" huh. Was this a part of lore in 1e?

Oh yeah this is cool book :3

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